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I was a GOD in The Philippines!

Post your trip reports, travel experiences, and updates abroad. Or your expat story if you already live overseas. Note: To post photos and images, insert the image URL between the tags [img]and[/img] after uploading them to a third party site.

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steve55
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My 2 cents worth

Post by steve55 » July 15th, 2012, 8:04 pm


Last edited by steve55 on July 15th, 2012, 8:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: My Side of the PI Story

Post by OutWest » July 15th, 2012, 8:10 pm



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Re: My Side of the PI Story

Post by davewe » July 15th, 2012, 11:56 pm

Mr S wrote: I actually got arrested for standing up to a girl in a relationship and smacking her around a bit when she was emotionally/physically violent towards me. Not that violence is the answer, but some women need a good smacking around to be shown who is boss. She will usually respect you after that and you won’t have as many issues with her. If you let shit go, like what Western women get away with, you may become pussified eventually, just a friendly warning to you all. It’s still old school in Philippines if you’re into that kind of relationship, it’s really up to you how radically feminized she becomes after she is with you for some time.
While this was an informative and cool post, I am not sure that going to a 3rd world country where I am not a citizen and smacking a girl around, getting arrested, and prison f***ed by a bunch of Filipinos is exactly the way I wanna spend my retirement years, but that's just me :) YMMV.

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Post by Winston » July 16th, 2012, 1:56 am

Just to clarify something to you all:

I'm not saying that high society parties for expats don't exist. Everything exists somewhere, duh, from the best to the worst of things.

What I'm saying is that these parties are NOT open to most expats. Also, it is NOT easy to date attractive middle class girls in the Philippines at all. Most middle class girls there aren't even that attractive, and the ones that are are snobby as hell.

If it was easy, then how come every random expat I've met hasn't been able to do it? Even expats who work in Makati have to come to Angeles City once in a while for fun.

Lesson in basic economics for you all:

If something is easy to get for free, then no one would be paying for it. The go go bars in AC, Manila and Cebu would not exist.

I'm all for giving you guys hope, but not false hope, because false hope leads to disappointment.

This is NOT about my looks. This is about logic, evidence, probability and common sense. I wish some of you would learn about that. Taking cheap shots at my looks isn't going to change the reality of all this.

In fact, Steve Neese, Steve Hoca, and Rock are all good looking white guys who went to the Philippines but they didn't date middle class girls. See Steve Neese's long reply above.

Challenge to you all:

Try to find just ONE credible source that claims that middle/upper class Filipinas are easy to date and shag with no cost for the average expat foreigner in the Philippines. Just one. You can't find it, because there are no credible sources that say that.

Question for nightwatchsf:

Is it your claim that any average joe expat can shag good looking middle class Filipinas easily? Can most? Answer yes or no. Please clarify your claim and argument.

Btw all, I asked a friend on this forum about why some of you prefer to believe an anonymous poster over a credible source, which is illogical. Here is his interesting response to me:

"I'll give you the same answer for the second time in 2 days! I think I told you this also the day I bumped into you in Diane in the little 7 - 11 in AC that time too! Hopefully you believe me and not ask me for the 10th time. Here it is:

People want to believe in Fantasy. It makes life simpler and nicer. Guys want to believe they can say some PUA routines and get any girl hot and sleep with them. They want to believe they can get rich by passive income, 4 hour work week, get rich quick with no hassle Real Estate and bang 100 girls a year in the USA. I see people talk about stupid shit like this all the time on Forums like yours or on TV shows.

Reality sucks! and Fantasy sells. That's why everybody's real life is such shit. What did you tell me that of all your thousands of Forum members that <10 people have ever visited you in the Phil (or anywhere) and that most of them were weird and you didn't like them. So basically even with your Forum of "truth seekers" more 99% of them a talkers, bullshitters, and not doers!"


