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Do we all have low self-esteem, as my female friend says?

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Do we all have low self-esteem, as my female friend says?

Postby Winston » Thu Mar 06, 2014 2:54 pm

Hi all,
I've been talking to my close friend Elizabeth, who now lives in Reno, NV. I saw her when I was there and I've known her since 2001 when I was an actor in Reno. She insists that the reason why AW have always rejected me is because I have low self-esteem. When I refer her to the fact that 95 percent of AW on AOL rejected me online in the 1990's, after I sent them my best picture that I am proud of, she still insisted on this claim. I guess she thinks that low self-esteem can be transmitted online too. lol

I don't understand her basis. She is well meaning, honest, intelligent and a freethinker too. She's not the kind of woman that BSes or likes to shame others. And she agrees with many of our cultural comparisons of America vs. Abroad. So she is very aware. But she has a lot of New Age views as well.

Yet she honestly believes that low self-esteem is our problem, rather than looks or the spoiled ridiculous standards of AW. This is her honest view, not a shaming tactic.

So where does she and many other women get this idea that guys who are rejected by AW must have low self-esteem? What is the basis of this claim? What is the evidence for it? And why does she cling to it religiously? Does she know something that we don't?

She is somewhat New Ageish in her views and beliefs though. So could that be it? A lot of New Agers believe that there are no victims and that everything happens to you is a result of your attitude and thoughts drawing them to you. So someone who is always rejected by AW must be creating this rejection in their subconscious mind and drawing this rejection in a self-fulfilling prophecy. That's the logic of New Agers. They call it the "Law of Attraction" and take it very literally.

She has no explanation for why foreign women are friendlier to us, and why every guy does better abroad. She only says that in America, women see men as "all or nothing", so that if they are not romantically interested in you, then they want nothing to do with you, not even as friends. She acknowledges that in Europe, women are far more social toward men and are cool with going out with a guy as friends, even if she's not into him romantically. So she is well aware of such cultural differences. She's been to Hungary too. But she insists that low self-esteem is the cause of not being able to get dates in America.

At least she isn't one of those women who claim that foreign women are only friendly because they want your money and a green card. She is more evolved and aware than that.

Here is a photo of her and me when we were at a mall plaza in Orange County, CA. As you can see, she is attractive and obviously cannot relate to being dateless or rejected all the time. She is Eurasian - half Chinese and half Hungarian.

Image
Last edited by Winston on Wed May 07, 2014 3:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby CrazyCanuck944 » Thu Mar 06, 2014 7:16 pm

Some of us definitely have low self-esteem. Being consistently rejected by AW over time will contribute to this occurrence. A bit of a vicious cycle after that...receive less attention/interest and interaction=self-esteem dropping lower, which means you don't feel like even going out and trying to meet anyone (i.e. depression). Thank God for CF right now. Women are always interested.

Man, I can't wait until I can take a trip to the Phils. From everything I've read on here, it sounds like a life and soul rejuvenating experience....
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Postby nicho12 » Thu Mar 06, 2014 9:02 pm

Why wouldn't you have low self esteem if you're constantly being reject by women, alienated in this social catastrophe, bombarded with negative anti-male images from this toxic media, hated in college for being male, I can go on and on.
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Postby terminator » Thu Mar 06, 2014 9:23 pm

CrazyCanuck944 wrote:Some of us definitely have low self-esteem. Being consistently rejected by AW over time will contribute to this occurrence. A bit of a vicious cycle after that...receive less attention/interest and interaction=self-esteem dropping lower, which means you don't feel like even going out and trying to meet anyone (i.e. depression). Thank God for CF right now. Women are always interested.

Man, I can't wait until I can take a trip to the Phils. From everything I've read on here, it sounds like a life and soul rejuvenating experience....


I agree, but women are the cause of low self esteem with their big lists of requirements so get a robot wife to make you have high self esteem.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rB17GPkXzbg[/youtube]
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Postby Winston » Thu Mar 06, 2014 10:27 pm

CrazyCanuck944 wrote:Some of us definitely have low self-esteem. Being consistently rejected by AW over time will contribute to this occurrence. A bit of a vicious cycle after that...receive less attention/interest and interaction=self-esteem dropping lower, which means you don't feel like even going out and trying to meet anyone (i.e. depression). Thank God for CF right now. Women are always interested.

Man, I can't wait until I can take a trip to the Phils. From everything I've read on here, it sounds like a life and soul rejuvenating experience....


