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USA: The "No-Vacation Nation"

Discuss and talk about any general topic.

Moderators: jamesbond, fschmidt

Postby S_Parc » Wed May 25, 2011 1:49 pm

djfourmoney wrote: American Women may not hate men but they sure like Man Haters speak for them.


I do believe they hate men.

My sister, an armchair feminist, used to put down women who 'hated' men but then, she hated on guys but in an askance manner, making it look like she supported equality between the genders.

All and all, AWs play on the lifelong victimization game and in order for that to work, they need a target group to hate & that group is men.
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Postby momopi » Wed May 25, 2011 3:30 pm

Adama wrote:
aozora13 wrote:Adama, that sounds like slavery. Even working for companies in the US usually a person gets 15 days (Realistically 10 days because 1 week for sick leave). However, at my current traineeship I have 25 days off so 5 weeks plus 13/14 holidays for the year so it is really nice.

America is just not the place if you want to have time off. It is not possible. Unless you work for a foreign company,


Basically. I had surgery and then had to return immediately to work. I couldn't function and had to go home. I received a written warning and was forced to make up the days I missed. They aren't joking around.



If you had a serious health condition that rendered you unable to work, you may be protected under the FMLA (Family and Medical Leave Act). To qualify, your employer must have at least 50 employees, and you need to have your doctor sign form WH-380-E. If your employer is in violation of FMLA, you can file a complaint with the department of labor. In the State of California, you'd also file form DFEH-300-03 (right to sue notice) with the California State Department of Fair Employment and Housing.

http://www.dol.gov/compliance/laws/comp-fmla.htm
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Postby Adama » Wed May 25, 2011 3:59 pm

momopi wrote:
Adama wrote:
aozora13 wrote:Adama, that sounds like slavery. Even working for companies in the US usually a person gets 15 days (Realistically 10 days because 1 week for sick leave). However, at my current traineeship I have 25 days off so 5 weeks plus 13/14 holidays for the year so it is really nice.

America is just not the place if you want to have time off. It is not possible. Unless you work for a foreign company,


Basically. I had surgery and then had to return immediately to work. I couldn't function and had to go home. I received a written warning and was forced to make up the days I missed. They aren't joking around.



If you had a serious health condition that rendered you unable to work, you may be protected under the FMLA (Family and Medical Leave Act). To qualify, your employer must have at least 50 employees, and you need to have your doctor sign form WH-380-E. If your employer is in violation of FMLA, you can file a complaint with the department of labor. In the State of California, you'd also file form DFEH-300-03 (right to sue notice) with the California State Department of Fair Employment and Housing.

http://www.dol.gov/compliance/laws/comp-fmla.htm


Employee handbook says if you make use of that before 1 year of employment, you may not have a job to come back to! (Phrased differently of course.)
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Postby jamesbond » Wed May 25, 2011 4:50 pm

Adama wrote:At my job, there is no vacation time the first year and only five days the second.


In Europe you get 4 to 6 weeks paid vacation your first year on the job. In addition, you also get paid holidays and paid sick days.

Americans are the most productive workers in the world, yet they get the least amount of time off from their jobs.

Europe is looking better and better to me! :D
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Postby Think Different » Wed May 25, 2011 5:01 pm

"Americans are the most productive workers in the world"

According to the latest research, this is no longer true. It's true that Americans spend more time in the office than most anyone else, but we also waste inordinate amounts of time surfing the net, sitting in useless meetings that accomplish nothing, hanging out at the water cooler BSing with colleagues, etc. As far as productivity per man hour "worked", the US is down the list quite a few notches now. You must realize that to the modern American mentality working yourself to death (or to a heart attack/stroke) is considered a badge of honor. It's a d*ck measuring contest: "well, I work 80 hours per work!". "That's nothing, I work 100 hours per week", and so on. It's pure insanity. I'm not opposed to hard work at all, but a hard worker should be compensated properly and that doesn't just mean with money.

What's the point of having lots of money, if you have no time off to enjoy it? That proverbial soon-to-be-divorced doctor or lawyer who never sees his family, because he works too much, but still has a $1M powerboat sitting unused in the harbor? What's the point? The low-income guy who works normal hours may have just a flat-bottom canoe, but at least he can have time off to go fishing with his son. Who's better off in this scenario? Waiting to get rich so you can spend it on the golf course when you retire someday? Boring! I've known men (and women) like this who end up with heart attacks or strokes and then are immobilized at age 60 and can't even enjoy retirement. How horrible! Putting off your whole life, so you can enjoy the last 15 "golden years" with your nagging wife or on the golf course? No thanks. I prefer to enjoy life as it comes, and not put it off until the end of my days.

