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"Is America Still Puritan After All These Years?"

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jamesbond
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"Is America Still Puritan After All These Years?"

Post by jamesbond » April 16th, 2014, 5:29 am

Here is a link to an interesting news article I found from the New York Times called, "Still Puritan After All These Years."

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/05/opini ... .html?_r=0


Here are some excerpts from the article:

A series of experiments conducted by researchers led by the psychologist Eric Luis Uhlmann and published last year in the Journal of Experimental Social Psychology. In one study, they investigated whether the work habits of today’s Americans reflected the so-called Protestant work ethic. Martin Luther and John Calvin argued that work was a calling from God. They also believed in predestination and viewed success as a sign of salvation. This led to belief in success as a path to salvation: hard work and good deeds would bring rewards, in life and after.

In the study, American and Canadian college students were asked to solve word puzzles involving anagrams. But first, some were subtly exposed to (or “primedâ€￾ with) salvation-related words like “heavenâ€￾ and “redeem,â€￾ while others were exposed to neutral words. The researchers found that the Americans — but not the Canadians — solved more anagrams with salvation on the mind. They worked harder.


Professor Uhlmann and his colleagues also conducted an experiment to see if Americans shared the prudishness of the Puritans. They found that American students judged promiscuous women more harshly than British students did.

Why the persistence of Puritanism in American life? “New England exercised a disproportionate influence on American ideals,â€￾ the historian John Coffey says, “thanks to a powerful intellectual tradition disseminated through its universities, its dynamic print culture and the writings of its famous clergy.â€￾ He also notes the power of Evangelicalism as a carrier of Puritan values and America’s resistance, compared with other largely Protestant nations, to secularization.
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Post by S_Parc » April 16th, 2014, 5:44 am

Here's what I don't understand ... how about working hard and then ... screwing hard, afterwards?

I mean this whole Puritan work ethic is about working hard and then, living a life of *blue balls*. That makes no sense to me. If Calvin advocated determinism, then the avg Joe should just kill himself, and get it over with, since the almighty has already made his decision.

My version of Puritanism is that after a hard week of work, one should indulgence in a wild orgy, so that one's ready for the following Monday.

In other words, there's nothing wrong with *being all that one can be*, the basic Marine's credo, but then, b@inking hoes during one's rest time.
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Beware of long term engagements with AWs, you may find yourself in a coffin.

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Post by jamesbond » April 16th, 2014, 8:56 pm

Check out this awesome article called, "Implicit Puritanism in America." It goes into great detail on how puritanism caused both our obsession with work (Americans work more hours than anyone else in the industrialized word) and our prudish ideas regarding sex, nudity and prostitution (America is one of the few countries were p4p is illegal).

Here are some excerpts from the article:

Numerous scholars have argued that since the inception of the first New England colonies, both Protestant work values (views on work and salvation articulated by John Calvin), and the pursuit of piety through sexual purity, have been at the forefront of American culture.

The roots of the America we currently know are firmly planted in the soil of some of the earliest and most influential Americans—a zealous group of Puritan-Protestants, who intended to
create an inherently spiritual nation, envisioning it as a land of purity and spiritually righteous people.


Here is the link for the article:

https://webfiles.uci.edu/dtannenb/www/d ... tanism.pdf
"When I think about the idea of getting involved with an American woman, I don't know if I should laugh .............. or vomit!"

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Post by jamesbond » April 16th, 2014, 9:32 pm

Holy smokes, check out this article, it gives statistics showing that in countries that are sexually repressive and prudish (like the USA) teen pregnancy, STD's and abortion are HIGHER than in countries that are more open towards sexuality.

Here are some excerpts from the article:

Someone who wants to make a strong argument in favor of more sexual liberalism needs only to compare the United States and Germany, a country that has comprehensive sex-ed programs and legal prostitution.

In 2010, Germany had a rate of 8 abortions per 1,000 compared to the United States ’ 19.6 abortions per 1,000 in 2008.


The Netherlands has a reputation for being one of the most pro-sex countries in the world, and it isn’t hard to understand why. From comprehensive sex education to legal prostitution (Amsterdam has one of Europe’s most famous red light districts) to nude and topless beaches.

In 2009, the Netherlands had a teen birth rate of 5.3 per 1,000 compared to 39.1 per 1,000 in the United States in 2009.