Again, I'm all for giving people hope, but not false hope.
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Post by Winston » July 16th, 2012, 2:15 am

Thanks for weighing in Mr S. You've given the most realistic assessment of Filipinas ever, better than I could have. You are a great writer who tells it like it is. I will try to mark your post or reference it as an info resource. Perhaps I'll add it to the FAQ topics as well.

I hope people take to heart what you wrote, so they can know the real situation in the Philippines and not get disappointed by big over the top promises and stories. This forum should be all about the truth, not about promoting BS. We are here to tell the good, bad and the ugly.

Thanks for taking the time. I'll be glad to treat you to dinner next time we meet. :)
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Post by pete98146 » July 16th, 2012, 2:59 am

Winston wrote: People want to believe in Fantasy. It makes life simpler and nicer. Guys want to believe they can say some PUA routines and get any girl hot and sleep with them. They want to believe they can get rich by passive income, 4 hour work week, get rich quick with no hassle Real Estate and bang 100 girls a year in the USA. I see people talk about stupid shit like this all the time on Forums like yours or on TV shows.

Reality sucks! and Fantasy sells. That's why everybody's real life is such shit. What did you tell me that of all your thousands of Forum members that <10 people have ever visited you in the Phil (or anywhere) and that most of them were weird and you didn't like them. So basically even with your Forum of "truth seekers" more 99% of them a talkers, bullshitters, and not doers!"[/b]

Again, I'm all for giving people hope, but not false hope.
Winston, with an attitude like this, why don't you shut the entire site down? Seriously, if you are going to be a Debbie Downer, why should anybody listen to you? You base your argument that guys can't land a middle class filipina on Rock and Steve Hoca? Last time I checked, Rock (who seems cool) doesn't even like the filipino look and Steve Hoca seems to be a miserable nagger just like you. Why do you sweep guys that are successful like myself, Outwest and Davewe under the carpet? Shouldn't we be your heros ie guys that have gone abroad and found the best that a given country has to offer? Isn't that the coolaid that you are selling on this site? Hey the concept is there Winston. If you don't believe in possibilities and dreams then you are promoting the wrong message. Shut the site down or rename it "Miserable Abroad" because you are sending a mixed message. At best be neutral. Your pursuit of telling the truth is clearly painting a portrait of somebody that is not Happier Abroad. So what gives bro?

So just because you can't find a middle class lady in Phils doesn't.....I repeat doesn't mean others can't. Yes you need to have your stuff together to land one, but there are guys that are tired of dating in the west that do have good jobs, good personalities and decent looks. If they apply themselves and know where to look, then middle class filipinas are there for the taking.

Lastly, if Phils or Taiwan aren't working for you, get off your ass and try a place like Northern China!? Until you prove to be nothing more than an excuse filled bag of hot air that constantly needs to win every argument, you are quickly losing credibility by the day. BTW, no need to reply because I won't read it. Stop being so negative and step up the positive Winston. There are guys that are interested in being Happier Abroad afterall.

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Post by Winston » July 16th, 2012, 3:32 am

Pete,
You miss my point. Of course I want you all to be happier abroad. I'm not spreading misery. But I'm not going to give you false hope and tell you that hot middle class girls are easy. No way. I have met them and they aren't that much different than in the USA.

You are right that just because I can't get them, doesn't mean others can't. But MOST expats don't get them either. If it were that easy, every expat would be getting them, and all the go go bars would shut down. There would be no demand.

I'm just trying to be accurate. Accuracy is the top priority to me. Not giving false hope or BSing or sweet talking you guys. That's what makes me credible. I am also very talented and skillful in debunking BS. It's one of my major strengths. Take a look at these for proof:

http://www.debunkingskeptics.com/Articles.htm

It's one of my fortes obviously. Not every guy here is good at BS detection.

Again, I don't want you to be miserable. I just hate bullshit. It's not easy. Life is not easy. Everything has a cost and price, one way or another, unless you are talking about "true love" but that's not easy to get, even for celebrities.

That's life dude. Deal with it. Stop trying to attack me in irrelevant ways.

Read Mr S assessment and comparison above. Now THAT's accurate and realistic and no-nonsense. That's what I love... TRUTH! ACCURACY!

Some of you guys may not care about truth or accuracy (I know Davewe doesn't, because he's admitted that to me), but I am very big on it.

Lastly, if you want me to go somewhere where I'll be happy, such as China, then quit wasting my time by spouting irrelevant BS for me to correct over and over again. It's exhausting and time consuming.
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Re: My Side of the PI Story

Post by Mr S » July 16th, 2012, 5:06 am

davewe wrote:
Mr S wrote: I actually got arrested for standing up to a girl in a relationship and smacking her around a bit when she was emotionally/physically violent towards me. Not that violence is the answer, but some women need a good smacking around to be shown who is boss. She will usually respect you after that and you won’t have as many issues with her. If you let shit go, like what Western women get away with, you may become pussified eventually, just a friendly warning to you all. It’s still old school in Philippines if you’re into that kind of relationship, it’s really up to you how radically feminized she becomes after she is with you for some time.
While this was an informative and cool post, I am not sure that going to a 3rd world country where I am not a citizen and smacking a girl around, getting arrested, and prison f***ed by a bunch of Filipinos is exactly the way I wanna spend my retirement years, but that's just me :) YMMV.
I never said I went to jail, you have to pretty much kill someone for that to happen. Basically with domestic disputes you have to chat with the barangay police chief and have it settled amongst all parties there. The police generally try to resolve most disputes amongst parties before arresting people and throwing them in jail. Remember, America is a litigation based society now who feeds off of the prison and legal system for graft and profits, it's not really a deterrent anymore. Back in the day in America and any other country domestic disputes were given low priority as the legal force shouldn't be butting into peoples lives to begin with, they should work it out themselves. Western feminist mentality has brainwashed men and women into believing the the law should handle every little disturbance, basically a nanny state where the government is the parent and husband and wife are the kids. You've all given up your personal liberties and been duped into a corrupt litigation system backed by a growing police state mentality over there that hurts people's lives rather than betters them. I would say only in rare cases do domestic problems need outside sources to resolve them. Relationships and marriage have always been like this, I assume for thousands of years and the leftist pinko feminist wackos want to rewrite genetics and human emotions? I ain't gonna put up with female over-the-top emotional bullshit so I don't and refuse to ever live again in an Anglo or Nordic radical feminist oriented culture.
"The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane." Marcus Aurelius, Roman Emperor and stoic philosopher, 121-180 A.D.

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Post by davewe » July 16th, 2012, 5:16 am

Winston wrote:Pete,


Some of you guys may not care about truth or accuracy (I know Davewe doesn't, because he's admitted that to me), but I am very big on it.
Why keep sucking me into this nonsense? I did not tell you that I didn't care about truth or accuracy. I said that when it comes to human relationships there is no absolute, scientific objective truth. That people have different goals and experiences. That my experience and Pete's and Outwest's and a dozen other guys I know from other boards tells me that middle class Filipinas do date and marry Westerners - at least some do.

BTW, I ready Mr. S's report. He never said that guys can't get middle class Filipinas. Again this is the point. Two people read the same posting and saw different things.

Rock is gone, Repatriate is gone, we haven't seen Will N since he started this thread (maybe that makes him smart) and the new guy got driven away too. And why? Because he had the temerity to post an experience that was different.

Guys - shouldn't we be cheering each other on? Shouldn't we be excited about our successes, even if someone's success is different from ours? Isn't this what originally brought everyone to this forum? That for me is the ultimate truth; that each person has a unique experience but his experience can still inspire me.

Or do we just want to sit in front of our computers, be miserable, complain about our world and our life, and do nothing about it? That's not the life I lead nor the life I intend to lead in the future.

So I will return to the Philippines, as well as other places abroad. I will "believe in the fantasy" and make it into my reality. That's my truth and a far more accurate truth it is than expressing the hopelessness than many of us feel in the West.

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Re: My Side of the PI Story

Post by davewe » July 16th, 2012, 5:22 am

Mr S wrote:
davewe wrote:
Mr S wrote: I actually got arrested for standing up to a girl in a relationship and smacking her around a bit when she was emotionally/physically violent towards me. Not that violence is the answer, but some women need a good smacking around to be shown who is boss. She will usually respect you after that and you won’t have as many issues with her. If you let shit go, like what Western women get away with, you may become pussified eventually, just a friendly warning to you all. It’s still old school in Philippines if you’re into that kind of relationship, it’s really up to you how radically feminized she becomes after she is with you for some time.
While this was an informative and cool post, I am not sure that going to a 3rd world country where I am not a citizen and smacking a girl around, getting arrested, and prison f***ed by a bunch of Filipinos is exactly the way I wanna spend my retirement years, but that's just me :) YMMV.
I never said I went to jail, you have to pretty much kill someone for that to happen. Basically with domestic disputes you have to chat with the barangay police chief and have it settled amongst all parties there. The police generally try to resolve most disputes amongst parties before arresting people and throwing them in jail. Remember, America is a litigation based society now who feeds off of the prison and legal system for graft and profits, it's not really a deterrent anymore. Back in the day in America and any other country domestic disputes were given low priority as the legal force shouldn't be butting into peoples lives to begin with, they should work it out themselves. Western feminist mentality has brainwashed men and women into believing the the law should handle every little disturbance, basically a nanny state where the government is the parent and husband and wife are the kids. You've all given up your personal liberties and been duped into a corrupt litigation system backed by a growing police state mentality over there that hurts people's lives rather than betters them. I would say only in rare cases do domestic problems need outside sources to resolve them. Relationships and marriage have always been like this, I assume for thousands of years and the leftist pinko feminist wackos want to rewrite genetics and human emotions? I ain't gonna put up with female over-the-top emotional bullshit so I don't and refuse to ever live again in an Anglo or Nordic radical feminist oriented culture.
Yeah, I get you. I suppose we're just gonna have to agree to disagree on this one. My dislike of feminism does not go so far as to justify smacking a girl around. And even if it did I still would be very nervous doing it in a country where I am not a citizen and she is.

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All I know this....

Post by djfourmoney » July 16th, 2012, 7:54 am

For it seems like decades, I have heard if you want to find a nice girl to marry go to the Philippines. Here's the problem, the majority of women I see expats and mongers bag are the typical poor, short, dark skinned women. For thirsty men old men this is perfectly okay they are getting overlooked by the majority of women in their own country (usually UK, CA, US).

But I will not spent $1,000+ on a plane ticket to find women NO BETTER LOOKING THAN WHATS ALREADY IN LOS ANGELES and that's not saying much. The hottest Pinays are in the car model game (Import Tuner, D Sport, etc) complete with bolt-ons too, I don't care. If you want a stunner then sometimes they are modified and I don't take issue with that at all.

Problem is most of these women chase around and get upper middle class Asian (Japanese, Chinese, Korean) Men and White Men. Every so often a hot Pinay will date a brother but its fairly rare.

Would this dynamic change in the Philippines? I can't get a clear answer. Because its people like Winston that want to throw cold water on nice tales of success when everybody else wants to hear tales of woe. Look I don't wanna here how some body with checkered, bell-bottom pants came home from Cebu to complain about the quality of women.

Let's face it, some dudes just have no games, style or social skills. Its fine for Winston to point out that is largely not needed, which is true if you want to pull average looking women. But if you want something of higher quality you're wallet doesn't have to be bigger but man you better know how to talk, dress nice and dance a little bit, it all helps.

It also helps to stop chasing women 20 years younger than you. Most Upper Class women will have NONE of that unless your a former athlete in which case you won't find yourself in a developing nation chasing p***y, you don't need too.

Image

I take all of this with a gain of salt, because frankly I am reading stories of traveling sales men, retirees and contract workers from around the world. Not all these guys are young/distinguished, clean cut investment bankers, though some are.

Frankly Winston my only criticism is this -

According to your story you struggled mightily in the States and only found mild success away from here. That's great story and empowering to alot of men left on the trash heap by Western Women. That said I have not struggled that much with Western women in the sense I have left more chances on the table than a little bit by not having complete faith in my ability to pull.

So while in your experience or some retired dude experience may reflect what happens when a man isn't the classic tall, dark and handsome prototype that many women use to judge males from. As I said in another post, I don't make up the rules of sexual attraction. It doesn't matter if its man made via the media or something physical, that's what happens we have no control over that.

If you can find me a screaming hot Eurasian Pinay and she digs bothers I'll go...

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Post by Winston » July 17th, 2012, 1:25 am

To Davewe and Pete:

It appears that there are some misunderstandings between us. So I sent Davewe this PM, which I will also paste below so I don't have to retype it.

I'm not arguing the accuracy of experience. I'm arguing the accuracy of the GENERAL SCENE. Repatriate also made inaccurate statements comparing me to Tom Arnold and saying that I alienate everyone I know, which I can easily prove false.

That's the kind of inaccuracy I'm talking about.

Did you read Mr S comparison of Filipinas in that thread? It was a winner and was very accurate. That's the kind of accuracy I'm talking about. It's not about experiences, just a general summary of the dynamics of the scene.

You misunderstood me again. Why do you keep misunderstanding me? Usually men don't misunderstand each other. Only women do.

I will clarify this in the "I was a God in the Philippines" thread.

I didn't say that you can't have a different experience than me. But saying that most expats can easily shag hot middle class Filipinas for free is NOT TRUE. Most expats can't.

This has nothing to do with your girlfriend or wife, or Pete's. I don't know anything about your Filipina girlfriend. I don't know if she's middle class or not, or whether Pete's is or not. Even if you and Pete and Outwest do have middle class wives, so what? That isn't relevant to my point. Let me try to explain:

I NEVER said that expats can't get middle class Filipina wives. NEVER. I said that an average expat cannot easily pick up and shag a good looking middle class Filipina any time he wants to. Is that clear? NOTHING about your experience or Pete's disproves that. So what are you disputing exactly?

Most middle class Filipinas who are friendly to foreigners are not good looking at all. The ones that are good looking are super snobby and would not even be available to foreigners in most cases.

You can get a wife in the US too, but you will mostly likely settle. Most people in the US can get wives, but they have to settle, often on someoe not even very desirable. That's because in the US, you take what you can get. You don't have the pick of the litter, like you do with food in a supermarket. You can't just pick any girl that you think is hot.

The same could be said with middle class Filipinas. Sure you can marry them. Even Ladislav was married to one long ago. But that doesn't mean you have your pick of the litter or that you can pick up a hot one any time, like nightwatchsf claimed. They aren't easy, esp the good looking ones.

Do you understand?

Now that I've made myself clear, do you disagree with anything I've said above? If so, what and why?

Of course Rock doesn't find Filipinas generally attractive. Neither do I. Less than 5 percent are attractive to me. But that isn't relevant to his experience in the malls where he said that chubby middle class girls were rude to him and not approachable. I can see where he would get that since I've seen that kind of attitude from non p4p women as well.

I was just using Rock as an example that you can't just go anywhere you want and pick up middle class Filipinas who aren't in poverty, even if you are tall and good looking like he is. His tastes in women have nothing to do with that.

Likewise, Steve Neese and Steve Hoca did not easily pick up middle class girls either.

I never said it was impossible, just that it is not easy at all and plus, most of the middle class girls that like foreigners are not good looking at all. The hot ones there have this hostile vibe around them. Have you noticed that?

Anyway, I will post portions of this to the thread for clarification so I don't have to retype it.

Congrats to you and your Filipina partner, whether she's middle class or not.

Come to think of it, Cinderella was beautiful with a heart of gold, yet she wasn't middle class either, but very poor. On the other hand, her three step-sisters were all upper class and had the worst personalities. lol. So maybe it's best to find a lower class girl with beautiful looks and a heart of gold, whom you can bring up and hone? lol
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Post by pete98146 » July 17th, 2012, 3:29 am

Thanks for the post Winston. Agreed that it isn't always easy to pull a middle class girl especially the better looking ones but all of you guys have to remember it's a numbers game. All it takes is to get ONE lady and your dreams are hopefully answered.

I do agree that you won't have any luck simply showing up and try to chat them up. My wife used to have American guys approach her at the mall frequently but she blew them off because middle class girls view this as creepy. So that leaves one of two ways to meet them.

Number one would be chatting with them online. I've shared my tips on how to locate them using a search engine which tosses out all women except those with a 4 year degree. But these women are there and they ARE looking to move abroad because so many of them are much more talented than the opportunities that they are given in Phils. Chances are these girls have brothers or sisters that already live abroad and they want to escape too! This includes accountants, nurses, programmers etc. But, you will need your crap together or they will quickly lose interest in you. This I will admit is true. Most are very smart and perceptive. Worst case scenerio the want a lateral move. If they don't view you as an equal, you're toast. But I met my wife online thru Cherry Blossoms. I've living and breathing proof that this technique can yield dividends.

The other option would be to get into their social circles if you are lucky to live there. But this requires confidence and a bit of persistance. Go find out where the middle class girls let off steam. Is it a yoga class? Singing class? Book club? http://wanderlust-padmini.blogspot.com/ ... anila.html. There are hundreds of things they do. But find out and go join them. If they see enough of you and they learn you are not a wierdo, they'll eventually let you into their clique. All of a sudden the yoga class turns into a Friday night karaoke party and one thing leads to another!!!!

But in either case, you need a plan of attack. You'll have to learn on the fly (VERY QUICKLY) Filipina 101. What do they like? How are they different from Western Women? How can you entertain them? How do you make them want you? Also, if you are successful, you'll need to learn that Filipinas NEED ATTENTION.....all of them. With this knowledge, use it to your advantage. Filipina men often drop the ball because they have so many women to choose from. You need to make her (not you) the center of your universe. If you are unwilling to do this then I can tell you flat out that Filipinas ain't your cup of tea.

Last but not least is clear your mind and get rid of all the negativity. Who cares if you've had bad luck with women in the past. News Flash: we all have!!! Get into the right frame of mind to date them. Again, they are clever and will drop you like a hot potato if you are a negative, me-first type of guy.

Hey let's be honest here for a second. Many of you guys will roll your eyes at my advice. That's perfectly fine but you won't succeed with middle class filpinas. Nothing wrong with the ones from the poorer families. Id' rather date a poor filipina than a rich American broad any day of the week. But know your limitations. If you don't have luck or experience with women, focus on a middle class 6 or 7 and then work your way up once you gain confidence. Trust me, they are out there but you have to go where they go. Unlike the poor girls, they won't be approaching you. Not only that, they are single and lonely too....just like the poor girls.

So that's it Winston. It's not so much of a rebuttual but instead a game plan. But I still think the middle class filipinas are there for the taking. I'm also confident that if I had to, I could duplicate my efforts over and over and over again with them.

That's my take the topic and I'm sticking with my guns still.....
Last edited by pete98146 on July 17th, 2012, 5:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by chanta76 » July 17th, 2012, 6:11 am

I never been to the Philippines but something is telling me that compared to USA it's easier to get a middle class decent looking girl vs a decent looking girl who is middle class in USA.

I think it's more work for an expat to get a middle class and because there is so many poorer girls who are easier to pick up most of the expat take the path of least resistance.

I think it also depends upon the expat. Let say you got an expat who is 30 or 40 something. Decent looking and clean cut with good personality. He wants a middle class attractive filipina. I wager he would land one . Just my thinking..again I never been to the Philippines so I have no idea how it's really like....but I think it's just more work but not impossible to land one

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Post by OutWest » July 17th, 2012, 8:08 am

pete98146 wrote:Thanks for the post Winston. Agreed that it isn't always easy to pull a middle class girl especially the better looking ones but all of you guys have to remember it's a numbers game. All it takes is to get ONE lady and your dreams are hopefully answered.

I do agree that you won't have any luck simply showing up and try to chat them up. My wife used to have American guys approach her at the mall frequently but she blew them off because middle class girls view this as creepy. So that leaves one of two ways to meet them.

Number one would be chatting with them online. I've shared my tips on how to locate them using a search engine which tosses out all women except those with a 4 year degree. But these women are there and they ARE looking to move abroad because so many of them are much more talented than the opportunities that they are given in Phils. Chances are these girls have brothers or sisters that already live abroad and they want to escape too! This includes accountants, nurses, programmers etc. But, you will need your crap together or they will quickly lose interest in you. This I will admit is true. Most are very smart and perceptive. Worst case scenerio the want a lateral move. If they don't view you as an equal, you're toast. But I met my wife online thru Cherry Blossoms. I've living and breathing proof that this technique can yield dividends.

The other option would be to get into their social circles if you are lucky to live there. But this requires confidence and a bit of persistance. Go find out where the middle class girls let off steam. Is it a yoga class? Singing class? Book club? http://wanderlust-padmini.blogspot.com/ ... anila.html. There are hundreds of things they do. But find out and go join them. If they see enough of you and they learn you are not a wierdo, they'll eventually let you into their clique. All of a sudden the yoga class turns into a Friday night karaoke party and one thing leads to another!!!!

But in either case, you need a plan of attack. You'll have to learn on the fly (VERY QUICKLY) Filipina 101. What do they like? How are they different from Western Women? How can you entertain them? How do you make them want you? Also, if you are successful, you'll need to learn that Filipinas NEED ATTENTION.....all of them. With this knowledge, use it to your advantage. Filipina men often drop the ball because they have so many women to choose from. Use this to your advantage. You need to make her (not you) the center of your universe. If you are unwilling to do this then I can tell you flat out that Filipinas ain't your cup of tea.

Last but not least is clear your mind and get rid of all the negativity. Who cares if you've had bad luck with women in the past. News Flash: we all have!!! Get into the right frame of mind to date them. Again, they are clever and will drop you like a hot potato if you are a negative, me-first type of guy.

Hey let's be honest here for a second. Many of you guys will roll your eyes at my advice. That's perfectly fine but you won't succeed with middle class filpinas. Nothing wrong with the ones from the poorer families. Id' rather date a poor filipina than a rich American broad any day of the week. But know your limitations. If you don't have luck or experience with women, focus on a middle class 6 or 7 and then work your way up once you gain confidence. Trust me, they are out there but you have to go where they go. Unlike the poor girls, they won't be approaching you. But they are out there! Not only that, they are single and lonely too....just like the poor girls.

So that's it Winston. It's not so much of a rebuttual but instead a game plan. But I still think the middle class filipinas are there for the taking. I'm also confident that if I had to, I could duplicate my efforts over and over and over again with them.

That's my take the topic and I'm sticking with my guns still.....
Good stuff Pete. Middle class girls can be found, but certainly not "picked up". To be clear, experiences vary, and NightwatchSF did imply for example that he was quite well off and able to spend the kind of money that would put him in certain circles that most expats never touch. So without judging that one way or the other, his experience will not be typical....besides, for many they are better off meeting a poor girl with a heart of gold and some humility.

And Winston, I will grant you this for sure, no one is just picking up middle class girls in malls or other places to shag, and the only thing like that would be if you can be around long enough or if you have the money to buy your way into certain cliques.
It sounds like NightwatchSF is in that category, but few will experience that. Like a lot of things, some people can do things that make it look easy, but it might be just their luck and or good skills.

I will tell you, I met my wife in a mall. I was in Gaisano mall in CDO. (Cagayan de Oro) and I was buying shoes at the same shop she was. She was buying some decent type athletic shoes made in China- for a about p1800 I think- that is a bit over $40.
Right there is a hint- even such a relatively low priced shoe is still expensive for most filipinas and half a months pay for some at the low end or worse. I was buying some walking type shoes for a bit more, like P2000. ($50). She moved so gracefully and she had on these nice slacks...really the loveliest girl I had seen in a long time. (Got that? just in case you read this love...wink wink) I tried and succeeded in catching her eye, but frankly, she gave me the brush off and left the store, and I was thinking I had just seen a disappearing angel.

I decided to cheer myself of my escaped angel by going upstairs and having nice mango shake at Izzy's cafe, and who should walk in right behind me but my escaped angel! She ordered a tall halo-halo and sat at the opposite side of the cafe even though the place was almost empty. Hmmm, I decided I would rather make a fool of myself than let this one get away totally- maybe she has a BF...or whatever, so when none of the staff girls were within earshot I walked over and said I noticed her from the shoe shop and gave her my card and asked if she was from CDO. I was able to put her at ease right away and I asked if her father was also in CDO, (Which I thought was highly likely, I was only asking as a formality and to show respect.) Then she came out of left field with a "Why, are you going to court me? She was laughing and blushing at the same time. I chuckled, but did not let that pass. I said yes, I would love to talk to your father. Then I ordered a soft drink and asked her if she would like one, which she did. Within minutes I we had agreed to meet at the Dunkin Donuts in the Divisoria the next morning and I had her cell number and she had mine on the card. Well gents, I floated out of the mall that afternoon. I had the giddy feeling that something really important had just happened.

I figured it would be interesting to see in the morning if she brought her dad along. Well she was actually early getting to Dunkin's rather than being on Filipino time. (good sign!) but she was by herself..(Neutral sign). Then she told me that her dad was down in Zamboanga, but she was in town with her auntie. (very good sign! A favorite aunt will usually know before the mom and dad!) Her aunt showed up in less than an hour while we talked about Beaches, places she had seen in the Philippines, and Xavier University just down the street. When her aunt showed up she gave me a looking over like a mother hen, but smiled when I asked if she would like some donuts and a drink, and by the time she had worked her way through two raspberry filled donuts, everything was just fine.
(Auntie likes me, a very good sign!) Well things moved pretty quickly from there, but that is a separate story.

What counted here most was a few things. In a very short period of time I had established with my soon to be GF and her auntie (Chaperone) that I was a gentleman, that I had manners, that I had a business card, that I was respectful of her and her family, and that I respected Filipino traditions related to family. Even if I would go on to respectfully violate a few of those later, the fact was I had shown that I at least was respectful from the get-go. My now wife has told me that she could not even believe what had happened with her within three days. She had her first romantic contact with a "Foreigner" and had already told her auntie that she would marry me someday.

If you are "family inclined" my experience will resonate a bit. Otherwise it is just my experience, your mileage may vary. Maybe I just got lucky. Maybe a life of many hard core risks found a way to settle me down. Whatever it was, I am fine with it now
Her dad? We are allies. One evening spent plying him with some expensive booze turned him into a maudlin dad from anywhere as he realized that his daughter was in a way, slipping away. He was a bit drunk and I thought a bit teary eyed as we parted ways that night.
All of that was just a bit more than 3 years ago.

Outwest

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