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Why Aren't More Guys Here Focused on Getting Rich?

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Postby HouseMD » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:03 pm

Cornfed wrote:
HouseMD wrote: Every time someone claims it is impossible to make it on your own in this world, most particularly in America, pisses me off to a great degree. I have worked my way from a homeless teenage runaway with no social skills and an unattractive face and body to a medical student and former healthcare worker that is in good physical shape and has many close friends. Your life is what you make of it, and your successes and failures are yours to own. Some things make it harder- being a homeless outcast without a high school diploma three thousand miles from home, for instance- but it is still ultimately your failure to overcome those challenges that leads to your downfall, not the obstacles themselves.

Perhaps there is some vast conspiracy out there that is going to crush the world beneath its might one day, but I would rather at least try to live a life worth living until that comes to pass, for simply saying "the odds are stacked, f**k it, I quit" is a weak and pathetic course of action that demonstrates a complete lack of conviction and faith in one's own ability to accomplish things.

You think that being a medical student is "making it on your own in the world" and showing faith in "your own ability to accomplish things"? Lol, that's attempting to join the cartel and be looked after like a baby your whole life, and you may have left bit late to do that. As to the rest of your spiel, it is pretty clear that you have no real knowledge of the situation and are just another fantasist believing what you want to be true. As a former homeless teen, it is natural that you want to think of DaddyGov as some benevolent entity that will take you under his wing and hand you approval, resources and social status. Enjoy your delusions while they last.


Delusions? Truly, you are one to talk. And how am I a servant of the state? I won't accept medicare, nor will I be an employee. How is accepting pre-arranged cash payments for services rendered being a slave? And what is your alternative to this "slavery" of me accepting a payment that I agree to for a service that I agree to provide?

And I cant wait to hear the weapons grade derp that is likely your alternative to being a functional part of a society, earning your money, then getting the f**k out.
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Postby gsjackson » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:03 pm

HouseMD wrote:
Jeremy wrote:Tucking your little mangina between your legs and serving some despot while sporting a simper doesn't make a man out of anyone. Would you like a coffee, master? How about a nice rim job to finish you off?

The longer I live, the more appealing the vagabond route seems. I just wasted 2 hours applying for a grocery bagging position at Safeway. It took me that long because they require applicants to enter their resumes manually, instead of just e-mailing the word documents. It's likely no one will even read my resume anyway because it doesn't happen to have the right "buzzwords." Into the abyss. Ridiculous.


Get some skills so you don't have to work at Safeway. Most states have community colleges that will literally pay you to attend after grants. Find a job that can make you some money and work to earn the credentials for said job. Use your earnings to make something where YOU are in control. My first three jobs were a McDonalds, a supermarket, and a cold storage warehouse that was entirely staffed by ex cons. I didnt let that shit get me down, I went to college and dug my a** out from under the shit that life had handed me. Soon I will be where I want to be in life, at the top of a field. And I will not accept insurance, government or otherwise, for my services, because that is just letting yourself be a slave to yet another paymaster. I will serve my patients and the insurance companies and government can go f**k themselves. Point being, if you work hard and have a useful set of skills, you make your own rules. I wouldn't be who I am today if I hadn't spent years working awful service jobs that made me decide to never serve another person as less than an equal again for as long as I lived.

I am trying to show you the way. There is hope for a better life if you have the strength of will to build the life you desire. Don't give up, for you have everything to gain in trying, as by the sound of it you have nothing to lose by failing.

There is nothing less manly than backing down from a perfectly surmountable challenge and whining like a bitch. This forum used to be for those willing to make positive changes in their lives whatever the cost, be it hard work or moving to a place where you didnt speak a word of the local language and couldn't stand the food, not for boys that were complaining about their unfortunate circumstances and not seeking to change them.


Presuming to answer for him: IIRC, he has a bachelor's degree in economics and has applied unsuccessfully for lots of jobs, so your inspiration will have to overtake him a couple rungs further up the ladder past community college.

And if you plan not to do business with the insurance companies as a practicing MD, it will be very interesting to see how that model works out. The "health" insurance companies control what you can earn, and the malpractice insurance companies make sure your operating costs are high enough that you have to earn it.
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Postby Moretorque » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:04 pm

Repatriate wrote:
Cornfed wrote:
HouseMD wrote: Every time someone claims it is impossible to make it on your own in this world, most particularly in America, pisses me off to a great degree. I have worked my way from a homeless teenage runaway with no social skills and an unattractive face and body to a medical student and former healthcare worker that is in good physical shape and has many close friends. Your life is what you make of it, and your successes and failures are yours to own. Some things make it harder- being a homeless outcast without a high school diploma three thousand miles from home, for instance- but it is still ultimately your failure to overcome those challenges that leads to your downfall, not the obstacles themselves.