Sociologist Amy Schalet who is also professor at the University of Massachusetts has done extensive sex-related research on the United States and the Netherlands, often asserting that Americans would be much better off if they had the sexual openness of the Dutch.


Here is the link for the article:


http://www.alternet.org/story/154970/5_ ... page=0%2C0
"When I think about the idea of getting involved with an American woman, I don't know if I should laugh .............. or vomit!"

"Trying to meet women in America is like trying to decipher Egyptian hieroglyphics."

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Post by SilverEnergy » April 16th, 2014, 11:11 pm

The people who came over here from America were very Puritan and violent.

The overly religious atmosphere has created a sexually Puritanical country.

Sure, there are promiscous people here, including women but it doesn't change the fact that according to studies, Americans have among the least sex per year among developed countries and that sexless marriages are higher here than anywhere in the world.
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Post by OutWest » April 17th, 2014, 7:33 am

jamesbond wrote:Holy smokes, check out this article, it gives statistics showing that in countries that are sexually repressive and prudish (like the USA) teen pregnancy, STD's and abortion are HIGHER than in countries that are more open towards sexuality.

Here are some excerpts from the article:

Someone who wants to make a strong argument in favor of more sexual liberalism needs only to compare the United States and Germany, a country that has comprehensive sex-ed programs and legal p4p.

In 2010, Germany had a rate of 8 abortions per 1,000 compared to the United States ’ 19.6 abortions per 1,000 in 2008.


The Netherlands has a reputation for being one of the most pro-sex countries in the world, and it isn’t hard to understand why. From comprehensive sex education to legal p4p (Amsterdam has one of Europe’s most famous red light districts) to nude and topless beaches.

In 2009, the Netherlands had a teen birth rate of 5.3 per 1,000 compared to 39.1 per 1,000 in the United States in 2009.

Sociologist Amy Schalet who is also professor at the University of Massachusetts has done extensive sex-related research on the United States and the Netherlands, often asserting that Americans would be much better off if they had the sexual openness of the Dutch.


Here is the link for the article:


http://www.alternet.org/story/154970/5_ ... page=0%2C0

These posts seem to be pretty much about stereotypes and cliches. I don't know if the Puritans were all that rigid...from what I read, they were pretty practical. Keep in mind, they primarily settled in the NE colonies, and there were many other settlers and influences to be found.

Because of the general lack of knowledge to be found within the USA, most can say anything, and few have the ammo to dispute it. Much of what is labeled as "Puritan" is in fact just
Evangelical or fundamentalist belief- much of which sprung up with the advent of the temperance movement in post civil war America.

As far as the teen birthrate in Western Europe goes- don't place much stock in stats like those listed.
Do they account for teen marriages? In general, the birthrate with Europeans is so low that their societies are headed towards collapse.

Jeesh, you all cannot make up your minds whether or not American women are a bunch of sluts or
whether they are a bunch of up-tight prudes...

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Post by jamesbond » April 17th, 2014, 11:44 am


"When I think about the idea of getting involved with an American woman, I don't know if I should laugh .............. or vomit!"

"Trying to meet women in America is like trying to decipher Egyptian hieroglyphics."

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Post by jamesbond » April 22nd, 2014, 2:32 pm


"When I think about the idea of getting involved with an American woman, I don't know if I should laugh .............. or vomit!"

"Trying to meet women in America is like trying to decipher Egyptian hieroglyphics."

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Post by jamesbond » April 23rd, 2014, 9:06 pm

Check out this video where a guy from Germany explains how life is different there than it is in puritanical America. For example, in Germany they show nudity in television commercials and TV programs. You also see nudity on billboards and in newspapers.

Germany also has parks where women can sunbath topless. Also, in Germany they have co-ed all nude saunas.

This is stuff you would NEVER see in America because of our prudish, puritanical heritage.

"When I think about the idea of getting involved with an American woman, I don't know if I should laugh .............. or vomit!"

"Trying to meet women in America is like trying to decipher Egyptian hieroglyphics."

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Post by jamesbond » April 24th, 2014, 6:34 pm

Here is an excerpt from an article from the Seattle Times called, "European nudes and American prudes" by Rick Steves.

Any traveler to Europe who's visited a bath, perused a newsstand, hung out at a beach or park on a sunny day, or channel-surfed broadcast TV late at night has noticed that Europeans are more relaxed than Americans about nudity.

