Join John Adams, world renowned Intl Matchmaker, Thurs nights 8:30 EST for Live Webcasts with FREE Prizes!
And check out Five Reasons why you should attend a FREE Live AFA Seminar! See locations and details.


Scam free! Check out Christian Filipina - Meet Asian women with Christian values! Members screened.
Exclusive book offer! 75% off! How to Meet, Date and Marry Your Filipina Wife



View Active Topics       Latest 100 Topics       View Your Posts       FAQ Topics       Switch to Mobile


JT Tran, Asian PUA Guru: What a Scam and Ripoff!

For Asian Americans to discuss Asian American issues and topics.

Moderators: jamesbond, fschmidt

JT Tran, Asian PUA Guru: What a Scam and Ripoff!

Postby Winston » Wed Sep 30, 2009 10:46 am

Check this out. An Asian PUA guru named JT Tran, or Jerry Tran, aka "The Asian Playboy" is charging $3500 for a PUA bootcamp, just to make Asian guys feel a little better about themselves! What a SCAM and RIPOFF! Those guys must be super gullible suckers. Anyone can learn to approach American women and make conversation, but it doesn't usually lead anywhere. Even I can do that. No one needs to pay $3500 for it. I can't believe smart Asian bros are being taken in like that. That money would obviously be better spent going abroad to date sincere, natural, down to earth women where no PUA or game is required.


http://www.asianweek.com/2008/02/08/pro ... %E2%80%99/

Proselytizing ‘the Game’

February 8, 2008
Print Email Share

Cover

Decoding the Asian Playboy, the world’s greatest Asian pick-up artist

NEW YORK — Clad in a black leather motorcycle jacket with red racing stripes, he stood at 5’6â€￾, with his hair in a textured faux hawk and a wispy mustache and goatee at the bottom of his boyish face. This was the Asian playboy.

Self-described as the “Asian Hitchâ€￾ and a “hard ass drill sergeant of a pick-up artist instructor,â€￾ the Asian Playboy serves as a guide into the underground world of seduction.

In every major city across the world, there lies a more duplicitous subset of the nightlife community. Known as the “seduction community,â€￾ they organize themselves into regional chapters called “lairs,â€￾ and meet to trade stories or discuss new pick-up tactics and strategies.

Although highlighted by Neil Strauss’ bestselling book, The Game: Penetrating the Secret Society of Pick-Up Artists, and VH1’s reality series, The Pick-Up Artist, true pick-up artists generally prefer to operate discreetly, their advances and techniques only recognizable by their peers. They often adopt an appellation to conceal their true identities as they intoxicate the nightlife scene gallivanting as modern day Lotharios, using seduction as their only drug.

Born in Texas as Jerry Tran — the Asian Playboy aka “APB,â€￾ or as he prefers to be called, “JTâ€￾ — studied aerospace engineering at the Florida Institute of Technology before becoming a professional social swinger. “For me, it was graduating from college, and I go out to California and realize I just sucked [at my social skills],â€￾ Tran explained. “So, I decided to do something about it.â€￾

He turned to what he knew best as an engineer: research, self-education, and reverse-engineering the social protocols and processes in the nightlife scene.

On the Internet, Tran encountered the writings of Erik von Markovik, aka “Mystery,â€￾ a master pick-up artist featured in Strauss’ book and the VH1 series. He signed up for Mystery’s boot camp as a primer for becoming a pick-up artist. But the real development of a young pick-up protégé begins in the weeks after boot camp, affectionately referred to as “beginner’s hell.â€￾

“There were weeks when I trained four to seven nights a week,â€￾ Tran explained about the effort it took to overcome his “approach anxiety,â€￾ or the anxiety felt when striking and maintaining a conversation with total strangers, and become “socially acclimated.â€￾

That was four years ago. Since then, he has emerged as a master pick-up artist and entrepreneur who has founded his own company, evolved a new pick-up system called the “ABCs of Attraction,â€￾ and now travels around the world running his own boot camps aimed toward Asian and ethnic men. In 2007, he won the title of “The World’s Greatest Asian Pick-up Artistâ€￾ at the Global Seduction Summit in Hollywood. “It’s actually a little grandiose,â€￾ he laughed about the peer-voted honor. “It’s not like there’s a formal body or anything that decides.â€￾

Although he admits “the gameâ€￾ is no different for Asian men, Tran explained the need for an ethnic specific boot camp by stressing the recognition of societal influences from stereotypes and the media. “There will always be underlying perceptions that people have about Asian men — that we’re small, misogynistic, stable, effeminate, have small penises, asexual, etc.,â€￾ Tran said.