Perhaps there is some vast conspiracy out there that is going to crush the world beneath its might one day, but I would rather at least try to live a life worth living until that comes to pass, for simply saying "the odds are stacked, f**k it, I quit" is a weak and pathetic course of action that demonstrates a complete lack of conviction and faith in one's own ability to accomplish things.

You think that being a medical student is "making it on your own in the world" and showing faith in "your own ability to accomplish things"? Lol, that's attempting to join the cartel and be looked after like a baby your whole life, and you may have left bit late to do that. As to the rest of your spiel, it is pretty clear that you have no real knowledge of the situation and are just another fantasist believing what you want to be true. As a former homeless teen, it is natural that you want to think of DaddyGov as some benevolent entity that will take you under his wing and hand you approval, resources and social status. Enjoy your delusions while they last.


Here's the thing about the various loony bin conspiracy theorist guys like yourself. You never propose any actual solutions. How does one not "cooperate" with the cartel? Do you propose that people try and drop off the grid and live on their homestead plantations? How does one achieve this lifestyle of not being under anyone's control.



Hey guy if you have not figured out the financial system that runs our lives is a conspiracy con job you are not to bright, Cornfed is right, how people go about their lives is their own business but the intelligent people know to lay low and hide the best you can if you do not want the hassel this system offers trying to make your way in it. If you are connected to the con directly it is a different story and even then who would want the benefits at the cost of your soul if there is such a thing, also not to mention bastille day if de dumb daa daa herd ever figures it out which is highly unlikely since the average IQ world wide is 79. DAAaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Postby Moretorque » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:05 pm

HouseMD wrote:
Cornfed wrote:
HouseMD wrote: Every time someone claims it is impossible to make it on your own in this world, most particularly in America, pisses me off to a great degree. I have worked my way from a homeless teenage runaway with no social skills and an unattractive face and body to a medical student and former healthcare worker that is in good physical shape and has many close friends. Your life is what you make of it, and your successes and failures are yours to own. Some things make it harder- being a homeless outcast without a high school diploma three thousand miles from home, for instance- but it is still ultimately your failure to overcome those challenges that leads to your downfall, not the obstacles themselves.

Perhaps there is some vast conspiracy out there that is going to crush the world beneath its might one day, but I would rather at least try to live a life worth living until that comes to pass, for simply saying "the odds are stacked, f**k it, I quit" is a weak and pathetic course of action that demonstrates a complete lack of conviction and faith in one's own ability to accomplish things.

You think that being a medical student is "making it on your own in the world" and showing faith in "your own ability to accomplish things"? Lol, that's attempting to join the cartel and be looked after like a baby your whole life, and you may have left bit late to do that. As to the rest of your spiel, it is pretty clear that you have no real knowledge of the situation and are just another fantasist believing what you want to be true. As a former homeless teen, it is natural that you want to think of DaddyGov as some benevolent entity that will take you under his wing and hand you approval, resources and social status. Enjoy your delusions while they last.


Delusions? Truly, you are one to talk. And how am I a servant of the state? I won't accept medicare, nor will I be an employee. How is accepting pre-arranged cash payments for services rendered being a slave? And what is your alternative to this "slavery" of me accepting a payment that I agree to for a service that I agree to provide?

And I cant wait to hear the weapons grade derp that is likely your alternative to being a functional part of a society, earning your money, then getting the f**k out.


There isn't going to be any cash you dope!
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Postby HouseMD » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:06 pm

Cornfed wrote:
Repatriate wrote: Here's the thing about the various loony bin conspiracy theorist guys like yourself. You never propose any actual solutions. How does one not "cooperate" with the cartel? Do you propose that people try and drop off the grid and live on their homestead plantations? How does one achieve this lifestyle of not being under anyone's control.

That is a topic for several threads.

Elaborate away, resident mastermind of surviving the coming apocalypse. Repatriate and I eagerly await your response.
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Postby Maverick » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:11 pm

Moretorque wrote:
HouseMD wrote:
Jeremy wrote:Tucking your little mangina between your legs and serving some despot while sporting a simper doesn't make a man out of anyone. Would you like a coffee, master? How about a nice rim job to finish you off?

