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The core problem: Your mentality vs American mentality

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Postby Winston » Fri Nov 01, 2013 12:37 pm

Great rant OTB.

I agree that our wavelength is different somehow than the typical American. Not just in the ways that you describe, but in other ways that are hard to put into words too. There is like a rift between us and the mainstream American culture that's hard to explain in words.

I think there's another problem too, in that a lot of us also do not fit into groups and do not naturally conform to others. The thing is, being a nonconformist gets you judged as a weird loser in America, but not so much in other countries.

Also, we like women. If we didn't like women and only wanted to talk to men, we could easily find friendly men to talk to if we wanted to. It's the women that are very hard to connect with because they simply don't like to connect with others.

What I've noticed is that American girls are very closed, private and don't like to connect with others, not even with other women that they don't know.

That Ukrainian girl I met in Las Vegas admitted to me that she noticed that guys were friendly and easy to talk to in America, but the girls were not. They were very closed and did not like to connect or share their feelings with her, which is different than how girls in Ukraine are.

So the problem is not just us or our different wavelength from American culture. American girls in general do not like to connect with others. They are very closed, private, distant and in their own shell that they do not welcome others into. We don't like that, so we suffer, because we desire to connect with girls. Simple as that.

Does that make sense?
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

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"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
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Postby OTB » Sat Nov 02, 2013 10:05 pm

Thanks for pulling this back out Winston. I feel like a foreigner in my own country. I'm very personable but when it comes to establishing a relationship with a AW it would be very difficult because I don't conform to this culture. I do my own thing and have always been that way. I even have a co-worker who told me I should move to another country. She knows from working with me for three and a half years my way of thinking is not very American.

So if I am to meet a girl here she would have to be a free thinker/non-conformist which is EXTREMELY rare in this country.
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Postby Winston » Sun Nov 03, 2013 1:37 am

You're welcome OTB. I think the key problems we have are:

1. We don't fit into American culture, wavelength and mentality.
2. We don't fit into groups in general because we are non-conformists.
3. As a result of #2, we aren't good at breaking into closed cliques. In America to have a social life, you have to break into closed cliques. It's not easy and is hard work and requires effort. But even when you do break into a clique, your social life is then LIMITED by that clique, so if there aren't any desirable women in the group who like you, then you are still out of luck. In contrast, in most other countries it's a lot easier to have a social life because you don't to break into closed cliques and people are glad to invite you out to places.

Result:

If you don't fit in, you don't appear vibrant and alive, or in your element. Thus you appear weak and non-thriving. This makes you less attractive to others and makes you feel more depressed and lonely as well. It becomes a vicious cycle.

Btw, what do you think of my new four point comparison pamphlet?

http://www.happierabroad.com/Pamphlet.pdf
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

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"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
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Postby Winston » Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:29 am

OTB,
I think you will find this very revealing. This guy talks about how becoming a better person turns American girls away from you.

http://www.happierabroad.com/forum/view ... hp?t=18906
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

Don't forget my HA Grand Ebook and Dating Sites!

"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
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Postby jamesbond » Tue Nov 05, 2013 12:14 pm

Winston wrote:In America to have a social life, you have to break into closed cliques. It's not easy and is hard work and requires effort. But even when you do break into a clique, your social life is then LIMITED by that clique, so if there aren't any desirable women in the group who like you, then you are still out of luck. In contrast, in most other countries it's a lot easier to have a social life because you don't to break into closed cliques and people are glad to invite you out to places.


I remember having this discussion with my roommate when I was away at college in the early 90's. We both agreed that the culture of the US is toxic and not conducive to meeting people.

Me and my roommate also talked about the fact that in America, you need to make your friends early in life (like in grade school and high school) because once you are out of school, it's very difficult to meet people.

In the US, women only meet men through their friends. So in order to meet women in America, you need to have friends who can introduce you to single women. This has been true in America for decades I believe.
"When I think about the idea of getting involved with an American woman, I don't know if I should laugh .............. or vomit!"

"Trying to meet women in America is like trying to decipher Egyptian hieroglyphics."
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Postby Winston » Tue Nov 05, 2013 12:25 pm

I just realized something else.

Some of us probably do like having groups of friends to share good times with and hang out with. Humans by nature want to belong to something, such as a nice group, community or organization. And I think that is true of us too.

The problem is that in America, there aren't really any groups or organizations that we get along with or vibe with. So we don't feel truly accepted or a part of something. We also don't click with the culture and mentality, nor thrive in it.

Simply put, we don't want to conform to groups or cultures that we don't like and don't have much in common with. Even if we wanted to, we couldn't. It's not really a choice. You can't force yourself to be something you're not or to be part of a group you don't belong in. In other words, you can't conform to something you don't like, even if you wanted to.