Noting the sentiment of frustration felt by many Asian Pacific American men, Tran acknowledged that his program was not for everybody. “There’s been a lot of anger. You can either do something about it or you can wallow in your own self-pity. [The latter] are the guys that I can’t help. … They don’t want to take responsibility for their own mediocrity in life.â€￾

The boot camps span three days from 6 p.m. to 3 a.m. each day. Three to four hours each day are dedicated to lectures and workshops, followed by hands-on practice at a local nightlife establishment. At the end of the night, the students meet to recap.

At a recent New York boot camp, students ranged from early-20s-to-mid-30s, most were Ivy League-educated, and some worked in finance, consulting and law. They did not seem particularly socially awkward or unattractive, but all were motivated by dissatisfaction with their social lives and wanted to embody more of the alpha male qualities they respected.

Tran wants to teach Asian American men to leverage their ethnicity in dating, instead of ignoring it. “There’s the Asian guy who tries to be as white as possible in order to get girls. And he will. And he hates everything about being Asian. And then there’s a guy who tries to be super-Asian. He hangs out in Chinatown and only dates Asian women. Both of who will succeed in spite of being Asian. What I’m trying to teach is to be successful because you’re Asian.â€￾ For example: “Very rarely will people think that we are rapists. You can use that to your advantage. Women don’t have to worry about their physical safety around us. But, we have to be more sexual, be more direct.â€￾

Tran feels little unease about evangelizing a method in which men could potentially exploit weaknesses in women, notwithstanding the fact that the inherent goal of “the gameâ€￾ involves the objectification of women.

“It is true that a lot of this is misogynistic,â€￾ Tran conceded. “I try to lead by my own lifestyle, by setting a good example. But at the same time, I don’t teach ethics. It’s up to each guy to decide what to do with it.â€￾

Not surprisingly, many object to Tran’s line of work. “I do get a lot of hatred within the Asian community, especially the Asian feminists. They despise me,â€￾ Tran said. “We’re the only ethnic group where the women sexually outperform the men.â€￾

Asian pick-up artists seek to sexually empower themselves to balance the scales and serve as an antidote to the emasculated Asian male archetype. Tran also did not disagree with the characterization that what he teaches are the skills to be misogynists and bed as many women as possible.

“Is there something wrong with that?â€￾ Tran countered. “On a sheer population level, white guys are good at that far more than we are. This just puts us on par with everyone else. We’re often the backup plan [for Asian women]. … So when the options [for potential mates] begin to dwindle, it starts to threaten your confidence.â€￾

After all, he pointed out, “I never lie to them,â€￾ adding that the only thing he offers to women is a good time.

On the final night of the boot camp, at the Hotel Gansevoort’s rooftop lounge, the Asian Playboy stood against the bar smugly surveying his new protégés. The efficacy of his methods was evident: His students were confidently working the room, chatting with groups of beautiful, well-to-do women — blondes, brunettes, you name it.

“Isn’t this a good time? I’m in my element!â€￾ he shouted as he disappeared into the crowd.

Visit www.abcsofattraction.com for the schedule of boot camps. Private boot camps and boot camps in unlisted cities can also be arranged.
Last edited by Winston on Sat Mar 10, 2012 6:54 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

Don't forget my HA Grand Ebook and Dating Sites!

"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
User avatar
Winston
Site Admin
 
Posts: 23612
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:16 pm







Postby Winston » Wed Sep 30, 2009 10:52 am

On his forum where his boot camps are advertised, people who went to them are saying that it helped them learn a lot, but none of them have proven that it really works or changes their dating life. And that's assuming that the testimonials are real too. There's like only one or two reviews for each bootcamp.

Kind of stupid treating this game like the army don't you think?

http://www.abcofattraction.com/community/
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

Don't forget my HA Grand Ebook and Dating Sites!

"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
User avatar
Winston
Site Admin
 
Posts: 23612
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:16 pm

Postby momopi » Thu Oct 01, 2009 3:44 am

http://www.abcsofattraction.com/

If you look at the upper left corner, where he has youtube videos, you'd notice that your "Winston Wu in Russia" video is on the list. hehehehehe.

I don't think someone's popularity and appeal to women can be simply taught, the students may pick up a few useful tidbits but few will become very successful. Most will just blow their $ and feel better about themselves.

IMO you may not agree with his methods, but he, among many others on the web, does address some of the same topics that you do here regarding AM dating issues.
momopi
Elite Upper Class Poster
 
Posts: 4711
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2007 4:44 am
Location: Orange County, California

Postby Winston » Tue Oct 27, 2009 4:34 pm

momopi wrote:http://www.abcsofattraction.com/

If you look at the upper left corner, where he has youtube videos, you'd notice that your "Winston Wu in Russia" video is on the list. hehehehehe.