The longer I live, the more appealing the vagabond route seems. I just wasted 2 hours applying for a grocery bagging position at Safeway. It took me that long because they require applicants to enter their resumes manually, instead of just e-mailing the word documents. It's likely no one will even read my resume anyway because it doesn't happen to have the right "buzzwords." Into the abyss. Ridiculous.


Get some skills so you don't have to work at Safeway. Most states have community colleges that will literally pay you to attend after grants. Find a job that can make you some money and work to earn the credentials for said job. Use your earnings to make something where YOU are in control. My first three jobs were a McDonalds, a supermarket, and a cold storage warehouse that was entirely staffed by ex cons. I didnt let that shit get me down, I went to college and dug my a** out from under the shit that life had handed me. Soon I will be where I want to be in life, at the top of a field. And I will not accept insurance, government or otherwise, for my services, because that is just letting yourself be a slave to yet another paymaster. I will serve my patients and the insurance companies and government can go f**k themselves. Point being, if you work hard and have a useful set of skills, you make your own rules. I wouldn't be who I am today if I hadn't spent years working awful service jobs that made me decide to never serve another person as less than an equal again for as long as I lived.

I am trying to show you the way. There is hope for a better life if you have the strength of will to build the life you desire. Don't give up, for you have everything to gain in trying, as by the sound of it you have nothing to lose by failing.

There is nothing less manly than backing down from a perfectly surmountable challenge and whining like a bitch. This forum used to be for those willing to make positive changes in their lives whatever the cost, be it hard work or moving to a place where you didnt speak a word of the local language and couldn't stand the food, not for boys that were complaining about their unfortunate circumstances and not seeking to change them.



The skills you will learn in college are designed these days for serfdom to the state and the debt burden they carry makes this point.


Personally, I agree with HouseMD. I'm in the medical field (as a diagnostician) as well and I'm also working towards starting my own business.

Even society collapses, medical people will STILL be valuable because people will get sick and hurt and will need to be treated.

Also, if money no longer becomes valuable, people will still need to get food, shelter, etc somehow. So there WILL be bartering going on (even if its in a simple form). A person that is a successful businessman will have a deep understanding of value exchange and, thus, will most likely do well in a situation like this.

Do I know how to survive in the outdoors? No, not really. BUT I could easily use my medical knowledge to link up with a group that includes an able outdoorsman, as I will have a lot of value to offer.

See, backup plans, my friends. ;)
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Postby gsjackson » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:12 pm

[quote="HouseMD
I won't accept medicare.[/quote]

Oh, so no poor or middle-income elderly patients for you, then. Well, you will be completely at the mercy of a cartel of bloodsucking middlemen who provide no service (insurance companies), unless you plan on rounding up a clientele of the ultra-affluent. In which case, the moral authority of your pull-yourself-up-by-the-bootstraps sermons might be diminished somewhat in the eyes of people who are looking squarely at the dramatically increasing polarization of wealth and trying to figure out just what the heck is going on.
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Postby Cornfed » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:15 pm

HouseMD wrote:Delusions? Truly, you are one to talk. And how am I a servant of the state? I won't accept medicare, nor will I be an employee. How is accepting pre-arranged cash payments for services rendered being a slave? And what is your alternative to this "slavery" of me accepting a payment that I agree to for a service that I agree to provide?

As a doctor, if they let you be a doctor, your every waking moment will be controller by the state/Rockefeller cartel. Did you not realize this when you signed up? It will probably not even be possible to imagine you are in "private practice" by the time you graduate. You might want to do some research on the subject.
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Postby Maverick » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:31 pm

HouseMD, while I do agree with your points, as a practicing medical provider, your thoughts will be more on covering your ass than actually treating your patients.

Unfortunately, everyone is looking to sue us for everything and they oftentimes win. It's one of the reasons why I'm trying to get out of health care in the US. In my opinion, it's more risky than starting your own business.

While it is a high paying field that is noble to enter, most students don't realize just how bad it can get. IMO, it's not a good long-term career. But, of course, to each their own.
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Postby HouseMD » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:34 pm

gsjackson wrote:[quote="HouseMD
I won't accept medicare.


