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What's your cash over-under for moving abroad?

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What's your cash over-under for moving abroad?

Postby manly5000 » Thu Jan 02, 2014 12:10 pm

Hey all,

Wanted to get a discussion going on the minimum cash savings you guys would need to have before leaving the west and moving abroad... The conditions of this being that you plan on either finding a job or will be making money online within a few months of arriving in your country of choice (as opposed to retiring). Some other considerations are that you have no debt whatsoever, nor do you have anything or anyone here that would compel you to stay longer or anchor you in any way, such as a house, or family of any kind.

For me I'd say that I'd want to have enough to support myself for at LEAST 6 months living like a local, plus enough to both get a CELTA (if I decided to teach English) AND have a nice little vacation my first few weeks abroad and live it up a bit and have some fun. After so many rough years here I gotta cut loose a little bit before I hunker down and start working. 8)

So not sure how much that would be... 10 grand maybe? Maybe even lower with some tight budgeting and finding work sooner than later?

Looking forward to your thoughts.
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Postby Taco » Thu Jan 02, 2014 1:01 pm

If your starting a teaching job in China you only need to bring one months salary with you, basically $1000. In Korea your first paycheck arrives after you've been teaching for 6 weeks so you might need to bring $2000-$2500 with you. Most English schools will rip you off in some way without you knowing it so its a good idea to bring at least $1000 with you in case something bad happens.
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Postby Ghost » Thu Jan 02, 2014 1:35 pm

I'm pretty much in EFL teaching for the long haul if I want to live anywhere for up to a year, so I agree with Taco. Although I also had $15k in savings before coming to China. Now that's about $20k.

What's being talked about on this forum a lot now is making either a passive income or an active income that can be gained working via internet. That's my plan for the future, along with EFL teaching.
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Postby xiongmao » Thu Jan 02, 2014 2:51 pm

Last year I spent $350 a month on rent in Bangkok and $250 a month in China. Expenses in both places ran to about $750 a month.

You could live more cheaply than I did, because in China I spent a lot on foreigner food (eating at Pizza Hut a lot!) and in Bangkok I went out to bars pretty much every single night.

Also bear in mind I lived in two of Asia's most expensive cities. For example in Bangkok it was 300 baht for a foot massage, in Pattaya it was 200. Falcon and I found an Indian restaurant in Pattaya that cost us 150 baht each for a set menu. Sheesh, buy a Korma back in the UK and you'll pay the equivalent of 295 baht!

Remember to plan for unknown unknowns by having savings of at least $5000 and getting some sort of medical insurance.
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Postby The_Adventurer » Thu Jan 02, 2014 3:24 pm

If you're going to be doing anything on the internet, make sure you have enough to, at least, replace your laptop.
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Postby manly5000 » Thu Jan 02, 2014 3:41 pm

Good thoughts all, thanks.

Ideally I want to have enough where I can just kick back for a few months while I gradually try to set up my income, whether it be online or otherwise. Focus on my pursuit of making new friends, finding a quality woman to share my life with, and becoming a part of whatever community I choose to live in.

Having a spare amount to go to an alternate country in case my first choice doesn't pan out would be a good thing too. I originally wanted to save up damn near 25k+ before going so I could REALLY take my time and try a number of countries if necessary, but that would require me staying here until the beginning of summer of 2015. This midwestern USA winter has already been so god-awful, I don't think there's any chance in hell I can deal with one more after this. This horrible, horrible climate and society is sucking the life out of me, so at this point I don't believe that the extra cash I would save is worth the misery I'd suffer living here for close to an extra year to save it.

Besides, the sooner I leave, the sooner I can find love, happiness, a family, and my place in this world. All things I absolutely do not and can not have here, things that money can't replace or make up for. If I can get 10-15k saved by end of summer this year, I don't think there will be any reason NOT to get this show on the road right then and there.
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Postby FlyingMoose » Thu Jan 02, 2014 5:15 pm

Assuming you don't want to have to work wherever you move, and that you keep the money in a balanced portfolio between 50%-90% equities (stocks) and the rest in bonds:

A SWR (Safe Withdrawal Rate) for someone of retirement age is usually considered to be 4%. This will give you about a 95% chance of not running out of money in 30 years (ages 65-95) based on a Monte Carlo simulation. So, to have an income of $24,000 a year, you need about $600,000.

For someone younger, with a 50-year-plus horizon (the actual time doesn't matter as much when it gets this long), a SWR is considered to be 2%-3%. So, you would need $800,000 to $1,200,000.

