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I was a GOD in The Philippines!

Post your trip reports, travel experiences, and updates abroad. Or your expat story if you already live overseas. Note: To post photos and images, insert the image URL between the tags [img]and[/img] after uploading them to a third party site.

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Postby davewe » July 8th, 2012, 8:56 pm

Winston wrote:
I don't understand Davewe's claim that he's experienced what nightwatch has claimed. As a fat bald middle aged guy himself, there is no way in hell he could be getting middle/upper class Filipinas to shag him for free with no strings attached. No way! So I don't know why Davewe made such an illogical claim. I thought he was down to earth and credible, but I guess I was mistaken.


Ah Winston...Once again your logic escapes you and you break down into personal insults. You can't imagine how crushed I am that I have lost your support :)

First off I have to apologize to nightwatchsf. The guy's a new member, comes on posting his personal experience with a mature if different perspective, and he's attacked from all sides. Welcome to HA! I hope some of the friendly guys here don't drive you off.

Secondly, this was never a thread about middle class Filipinas. This thread was about Will N. Dowd's trip report. Sorry Will. I know enough about you outside of HA to completely believe your report.

This whole middle class Filipina issue is a red herring. It is hard enough to define what middle class means in the U.S., let alone in a third world country. And certainly this is even harder when you are talking about young people (since most Filipinas we are interested in are gonna be young). What do I mean? I grew up in a middle - upper middle class suburban family. Father was a corporate VP with all that meant.

But at 23 I was living in a shithole of an one room apartment, working a barely over minimum wage job, driving a beater - and yes having few women. Did that make me lower class? By the definition of the IRS it did. Like anyone else I was beginning my life. So does middle class just refer to your upbringing, your education level, or your income? Or does it really matter?

I agree with ladislav. Everyone has different experiences wherever they go. Millions of people immigrate to the US believing that everyone is rich here and hoping to create their own fortune. Some do. Most don't. Most people are appalled to discover that the US itself has much poverty. But still, no matter how I might criticize the US, I must admit that this country gives people a chance - not a guarantee - but a chance.

So people will have different experiences with women in the Philippines. Some will have Will N's experience or nightwatchsf - many won't. My gf, by any definition I can think of, is middle class; parents with professional jobs, their own home, putting kids through college, etc. Pete's wife is middle class, as obviously is Outwest's. Personally I don't find that a big deal. If the women I met came from a poorer background it would not necessarily have been a deal breaker for me. To each his own.

The point is that just as the US affords financial opportunities but no guarantees - the Philippines offers opportunities with women - but no guarantees. Guys come here to vacation and find bar girls, or to look for long term relationships or wives, or as a place they might expat or retire. PI will give you an opportunity but no guarantees. If a guy is a lame dumbass, he will not be successful with women anywhere, even in the Philippines.

As to the notion of no strings attached sex or "free" sex, I must begrudgingly agree with Winston - but not just about PI. Women the world over always want something. They want an exciting memory with a foreign guy which they can share with their friends. They want a bf. They want a husband. They want support - emotional or financial. They want to build a life. They want a white baby lol. Most people have goals and dreams that go beyond the hour they spend with you in the sack. Hell even guys have things they want beyond the hot hour, even if it's only to repeat the hour again and again.

And Winston - I must sadly admit that you are right about me. By any definition I am old. The hair is becoming a distant memory. Despite my best efforts I am 20 pounds over what I was in my prime. In two months I will be returning to PI. I will be reflecting on these sad truths and your benign wisdom - as I sleep with my hot 23 year old gf. And ultimately I will come to a conclusion - it's good not to be a dumbass!
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Postby nightwatchsf » July 8th, 2012, 9:32 pm

Winston wrote:Here is one example, Bianca King:

ImageImage

You can tell in that photo that she's used to comfort and class. There are many girls like that. You can see them in nice upscale places in the Philippines. They are not approachable at all. I'll bet you that nightwatchsf would get the cold shoulder and would not even dare to approach Filipinas of such class.