I don't think someone's popularity and appeal to women can be simply taught, the students may pick up a few useful tidbits but few will become very successful. Most will just blow their $ and feel better about themselves.

IMO you may not agree with his methods, but he, among many others on the web, does address some of the same topics that you do here regarding AM dating issues.


I don't see it. Maybe he removed it? Why would he use one of my videos?
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

Don't forget my HA Grand Ebook and Dating Sites!

"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
User avatar
Winston
Site Admin
 
Posts: 23612
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:16 pm

Postby momopi » Wed Nov 04, 2009 9:56 am

Here's an excellent commentary titled "A Long List Of Ways The Seduction Community Can Make You Weird":

http://www.datinggroundwork.com/community
momopi
Elite Upper Class Poster
 
Posts: 4711
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2007 4:44 am
Location: Orange County, California

Postby chanta76 » Tue Feb 02, 2010 8:55 am

I actually took a pick up boot camp. I'm full blooded Korean male. Grew up america all my life and to some degree have the same experience that Wu has. I think dating for Asian men in USA is allot harder because of racial sexual stereotypes the sad part is you find a fair number of Asian women who refuse to date asian men also.

OK this is what I think of the pick up boot camp. I'm not going to say which company I took it with because allot of the concept they use is pretty much borrowed from one pick up school to the other. You know you learn to open correctly and approach correctly ..
Overall I think in the boot camp you do learn some good social skills. You learn not to act weird and how to properly approach a woman and to escalate .
Does this stuff work? Yes ..and no. What I mean is that the template for the structure approach is a good frame to work with but in order for this to work effectively you have to attractive life for it to work. In other words what I learn in my boot camp is that staying home all day and doing nothing is not how to be an attractive man. Get hobbies , get passion be in good shape, dress better etc..etc..and learn the pua social skills and practice on 100's of girls and than you could make it.

So yeap..can this work yes if you actually improve yourself and better yourself but I see allot of guys quitting because it is hard. If anything the gain from a pua boot camp is learning the social frame work in how to interact with a woman in non-needy way . There were guys before the boot camp who were just way too needy or too weird that needed correction in how to act around a woman. Just by fixing this they got better..the next step is sharpen and develop an attractive life style.

An attractive life style does not mean having allot of money but being fun and interesting. Overall pua can work but it takes allot of I mean allot of work and well..not every guy will get there because it is hard.
chanta76
Experienced Poster
 
Posts: 1494
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 3:56 pm

Postby globetrotter » Tue Feb 02, 2010 12:20 pm

chanta76 wrote:What I mean is that the template for the structure approach is a good frame to work with but in order for this to work effectively you have to attractive life for it to work. In other words what I learn in my boot camp is that staying home all day and doing nothing is not how to be an attractive man. Get hobbies , get passion be in good shape, dress better etc..etc..and learn the pua social skills and practice on 100's of girls and than you could make it.

So yeap..can this work yes if you actually improve yourself and better yourself but I see allot of guys quitting because it is hard. If anything the gain from a pua boot camp is learning the social frame work in how to interact with a woman in non-needy way . There were guys before the boot camp who were just way too needy or too weird that needed correction in how to act around a woman. Just by fixing this they got better..the next step is sharpen and develop an attractive life style.

An attractive life style does not mean having allot of money but being fun and interesting. Overall pua can work but it takes allot of I mean allot of work and well..not every guy will get there because it is hard.


The point Winston makes is that this is all unnecessary outside of the USA, which is socially f***ed up.

This notion that someone has to try to meet 100's of women in order to be able to meet women - that is a USA, goal oriented, approach. In normal healthy societies you meet a nice girl and you go out. You don't NEED to practice because society is not dysfunctional. You get coffee, the waitress is cute, you talk with her, you get her mobile number, you go out. Easy.

Here in China it is an embarrassment of riches. The ONLY reason I have yet to hook up with someone is that my Pantungua is horrible and I cannot communicate with the ladies, and they approach me. Conversations stall. I recall one time last week in Xian when I got a manicure and 3 girls hovered over me for 40 minutes. Yowza. I meet at least 2 or 3 a day who are interested. Cell phone clerks, hotel workers, grocery store workers, girls selling food, they are literally everywhere.

This idea that one must f**k 100 different people so that one knows how to f**k, talk with 100 so that you can meet 1 - do you think the hotties in Asia have bedded 100 guys before they date you in the RP or China or Russia? No. They haven't. Yet they know how to f**k.

