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More Proof that a College Degree is Worthless

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Postby momopi » Fri Dec 13, 2013 2:25 am

Consider, if you spend years to obtain a Pharmacy degree, then pass the exam, it does not guarantee you to a nice job in an upscale neighborhood. As a matter of fact, if you tried to apply for a gig in Orange County, California, you'd find a long wait list in front of you.

But, if you're willing to accept a contract in say, Lancaster CA, you'd find a few dozen pharmacist openings today, many with sign-on bonus. But you'd probably want to live on the West side of Palmdale instead of Lancaster. The school API rating around Rancho Vista is actually not terrible, and Mountain High slopes is nearby if you like snow sports.

You would, however, want to stay away from the East side (of HWY 14) if possible. There are some good reasons why companies pay sign-on bonuses to pharmacists who are actually willing to work there. You're 4 times more likely to be the victim of a violent crime in Lancaster vs OC.

http://www.trulia.com/real_estate/Lanca ... nity-info/
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Postby The_Adventurer » Fri Dec 13, 2013 6:23 pm

Cornfed wrote:
The_Adventurer wrote:As I am sure you know, many billionaires have said if you your kid to succeed, get em OUT of school. And we all know how billionaire Larry Elison was pulled off the stage and a University grad ceremony for saying that it is too late for those graduating, but that the first years shoukd RUN LIKE HELL.

Brilliant. But then again, if you are a young man and your talents lie in the area of academic skills, what exactly are you to do to develop and use those talents without a college education? But then again again, a degree probably won't help you do that anyway. It is hard to think of anything better than giving up, contriving to go on some form of welfare, playing video games, getting drunk and drugged off your a** and supplementing your income with some form of crime. As an added bonus, doing so would probably make you much more attractive to females.


That's pretty much what happened in Japan, which now have millions of so called NEETS. They don't work, don't go to school and play games all day. They have truly given up. Their parents support them, though, (some are up to 40 years old) so they skipped the welfare and crime part.
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Postby tre » Fri Dec 13, 2013 9:33 pm

SilverEnergy wrote:Colleges don't teach you street smarts.

Screw college, become a business owner and an investor.



Just don't put all your eggs in ONE basket. That is why I lost my life savings and ended up being around $30K in debt. I could have lived in Asia without working for many years with the money I lost in business in less than one year.

Business/Investments = Risk

Sure, it can be very much worth it. However, you can't discount the risks involved. If it were so easy, everyone would be doing it...successfully.

I think a good idea would be to get educated and build a business, little by little, on the side at the same time. That way you'll have some sort of support if you fail with one of your goals/projects. This would involved making $$ your primary focus in life and pushing everything else down on your priority list. IMO, I think this will be the ONLY way to do WELL in the future...you won't get to have a "balanced" life. I'm going to Asia when I can make enough money to survive AND to save/invest. I won't go until I can do that as living paycheck to paycheck is suicide in today's world....
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Postby Devil Dog » Fri Dec 13, 2013 10:57 pm

tre wrote:
SilverEnergy wrote:Colleges don't teach you street smarts.

Screw college, become a business owner and an investor.



Just don't put all your eggs in ONE basket. That is why I lost my life savings and ended up being around $30K in debt. I could have lived in Asia without working for many years with the money I lost in business in less than one year.

Business/Investments = Risk

Sure, it can be very much worth it. However, you can't discount the risks involved. If it were so easy, everyone would be doing it...successfully.

I think a good idea would be to get educated and build a business, little by little, on the side at the same time. That way you'll have some sort of support if you fail with one of your goals/projects. This would involved making $$ your primary focus in life and pushing everything else down on your priority list. IMO, I think this will be the ONLY way to do WELL in the future...you won't get to have a "balanced" life. I'm going to Asia when I can make enough money to survive AND to save/invest. I won't go until I can do that as living paycheck to paycheck is suicide in today's world....



"I've always wanted to sail to the south seas, but I can't afford it." What these men can't afford is not to go. They are enmeshed in the cancerous discipline of "security." And in the worship of security we fling our lives beneath the wheels of routine - and before we know it our lives are gone.