In the south of France, sunbathing grandmothers have no tan lines. In Norway, young children play naked in fountains. On summer days, accountants in Munich head to the park on their lunch break to grin and bare it, trading corporate suits for birthday suits. It's quite a shock to Americans (they're the ones riding their bikes into the river and trees). In Belgium, huge billboards advertise soap by showing a woman's lathered-up breasts.


On a recent trip to Europe, I spent an afternoon relaxing at the German spa resort of Baden-Baden. In two hours, I saw more naked people than I've seen in the last two years.
"When I think about the idea of getting involved with an American woman, I don't know if I should laugh .............. or vomit!"

"Trying to meet women in America is like trying to decipher Egyptian hieroglyphics."

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Post by jamesbond » April 24th, 2014, 7:01 pm

Here is a great article called "American Prude."

Why are Americans so prudish? There are many reasons to wonder. Europeans are more relaxed in every respect with regard to body image. They have topless beaches and the European men are much more inclined to wear skimpy Speedos, regardless of body shape. When I was in Europe, I watched a bit of "Euro TV" in various hotels -- sometimes late at night, or during the day between museum forays.

I was amazed that they showed what we would consider R-rated movies for general audiences after 10:30PM. Even the daytime TV commercials showed more than Americans see at a peep show. The same relaxed attitude also extends to print media, where Europeans flaunt what they have in weekly news magazines aimed at the general public. In Amsterdam, one of the nicest most historic canal streets is in the "red light" district. They don't see a need to set aside any other area for “the world’s oldest professionâ€￾.

Americans are prudes by any measure. American men wear boxy, down-to-the-knee swim suits. Women have even flirted with a return to one-piece suits -- Hello Miss America 1923. We fastidiously put V-chips in every TV and have several agencies that enforce censorship and movie ratings. America has a few nude and topless beaches, but they're more the subject of silly jokes than serious sunbathing. Magazines with adult content are in wrappers or covers partially concealed and proof of age is required to buy one.

That people might "have needs" is seen as a heinous evil that should only ever be met with monogamous, marital coupling and prayer sessions if needed. Particularly the American South (the "Bible Belt") has a problem with things like sexually oriented businesses, massage parlors and condom stores. Mind you, the presence or need of such things hasn't gone away -- America simply chooses to indulge its appetites privately, furtively, under the cloak of darkness. A part of the American psyche says, "It's not a sin if I don't get caught". The very concept of "getting caught", that sex is a crime -- is American as Apple pie.

Will America ever be less uptight about sex? Can we ever “get realâ€￾ about human nature and the human condition? It may well come to pass, but we will probably have to be as old as Europe and as burned by religion as they have been. Rome wasn’t built in a day, and the Church of Rome did not lose its glorious patina all in a day. Can sex and spirituality coexist in the same philosophical plane? I think so, but Americans will have to learn to “think different."
"When I think about the idea of getting involved with an American woman, I don't know if I should laugh .............. or vomit!"

"Trying to meet women in America is like trying to decipher Egyptian hieroglyphics."

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Post by QuestionMark » April 24th, 2014, 8:11 pm

This is a great topic, great points were made and great discussion. James Bond, you hit the nail on the head with almost every post. This is something I've noticed for over ten years now. And it's one of the big reasons why I've wanted to leave the states and move somewhere else for so long.

Yes america is prudish and puritanical. And as you stated, they're are contradictions of that in society all over the place. We have a culture which celebrates things like hooters, girlsgonewild, provocatively dressed women in movies and music videos, strip clubs, and porn (to an extent). But at the same time p4p is illegal in all but roughly half of one state, they teach teenagers to abstain from sex before marriage (although most people dont do that), nudity and even females being topless in mainstream media is considered obscene, is censored, and if it happens all hell will break loose (Janet Jackson at superbowl 04 ring a bell), and if men express that they like sex or female nudity they're considered disgusting, tasteless, immature perverts who don't respect women. America is a sexual hypocrite.