Wanna put it to the test nightwatchsf? Words don't mean anything. Action and results are the real proof.


Good lord man. I'm a well educated successful business man from the US, what makes you think I would aspire to or tremble in the presence of a B-level celebrity in a third world country. Actually I find many of the local celebrities intolerable as they are big fish in a really tiny pond. Comfort and class? Do you have any idea what 10K USD a month gets you in the Philippines? you live like a king. even 5K a month is 5X more than a well paid middle class wage earner. Shes a pretty girl and I'd be happy to shag her given the opportunity, but i wouldn't go out of my way to chase that. Why? There are many many more where that came from without the senes of self importance. And class my friend is a very rare commodity in the Philippines. Don't know if I met her and frankly I could care less as I have zero interest in or admiration for Filipino celebrities. I've been out several nights when someone has said, did you know that you were talking to so and so. I never do as I don't watch Filipino movies (I'd rather drive a nail through my hand), and I don't read Filipino entertainment rags.

But I'll play along:

High profile celebrities are for obvious reasons not the best targets for casual hookups. They are often suspicious that you are after them to put a notch on your belt with your name. I remember an article I read with Carrie Fisher, where she said that Star Wars ruined her dating life, because every guy she met wanted to bag Princess Leah.

And so were clear.. some of the FHM models are just a small step up from working girls, with some of them having worked as high class escorts, or in upscale Karaoke joints, etc.. Even so.. One of the two that I shagged put me through half a dozen dates with nothing but kissing to make sure that I was sincère. Of course on date 7, she got her freak on and whipped out the fuzzy hand cuffs and a whip! go figure.

I do know this one. Last time I saw her she was with her american boyfriend. She's openly bi-sexual by the way.. which is a major bonus in my book.
Image

I know these flame wars can be lots of fun, but given the offhand chance that I'm not full of crap, wouldn't it make sense to ask some real questions instead of trying to discredit me?
nightwatchsf
Freshman Poster
 
Posts: 23
Joined: July 7th, 2012, 8:38 pm

Postby nightwatchsf » July 8th, 2012, 9:56 pm

davewe wrote:
Winston wrote:
I don't understand Davewe's claim that he's experienced what nightwatch has claimed. As a fat bald middle aged guy himself, there is no way in hell he could be getting middle/upper class Filipinas to shag him for free with no strings attached. No way! So I don't know why Davewe made such an illogical claim. I thought he was down to earth and credible, but I guess I was mistaken.


Ah Winston...Once again your logic escapes you and you break down into personal insults. You can't imagine how crushed I am that I have lost your support :)

First off I have to apologize to nightwatchsf. The guy's a new member, comes on posting his personal experience with a mature if different perspective, and he's attacked from all sides. Welcome to HA! I hope some of the friendly guys here don't drive you off.

Secondly, this was never a thread about middle class Filipinas. This thread was about Will N. Dowd's trip report. Sorry Will. I know enough about you outside of HA to completely believe your report.

This whole middle class Filipina issue is a red herring. It is hard enough to define what middle class means in the U.S., let alone in a third world country. And certainly this is even harder when you are talking about young people (since most Filipinas we are interested in are gonna be young). What do I mean? I grew up in a middle - upper middle class suburban family. Father was a corporate VP with all that meant.

But at 23 I was living in a shithole of an one room apartment, working a barely over minimum wage job, driving a beater - and yes having few women. Did that make me lower class? By the definition of the IRS it did. Like anyone else I was beginning my life. So does middle class just refer to your upbringing, your education level, or your income? Or does it really matter?

I agree with ladislav. Everyone has different experiences wherever they go. Millions of people immigrate to the US believing that everyone is rich here and hoping to create their own fortune. Some do. Most don't. Most people are appalled to discover that the US itself has much poverty. But still, no matter how I might criticize the US, I must admit that this country gives people a chance - not a guarantee - but a chance.