Yeah but you are saying that low self-esteem is the RESULT of rejection by AW. That's my point too. Her claim is that low self-esteem is the INITIAL CAUSE of rejection by AW. You see what I mean? In other words, AW look at us and reject us not for our looks, but because they see low self-esteem in us. That's the argument that she clings to.

Do you agree with that? Why do many AW cling to this belief? What is the basis for it?

In theory, if she was right, then if I love myself, AW will love me too. I don't see any basis for this. But this is the popular mentality. What is the basis of it? I don't see the logic behind it.

Also, since I have narcissistic tendencies, I do love myself, more than I should. So her theory makes no sense.
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Postby tre » Thu Mar 06, 2014 11:12 pm

Winston wrote:
CrazyCanuck944 wrote:Some of us definitely have low self-esteem. Being consistently rejected by AW over time will contribute to this occurrence. A bit of a vicious cycle after that...receive less attention/interest and interaction=self-esteem dropping lower, which means you don't feel like even going out and trying to meet anyone (i.e. depression). Thank God for CF right now. Women are always interested.

Man, I can't wait until I can take a trip to the Phils. From everything I've read on here, it sounds like a life and soul rejuvenating experience....


Yeah but you are saying that low self-esteem is the RESULT of rejection by AW. That's my point too. Her claim is that low self-esteem is the INITIAL CAUSE of rejection by AW. You see what I mean? In other words, AW look at us and reject us not for our looks, but because they see low self-esteem in us. That's the argument that she clings to.

Do you agree with that? Why do many AW cling to this belief? What is the basis for it?

In theory, if she was right, then if I love myself, AW will love me too. I don't see any basis for this. But this is the popular mentality. What is the basis of it? I don't see the logic behind it.

Also, since I have narcissistic tendencies, I do love myself, more than I should. So her theory makes no sense.


She could be right or wrong, depending on the circumstance or person. Confidence can definitely complete the "game" of a person that already has a lot going for him...it can take him to the next level. However, no matter how much a guy may love himself for who he is, it doesn't mean that women are going to love him because of it. Women have eyes and ears too. Just like most guys here wouldn't want a frumpy, fat, unattractive female...the same goes for them in regard to males. Just like most guys here, many females have a "type". If you are not that type, then you are at a disadvantage. I'm not saying that men should give up though....far from it. There are always options to better yourself physically, mentally and financially. Seeking improvement is MUCH better than sitting around complaining that no woman wants you. I do understand the 35+ crowd worrying and discussing what to do in regard to getting younger women as age = reduced attraction in MOST cases. If you are in your 20's, then I don't feel sorry for you. The majority of men (unless they are handicapped in some way) in their 20's have the opportunity to fix practically anything about themselves or their situation. A guy that is 40+ really should just focus on being healthy, having control of his finances and then MOVING abroad where women might appreciate him.
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Postby CrazyCanuck944 » Thu Mar 06, 2014 11:41 pm

Winston wrote:
CrazyCanuck944 wrote:Some of us definitely have low self-esteem. Being consistently rejected by AW over time will contribute to this occurrence. A bit of a vicious cycle after that...receive less attention/interest and interaction=self-esteem dropping lower, which means you don't feel like even going out and trying to meet anyone (i.e. depression). Thank God for CF right now. Women are always interested.

Man, I can't wait until I can take a trip to the Phils. From everything I've read on here, it sounds like a life and soul rejuvenating experience....


Yeah but you are saying that low self-esteem is the RESULT of rejection by AW. That's my point too. Her claim is that low self-esteem is the INITIAL CAUSE of rejection by AW. You see what I mean? In other words, AW look at us and reject us not for our looks, but because they see low self-esteem in us. That's the argument that she clings to.

Do you agree with that? Why do many AW cling to this belief? What is the basis for it?

In theory, if she was right, then if I love myself, AW will love me too. I don't see any basis for this. But this is the popular mentality. What is the basis of it? I don't see the logic behind it.

Also, since I have narcissistic tendencies, I do love myself, more than I should. So her theory makes no sense.


I can only speak for myself, and my personal experience...but I believe both theories are true. Once you start to get rejected a few times, your self-esteem can become unraveled pretty fast. It acts as a synergistic negative cycle. We are always told that women are masters at reading non-verbal communication and body language. Is it safe to assume that men with low self-esteem show different body language than guys who feel great about themselves? If that's the case, then women will reject a guy based on his (perceived) lack of self-esteem.