You were right about america being on of the few places were p4p is illegal in the world. There's a few other places where it's illegel such as Sweden, but most places dont take it so seriously that they're willing to waste taxpayers money and police resources to setup sting operations and vice squads just bust those involved, fine them, and make them attend a "john school". Also it goes on the person's record, so it even makes it hard for them to get an apartment or even certain jobs. Even in Canada, the supreme court just fully legalized it a few months ago. American cops even admit that they can never get rid of it altogether, but they're willing to go to that extent just to deter as many ppl as possible from doing it. In other countries such as Brazil and Australia, it's normal for cities to have a red light district. This is the self-proclaimed "freest" country in the world, but they will slam you to the ground and arrest you for paying for romance with a consenting adult?

Society encourages women to dress and look sexy but it's illegal in america for a woman to be topless in public. In other places this isn't the case.

I've heard some of those things about Europe but some of them are news to me. And that just makes Europe sound even better. I gotta get over there.

In america, if you want to see nudity or even toplessness on tv, or even just profanity, you pretty much have to pay significantly more money for movie channels.

And americans always use the excuse of "how will this affect the children" as the trump card. Are European children becoming inappropriately sexualized at 8 yrs old? No, if anything they're more mature than american kids, because sex education is better there, and the parents are more mature about sex.

And it's funny how americans are so prudish about sex, but they're very liberal towards violence. Violence is everywhere in america, in the media and in real life. How come american parents aren't offended and want to protect their kids from that. America is so backwards that it's not even funny, it's actually an embarrassment more than anything.

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Post by S_Parc » April 24th, 2014, 9:40 pm

QuestionMark wrote:This is the self-proclaimed "freest" country in the world, but they will slam you to the ground and arrest you for paying for romance with a consenting adult?
Yeah, but it's worse than that. The Sugar Daddy/Sugar Baby thing is fully ok in the US because in part, the guy is paying for an entire week's (month's or even year's) companionship but not for s*x. Thus, it's also made p4p an elite society where only the top 1% can afford to have mistresses at their beck & call.

The sting ops by the vice squad are all geared towards the avg Joe, who can't afford to have a 'kept' woman around for R&R, and thus, are entrapped into actually paying for the act itself.

If I were Kobe Bryant, I would never have married Vanessa. Instead, I'd have mistresses in each quadrant of the US, one near Delaware, one in Orlando, one in LA, one in Seattle, perhaps one in the heartland or TX triangle, and depending upon the NBA schedule, see a different gal during the national touring. Instead, the guy's got a false rape accusation (by a worker at a hotel in CO), had to pay her off [ or else ], lost a huge amount of advertising money as a result of the chatter, and then, had to apologize to Vanessa by buying her a $4M diamond ring. How pathetic :roll:
Many years ago, the Best Picture of 1999, "American Beauty", telegraphed the message of Happier Abroad to the world.

Beware of long term engagements with AWs, you may find yourself in a coffin.

AB discussion thread

BTW, despite settling down with an AW, myself, the warning is still in effect.

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Post by QuestionMark » April 24th, 2014, 10:05 pm

S_Parc wrote:
QuestionMark wrote:This is the self-proclaimed "freest" country in the world, but they will slam you to the ground and arrest you for paying for romance with a consenting adult?
Yeah, but it's worse than that. The Sugar Daddy/Sugar Baby thing is fully ok in the US because in part, the guy is paying for an entire week's (month's or even year's) companionship but not for s*x. Thus, it's also made p4p an elite society where only the top 1% can afford to have mistresses at their beck & call.

The sting ops by the vice squad are all geared towards the avg Joe, who can't afford to have a 'kept' woman around for R&R, and thus, are entrapped into actually paying for the act itself.
That's right. In other countries, p4p is much more affordable and reasonable prices for the average joe. In the few counties in Nevada that actually do have legal p4p, I've heard of the girls charging men $800 an hour and up! In other places, you can get them much cheaper than that.

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Post by S_Parc » April 24th, 2014, 10:29 pm

QuestionMark wrote:That's right. In other countries, p4p is much more affordable and reasonable prices for the average joe. In the few counties in Nevada that actually do have legal p4p, I've heard of the girls charging men $800 an hour and up! In other places, you can get them much cheaper than that.
Even in London, quite possibly the most expensive city of the former Anglo-American empire, $800/hr is way over the top and could probably get one a date with an English rose actress, better looking than Kate Beckinsale.
Many years ago, the Best Picture of 1999, "American Beauty", telegraphed the message of Happier Abroad to the world.

Beware of long term engagements with AWs, you may find yourself in a coffin.

AB discussion thread

BTW, despite settling down with an AW, myself, the warning is still in effect.

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