That's probably the core problem here, not that we don't like groups or don't like belonging to communities or teams. We simply don't get along and can't be something we're not. It has nothing to do with social skills.

Does that make sense?
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

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"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
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Postby Winston » Wed Jan 01, 2014 2:04 am

OTB,
Here's my theory that I posted in another thread that's related to yours. What do you think? Does it make sense?

http://www.happierabroad.com/forum/view ... hp?t=21583

1. As OTB explained in his other threads, our problem isn't our looks, since if you look around you, you will see regular average Joes with AW. Our problem is that we are NONCONFORMIST, and thus we don't fit into mainstream cliques in America.

We also think too much, which alienates us from the mainstream, because society is set up for people who follow a routine and do what they are supposed to without thinking too much. It's not set up for people who think too much. Thus, the dumber you are, the easier it will be to get along with others. So we don't get along with many people.

2. In America, social life is all about CLIQUES. You are expected to mind your own business and limit your social interaction to within your own clique or family. AW aren't comfortable talking to strangers. They limit their socializing to within their own clique. If you are outside their clique, they aren't friendly to you. But even if you are in her clique, if you aren't her type, she won't be into you either, which goes without saying. Regardless, we aren't conformists so we don't break into cliques naturally.

3. Therefore, without a clique, the only way we can meet women is through COLD APPROACH. However, cold approach is not welcome in America (except in the movies). It's not an appropriate way of meeting women. AW don't welcome it. Only AW in the movies are open to cold approach, but not the AW in real everyday reality. It's more acceptable overseas in other countries to meet women that way, but not in the US.

4. Therefore, we are out of luck, since we don't fit into cliques, and cold approach isn't welcome or appropriate in America. Thus, we are left out in the cold.

Does that make sense? I think this is a logical explanation. What do you think?
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

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"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
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Postby Winston » Fri Mar 21, 2014 8:01 am

While observing people today, I realized why we don't fit in with mainstream America. Here are probably the key differences between us, the HappierAbroaders, and mainstream Americans.

1. Mainstream Americans thrive on routine and familiarity. They aren't comfortable with strangers, and only talk to strangers when its business related. That's why they are cliquish. They live for a stable work routine and a familiar group of friends and family. They prefer routine and familiarity.

We, on the other hand, thrive on novelty, new experiences, adventure, and the exotic. We enjoy meeting new people and thrive on it. We are more comfortable with unfamiliarity and more open minded. But that's not how mainstream Americans are.

2. Mainstream Americans live to work, literally. Work makes them happy. Having a job is fulfilling to them. This is what they are conditioned to believe, and they follow it. But we do not live to work. We see it as slavery and a barrier to freedom.

3. We deem things like love, dating, beautiful girls, flirtation, being able to pick up girls and chat them up, being able to get sex anytime we want, etc. as mandatory necessities. But mainstream Americans don't. They see those things as sentimental stuff in movies and TV and not part of practical life. And they view them as extras.

Their attitude is: If it happens great, if not, then it's not meant to be yet. The most important thing to them is that they have a JOB to go to everyday that they are happy with. Work is all that matters. Everything else is optional. (Personally, I've never understood how one can be happy only having a job and nothing else. But that's what America preaches for some odd reason, and you are expected to think the same way.)

They also believe that once you get married and settled down, all these things become non-issues anyway. Everything revolves around the stability and routine of work and family. Adventure and exploration, new experiences, meeting new people, dating new women, going to new places, etc. are dreams and fantasies to them, not necessities.

These core differences in mentality means that we have a different vibe and wavelength than the mainstream. This means that we cannot relate to them and they cannot relate to us.

Plus, in America you have to join a group or clique to meet people. You gotta have a good social network, in other words. People in America are more comfortable meeting you if you are part of a couple or in a group, but not if you're alone. This is why couples make friends with other couples easier than singles do. When you are a couple, people seem more friendly and talkative to both of you when you go out. But when you're alone, they ignore you. Even waiters at restaurants prefer to talk to couples rather than customers sitting alone. I've noticed this pattern.

In most other countries, it is far easier to meet people by yourself. People are cool with that for some reason. I don't know why. But the big difference is there.

Anyway, since we are nonconformists, we are unlikely to be part of any group in the mainstream. So we are left out and trapped with no options.

What do you think? Does that make sense?
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

Don't forget my HA Grand Ebook and Dating Sites!

"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
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Postby Winston » Wed Apr 30, 2014 10:23 am

I just realized something. I think I've found the answer to a long-time mystery I've always wondered about:

Why is it that I can be very outgoing and social in America, yet not make any good friends or have a great social life?