As a fellow narcissist, I have been on both sides of this issue. In my teens and early 20's, I felt great. I was the best looking guy in town (in my mind). I loved to go out and strut around...smiling and giving suggestive looks to every pretty girl I saw. I had no fear. Failure was not a possibility in my mind....and if I didn't get a positive response...THEY had the problem, not me. I didn't have GAME, per se, but I did have lots of self-confidence. I had no money and didn't even have a car.

In all honesty, I used to receive a lot of positive feedback, which of course fed my self-esteem.

I'm not sure if women just started to become more sophisticated, or my lack of game began to betray me, but once self-doubt started to creep in, things went south pretty fast. I started to feel (and act) like an AFC, and soon I didn't even try anymore. No flirting, no looking, just avoidance and a whole lot of feeling awkward around women. Of course, women have pretty much reciprocated. It's different with Asian women though.. I'm very attracted to them, and I'm sure they are aware of it, so my self-esteem tends to rise around them, and the results are much better.
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Postby Hero » Thu Mar 06, 2014 11:46 pm

I think that not settling for a sub-par woman is a mark of high self-esteem, not low self-esteem.

It's funny, but I haven't noticed any correlation between a man's self-esteem and the quality of his wife/gf. Plenty of confident men are in serious relationships with physically repulsive women with horrible personalities.
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Postby Winston » Fri Mar 07, 2014 12:30 am

CrazyCanuck944 wrote:Some of us definitely have low self-esteem. Being consistently rejected by AW over time will contribute to this occurrence. A bit of a vicious cycle after that...receive less attention/interest and interaction=self-esteem dropping lower, which means you don't feel like even going out and trying to meet anyone (i.e. depression). Thank God for CF right now. Women are always interested.

Man, I can't wait until I can take a trip to the Phils. From everything I've read on here, it sounds like a life and soul rejuvenating experience....


Do you mean you joined Christian Filipina? What happened? Can you give a report? Did you meet any quality women on there?

So you are planning to go to the Philippines to meet someone? Is it someone you met on CF?
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

Don't forget my HA Grand Ebook and Dating Sites!

"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
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Postby CrazyCanuck944 » Fri Mar 07, 2014 5:39 pm

Winston wrote:
CrazyCanuck944 wrote:Some of us definitely have low self-esteem. Being consistently rejected by AW over time will contribute to this occurrence. A bit of a vicious cycle after that...receive less attention/interest and interaction=self-esteem dropping lower, which means you don't feel like even going out and trying to meet anyone (i.e. depression). Thank God for CF right now. Women are always interested.

Man, I can't wait until I can take a trip to the Phils. From everything I've read on here, it sounds like a life and soul rejuvenating experience....


Do you mean you joined Christian Filipina? What happened? Can you give a report? Did you meet any quality women on there?

So you are planning to go to the Philippines to meet someone? Is it someone you met on CF?


Yes, I joined CF a few weeks ago. Not much to report yet...I am still getting to know my matches, but there are some that I definitely want to meet in person. It sounds like the best plan is to have a half dozen or so favorites then meet up with them. Problem is how to arrange the dates without the others knowing.
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Postby mattyman » Fri Mar 07, 2014 6:41 pm

Winston wrote:Her claim is that low self-esteem is the INITIAL CAUSE of rejection by AW. You see what I mean? In other words, AW look at us and reject us not for our looks, but because they see low self-esteem in us. That's the argument that she clings to.


That seems a bit too simplistic an explanation. The thing is, you are not responsible for the other person's actions.

In a way that does come across as suggesting that one who's not feeling 100% deserves to be rejected.

It would be helpful if you were to elaborate on what you mean by 'low-self-esteem'. Is it things such as trying to avoid rejection, trying too hard to please, be something someone supposedly wants?

To a degree, you have a certain amount of control as to how things such as rejection affects your self-esteem. For example, you can learn not to take it personally. This is not to suggest that someone who's feeling low about themselves as a result of many rejections, exclusions, alienation, bullying etc. deserves to be blamed for it or feeling weak (the latter is too American a mentality).
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Postby SilverEnergy » Sat Mar 08, 2014 3:21 am

That's why you have to find something that gives you a sense of fulfillment and accomplishment outside of dating, like a hobby or something that you do very well.

It's up to YOU to have high self esteem.

It's not a woman's responsibility to give you high self esteem, only YOU can do that.