What does a man need - really need? A few pounds of food each day, heat and shelter, six feet to lie down in - and some form of working activity that will yield a sense of accomplishment. That's all - in the material sense, and we know it. But we are brainwashed by our economic system until we end up in a tomb beneath a pyramid of time payments, mortgages, preposterous gadgetry, playthings that divert our attention for the sheer idiocy of the charade.

The years thunder by, The dreams of youth grow dim where they lie caked in dust on the shelves of patience. Before we know it, the tomb is sealed.

Where, then, lies the answer? In choice. Which shall it be: bankruptcy of purse or bankruptcy of life? â€￾
― Sterling Hayden, Wanderer
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Postby SilverEnergy » Sat Dec 14, 2013 12:59 am

tre wrote:
SilverEnergy wrote:Colleges don't teach you street smarts.

Screw college, become a business owner and an investor.



Just don't put all your eggs in ONE basket. That is why I lost my life savings and ended up being around $30K in debt. I could have lived in Asia without working for many years with the money I lost in business in less than one year.

Business/Investments = Risk

Sure, it can be very much worth it. However, you can't discount the risks involved. If it were so easy, everyone would be doing it...successfully.

I think a good idea would be to get educated and build a business, little by little, on the side at the same time. That way you'll have some sort of support if you fail with one of your goals/projects. This would involved making $$ your primary focus in life and pushing everything else down on your priority list. IMO, I think this will be the ONLY way to do WELL in the future...you won't get to have a "balanced" life. I'm going to Asia when I can make enough money to survive AND to save/invest. I won't go until I can do that as living paycheck to paycheck is suicide in today's world....


Many businessmen made mistakes and were in much worse debt than you were and bounced back.

Donald Trump was in MUCH worse debt than you were and look where he is at today.

Overcoming adversity and learning from your mistakes is the key.

You could bounce back from your 30K debt but you need to seek expert and professional advice regarding your debt......it's not impossible.

It takes persistence and a good financial/business mindset to bounce back from business and personal finance adversity.

Seeking guidance from a business coach/mentor/expert would be ideal in your situation.

Business/investing isn't so much risky......we are our biggest risk.

You have to learn how to MANAGE risk.
"Allow me to show you the Power Cosmic!" - Silver Surfer
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Postby tre » Sat Dec 14, 2013 1:14 am

SilverEnergy wrote:
tre wrote:
SilverEnergy wrote:Colleges don't teach you street smarts.

Screw college, become a business owner and an investor.



Just don't put all your eggs in ONE basket. That is why I lost my life savings and ended up being around $30K in debt. I could have lived in Asia without working for many years with the money I lost in business in less than one year.

Business/Investments = Risk

Sure, it can be very much worth it. However, you can't discount the risks involved. If it were so easy, everyone would be doing it...successfully.

I think a good idea would be to get educated and build a business, little by little, on the side at the same time. That way you'll have some sort of support if you fail with one of your goals/projects. This would involved making $$ your primary focus in life and pushing everything else down on your priority list. IMO, I think this will be the ONLY way to do WELL in the future...you won't get to have a "balanced" life. I'm going to Asia when I can make enough money to survive AND to save/invest. I won't go until I can do that as living paycheck to paycheck is suicide in today's world....


Many businessmen made mistakes and were in much worse debt than you were and bounced back.

Donald Trump was in MUCH worse debt than you were and look where he is at today.

Overcoming adversity and learning from your mistakes is the key.

You could bounce back from your 30K debt but you need to seek expert and professional advice regarding your debt......it's not impossible.

It takes persistence and a good financial/business mindset to bounce back from business and personal finance adversity.

Seeking guidance from a business coach/mentor/expert would be ideal in your situation.

Business/investing isn't so much risky......we are our biggest risk.

You have to learn how to MANAGE risk.