So people will have different experiences with women in the Philippines. Some will have Will N's experience or nightwatchsf - many won't. My gf, by any definition I can think of, is middle class; parents with professional jobs, their own home, putting kids through college, etc. Pete's wife is middle class, as obviously is Outwest's. Personally I don't find that a big deal. If the women I met came from a poorer background it would not necessarily have been a deal breaker for me. To each his own.

The point is that just as the US affords financial opportunities but no guarantees - the Philippines offers opportunities with women - but no guarantees. Guys come here to vacation and find bar girls, or to look for long term relationships or wives, or as a place they might expat or retire. PI will give you an opportunity but no guarantees. If a guy is a lame dumbass, he will not be successful with women anywhere, even in the Philippines.

As to the notion of no strings attached sex or "free" sex, I must begrudgingly agree with Winston - but not just about PI. Women the world over always want something. They want an exciting memory with a foreign guy which they can share with their friends. They want a bf. They want a husband. They want support - emotional or financial. They want to build a life. They want a white baby lol. Most people have goals and dreams that go beyond the hour they spend with you in the sack. Hell even guys have things they want beyond the hot hour, even if it's only to repeat the hour again and again.

And Winston - I must sadly admit that you are right about me. By any definition I am old. The hair is becoming a distant memory. Despite my best efforts I am 20 pounds over what I was in my prime. In two months I will be returning to PI. I will be reflecting on these sad truths and your benign wisdom - as I sleep with my hot 23 year old gf. And ultimately I will come to a conclusion - it's good not to be a dumbass!


Thanks for the kind words. Surprisingly rough crowd here.

You're right on with your NS attached analysis. There is always a motive. Having spent many years over seas, many of my American friends would disparage some of the hot women they saw in my pictures by saying did she reach for your wallet or your passport (While there is some humor in that), it doesn't do many of these women justice. The term middle class is a red herring. I brought it up to make the point that there are girls here who have their financial needs reasonably met, and hook up with foreigners for their wants instead of their needs.

I was with a P4P girl that have asked me not to pay (with a tear in her eye), because she wanted a "real" date with me. And with an upper middle class girl who went out of the way to order the most expensive thing on the menu. All depends on which strings are attached. If there is a single recommendation I can make to the guys here. Treat them all with respect, whether they are go-go girls or celebrities, don't make assumptions, and leave your preconceptions behind, they simply don't map here. I've seen some of these girls spend half their monthly salary on a decent bra. They have their pride, their dreams, and their self-esteem no matter how poor they are. Assuming that a girl is a hooker because she went home from you on the first night, or that she is only after your passport is disrespectful, and the good ones deserve better.
nightwatchsf
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Joined: July 7th, 2012, 8:38 pm

Postby OutWest » July 9th, 2012, 3:15 am

nightwatchsf wrote:
Winston wrote:Here is one example, Bianca King:

ImageImage

You can tell in that photo that she's used to comfort and class. There are many girls like that. You can see them in nice upscale places in the Philippines. They are not approachable at all. I'll bet you that nightwatchsf would get the cold shoulder and would not even dare to approach Filipinas of such class.

Wanna put it to the test nightwatchsf? Words don't mean anything. Action and results are the real proof.


Good lord man. I'm a well educated successful business man from the US, what makes you think I would aspire to or tremble in the presence of a B-level celebrity in a third world country. Actually I find many of the local celebrities intolerable as they are big fish in a really tiny pond. Comfort and class? Do you have any idea what 10K USD a month gets you in the Philippines? you live like a king. even 5K a month is 5X more than a well paid middle class wage earner. Shes a pretty girl and I'd be happy to shag her given the opportunity, but i wouldn't go out of my way to chase that. Why? There are many many more where that came from without the senes of self importance. And class my friend is a very rare commodity in the Philippines. Don't know if I met her and frankly I could care less as I have zero interest in or admiration for Filipino celebrities. I've been out several nights when someone has said, did you know that you were talking to so and so. I never do as I don't watch Filipino movies (I'd rather drive a nail through my hand), and I don't read Filipino entertainment rags.