Kind of depressing, I know, but that's the math.
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Postby manly5000 » Thu Jan 02, 2014 5:28 pm

Thanks Moose but this discussion pertains to those of us who will be working and earning income abroad, not retiring.
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Postby rudder » Thu Jan 02, 2014 5:47 pm

I will have almost exactly 10k in two weeks when I leave for Peru. This amount is much more than I initially thought I would have about 4 months ago when I bought my one-way ticket, so I'm pretty excited. I've been following the advice on this forum, working my ass off here at menial jobs for a few months, and it looks like it's going to pay off. I'll be able to travel frivolously for the first month or two, changing locations frequently with long-distance bus rides and domestic flights. Then I'll have a couple more months to get situated somewhere, buy a small laptop and resume my online income pursuits. I also plan to do some volunteer work in my sector in order to network with locals and secure some source of employment if and when I obtain residency.

I came back from a trip to Mexico this summer, and that's when I decided that enough was enough. I conquered 2+ years of unemployment, got more than 2 part time jobs and started saving up money fast. All so I could fly off to a faraway land in pursuit of a wild dream. I really hope things work out for me.

The first post in this thread really helped steer me in the right direction when I came back from Mexico: http://www.happierabroad.com/forum/view ... hp?t=10859
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Postby manly5000 » Thu Jan 02, 2014 6:26 pm

Thanks Rudder, good luck in your endeavor to Peru!

Out of curiosity, what made you choose Peru over Mexico as a long-term place to live?
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Postby decentrader » Thu Jan 02, 2014 10:31 pm

guys...you can have the time of your life at the moment in greece.prices are the cheapest in europe,the country has a first world infast.
the weather is great,but also you never been 150 km far from a well organized ski resort.
women are hot...and they need support.im at my mid 50's and many hot students are consider me
a blessing to theyr lives.

Image
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Postby djfourmoney » Sat Jan 04, 2014 2:49 am

Why would Greece be a better bargain than Croatia or Bulgaria?

Can you rent a nice apartment in Greece and not too far from any of the major cities for less than $500 like in the countries I just mentioned?

Money is relative, why? Because if relationship with women are about important as getting a good beer in whatever country you're in at a low cost, then short, dark local women will be available to you and if that's okay, by all means.

Otherwise you won't need 10K! You only need that much of you are possibly buying/building a home in a developing country and that would be Brazil maybe.

Half that much is double what locals earn in most countries. The only things that you would want that most locals don't have is a constant, reliable and fast internet connection, a PC/Mac not much more than 2-3 years old if that and a smartphone which you may want a decent amount of minutes with about 1-3GB of data, since WiFi is not nearly as widespread as it is in South Korea, Japan and much of Europe.

At $1,000 per mouth ($12,000 a year) you're already living at a higher level than the majority, the entire working class and the majority of the middle class in these countries. Remember a family of four averages $1,500 a month or less in Latin America.

If you're doing it online, even better you have vastly more free time than any of these individuals and families do.

Stephen and his wife live on about 600R a month. Favela rent is cheap, Whites automatically think its dangerous; maybe because its so unlike their usually plush middle class upbringing. As long as you listen to the locals who know where its dangerous or the police may pick on you, like in Brazil. Its best to enter Rochina through the main entry and exit the same way, otherwise if you use one of the alternative exits/entries are scrutinized by local law enforcement and treat you accordingly Gringo or not, maybe even more of if you are a Gringo.

Only a local would know such information that generally not found on forums and blogs.

One alternative I have considered myself, is buying out of commission shipping containers. These can be bought for under $1,000 in many cases and you have a roof, all four walls, do a Google search. It would be better than living in a hut somewhere in Nicaragua...

This isn't talked about much but I know of at least two or three examples -

You can live as cheaply as possible in the US, remember even min wage is 5 times what local wages are in Latin America, even SEA and even much of Eastern Europe.

Work for six months, say during the holiday rush here (Dec/Nov) and during the summer (May-Sept). Say Toys R-Us during Christmas and say Six Flags or another park that's close to you. During the summer you can get as many hours as you want in most cases. Same with TRU, overtime will allow you to work for only five months instead of half a year (six).

This is a good option for those under 25 without major job skills. You could easily generate $1,000+ a month as long as you live as cheaply as possible. That would be living at home, renting a room from a family, some how get on the list for housing for the homeless or what Ez is doing which is chilling in homeless shelters.

$6-7K will easily allow you to live nicely the other six months of the year and in-between you can work towards an online business. You can just make money talking about your adventures on YouTube.

I've said before there is a guy I know that works as a substitute teacher but lives full-time otherwise in Argentina. He works during the school year in America and when its over, he flies back to BA where he's becoming such a regular to a few pros down there, that they don't even charge him and he basically has to force them to leave.

They don't ask for payment, he'll kick them down every so often.