Without a reasonable amount of sick leave and vacation, Americans are becoming burned out on the job and disillusioned. That's why we waste so much time at work: surfing the net is a form of escapism/vacation that we cannot otherwise get. It's not normal for a human to work like robots with no rest. The Europeans figured this out a long time ago, but America is still stuck in the sweat shop labor model and it's only getting worse, as fewer jobs are available and employers know they can milk every employee for every drop of energy. If you don't like it, there are 200 other people that would gladly take your job.
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Postby E_Irizarry » Wed May 25, 2011 5:36 pm

Think Different wrote:"Americans are the most productive workers in the world"

According to the latest research, this is no longer true. It's true that Americans spend more time in the office than most anyone else, but we also waste inordinate amounts of time surfing the net, sitting in useless meetings that accomplish nothing, hanging out at the water cooler BSing with colleagues, etc. As far as productivity per man hour "worked", the US is down the list quite a few notches now. You must realize that to the modern American mentality working yourself to death (or to a heart attack/stroke) is considered a badge of honor. It's a d*ck measuring contest: "well, I work 80 hours per work!". "That's nothing, I work 100 hours per week", and so on. It's pure insanity. I'm not opposed to hard work at all, but a hard worker should be compensated properly and that doesn't just mean with money.

What's the point of having lots of money, if you have no time off to enjoy it? That proverbial soon-to-be-divorced doctor or lawyer who never sees his family, because he works too much, but still has a $1M powerboat sitting unused in the harbor? What's the point? The low-income guy who works normal hours may have just a flat-bottom canoe, but at least he can have time off to go fishing with his son. Who's better off in this scenario? Waiting to get rich so you can spend it on the golf course when you retire someday? Boring! I've known men (and women) like this who end up with heart attacks or strokes and then are immobilized at age 60 and can't even enjoy retirement. How horrible! Putting off your whole life, so you can enjoy the last 15 "golden years" with your nagging wife or on the golf course? No thanks. I prefer to enjoy life as it comes, and not put it off until the end of my days.

Without a reasonable amount of sick leave and vacation, Americans are becoming burned out on the job and disillusioned. That's why we waste so much time at work: surfing the net is a form of escapism/vacation that we cannot otherwise get. It's not normal for a human to work like robots with no rest. The Europeans figured this out a long time ago, but America is still stuck in the sweat shop labor model and it's only getting worse, as fewer jobs are available and employers know they can milk every employee for every drop of energy. If you don't like it, there are 200 other people that would gladly take your job.


EPIC f***ing POST. +1
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Postby OutWest » Wed May 25, 2011 5:37 pm

Think Different wrote:
The_Hero_of_Twilight wrote:
Think Different wrote:Yeah, we make fun of the French, but they are the ones with balls. Their government has a healthy fear of their populace and it shows. The French people have real clout. Americans have been castrated by the government and their employers.


Well, even in that sense, Would France be a nation to meet good women, or is it like America (stuck up, "feminized" woman)?


Not in my experience. French women are independent and strong-willed, but they are classy and very feminine. If you can handle their strong will, they are wonderful. They are in my personal top 5 for favorite choices for foreign women. Note that like most western European women, French women would almost NEVER consider living in the US, so don't even consider trying to bring them here.



Hating the French as a group is great fun...many European countries tend that way...
but liking them as individuals is quite likely. French girls? Ah...fond thoughts there...
they are known for their "oral" skills....

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Postby S_Parc » Wed May 25, 2011 5:39 pm

Think Different wrote:That proverbial soon-to-be-divorced doctor or lawyer who never sees his family, because he works too much, but still has a $1M powerboat sitting unused in the harbor?


Here's the point ... that person can quit his job, sell the boat, move to Thailand, and never work a day again.

If I were a neurosurgeon, I'd work for exactly 7 years post-residency (that's $1-2 million in the bank) and retire. Then, I'd exercise, boink merrily, work on the great American novel, and do some research part-time for fun.
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Postby momopi » Wed May 25, 2011 6:17 pm

Adama wrote:Employee handbook says if you make use of that before 1 year of employment, you may not have a job to come back to! (Phrased differently of course.)


Contact the Wage and Hour Division of the United States Department of Labor, and see if they'd review the employee handbook for possible violations.

http://www.dol.gov/whd/contact_us.htm
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Postby odbo » Wed May 25, 2011 11:28 pm

E_Irizarry wrote:
Think Different wrote:"Americans are the most productive workers in the world"

According to the latest research, this is no longer true. It's true that Americans spend more time in the office than most anyone else, but we also waste inordinate amounts of time surfing the net, sitting in useless meetings that accomplish nothing, hanging out at the water cooler BSing with colleagues, etc. As far as productivity per man hour "worked", the US is down the list quite a few notches now. You must realize that to the modern American mentality working yourself to death (or to a heart attack/stroke) is considered a badge of honor. It's a d*ck measuring contest: "well, I work 80 hours per work!". "That's nothing, I work 100 hours per week", and so on. It's pure insanity. I'm not opposed to hard work at all, but a hard worker should be compensated properly and that doesn't just mean with money.