Oh, so no poor or middle-income elderly patients for you, then. Well, you will be completely at the mercy of a cartel of bloodsucking middlemen who provide no service (insurance companies), unless you plan on rounding up a clientele of the ultra-affluent. In which case, the moral authority of your pull-yourself-up-by-the-bootstraps sermons might be diminished somewhat in the eyes of people who are looking squarely at the dramatically increasing polarization of wealth and trying to figure out just what the heck is going on.[/quote]

It is actually cheaper for many patients to pay for surgery out of pocket than pay with insurance due to the added costs insurance companies force upon providers. Surgery center of oklahoma is a cash only surgical center, which can perform an inguinal hernia repair for $3,060. The average cost of the same procedure in a hospital is $14,000. Even with insurance, you would likely end up paying more than 3k, as surgical copays are often 2k plus 20% of the cost of surgery. My insurance is good, in network it would cost me a 1k copay plus 2600 (20% coinsurance on 13k) for a total of 3600 or 570 dollars more than the place that doesnt accept insurance. Plus I plan to offer discount rates based on patient income and ability to pay and do some pro bono work, because its the ethical thing to do. How is it unethical to provide a needed service at reduced cost to the consumer and society? And how is it unethical to choose how many charity cases I perform, rather than being forced to perform them by a hospital employer? Look up surgery center of oklahoma, or any of the primary care practices that have gone cash only. The care costs LESS and is better than that offered by those with the overhead of insurance.
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Postby djfourmoney » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:40 pm

HouseMD wrote:
djfourmoney wrote:
Rich wrote:I'm not going to be "rich" by what many people would think of as rich but I am really focussed on having "enough" money. I don't think I have what it takes to be rich but I can get enough money for my needs.

I'm up to year 14 ie if I left my job tomorrow I'd have enough money to last for 14 years (1500 USD per month inflation adjusted - inflation rate of 3%, rate of return of 6% after tax). I'm a way off from getting to my goal of 25 years but really keen to make it.


The official rate of inflation already makes your plan flawed; The Unofficial inflation number is around 9%.

It also stands to go up, though I don't believe we'll ever experience the hyperinflation alarmist like to talk about.

IMHO and I don't claim to be an expert but it seems to me you need to project what inflation is going to be 10-15-20 years out and adjust whichever one is easier -

Lifestyle or Income source

However the truth is worst than that, since 1970 on some items vital to being considered "Middle Class" have gone up 200-300%!

Cornfed is right, the economy has been basically stagnant since the 1970's, Dean Baker has been saying this for a very long time actually.


There is a counter to this, however. What you can own at the same income level would be mind blowing to a person in the 70s. While they might have hardly been able to afford a color TV, we have flat screens for a fraction of our yearly income that are larger than the largest of TVs at that time. We can afford cell phones, computers, cars, a washer and dryer, a refrigerator, international flights, you name it, many of which were only possessed by the wealthy in years past. In 1980, you had to be an iBanker to have a cell phone- today most African have one. Many of us are relatively upset that there are those who have so much more than us, leading us to forget how great the things we own actually are. Income inequality is a bitch like that.

The essentials of life have become more expensive, yes, but many of the amenities that make modern life what it is have decreased in relative price ten to a hundredfold compared to the 70s.

And if you want to strike a blow to those that run this country, make as much money as you can as fast as you can, then retire overseas and spend it elsewhere. Pulling money out of their system is the only way to make them feel some pain- you cant funnel all the money to the top if it never enters the funnel to begin with. But it will take a lot of people relocating and renouncing their citizenship to make any real difference.


Color TV's made in the US by various companies like Thompson Electronics (RCA) are now outsourced to cheaper locations to maintain profit margins but offer the same product at a lower price to manufacture. Same with computers, all manufactured in Southeast Asia, including Apple.

I don't disagree technology advances have made products previously enjoyed by the wealth affordable, it's they way in which it was done is what many have a problem with.

The US/EU/Asia is switching to a information based economy when society was not prepared for it; Who's fault is that? Are you suppose to read tea leaves?

More wealth was created coming out of the Great Depression then there was going into it. The question becomes are you going to take advantage of that and how?

Its the how that people get stuck on.

Everybody has a skill they can put to work. I've given several examples... I am going the blog/media route, I believe I have found a niche to exploit.

I don't think what I am doing will be funded by an angel fund, so I am not sure getting a business plan together from Fiver will help here. I really just need some cold hard cash, I think $5K will get it done, it could be less.

