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My thesis: Modern men lose the dating game

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Re: My thesis: Modern men lose the dating game

Postby WorldTraveler » Mon Dec 16, 2013 12:33 am

Someone wrote:There are some optimistic bloggers in the "manosphere" who pen articles with titles like "Why Women Lose the Dating Game. You can read their arguments at your leisure. The general meme seems to be very popular in the media and pop-culture: women get older and their pool shrinks, while all the eligible bachelors are snapped up quickly.

In my opinion the promulgators of this myth are wrong, dead wrong. The losers in the modern dating game are men, not women.

Here's why:

1) Single women tend to be quite happy and well-adjusted and lead productive, fulfilling lives, while single men are lonely and usually afflicted with serious psychological problems stemming from loneliness. The reason for single women being happy and content is that they maintain good social networks consisting of friends and family; on the other hand, men don't network very well, and tend to lose their social connections in adult years. This creates acute loneliness for single men which is not the case for single women. Thus, men depend on women for companionship, while the reverse isn't true. The same applies to sex. Men depend on women for regular sex much more than vice-versa.

2) If men uniquely depend on women for sex and companionship, what do women depend on men for? Historically, resources -- a general term for financial or material investments. But the current generation of women is economically independent and well-educated, which is different from before. Thus, women don't depend on men for resources to the same extent as before, they have resources themselves.

3) So far, the score is 2:0 (sex/companionship vs. NO dependency). What about social stigma? Aren't spinsters stigmatized in society, and don't women want to be mothers? No and no.
a) Social stigma: single men are actually more stigmatized by society than single women. They are treated as potential criminals or outcasts, and also often suspected of being homosexual. The same doesn't apply to women to the same extent. Women are rarely suspected of being deviants or lesbians.
b) Motherhood: In modern Western counties 20-25% of women are childless, but even the ones who have children didn't necessarily want them. In my experience, women's "maternal instinct" is a gross exaggeration, with just as many if not more men wanting kids than women.

So we actually have an environment right now where more men than women strive to get married as soon as possible. They seem to have far more dependencies on the other gender than women do, from companionship to social adjustment. Without some kind of pressure from the outside, and if resources aren't an issue, there is little incentive right now for women to get married, but men are rightly concerned about their single status.


Someone is very smart. I agree with what you say 100%. Women have more friends than men. Men are bred for completion. Women have no use for men, once they decide they don't want to make babies,

Cornfed wrote:
Females are more than 2.5 times as likely to take [antidepressants] as males, with nearly a quarter of all women aged 40-59 taking antidepressants. Non-Hispanic white persons are 10 percent more likely than non-Hispanic blacks and Mexican-Americans to take the drugs, the report showed.

Don't forget all the single females taking prescription painkillers as happy pills. Single Western females over thirty are the most miserable and crazed people on the planet.


They may be crazy, but they still don't need men for sex or companionship!
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Re: My thesis: Modern men lose the dating game

Postby djfourmoney » Wed Dec 18, 2013 9:49 am

WorldTraveler wrote:
Someone wrote:There are some optimistic bloggers in the "manosphere" who pen articles with titles like "Why Women Lose the Dating Game. You can read their arguments at your leisure. The general meme seems to be very popular in the media and pop-culture: women get older and their pool shrinks, while all the eligible bachelors are snapped up quickly.

In my opinion the promulgators of this myth are wrong, dead wrong. The losers in the modern dating game are men, not women.

Here's why:

1) Single women tend to be quite happy and well-adjusted and lead productive, fulfilling lives, while single men are lonely and usually afflicted with serious psychological problems stemming from loneliness. The reason for single women being happy and content is that they maintain good social networks consisting of friends and family; on the other hand, men don't network very well, and tend to lose their social connections in adult years. This creates acute loneliness for single men which is not the case for single women. Thus, men depend on women for companionship, while the reverse isn't true. The same applies to sex. Men depend on women for regular sex much more than vice-versa.

2) If men uniquely depend on women for sex and companionship, what do women depend on men for? Historically, resources -- a general term for financial or material investments. But the current generation of women is economically independent and well-educated, which is different from before. Thus, women don't depend on men for resources to the same extent as before, they have resources themselves.

3) So far, the score is 2:0 (sex/companionship vs. NO dependency). What about social stigma? Aren't spinsters stigmatized in society, and don't women want to be mothers? No and no.
a) Social stigma: single men are actually more stigmatized by society than single women. They are treated as potential criminals or outcasts, and also often suspected of being homosexual. The same doesn't apply to women to the same extent. Women are rarely suspected of being deviants or lesbians.
b) Motherhood: In modern Western counties 20-25% of women are childless, but even the ones who have children didn't necessarily want them. In my experience, women's "maternal instinct" is a gross exaggeration, with just as many if not more men wanting kids than women.

So we actually have an environment right now where more men than women strive to get married as soon as possible. They seem to have far more dependencies on the other gender than women do, from companionship to social adjustment. Without some kind of pressure from the outside, and if resources aren't an issue, there is little incentive right now for women to get married, but men are rightly concerned about their single status.


Someone is very smart. I agree with what you say 100%. Women have more friends than men. Men are bred for completion. Women have no use for men, once they decide they don't want to make babies,

Cornfed wrote:
Females are more than 2.5 times as likely to take [antidepressants] as males, with nearly a quarter of all women aged 40-59 taking antidepressants. Non-Hispanic white persons are 10 percent more likely than non-Hispanic blacks and Mexican-Americans to take the drugs, the report showed.

Don't forget all the single females taking prescription painkillers as happy pills. Single Western females over thirty are the most miserable and crazed people on the planet.


They may be crazy, but they still don't need men for sex or companionship!


That's not true they do want sex AND companionship, even if they can't bear children, read the blog.

The point was not to feel terrible about yourself if you don't reach the goal of having a child, that's what that blog is about.

Obviously these women never considered IVF or admitted to trying it. Its only about 27% successful, but they never tried. Of course who wants to date a mid 40's woman with an infant????

The point is these women drive me nuts with their tales of woe. Give me a f***ing break already! If they wanted to be with a man they could, they are women after all. They believe they are entitled to certain men; that is the issue here. Where do they get this idea from? Hollywood!

If you're broke, I don't mean actually without a dime in your pocket, but you work a service sector job, the same job HouseMD's girl friend complained one of the men she dated did. The same type of job women in a NYT story about women who want to get married but increasingly find men who don't earn as much as they do, even if they work Pink economy jobs and retail themselves.

As I have said several times here. Western women do not want to go DOWN in lifestyle, they want to stay where they are with the possibility of moving up or move upward with an increase in purchasing power and status.

If you can not offer that to a woman, you'll be single. The only exception ironically come from women with children; who may reduce the income requirement in exchange for at the very least being a reliable employee and be constructive away from work (fixing things around the house...), they may not throw you out if you play video games too much when you're not a work but that woman won't be all that attractive either and is more concerned about being a single parent again than to punish you for playing your games other than to complain and possibly refuse sex over it.

I speak from experience, that is all I have done is work service sector jobs and except for a few missed opportunities there was always something about the girl I dated. My EX was fat though not morbidly so, she was tall but about 215-225lbs. I finally got her to lose weight after threatening to leave her over it.

The other women were single mothers. I remember one woman being serious interested and while she was attractive, she had one child (biracial) with a man she was dating come to find out, it was a miracle she even had that baby because they ended up removing her reproductive system after having her son.

Another woman (I've told this story before) who was at least a 9. I drove down from LA to SD (100 miles) just to take her on our first date. I forgot my wallet and she made up an excuse to take her back to her sister's place. This was an honest mistake but these are the sort of mistakes you can not make with these women if you work low level jobs like that.

I can guarantee if I was on the roster of the San Diego Chargers and I forgot my wallet you best believe she would have offered to pay.

Old women have no business being picky and when they try not to be too many loser men are on the loose. Women with children shouldn't be all that picky either, but as I just said you can't work one of these low level jobs and expect them to accept it unless your making some kind of effort either around the house or improve your position at work.