I'm going to bounce back...make no mistake. However, it will be by working a good-paying job for a few years. Money makes money, but unfortunately I not only do not have money anymore...I have considerable debt. I have to be realistic...there is no magic solution. I am going to go to school while I'm working so that I will never find myself in this situation again. I am the type of person that saves and doesn't spend much so I'll do fine once debts are paid off. Once they are, I'll look into investment opportunities again with money that I have saved.
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Postby tre » Sat Dec 14, 2013 1:25 am

Devil Dog wrote:
tre wrote:
SilverEnergy wrote:Colleges don't teach you street smarts.

Screw college, become a business owner and an investor.



Just don't put all your eggs in ONE basket. That is why I lost my life savings and ended up being around $30K in debt. I could have lived in Asia without working for many years with the money I lost in business in less than one year.

Business/Investments = Risk

Sure, it can be very much worth it. However, you can't discount the risks involved. If it were so easy, everyone would be doing it...successfully.

I think a good idea would be to get educated and build a business, little by little, on the side at the same time. That way you'll have some sort of support if you fail with one of your goals/projects. This would involved making $$ your primary focus in life and pushing everything else down on your priority list. IMO, I think this will be the ONLY way to do WELL in the future...you won't get to have a "balanced" life. I'm going to Asia when I can make enough money to survive AND to save/invest. I won't go until I can do that as living paycheck to paycheck is suicide in today's world....



"I've always wanted to sail to the south seas, but I can't afford it." What these men can't afford is not to go. They are enmeshed in the cancerous discipline of "security." And in the worship of security we fling our lives beneath the wheels of routine - and before we know it our lives are gone.

What does a man need - really need? A few pounds of food each day, heat and shelter, six feet to lie down in - and some form of working activity that will yield a sense of accomplishment. That's all - in the material sense, and we know it. But we are brainwashed by our economic system until we end up in a tomb beneath a pyramid of time payments, mortgages, preposterous gadgetry, playthings that divert our attention for the sheer idiocy of the charade.

The years thunder by, The dreams of youth grow dim where they lie caked in dust on the shelves of patience. Before we know it, the tomb is sealed.

Where, then, lies the answer? In choice. Which shall it be: bankruptcy of purse or bankruptcy of life? â€￾
― Sterling Hayden, Wanderer


Yes, but since when is an actor/author the best source of guidance? They usually have their head in the clouds. They can put together great written pieces, but few are realistic.

Yes, men don't REALLY need much to be happy. However, we DO need several things that will not fall in our laps. Your health is not guaranteed forever. In fact, you are likely have have an extremely expensive accident or health condition sometime in your life. The first half of your life is to set up the rest of your life. If you don't do that, you may not be able to have those bare necessities.

I put my neck out there to DO what this guy is talking about. I lost everything in that process and am in a position that I would consider to be less free than ever. I'll get out of it eventually and will try again...make no mistake. However, you can't just live your life by the sleeve of your shirt and expect that there will be no major disruptions that can and will cripple you if you are not prepared...
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Postby The_Adventurer » Sat Dec 14, 2013 4:32 am

The vast majority of successful businessmen had disastrous failures early on. Some had MANY. The key is they kept going. Most, you will find, were over 40 when they became millionaires. They are around 60 when they become billionaires.

I once saw this video where they interviewed ten successful businessmen on what they would do if they lost everything and had to get back on their feet. NOT ONE said they would get a job.
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Postby Tezcatlipoca » Sat Dec 21, 2013 4:08 am

HouseMD wrote:Some college degrees are worthless. In fact I'd venture to say the majority of them are. But degrees in engineering, the sciences, computers, mathematics, and trades are good investments. Every time I hear of someone going to school for history or art or some other bullshit I have to struggle not to facepalm so hard that I knock myself out cold.

My degree got me into medical school and got me a job in health care prior to that with an hourly pay in the high 20s or low 30s depending on what shift I was on and whether it was a weekend or not. It was a solid investment that got me out of stocking shelves and selling crap for $9.75 an hour.