Some of that cheap technology can be put to use, but I think too many people are thinking far too conventionally.
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Postby HouseMD » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:48 pm

Maverick wrote:HouseMD, while I do agree with your points, as a practicing medical provider, your thoughts will be more on covering your a** than actually treating your patients.

Unfortunately, everyone is looking to sue us for everything and they oftentimes win. It's one of the reasons why I'm trying to get out of health care in the US. In my opinion, it's more risky than starting your own business.

While it is a high paying field that is noble to enter, most students don't realize just how bad it can get. IMO, it's not a good long-term career. But, of course, to each their own.


I was in allied health prior to med school for 5 years, so I am well aware of CYA, the Joint Commission, etc, and the fact that I will likely do more paperwork than patient care. Much of the paperwork is related to reimbursement and accreditation, as well as follow up care, the former two of which I hope to avoid by working at a cash only outpatient surgery center and the latter of which I hope to limit due to the outpatient nature of the cases I am looking to perform. Working in the system is hell, I dont want to work on an inpatient hospital basis after my residency ever again, aside from the cases that go bad. Just going to have to keep a sizeable malpractice policy to cover my ass and hopefully life will be good. I just have to think outside the box a bit.
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Postby gsjackson » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:49 pm

HouseMD wrote:
gsjackson wrote:[quote="HouseMD
I won't accept medicare.


Oh, so no poor or middle-income elderly patients for you, then. Well, you will be completely at the mercy of a cartel of bloodsucking middlemen who provide no service (insurance companies), unless you plan on rounding up a clientele of the ultra-affluent. In which case, the moral authority of your pull-yourself-up-by-the-bootstraps sermons might be diminished somewhat in the eyes of people who are looking squarely at the dramatically increasing polarization of wealth and trying to figure out just what the heck is going on.


It is actually cheaper for many patients to pay for surgery out of pocket than pay with insurance due to the added costs insurance companies force upon providers. Surgery center of oklahoma is a cash only surgical center, which can perform an inguinal hernia repair for $3,060. The average cost of the same procedure in a hospital is $14,000. Even with insurance, you would likely end up paying more than 3k, as surgical copays are often 2k plus 20% of the cost of surgery. My insurance is good, in network it would cost me a 1k copay plus 2600 (20% coinsurance on 13k) for a total of 3600 or 570 dollars more than the place that doesnt accept insurance. Plus I plan to offer discount rates based on patient income and ability to pay and do some pro bono work, because its the ethical thing to do. How is it unethical to provide a needed service at reduced cost to the consumer and society? And how is it unethical to choose how many charity cases I perform, rather than being forced to perform them by a hospital employer? Look up surgery center of oklahoma, or any of the primary care practices that have gone cash only. The care costs LESS and is better than that offered by those with the overhead of insurance.[/quote]

Hey, I'm all for it, if you can do it, which seems pretty doubtful in the US. My parents paid about 50 bucks to produce me back in 1950. And they paid out of pocket, as most medical consumers did back then. But in the interim the medical services industry has been taken over by the insurance industry, which has totally distorted the market. If you can function outside their distortion, more power to you.

But I'm going to pay careful attention to cornfed or anybody else who can help me understand why every aspect of the economy has been taken over and corrupted by the financial sector. And I'm pretty certain this subject is not irrelevant to the job market as a whole, which so many are having frustrating encounters with these days, especially white males.
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Postby Cornfed » Sun Aug 18, 2013 9:53 pm

HouseMD wrote: I was in allied health prior to med school for 5 years, so I am well aware of CYA, the Joint Commission, etc, and the fact that I will likely do more paperwork than patient care.

OK, so you know you are essentially trying to become a government bureaucrat. How does this fit with your spiel about making it on your own?
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Postby djfourmoney » Sun Aug 18, 2013 10:36 pm

Cornfed wrote:
HouseMD wrote: I was in allied health prior to med school for 5 years, so I am well aware of CYA, the Joint Commission, etc, and the fact that I will likely do more paperwork than patient care.

OK, so you know you are essentially trying to become a government bureaucrat. How does this fit with your spiel about making it on your own?


Seems to me you want Medicare Ad-Hoc which only benefits the rich or the overly prepared.

Government is not evil, it depends how much power you give it and it depends on an informed and politically active populace. The problem with people offering solutions is they often have NO IDEA how to implement them without death and destruction. Small things like elimination of traffic lights in some areas and building more technology into the cars to prevent them from hitting each other due to driver error are quick and easy things that can be done.

Squelching about how healthcare is administered and who does it, its meaningless.
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