Leave the US. It ain't worth it. Even if you think that the larger income you make there will compensate - it doesn't. You will be happier earning less overseas and dating there, than saving for years enduring a decade or more of loneliness, solitude and deprivation.

This comes from someone (me) who is a ladies man. I have enjoyed many AW when I was 20-42, but I just tired of them.
globetrotter
Experienced Poster
 
Posts: 1023
Joined: Fri Nov 20, 2009 7:45 pm
Location: Someplace Other Than This Forum

Postby jamesbond » Tue Feb 02, 2010 12:34 pm

It is funny that pickup artists tell guys to approach 100 women just to see if your approach to them works. Who has time to approach a 100 women? Also, pickup artists tell guys that to get ONE phone number you may have to ask out 20 women! WTF? After getting rejected about 10 times in a row, your self esteem will go into the toilet! Also, David Deangelo said that for EVERY 10 PHONE NUMBERS YOU GET, YOU WILL ONLY HAVE A DATE WITH 1 OR 2 OF THOSE WOMEN! In other words, you will literally need to ask out HUNDREDS OF WOMEN if you ever hope to find a girlfriend in the USA! It could take years just to get a date with a woman in America. Unfricking believeable how hard it is to meet women in the United f***ed up States of America! :shock:
User avatar
jamesbond
Elite Upper Class Poster
 
Posts: 7501
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2007 5:45 pm
Location: USA

Postby Contrarian Expatriate » Tue Feb 02, 2010 12:47 pm

If one wants American women, it seems like a decent alternative. I especially like how he recognizes how ethnicity impacts the game.

Now, I would never waste my time with such a re-education camp, but it seems better than most PUA's who trumpet the myth that "one size fits all."
Feel free to visit my sites and to leave your respected words of wisdom:

http://thedeclineofmyamerica.blogspot.com/

http://www.youtube.com/user/ContrarianExpatriate
Contrarian Expatriate
Experienced Poster
 
Posts: 1405
Joined: Thu Dec 03, 2009 5:57 am

Postby chanta76 » Wed Feb 03, 2010 12:06 am

globetrotter,

I never been to China . If I may ask are you white? The reason why I ask is that I notice that for white guys they tend to have more of a privilege status in hooking up with foreign girls in foreign country more so than let say a guy like me who looks Asians. I know Wu will say other wise.
chanta76
Experienced Poster
 
Posts: 1494
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2008 3:56 pm

Postby Winston » Mon Feb 22, 2010 11:05 pm

It looks like the AsianPlayBoy got on Channel 5 ABC. That's odd. Why would they interview someone so fake and nothing special to offer. Watch his interview here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=36vl1Q1yUMA

As you can see in his interview, it's obvious that he doesn't present anything that isn't just common sense. No special tricks. And when they show one of his PUA bootcamps, it's obvious that he is paying three white girls to come and practice with the Asian guys and encourage them. So fake and lame.

What a waste of a thousand dollars. Who would be so dumb to sign up and pay that much, just for fake praises from paid girls and common sense advice?

And why would the mainstream media give him any attention? That's really lame.

I ought to do seminars and charge that kind of money too. What a ripoff. I'd only charge people 20 to 30 dollars though, not a thousand. Sheesh.
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

Don't forget my HA Grand Ebook and Dating Sites!

"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
User avatar
Winston
Site Admin
 
Posts: 23612
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:16 pm

Postby Winston » Mon Feb 22, 2010 11:17 pm

chanta76 wrote:globetrotter,

I never been to China . If I may ask are you white? The reason why I ask is that I notice that for white guys they tend to have more of a privilege status in hooking up with foreign girls in foreign country more so than let say a guy like me who looks Asians. I know Wu will say other wise.


Yeah white men do better, but it depends on where. If you are talking about China, it is great for both whites and asian foreigners. In China, women love overseas asians cause they think they are rich, and plus their parents will be more accepting of them dating another asian than another white.

Either way, there are women available to both whites and asians, but probably of different types.
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

Don't forget my HA Grand Ebook and Dating Sites!

"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
User avatar
Winston
Site Admin
 
Posts: 23612
Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:16 pm

Postby Jakob » Tue Feb 23, 2010 1:10 am

All these so-called PUA gurus who have "cracked" the North American dating scene have one thing in common. They make a lifestyle out of picking up women, which is made possible (i.e. financed) by guys taking their seminars & boot camps.