What's the point of having lots of money, if you have no time off to enjoy it? That proverbial soon-to-be-divorced doctor or lawyer who never sees his family, because he works too much, but still has a $1M powerboat sitting unused in the harbor? What's the point? The low-income guy who works normal hours may have just a flat-bottom canoe, but at least he can have time off to go fishing with his son. Who's better off in this scenario? Waiting to get rich so you can spend it on the golf course when you retire someday? Boring! I've known men (and women) like this who end up with heart attacks or strokes and then are immobilized at age 60 and can't even enjoy retirement. How horrible! Putting off your whole life, so you can enjoy the last 15 "golden years" with your nagging wife or on the golf course? No thanks. I prefer to enjoy life as it comes, and not put it off until the end of my days.

Without a reasonable amount of sick leave and vacation, Americans are becoming burned out on the job and disillusioned. That's why we waste so much time at work: surfing the net is a form of escapism/vacation that we cannot otherwise get. It's not normal for a human to work like robots with no rest. The Europeans figured this out a long time ago, but America is still stuck in the sweat shop labor model and it's only getting worse, as fewer jobs are available and employers know they can milk every employee for every drop of energy. If you don't like it, there are 200 other people that would gladly take your job.


EPIC f***ing POST. +1


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2J_d99qi8M[/youtube]
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Postby Think Different » Thu May 26, 2011 4:03 am

Yet another article today about it: Americans Forfeit $67 billion in vacation days in 2010.

http://money.cnn.com/2011/05/25/pf/unus ... htm?hpt=T2
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Postby have2fly » Mon May 30, 2011 9:10 pm

When I lived in France I loved local women. Yes, they are very independent and strong-willed. But in the same time MUCH more feminine, much more welcoming, they don't have that "don't bother me" look. Their faces are open, their conversation is non-biased, they like to get to know you deeply without considering you a creep or whatever else. Such a relief after living many years in the U.S. Oh, they also like to sit around the table drinking wine and laughing, not just "stand with cheap beer, eat cheap garbage pizza". Vacation? Hell yes! French enjoy their life, they work to live! I definitely recommend watching Michael Moore's "Sicko" movie to everyone that haven't seen it. He does truly remarkable job showing difference in healthcare AND life style between Europe and U.S. Even British are happier actually.
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Postby momopi » Tue May 31, 2011 7:25 am

have2fly wrote:When I lived in France I loved local women. Yes, they are very independent and strong-willed. But in the same time MUCH more feminine, much more welcoming, they don't have that "don't bother me" look. Their faces are open, their conversation is non-biased, they like to get to know you deeply without considering you a creep or whatever else. Such a relief after living many years in the U.S. Oh, they also like to sit around the table drinking wine and laughing, not just "stand with cheap beer, eat cheap garbage pizza". Vacation? Hell yes! French enjoy their life, they work to live! I definitely recommend watching Michael Moore's "Sicko" movie to everyone that haven't seen it. He does truly remarkable job showing difference in healthcare AND life style between Europe and U.S. Even British are happier actually.


Where in France did you live?
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Postby ajvf97 » Sun Jun 05, 2011 10:51 pm

I took 3 weeks of paid vacation back in March. The company I work for has a system where each employee accrues a certain amount of PTO (Paid Time Off) each pay period but it is up to the boss in their respective department to grant the vacation time. I took just over a month off a few years ago for the World Cup in Germany. Yeah. I had a lot of vacation time saved up by pretty much never calling in sick, strolling in late and/or being unproductive and my previous boss was acting all shocked when put in my request.

The thing is, there is a maximum amount of vacation time that an employee at my company can earn. If they reach the maximum then they can no longer accrue any more vacation time until they use some of the vacation time they already have saved up. So that's pretty much how I convinced my previous boss to give me that vacation. I said something like "Well, if I keep earning time off and never use it then it's just gonna sit there unused!"

My current boss is a lateral thinker (outside the box) and gave me only a good natured ribbing upon my return from my 3 weeks vacation. I explained that it was earned and needed and he, without hesitation, wholeheartedly agreed with me. He even mentioned during a meet-and-greet when he came on board last year that time off is important. He also mentioned that he once took 8 weeks off at a company that he used to work for. Ironically enough, his previous employer was reluctant to give him the time off as well but he used the same method of reasoning that I had used and in both cases, there was no debating what was rightfully earned.

My co-workers did not share the same sentiment. What is also ironic is that these same people who bash me for taking much needed and earned time off are the ones who always call in sick on Fridays, Mondays, right before holidays, always stroll in late and never get any work done once they arrive. Many of these colleagues are old, bitchy, fat, unhealthy americunts who can't stand a young man old enough to be their son showing them up in productivity and then taking a long vacation.

I will agree that Americans put in the most hours of work but are not the most productive. I could have told you that years ago. Every job I've ever had there have always been co-workers who clock in and "Check out" and their only solution is to not accept responsibility but rather be defiant and angry towards the boss and employees like me who simply punch in, get their shit done and go the f**k home.

So you know what? If I keep doing what I'm doing and continue to be smart in saving my vacation time, I could have enough time and money saved up by October or November to take another trip for 2 weeks abroad. In fact, that's what I'm going to do because one vacation of 2-3 weeks out of the entire f***ing year is not enough for one person to maintain their sanity. Not only that but I'll do it just to piss off those very same co-workers. f**k them. What do they know anyway?
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