But I'll play along:

High profile celebrities are for obvious reasons not the best targets for casual hookups. They are often suspicious that you are after them to put a notch on your belt with your name. I remember an article I read with Carrie Fisher, where she said that Star Wars ruined her dating life, because every guy she met wanted to bag Princess Leah.

And so were clear.. some of the FHM models are just a small step up from working girls, with some of them having worked as high class escorts, or in upscale Karaoke joints, etc.. Even so.. One of the two that I shagged put me through half a dozen dates with nothing but kissing to make sure that I was sincère. Of course on date 7, she got her freak on and whipped out the fuzzy hand cuffs and a whip! go figure.

I do know this one. Last time I saw her she was with her american boyfriend. She's openly bi-sexual by the way.. which is a major bonus in my book.
Image

I know these flame wars can be lots of fun, but given the offhand chance that I'm not full of crap, wouldn't it make sense to ask some real questions instead of trying to discredit me?




"And class my friend is a very rare commodity in the Philippines." You have got that right..and what class there is, is not really to be found among the "celebrity class". As you say, if you have lived in this world and had some success in it, going after B grade celebrities in a third world country is hardly some big reach. 10G in the Philippines should buy you a lot- here down south I cannot even imagine spending that much, as things are cheaper than metro-Manila. Very few expats are living at that level. and for that matter, few can imagine what the implications are with having that kind of bank every month. If I spend more than 2G in a month on routine things here, I feel like a spendthrift.


Outwest
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Postby Jester » July 9th, 2012, 3:20 am

davewe wrote:And Winston - I must sadly admit that you are right about me. By any definition I am old. The hair is becoming a distant memory. Despite my best efforts I am 20 pounds over what I was in my prime. In two months I will be returning to PI. I will be reflecting on these sad truths and your benign wisdom - as I sleep with my hot 23 year old gf.


:lol:
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Postby WorldTraveler » July 9th, 2012, 4:26 am

nightwatchsf wrote:
davewe wrote:
Winston wrote:
I don't understand Davewe's claim that he's experienced what nightwatch has claimed. As a fat bald middle aged guy himself, there is no way in hell he could be getting middle/upper class Filipinas to shag him for free with no strings attached. No way! So I don't know why Davewe made such an illogical claim. I thought he was down to earth and credible, but I guess I was mistaken.


Ah Winston...Once again your logic escapes you and you break down into personal insults. You can't imagine how crushed I am that I have lost your support :)

First off I have to apologize to nightwatchsf. The guy's a new member, comes on posting his personal experience with a mature if different perspective, and he's attacked from all sides. Welcome to HA! I hope some of the friendly guys here don't drive you off.

Secondly, this was never a thread about middle class Filipinas. This thread was about Will N. Dowd's trip report. Sorry Will. I know enough about you outside of HA to completely believe your report.

This whole middle class Filipina issue is a red herring. It is hard enough to define what middle class means in the U.S., let alone in a third world country. And certainly this is even harder when you are talking about young people (since most Filipinas we are interested in are gonna be young). What do I mean? I grew up in a middle - upper middle class suburban family. Father was a corporate VP with all that meant.

But at 23 I was living in a shithole of an one room apartment, working a barely over minimum wage job, driving a beater - and yes having few women. Did that make me lower class? By the definition of the IRS it did. Like anyone else I was beginning my life. So does middle class just refer to your upbringing, your education level, or your income? Or does it really matter?

I agree with ladislav. Everyone has different experiences wherever they go. Millions of people immigrate to the US believing that everyone is rich here and hoping to create their own fortune. Some do. Most don't. Most people are appalled to discover that the US itself has much poverty. But still, no matter how I might criticize the US, I must admit that this country gives people a chance - not a guarantee - but a chance.