I find it interesting that in order to get a K1 Visa for the women that need it (Western Europeans don't they can backdoor the system unofficially), you have to make 120% above the poverty line which comes out to just about $26,400; an amount easily made by anybody that works for about $12.00

While Western women expect you to make more than they do, so if she works a typical job making $30,000 you better have some office job somewhere because while you can make that and more say driving a truck, you won't be home often enough until you get enough experience to get local gigs, most women are not that patient.

Men don't understand it but about 70% of employed men have been priced out of the dating market in Western Culture.

For women who have never been pregnant before to have a child for the first time in their mid to late 30's is very risky, chances of conceiving are only about 50% for mid 30's to mid 40's women, while its 70-80 even 90% for women under 25, it goes down to about 70% for women 28-34.

I can't remember the title of the local PBS story that followed three couples, only one was able to have children naturally, the other via IVF and the last one never conceived and was devastated after trying every trick in the book even IVF. Not being able to bear children is grounds for divorce and don't wanna hear any sappy mangina nonsense about this. Adoption is a very SECONDARY OPTION and that's another reason why I will not date/marry/procreate with an American women, too many risk involved.

Law Jackson within the year he met, picked her up from Ukraine and were married for less than a year; Alyona was already pregnant by then. They just had baby number #2 about three month ago, she was 28 when they married.

He's Black, she's Taller than him and she's Ukrainian didn't know a stitch of English really and comes from a modest background.

I don't know what incentive you guys need to stop posting shock and awe stories of Western women suffering under the very system they created with the help of politicians looking to stay in office.

Do I have to tell you that women outnumber men going to the voting booths? It doesn't matter if its mid-terms or Presidential? Why do you think there was a big stink about Hilary running and being the presumed front runner in 2008?

Stop complaining about Western women, Stop posting useless stories about Western women and Stop looking for flaws in women overseas to pad your excuses.
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Postby The Professor » Wed Dec 18, 2013 12:11 pm

I still think women, even "modern" women want to have kids more than men do. Other than that I completely agree with OP's theory and I have been saying the same thing for a while now. Women just are not as interested in love, male companionship and sex as men are interested in love, sex and female companionship. Men want these things a lot more and there is a massive amount of evidence in favor of that. It's a really hard pill for men to swallow. Even in the "manosphere" most just can't accept that. They think women are less interested in men due to external factors when in fact it is simply due to biological differences between men and women. If it was the former it would mean that the problem could at least be solved in theory, by removing the external variables responsible. However, since it's the latter, there really is no fix.

A lot of guys on here think Filipina women are different but I posted a study the other day (which HA naturally tried to put a spin on) that showed that Filipina women are much LESS interested in both love and sex than Filipino men.
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Postby fightforlove » Wed Dec 18, 2013 3:31 pm

Maverick wrote:True.

I recently met a girl through a social group that I'm in. She has a very good reputation there, claims to want a long term relationship, and is very physically attractive.

All well and good until I found out that she's 34 years old (8 years older than me). Since I would like to have children one day (not today though) and I'm looking for a long term partner, this girl is not a very good match. However, I'm extremely curious to know what happened to bring her to this point (of seemingly wanting to have marriage and kids, being pretty, but not having it).

I feel like she will be a very good case study. I will keep you guys updated when I find out more.


Is this the woman you met at church that turned you down? There are a lot of women like her in church circles. Some of them are washed up carouselers, some are divorcees or were in an LTR for several years that didn't pan out and wasted their younger years. My ex gf is in this category.

Beware of these women. Try to find out what lead them to the church, what circumstances were they under? For example, if they came to the church in the middle of a relationship and then broke off that relationship, I would say that's a compelling testimony. If they came to the church after a failed relationship, potential red flag. Another example: if the kind of guys they've dated has radically changed, like going from dating fuckbuddy bad boy types to dating clean cut office workers, red flag.
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Postby Someone » Wed Dec 18, 2013 11:48 pm

The Professor wrote:I still think women, even "modern" women want to have kids more than men do. Other than that I completely agree with OP's theory and I have been saying the same thing for a while now. Women just are not as interested in love, male companionship and sex as men are interested in love, sex and female companionship. Men want these things a lot more and there is a massive amount of evidence in favor of that. It's a really hard pill for men to swallow. Even in the "manosphere" most just can't accept that. They think women are less interested in men due to external factors when in fact it is simply due to biological differences between men and women. If it was the former it would mean that the problem could at least be solved in theory, by removing the external variables responsible. However, since it's the latter, there really is no fix.