Traveling overseas or accomplishing something very big can definitely give you a confidence boost because women can smell low confidence on a guy a million miles a way.

Self esteem comes from WITHIN.
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Postby manly5000 » Sat Mar 08, 2014 3:36 am

If you let a woman tell you what kind of self-esteem you have or don't have...

you have NO self esteem.

Silver has it right in the post right up above me.
Out in the world living the dream!
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Re: Do we all have low self-esteem? Why do women say we do?

Postby NorthAmericanguy » Sun Mar 09, 2014 1:34 am

Winston wrote:Hi all,
I've been talking to my close friend Elizabeth, who now lives in Reno, NV. I saw her when I was there and I've known her since 2001 when I was an actor in Reno. She insists that the reason why AW have always rejected me is because I have low self-esteem. When I refer her to the fact that 95 percent of AW on AOL rejected me online in the 1990's, after I sent them my best picture that I am proud of, she still insisted on this claim. I guess she thinks that low self-esteem can be transmitted online too. lol

I don't understand her basis. She is well meaning, honest, intelligent and a freethinker too. She's not the kind of woman that BSes or likes to shame others. And she agrees with many of our cultural comparisons of America vs. Abroad. So she is very aware. But she has a lot of New Age views as well.

Yet she honestly believes that low self-esteem is our problem, rather than looks or the spoiled ridiculous standards of AW. This is her honest view, not a shaming tactic.

So where does she and many other women get this idea that guys who are rejected by AW must have low self-esteem? What is the basis of this claim? What is the evidence for it? And why does she cling to it religiously? Does she know something that we don't?

She is somewhat New Ageish in her views and beliefs though. So could that be it? A lot of New Agers believe that there are no victims and that everything happens to you is a result of your attitude and thoughts drawing them to you. So someone who is always rejected by AW must be creating this rejection in their subconscious mind and drawing this rejection in a self-fulfilling prophecy. That's the logic of New Agers. They call it the "Law of Attraction" and take it very literally.

She has no explanation for why foreign women are friendlier to us, and why every guy does better abroad. She only says that in America, women see men as "all or nothing", so that if they are not romantically interested in you, then they want nothing to do with you, not even as friends. She acknowledges that in Europe, women are far more social toward men and are cool with going out with a guy as friends, even if she's not into him romantically. So she is well aware of such cultural differences. She's been to Hungary too. But she insists that low self-esteem is the cause of not being able to get dates in America.

At least she isn't one of those women who claim that foreign women are only friendly because they want your money and a green card. She is more evolved and aware than that.

Here is a photo of her and me when we were at a mall plaza in Orange County, CA. As you can see, she is attractive and obviously cannot relate to being dateless or rejected all the time. She is Eurasian - half Chinese and half Hungarian.



Winston, I'm just going to frank here. I'm not trying to be mean or anything. But, just by looking at your pictures, I can tell that you wouldn't be the type of Asian man that American women would want to date. It has to do with your style and personality.

Asian guys who do well with the girls here in the States are guys like Eddie Huang who have embraced the urban/rap clothing style, look a little mean, and have an extrovert and dynamic personality.

Image




As far as the self esteem issue. Growing up here in America, I have noticed and experienced that American culture builds up the self esteem of the female, but doesn't care about building up the self esteem of males. It's a hard time being a male (of any race) these days in America because this country is openly sexiest, and anti male, so many men grow up feeling inadequate and inferior to women.
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Postby S_Parc » Sun Mar 09, 2014 2:57 am

Winston & others,

Many women in the land of the Stars & Stripes think that either a man's got low esteem or that he's gay, if he's not around a woman. That's why AWs do such little work in getting a guy.

Thus, until Mel and I started *dating*, I was this "socially gay" guy around most AWs. I was confident enough, to engage anyone, male or female, in a conversation but without bias. So if a guy was more interesting, I'd spend more time talking to him, over someone boring, just because she's got b@@bs.

Now, they (meaning the stupid AWs I used to know) all feel like they'd *lost* the big catch and that my old ex-classmate was astute enough to con 'em out of their fish.

Yet, if they were simply honest, straightforward, & knew how to hold a dialogue, they may have actually gotten a decent guy, all those years ago.
16 years ago, the Best Picture of 1999, "American Beauty", telegraphed the message of Happier Abroad to the world.

Beware of long term engagements with AWs, you may find yourself in a coffin.

AB discussion thread

BTW, despite settling down with an AW, myself, the warning is still in effect.
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