So people will have different experiences with women in the Philippines. Some will have Will N's experience or nightwatchsf - many won't. My gf, by any definition I can think of, is middle class; parents with professional jobs, their own home, putting kids through college, etc. Pete's wife is middle class, as obviously is Outwest's. Personally I don't find that a big deal. If the women I met came from a poorer background it would not necessarily have been a deal breaker for me. To each his own.

The point is that just as the US affords financial opportunities but no guarantees - the Philippines offers opportunities with women - but no guarantees. Guys come here to vacation and find bar girls, or to look for long term relationships or wives, or as a place they might expat or retire. PI will give you an opportunity but no guarantees. If a guy is a lame dumbass, he will not be successful with women anywhere, even in the Philippines.

As to the notion of no strings attached sex or "free" sex, I must begrudgingly agree with Winston - but not just about PI. Women the world over always want something. They want an exciting memory with a foreign guy which they can share with their friends. They want a bf. They want a husband. They want support - emotional or financial. They want to build a life. They want a white baby lol. Most people have goals and dreams that go beyond the hour they spend with you in the sack. Hell even guys have things they want beyond the hot hour, even if it's only to repeat the hour again and again.

And Winston - I must sadly admit that you are right about me. By any definition I am old. The hair is becoming a distant memory. Despite my best efforts I am 20 pounds over what I was in my prime. In two months I will be returning to PI. I will be reflecting on these sad truths and your benign wisdom - as I sleep with my hot 23 year old gf. And ultimately I will come to a conclusion - it's good not to be a dumbass!


Thanks for the kind words. Surprisingly rough crowd here.

You're right on with your NS attached analysis. There is always a motive. Having spent many years over seas, many of my American friends would disparage some of the hot women they saw in my pictures by saying did she reach for your wallet or your passport (While there is some humor in that), it doesn't do many of these women justice. The term middle class is a red herring. I brought it up to make the point that there are girls here who have their financial needs reasonably met, and hook up with foreigners for their wants instead of their needs.

I was with a P4P girl that have asked me not to pay (with a tear in her eye), because she wanted a "real" date with me. And with an upper middle class girl who went out of the way to order the most expensive thing on the menu. All depends on which strings are attached. If there is a single recommendation I can make to the guys here. Treat them all with respect, whether they are go-go girls or celebrities, don't make assumptions, and leave your preconceptions behind, they simply don't map here. I've seen some of these girls spend half their monthly salary on a decent bra. They have their pride, their dreams, and their self-esteem no matter how poor they are. Assuming that a girl is a hooker because she went home from you on the first night, or that she is only after your passport is disrespectful, and the good ones deserve better.


davewe, I'd like to frame your post. It was wonderful!

nightwatchsf, I love your post too!

I treat every girl that I've ever taken out like they are my girlfriend. I don't even waste time on girls that I don't think could possibly be at that level. The girls are not used to be treated by guys with such respect. I rarely get cheated and I always have a line of girls that want to go out with me or be my girlfriend!


P.S. I'm not impressed by celebrities and wouldn't walk across the street to even see an American "star"!
WorldTraveler
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Postby davewe » July 9th, 2012, 5:20 am

nightwatchsf wrote: Treat them all with respect, whether they are go-go girls or celebrities, don't make assumptions, and leave your preconceptions behind, they simply don't map here. I've seen some of these girls spend half their monthly salary on a decent bra. They have their pride, their dreams, and their self-esteem no matter how poor they are. Assuming that a girl is a hooker because she went home from you on the first night, or that she is only after your passport is disrespectful, and the good ones deserve better.


I think this is the key takeaway here. Your preconceived notions should go out the door. This is one of the most attractive things for me about traveling to other cultures and PI in general. Leave your Western concepts behind with these girls. Now I am not saying you should be blind and foolish but these women will surprise you and amaze you often if you let them.

A funny story (well kinda). I recently bought a new German car (not a VW lol). Now normally I am far too old to give a shit about impressing others but in this case I was pretty excited and posted pics to FB. My friends chimed in congratulating me - but nothing from my gf. A month or so later we somehow got onto the subject of my car. She admitted that she really didn't like it. I was surprised because my Western thinking told me that a girl from a 3rd world country ought to be impressed that her bf owns a German luxury car. But she genuinely doesn't care.