You have plenty of options out there, earning online just requires a good idea and dedication. If your blogging, making videos or podcast you must do it often if you ever hope to build a following. You can generate money via sponsorships, affiliate links or paid consulting. Pat Flynn interviewed a guy that did a series of biological science videos on YT and this lead him being a professor in his home country's (I wanna say Belize) University.

As long as you stop thinking conventionally how to earn money, the ideas will flow and with low start up cost in much of the develop world it really pays to be on the ground rather than try to formulate a plan that may not work there and waste time developing it.
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Postby rudder » Sat Jan 04, 2014 6:15 am

manly5000 wrote:Thanks Rudder, good luck in your endeavor to Peru!

Out of curiosity, what made you choose Peru over Mexico as a long-term place to live?


Mexico was too close to the US. I also wasn't too impressed by the women. Most seemed rather wary of me, and the vast majority was taciturn. Something tells me I'll encounter the same sort of behavior in Peru, but the Peruvian women I've known were not like this at all. I wanted to go somewhere with the sweetest women and be showered with affection and still get to use my Spanish.

I highly doubt the reality will live up to my absurd expectations, so I expect to feel somewhat disillusioned when women aren't elbowing each other to jump my bones. You see, these internet forums make it sound like, if you just pick the right place, you'll end up with women trying to rape you. Perhaps, it is just my conditioning from a lifetime of living in the USA, but I have my doubts...
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Postby djfourmoney » Sat Jan 04, 2014 10:28 am

rudder wrote:
manly5000 wrote:Thanks Rudder, good luck in your endeavor to Peru!

Out of curiosity, what made you choose Peru over Mexico as a long-term place to live?


Mexico was too close to the US. I also wasn't too impressed by the women. Most seemed rather wary of me, and the vast majority was taciturn. Something tells me I'll encounter the same sort of behavior in Peru, but the Peruvian women I've known were not like this at all. I wanted to go somewhere with the sweetest women and be showered with affection and still get to use my Spanish.

I highly doubt the reality will live up to my absurd expectations, so I expect to feel somewhat disillusioned when women aren't elbowing each other to jump my bones. You see, these internet forums make it sound like, if you just pick the right place, you'll end up with women trying to rape you. Perhaps, it is just my conditioning from a lifetime of living in the USA, but I have my doubts...


There is no place on earth where will women will jump you, if they do they are prostitutes... That includes often mention PI.

If you are an exceedingly AVERAGE White guy, nothing special about you, not in shape, but not fat, don't expect the world to stop when you hit town.

That said, if your in-shape and look the part (IE you can hit the beach without a t-shirt on and its okay, not the I don't give a f**k if I look like shit have my shirt off) and speak Spanish, you will do okay but man don't believe it will be one woman, your eyes meet and that's it. You'll have to do the same social sh*t that locals do.

You know discos (don't say nightclubs in Latin America or Europe for that matter, totally different meaning...) and other social events.

Meet SEVERAL women. This is why even if you're there on your own, you might wanna hit up one of AFA's socials. They aren't super cheap but they don't cost that much. There is NO OTHER WAY besides DIY of meeting over 100 women, not that you would actually meet that many unless you're really aggressive and don't spend too much time with each person.

Its worth it though because unless your repulsive, smell bad or look funny in your clothes most Latin woman will react positively to you and you'll have more dates than you know what to do with, but the key is to be more aggressive then you are at home. The woman are expected to be hit on overseas by and large and there's no "he's a creep" women should fear men culture. They want to talk to you because your a Westerner and upgrade over the local men they have been dating.

Use the internet and meet as many women as possible. Just don't contact them until you are about to leave for their country. You want to let these women know your serious.
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Postby skateboardstephen » Sat Jan 04, 2014 7:17 pm

Stephen and his wife live on about 600R a month. Favela rent is cheap, Whites automatically think its dangerous; maybe because its so unlike their usually plush middle class upbringing. As long as you listen to the locals who know where its dangerous or the police may pick on you, like in Brazil. Its best to enter Rochina through the main entry and exit the same way, otherwise if you use one of the alternative exits/entries are scrutinized by local law enforcement and treat you accordingly Gringo or not, maybe even more of if you are a Gringo.


Whoa pump the breaks there we don't live that cheaply.More like on a combined income of $R1,500 a month give or take sometimes a little more if i have to cover for a co-worker who frequently travels.The Favela is not as bad as the media portrays it to be..there are some really bad ones but one will figure out where they are..One Myth is that the Favlea=Poor which is not true...on my beco (alley) there is a cop that lives there and has a nice house..my neighbor has a good job working in some office (and a hot wife,and he is Afro-Brazilian by the way)My wife's sister's husband is a nurse he built a nice house in the Favela and likes it just fine..his kid always wears expensive shit.My other neighbor owns the a bar right across from my house,has a brand new car and has young women often appear going in and out of his house and he is a old Afro-Brazilian dude.
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