You see, there is an underlying assumption that if you are outgoing and social, then you will make friends everywhere you go in America. In high school and college, I began to imitate the characters on TV sitcoms, but that didn't get me any dates with American girls or create a great social life.

Anyway, I think I realized the reason for this. I (and many of you here) are on a different wavelength than that of normal mainstream Americans. Typical Americans (especially AW) are more on a superficial/fake/artificial wavelength that is composed of the following characteristics:

- superficial
- fake
- artificial
- soulless
- robotic, mechanized (programmed by the elite)
- focused on money, business, status
- no sense of romanticism, considers romance to be outdated in a cold modern unfeeling world
- paranoid and uptight toward strangers
- lives for consumerism, like they are supposed to in accord with their programming
- cliquish, social to their clique members but not toward strangers
- conformist, willing to adapt to a toxic, soulless culture if everyone else does
- afraid of what others think, fear of being different
- attuned to the practical, not the abstract or philosophical

In contrast, I'm more on a deep/authentic wavelength with the following traits:

- deep
- authentic, genuine
- soulful
- romantic, lives for romanticism in culture and life
- direct, honest, no-nonsense
- rich inner life
- desires to connect and develop social relations
- thinks for himself, does not need to conform
- not afraid of what others think
- not cliquish, open with strangers
- attuned to the abstract and philosophical rather than the practical, existentialist type

Many of us here have the above traits I'm sure.

This also explains why when I am outgoing in Russia, it gets results and fits in the flow. Because the average Russian is on a more deeper/authentic wavelength than the average American. So it's easier for me to talk to them and vibe with them, even though we are from different cultures. See what I mean?

So this explains why I can be outgoing and social in America yet not connect with others or have a good social life. Or get dates for that matter. What do you think?

A second rift:

In addition, there is also a second rift between me and mainstream Americans, as well as many guys on this forum as well.

You see, most guys are focused on the practical areas of life. Some guys are into both practical and abstract areas, but most are left-brained practical. I'm different. I'm more heavily focused on abstract, philosophical areas, which is how a true intellectual is. In fact, I would say that I am very far toward the abstract world that most people are not in.

This is why even on my own forum, many guys cannot relate to me or understand me. Mr S even told me that there are many guys who agree with my message on HA but do not vibe with me personally, or have bad chemistry with me (e.g. AmericaninBangkok, CheeseRaider, etc.) I think he's right. And this explains why, at least partially.

Mr S is one of the few guys I know who is heavily into abstract subjects who can talk to me on that wavelength. Mitchell is another guy that relates to me on a deeper level. But most guys can't or don't.

So in this area, there is a second rift between me and most Americans (who are focused on the practical) and even between me and many of the forum members here who agree with my message. Any of you notice that?

Thus there are at least two major rifts between me and mainstream Americans. Does that make sense? I think it does.
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

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"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
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Postby Winston » Mon Jun 09, 2014 5:49 am

OTB,
Your explanations about differences in mentality are true, but they only touch the surface of the rift between us and mainstream Americans. I have another theory that goes deeper, beyond words even. What do you think?

http://www.happierabroad.com/forum/view ... hp?t=23301
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

Don't forget my HA Grand Ebook and Dating Sites!

"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
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Postby pete98146 » Mon Jun 09, 2014 6:27 pm

My wife and I just got back from a weekend in San Francisco. SF is very touristy and there were thousands upon thousands of Europeans walking around taking in all the sites. It was fun sitting on a bench and observing them and how they differ from the Americans. Make no mistake, the Euros were generally MUCH MORE robust, smiling, laughing, outgoing (yes a bit loud but that's ok) because they were enjoying life and everything that a cool town like SF has to offer.

Back at our hotel, a European lady (pretty sure she was a Spaniard) hopped on the elevator with me and my wife and she made a point of saying "hello, how is your trip going?" We were staying on floor 14 and she was on floor 12. As she was exiting the elevator she turned to us and said "good bye and have a good day." How refreshing was this gesture? Call it silly but I thought it was cool and it demonstrated what is missing in the US.

I live in Seattle (world famous for the Seattle Freeze) and this type of outgoing, kind and easy going dialogue would never happen here and it's SAD. But I think this is quickly becoming the norm in all of the US ie people just don't care about the person standing next to them. It's about me, me, me, me, me here in the US. Interacting with a stranger? How creepy!!!!!!!!

So hats off to that nice European lady because she made me smile and her simply gesture made me realize how that this country is socially retarded and bankrupt.
Last edited by pete98146 on Mon Jun 09, 2014 10:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby OTB » Mon Jun 09, 2014 10:26 pm

So hats off to that nice European lady because she made me smile and her simply gesture made me realize how that this country is socially retarded and bankrupt.


Socially retarded is good way to sum up the social disconnectedness among people in this country. I feel I could write a book about this topic.
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