This has changed. Science bachelor's degrees are worthless, you'll end up doing low level apprentice type help for $14/hour which is sad considering the amount of rigorous courses required. Science is only worth it if you pursue a graduate degree and even then there is no point in terms of $$$. The high paying careers are sales related (investment banking/personal retirement stuff $200k-$300k a year) and you only need a bachelor's unfortunately it must be either in something like economics and you must some kind of badass guru or go to the ivy league however you can do personal retirement/sales with just any old bachelor's from a state school and be successful but you must have the personality for it. In terms of bachelor's degrees that are careers I would recommend as you said engineering or computer science. Mathematics is shit without any programming background same for physics. But the real money of course is in being an entrepreneur, but that is risky and not guaranteed. Everything in life is a gamble. edit: Actuary is also a good career path in the $200k range and perhaps of the engineering backgrounds the most lucrative would be petroleum engineering. Most uber rich people are really smart and invest/save but the multibillionaires generally a) came from money, b) were raised by educated parents who gave them a leg up on life/advice on what to study/which schools to go to and taught them the harsh realities of life c) are well connected. It is definitely possible for an average person in America to rise to be a multi-millionaire though imo.

momopi wrote:lancaster/palmdale


I lived in LA. Both lancaster and palmdale are shit (imo). If I were to live there and had money it is all about the west side. If not perhaps Glendale, San Marino, or something like that.
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Postby SilverEnergy » Sat Dec 21, 2013 11:05 pm

A university degree in sales is good to have.
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Postby HouseMD » Sun Dec 22, 2013 12:11 am

Tezcatlipoca wrote:
HouseMD wrote:Some college degrees are worthless. In fact I'd venture to say the majority of them are. But degrees in engineering, the sciences, computers, mathematics, and trades are good investments. Every time I hear of someone going to school for history or art or some other bullshit I have to struggle not to facepalm so hard that I knock myself out cold.

My degree got me into medical school and got me a job in health care prior to that with an hourly pay in the high 20s or low 30s depending on what shift I was on and whether it was a weekend or not. It was a solid investment that got me out of stocking shelves and selling crap for $9.75 an hour.


This has changed. Science bachelor's degrees are worthless, you'll end up doing low level apprentice type help for $14/hour which is sad considering the amount of rigorous courses required. Science is only worth it if you pursue a graduate degree and even then there is no point in terms of $$$. The high paying careers are sales related (investment banking/personal retirement stuff $200k-$300k a year) and you only need a bachelor's unfortunately it must be either in something like economics and you must some kind of badass guru or go to the ivy league however you can do personal retirement/sales with just any old bachelor's from a state school and be successful but you must have the personality for it. In terms of bachelor's degrees that are careers I would recommend as you said engineering or computer science. Mathematics is shit without any programming background same for physics. But the real money of course is in being an entrepreneur, but that is risky and not guaranteed. Everything in life is a gamble. edit: Actuary is also a good career path in the $200k range and perhaps of the engineering backgrounds the most lucrative would be petroleum engineering. Most uber rich people are really smart and invest/save but the multibillionaires generally a) came from money, b) were raised by educated parents who gave them a leg up on life/advice on what to study/which schools to go to and taught them the harsh realities of life c) are well connected. It is definitely possible for an average person in America to rise to be a multi-millionaire though imo.

momopi wrote:lancaster/palmdale


I lived in LA. Both lancaster and palmdale are shit (imo). If I were to live there and had money it is all about the west side. If not perhaps Glendale, San Marino, or something like that.

Hedge funds and wall street firms hire mathematics grads, they need them to create the intricate formulas required for automated market timing. You have to have a solid research history though, you can't just jump through the hoops. Physics you're right about- it's more of a foot in the door for high paying graduate degrees. Biology and chemistry are worthless. Engineering and computers are solid though, and I still stand by the trades and applied associates of science degrees.
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Postby Renata » Sun Dec 22, 2013 1:00 am

Undergraduate degrees in the some of the english speaking Caribbean are free. The tuition is covered by the government & exam fees & books etc are covered by the student. If you can't cover any of the expenses there are grants & no interest loans that kids can apply for. It's kind of nuts that American kids have to die paying when we don't. Master's & PHD's aren't covered by the gov't, though.

I don't believe that one needs to have a degree to migrate & make it abroad. Just some cash in hand & a plan is enough if you're a bit of a risk taker. You'll be forced to think your way into better.
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