Here's the angle:

"I will teach you how to be successful with women. That will make me enough money so that I can afford to spend the time and energy to approach tons of women (since I won't need a job). And due to the law of averages this will result in me being "successful" with women. This will justify me teaching guys how to be successful with women, and charging for it."

It's like a positive feedback. These guys make a living out of picking up women. This will statistically guarantee their success, which reinforces the perception that they are "good" and have a "method" that works. This keeps the demand high for their seminars & boot camps, which keeps the money flowing (thereby supporting their lifestyle), and the cycle continues.

So in large part, students of these seminars and boot camps are financing the pick-up lifestyle of the gurus, which is precisely what allows them to be so successful in the first place (if they are successful at all).

In reality, there is no actual method and there are no actual gurus. At best there is only the law of averages wrapped up to look like a viable strategy, and clever marketing.

No reasonable man would want to spend so much time and energy meeting women, unless he could somehow make money off it. So yeah, this is one big reason why PUAs would prefer if you stick to North America where the women are tough to meet, since that's the source of their livelihood.
Jakob
Freshman Poster
 
Posts: 16
Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 7:39 pm
Location: Ontario, Canada

Postby FuzzX » Mon Apr 05, 2010 7:17 am

The point Winston makes is that this is all unnecessary outside of the USA, which is socially f***ed up.

very true..


Learning PUA methods is like going into military navy seal black ops training and fighting some of the most heavily armed opposition in the world, they've got lasers, rocket launchers, F22 Raptors, Stealth Tanks. Then after you've mastered all the techniques and strategies you require to do battle on your own soil, you go overseas and find out that the 'enemy' can hardly throw rocks.

When I completed my first overseas 'campaign', I came back home looking like this: :shock:

and when I told other soldiers how under trainined/funded the 'enemy' was they looked at me like this: :roll:
FuzzX
Freshman Poster
 
Posts: 186
Joined: Tue Mar 02, 2010 10:59 pm

Postby the_ki » Sun May 23, 2010 1:55 am

Secrets aye?

'picking up chicks' isnt very special. Man has done it for thousands of years. Typically the guy that is confident and Decisive (not overthinking) is the most successful in this game.


"it's all in your heads guys, its SOOOO in your heads that its not funny..." said a man



Picking up girls is easy, YOU pick up girls with your identity. Making that changing.... is hard....

Identity to pick up girls:
Good posture (gym, yoga, whatever)
Well dressed
Strong voice (heaps of resources on net)
Having Passions
Having a strong sense of what you like and dont like
Positivity
Not freaking out JUST BECAUSE she's hot

Pre-open in club:
Keep it light guys. (ffs) keep your body language open and look friendly. This is just a room that has the lights switched off.

Walk up and talk to people. "hey hows it going?" at the least. If she see's you walking around talking to different people it might be enough to attract her. "oh, that guy knows everyone/is social" whereas if your just standing there you might come across as predatory or boring.

Movies aren't real, you don't want to like a wannabe vin diesel. Girls want fun, thats not fun.



Open in club:
Start by saying hi to girl at a bar. Or two girls at a bar. "Hi..... my names XXXXXX"

Note: Don't look apologetic when you approach as its very unnerving for a girl to be approached by someone bigger and stronger than she, who looks nervous.

Talk to her:
If your asking questions its pretty obvious you like her. Which may or may not work. Talking about stuff THAT YOU FIND interesting/cool/funny makes you cool and then she might talk about stuff that she is interested in. (You gotta get used to leading) If what your talking about makes genuinely smile and laugh while your talking your doing very well. She's just a girl and it doesnt matter what you say next(a very good attitude) pretend she's your little sister.

So you attract a girl by being in your own reality and having open friendly body language. (dont lean forward, ever)

You want your conversation to be very "in the moment." Conversation in a bar does not have to be logical.
KI:"OMG! I love scuba diving!" girl: "OMG! I SOOO WANT TO DO THAT" ki: "Its so cool! Like being surrounded by all that water" Basically I am just thinking allowed, it's spontaneous so it's good.

Once she's attracted to you its very effective to 'get to know her' in different ways. Like a friend that your close to, while at the same time still being sexual. Being sexual is a key part of picking up girls. (see escalation ladder)
http://www.vindicarlo.com/DiCarlo%20Esc ... lo.com.pdf

Okay so you dont HAVE to be a strong identity. Someone else with either learn it at a very very very early age or work for it like asian playboy did. I aint there yet, but I sure no where I'm going...

Master the fundamentals and YOU will have your own method. That you can sell in your own little ebook for $39.95.
the_ki
Freshman Poster
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Sun May 23, 2010 12:49 am

Next

Return to Asian American Issues

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest