I have dreams like this. Thanks.OutWest wrote:Good stuff Pete. Middle class girls can be found, but certainly not "picked up". To be clear, experiences vary, and NightwatchSF did imply for example that he was quite well off and able to spend the kind of money that would put him in certain circles that most expats never touch. So without judging that one way or the other, his experience will not be typical....besides, for many they are better off meeting a poor girl with a heart of gold and some humility.pete98146 wrote:Thanks for the post Winston. Agreed that it isn't always easy to pull a middle class girl especially the better looking ones but all of you guys have to remember it's a numbers game. All it takes is to get ONE lady and your dreams are hopefully answered.
I do agree that you won't have any luck simply showing up and try to chat them up. My wife used to have American guys approach her at the mall frequently but she blew them off because middle class girls view this as creepy. So that leaves one of two ways to meet them.
Number one would be chatting with them online. I've shared my tips on how to locate them using a search engine which tosses out all women except those with a 4 year degree. But these women are there and they ARE looking to move abroad because so many of them are much more talented than the opportunities that they are given in Phils. Chances are these girls have brothers or sisters that already live abroad and they want to escape too! This includes accountants, nurses, programmers etc. But, you will need your crap together or they will quickly lose interest in you. This I will admit is true. Most are very smart and perceptive. Worst case scenerio the want a lateral move. If they don't view you as an equal, you're toast. But I met my wife online thru Cherry Blossoms. I've living and breathing proof that this technique can yield dividends.
The other option would be to get into their social circles if you are lucky to live there. But this requires confidence and a bit of persistance. Go find out where the middle class girls let off steam. Is it a yoga class? Singing class? Book club? http://wanderlust-padmini.blogspot.com/ ... anila.html. There are hundreds of things they do. But find out and go join them. If they see enough of you and they learn you are not a wierdo, they'll eventually let you into their clique. All of a sudden the yoga class turns into a Friday night karaoke party and one thing leads to another!!!!
But in either case, you need a plan of attack. You'll have to learn on the fly (VERY QUICKLY) Filipina 101. What do they like? How are they different from Western Women? How can you entertain them? How do you make them want you? Also, if you are successful, you'll need to learn that Filipinas NEED ATTENTION.....all of them. With this knowledge, use it to your advantage. Filipina men often drop the ball because they have so many women to choose from. Use this to your advantage. You need to make her (not you) the center of your universe. If you are unwilling to do this then I can tell you flat out that Filipinas ain't your cup of tea.
Last but not least is clear your mind and get rid of all the negativity. Who cares if you've had bad luck with women in the past. News Flash: we all have!!! Get into the right frame of mind to date them. Again, they are clever and will drop you like a hot potato if you are a negative, me-first type of guy.
Hey let's be honest here for a second. Many of you guys will roll your eyes at my advice. That's perfectly fine but you won't succeed with middle class filpinas. Nothing wrong with the ones from the poorer families. Id' rather date a poor filipina than a rich American broad any day of the week. But know your limitations. If you don't have luck or experience with women, focus on a middle class 6 or 7 and then work your way up once you gain confidence. Trust me, they are out there but you have to go where they go. Unlike the poor girls, they won't be approaching you. But they are out there! Not only that, they are single and lonely too....just like the poor girls.
So that's it Winston. It's not so much of a rebuttual but instead a game plan. But I still think the middle class filipinas are there for the taking. I'm also confident that if I had to, I could duplicate my efforts over and over and over again with them.
That's my take the topic and I'm sticking with my guns still.....
And Winston, I will grant you this for sure, no one is just picking up middle class girls in malls or other places to shag, and the only thing like that would be if you can be around long enough or if you have the money to buy your way into certain cliques.
It sounds like NightwatchSF is in that category, but few will experience that. Like a lot of things, some people can do things that make it look easy, but it might be just their luck and or good skills.
I will tell you, I met my wife in a mall. I was in Gaisano mall in CDO. (Cagayan de Oro) and I was buying shoes at the same shop she was. She was buying some decent type athletic shoes made in China- for a about p1800 I think- that is a bit over $40.
Right there is a hint- even such a relatively low priced shoe is still expensive for most filipinas and half a months pay for some at the low end or worse. I was buying some walking type shoes for a bit more, like P2000. ($50). She moved so gracefully and she had on these nice slacks...really the loveliest girl I had seen in a long time. (Got that? just in case you read this love...wink wink) I tried and succeeded in catching her eye, but frankly, she gave me the brush off and left the store, and I was thinking I had just seen a disappearing angel.
I decided to cheer myself of my escaped angel by going upstairs and having nice mango shake at Izzy's cafe, and who should walk in right behind me but my escaped angel! She ordered a tall halo-halo and sat at the opposite side of the cafe even though the place was almost empty. Hmmm, I decided I would rather make a fool of myself than let this one get away totally- maybe she has a BF...or whatever, so when none of the staff girls were within earshot I walked over and said I noticed her from the shoe shop and gave her my card and asked if she was from CDO. I was able to put her at ease right away and I asked if her father was also in CDO, (Which I thought was highly likely, I was only asking as a formality and to show respect.) Then she came out of left field with a "Why, are you going to court me? She was laughing and blushing at the same time. I chuckled, but did not let that pass. I said yes, I would love to talk to your father. Then I ordered a soft drink and asked her if she would like one, which she did. Within minutes I we had agreed to meet at the Dunkin Donuts in the Divisoria the next morning and I had her cell number and she had mine on the card. Well gents, I floated out of the mall that afternoon. I had the giddy feeling that something really important had just happened.
I figured it would be interesting to see in the morning if she brought her dad along. Well she was actually early getting to Dunkin's rather than being on Filipino time. (good sign!) but she was by herself..(Neutral sign). Then she told me that her dad was down in Zamboanga, but she was in town with her auntie. (very good sign! A favorite aunt will usually know before the mom and dad!) Her aunt showed up in less than an hour while we talked about Beaches, places she had seen in the Philippines, and Xavier University just down the street. When her aunt showed up she gave me a looking over like a mother hen, but smiled when I asked if she would like some donuts and a drink, and by the time she had worked her way through two raspberry filled donuts, everything was just fine.
(Auntie likes me, a very good sign!) Well things moved pretty quickly from there, but that is a separate story.
What counted here most was a few things. In a very short period of time I had established with my soon to be GF and her auntie (Chaperone) that I was a gentleman, that I had manners, that I had a business card, that I was respectful of her and her family, and that I respected Filipino traditions related to family. Even if I would go on to respectfully violate a few of those later, the fact was I had shown that I at least was respectful from the get-go. My now wife has told me that she could not even believe what had happened with her within three days. She had her first romantic contact with a "Foreigner" and had already told her auntie that she would marry me someday.
If you are "family inclined" my experience will resonate a bit. Otherwise it is just my experience, your mileage may vary. Maybe I just got lucky. Maybe a life of many hard core risks found a way to settle me down. Whatever it was, I am fine with it now
Her dad? We are allies. One evening spent plying him with some expensive booze turned him into a maudlin dad from anywhere as he realized that his daughter was in a way, slipping away. He was a bit drunk and I thought a bit teary eyed as we parted ways that night.
All of that was just a bit more than 3 years ago.
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Many Thanks to Mr. S for the Best Post of the Year! This should be put into a Hall of Fame section on the Forum. I have printed this post off and now have 2 copies of it: one framed and on my wall and the other I keep in my pocket wherever I travel in the Philippines! Mr. S., Winston gave me your Email when I was having problems with my girlfriend and your advice was right on target back then too! Take care!
Nothing wrong with Dark Skined pinays IMO , I prefer them actually:
Just wish they were thicker overall....
Your welcome to your preference. I don't have a problem with dark skinned women if that's what you like, welcome to be friends and all that, just not what I'm attracted too and there plenty of them in LA no need to fly down to SEA to find them. Some look good but not worth spending 1K to see...
If you're using the Disney Cinderella Cartoon then not only was she poor but MILES better looking than her step-sisters but of course that's by design, when you say ugly or worst personalities they trumped it with drawing them ugly physically as well.
A post modern version of that would make the step sisters bitchy/vamp but attractive externally...
No diss to Neese or Hoca but there both average looking at best. I know what happens to a fairly attractive White Man that frankly ignores all advances from very attractive White women, but dates Asian, Black or Latinas (all attractive) women by preference and gets led by the nose by those women.
My boy Rob used to pull without all the bs, douche bag behavior now promoted by the PUA movement and White men lament. He couldn't dance, didn't know what the say half the time (asked me constantly...) but he was NICE and POLITE, had manners and soft spoken. He was in-shape, worked out and a scratch golfer...
You would think I could use him to find hot women and their friends, but nope... It never seem to work out like that.
The OP has that shaved head, 5 o-clock shadow thing going on that post modern chick dig. I am not shocked he had women down there flagging him down, after all he's not some middle aged bloke that typically tends to go down there. After all why would a "hot" guy from the States come down to Manila, no need too... He met his Japanese flame there anyway so he has game, like I said all the markings of a guy that knows how to handle women.
Almost everyone here is speaking as though preference for looks is universal, even I made a comment like that.
Depending on your race and your taste in women I'm sure every guy could find one girl attractive enough to be worth his time.
the door swings both ways a lot of women might find you ugly or attractive depending on what they like.
For years I've been telling my self I'd be happy with a cute girl, I don't even need a super tight body super model, yet here in america even when your 6'0 with a 6 pack its still impossible unless you have the face of a model and drive a BMW.
We need to find a country of women who have the cultural mind set of family not money.
These are much better than the Average Filipinas because they have nice faces! Thick chicks are all over the Philippines. They just won't be tall. Thick and short, but sorry most don't have big asses! Thin with some nice tits is harder to find!
This is a great summary of how it is over there.
I would rather make $2000 a month working for myself, then $4000 a month working for a bitch.
Davewe, I enjoy your insights and post very much.
Can you expound on the way they may surprise or amaze?
I would rather make $2000 a month working for myself, then $4000 a month working for a bitch.
Unsure... His mother died when he was young, his father remarried. Didn't really into into the stuff around that, not my business really but that may have something to do with it.
I don't think it's a very profound insight, but for me when I travel abroad I always study how people are the same and how they are different from us. How they are the same seems obvious: the same physical needs, emotional needs, the need for family and connection, the need to create a better life for your children. The ways that people in other cultures are profoundly different are more subtle and powerful. This is certainly not just true in the Philippines.
Since most of the discussion here is about women, well I'll stick to that, though many other differences also fascinate me. Women's views of men, relationships, sex, and marriage are different depending on what culture you are in. It isn't just the fact that you can get girls abroad when you couldn't get them at home. It isn't just that women are less feminist in 3rd world countries. Those views are too simplistic.
My gf has a simple mantra she repeats whenever I tell her she doesn't understand how attitudes and life are different in America from the Philippines. She says, "Well, I am not an American." That is it! These girls aren't American and they don't have the same views as we do. That was what resonated for me in nightwatchsf's posts. It wasn't whether he got middle class or "elite" Filipinas. It was that he understood that to flourish in a foreign culture you have to leave your Western concepts behind and accept the fact that the women and their attitudes are different. How does that manifest itself in the Philippines? This has been well documented in cases like Will N's and the unlimited supply of girls, or with older guys like me and many others (the supply is not unlimited, thank goodness, but the one is pretty damn nice).
There are so many differences that no simple post could cover them. But you know what amazes me about the Filipinas I have met - they really like men! Almost everything else comes out of that: the sweetness, the loyalty, the out of this world sex. These girls really seem to like men and if you are "her man" you may find yourself the object of intense adoration. This is something that Western men are no longer used to, where so many women just plain don't like men!
IMO, the guys who do the worst abroad are the guys who just want it to be America but with hotter girls. They complain about the conditions, the attitudes of the locals, the crappy food, the weather. And in the end, they even complain about the women. Why would any woman want to be with a guy who hates her culture or country?
But the guy who travels and expats and loves where he has landed and finds the attitudes, the people and the differences fascinating - that guy will have no lack of female companionship and the girls will adore him and think he is what Will N. claimed - a God.
Last edited by davewe on July 19th, 2012, 5:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.
lol! Mr S, please give more details.
I would rather make $2000 a month working for myself, then $4000 a month working for a bitch.
Superb post Dave!
Early in my stay in the Philippines I was touring a fellow american through some of the popular nightspots. He kept trying to order screwdrivers with kettle one vodka and instead got absolute with tang. After the second or third bar he started complaining bitterly about how bad the bars were. So I turned to him and said: Dude there are no oranges in this country and refined vodka hasn't caught on yet. However they have some of the best mangos in the world and you can get an entire bottle of 12 year aged Rum for less than 3 bucks. So I ordered him a Mango Daiquiri, which he said was the best he ever had.
Moral of the Story - adapt, embrace, and enjoy the differences.
I set one of my other western friends up on a blind double date with the sister of a girl I had recently met. Turned out that the sister was off the charts hot. During dinner they spoke and giggled sometimes in Tagalog but the sister wasn't hitting it off conversationally with my friend. He became increasingly agitated and pulled me aside to tell me he was done with the date. I said, "are you out of your mind? I wish I was with your date!"
His impression was that she was aloof because she wasn't interested and was stuck up because of her appearance, and that she was speaking in Tagalog with her sister to make fun of him. I told him you got it wrong man, these aren't american girls. She's aloof because she's shy, and they are talking in tagalog and giggling because they are a bit uncomfortable and excited (I could understand enough tagalog to know what they were talking about).
After he left, they asked me what happened. When I told them his impression they were shocked. As I suspected the Sister thought he was cute and was just shy and nervous. I went home with my date that night wishing that it had been me and not my friend set up with her sister, with the super hot sister going home alone.
2 weeks later I got a call from the sister who was in town (we had met on another island) and wondered if I could tour her around. After a night on the town we ended up in bed. In the morning she woke up to a call from her sister (my previous date), with me waving wildly to indicate that she shouldn't mention that she was with me. Ignoring my pleas she hands me the phone saying, my sister wants to talk to you. I answer reluctantly, and she asks did you sleep with my sister last night? So I'm sure that she's going to call me a disgusting jerk and say that she never wants to see me again (Which I wouldn't blame her for). Trapped I go for honesty: yes I did. pause.. "was it fun" she asks. "quite a bit actually". To my amazement, she laughs and says: "save some for me I'll be in town next week, and if you're up to it maybe both of us at the same time." - Me = Shocked and amazed.
- Winston disclaimer: While the above story is entirely true. I do not mean to mislead anyone into beleving this will happen to them. As apparently established on this forum my experiences put me in the < 1% category of statistical improbability. All, please bear in mind that there are many short stubby dark skinned girls running about (though neither of these girls were built that way), and many who will avoid you like the plague. If you are a first time tourist in the Philippines do not actively seek out sisters to sleep with, or admit it if you do, as this could backfire horribly.