The "Manosphere" are idiots, and I stopped following them long ago. TBH the only thing that comes closest to the truth, in my experience, is this forum, despite its serious flaws.

However, there's one potential issue in my analysis: Hormonal birth control, which alters women's hormonal preferences for men and sex. One could argue that widely-consumed birth control (even for something as trivial as avoiding periods, very popular in the West) has changed women's behavior which would have otherwise been more in pursuit of men and sexual relationships with them. I don't really think this is a major factor, however, but just something to keep in mind.
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Postby Seeker » Thu Dec 19, 2013 11:53 am

More evidence that women are more important to men than men are to women, from "Shyness and Love" by Professor Gilmartin:

"This study dealt with the relationship between personality traits and all aspects of
student behavior. A representative sample of over 300 students was, taken, and thousands of correlation figures were obtained. Of the thousands of correlation coefficients my study produced, the strongest one of all was the one relating the following two variables:

a. Degree of personal satisfaction and contentment with the amount of informal boy/girl interaction engaged in of late.

b. General happiness with life.

Simply put, nothing in the entire study correlated more strongly
with happiness and general sense of well-being than did extent of satisfaction
with amount of informal boy/girl interaction. The correlation
between these two factors was + .65 for the young men and + .32 for
the young women.
A related correlation coefficient dealt with the relationship
between general happiness and number of dates averaged per month
with the opposite sex. And this correlation figure was similarly far above
average by social science standards: it was + .49 for male students and
+ .16 for the female students. Thus we have another clear indication of
the fact that girls are far more important to men than men are to girls."
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Postby Maverick » Fri Dec 20, 2013 6:04 am

fightforlove wrote:
Maverick wrote:True.

I recently met a girl through a social group that I'm in. She has a very good reputation there, claims to want a long term relationship, and is very physically attractive.

All well and good until I found out that she's 34 years old (8 years older than me). Since I would like to have children one day (not today though) and I'm looking for a long term partner, this girl is not a very good match. However, I'm extremely curious to know what happened to bring her to this point (of seemingly wanting to have marriage and kids, being pretty, but not having it).

I feel like she will be a very good case study. I will keep you guys updated when I find out more.


Is this the woman you met at church that turned you down? There are a lot of women like her in church circles. Some of them are washed up carouselers, some are divorcees or were in an LTR for several years that didn't pan out and wasted their younger years. My ex gf is in this category.

Beware of these women. Try to find out what lead them to the church, what circumstances were they under? For example, if they came to the church in the middle of a relationship and then broke off that relationship, I would say that's a compelling testimony. If they came to the church after a failed relationship, potential red flag. Another example: if the kind of guys they've dated has radically changed, like going from dating fuckbuddy bad boy types to dating clean cut office workers, red flag.


Yes, it's the same woman. To be honest, I was on the fence about asking her out to begin with (due to her age and other factors that I saw). It's interesting to me that a girl that old that wants children can afford to be so picky (and that's not discrediting myself....in fact, this is the first time in a long time that I got turned down by a girl that I met through friends/social circle). It's also worth noting that I significantly tone down my personality in this group (I'm generally outgoing with a loud and offensive personality....however, I try not to offend in this particular group....I do notice that girls tend to be attracted to this part of my personality).

I do agree with the bolded though, for sure. Every single person (both girl and guy) that I've spoke to in real life about her said that she's either crazy, ridiculously picky, divorced, or was with a guy for several years that didn't work out. I think you're spot on here.

Either way, I do like this group and I'll be sticking with it. So I'm sure I'll find out the whole story sooner or later.

Also, since I was on the fence about this girl to begin with, I will no longer pursue her as a potential dating option (I generally don't anyway after I get shot down once).
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