OTOH, when I pull out my white iPhone there's a gleam in her eye :)
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Questioning nighwatchsf

Postby WorldTraveler » July 9th, 2012, 5:19 pm

nightwatchsf wrote: Especially so that the main point where you question my credibility is based solely on my experiences with free loving liberated Filipina's.. which btw.. echo those of Will, who started this thread. I shared an important insight to why this is the case, that was totally missed. Filipina girls don't call each other sluts. They don't viciously back stab each other for landing a guy. They are not judged by their friends based on the number of guys they have slept with. These are american hangups. And I know a lot of american women who would be much better off without them as well. I've met many foreign women in the Philippines as well who are even more open to casual sex than the local girls. Why? because of the insane competition. With thousands of beautiful and available local girls around, they can barely get the attention of foreign guys. Reason number 2.. No one is there to judge them and cast dispersions. The rules are different here.


Nightwatchsf, I thought your posts have been a little too rosy about the Philippines. I didn't bother to pick your posts apart for their true validity, but Winston and others said your list of bars where high class girls hang out to be picked up is incorrect, and that the dating site information you gave is incorrect to. I don't go to bars in Manila and I don't do dating sites so I had know way to know if what you are saying was true.

There ares some things I do know about the PI, and these things in your above quote are totally incorrect and I wonder where you've visted to come up with a statement like these. You say Filipinas never call each other SLUTS. This has to be the most false statement I've ever heard. I've heard Filipinas call girls sluts all the time! Just last night I mentioned to my Filipina GF that my friend is dating a girl from Leyte. The first thing out of her mouth is that girl is probably a slut and using him. You say "girls don't viciously backstab each other" I have to totally disagree with this statement too. I find Filipinas some of the most jealous girls in the world!

I'd like to comment on another things you said which I had to laugh at. You say you've met foreign women even more open to sex than the local Filipinas, because they live in some sexual paradise where there is so much competition that want to shag other foreigners too! Well, I had quite a different experience than you. While traveling in northern Luzon, I spoke to a foreign woman who was probably the only foreign women in the town, because I felt sorry for her being alone and told her where to go at night for fun. She was just as totally rude as she would have been back in the West! So I don't see this utopia that turns cold foreign women into promiscuous women!

I'm beginning to wonder if the next thing your going to tell us is that you've written a book called: Philippines: Sexual Paradise and Nirvana!

You're an eloquent writer, but I have a few specific questions. How old are you?, how do you look? and who do you look like? How long did you actually live IN the Philippines? This doesn't mean chatting online with girls on the websites you said that were good! Did all these wonderful sexcapades you describe like sleeping with models and upper class Filipinas happen to you, or was this something your friends told you that happened?
WorldTraveler
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Re: Questioning nighwatchsf

Postby davewe » July 9th, 2012, 5:58 pm

WorldTraveler wrote:There ares some things I do know about the PI, and these things in your above quote are totally incorrect and I wonder where you've visted to come up with a statement like these. You say Filipinas never call each other SLUTS. This has to be the most false statement I've ever heard. I've heard Filipinas call girls sluts all the time! Just last night I mentioned to my Filipina GF that my friend is dating a girl from Leyte. The first thing out of her mouth is that girl is probably a slut and using him. You say "girls don't viciously backstab each other" I have to totally disagree with this statement too. I find Filipinas some of the most jealous girls in the world!

This is an interesting point and I agree but with a big caveat. Women in PI call each other names, backstab and do God knows what else to each other. As you say they are very jealous. My gf irrationally hates the couple of other Filipina friends I have, calls them names and has no interest in ever meeting them. There is no sense in my telling her that the Filipina in question has a Fiancee - she is positive the girl is after me and will have nothing to do with her.

But the word "slut" in Western cultures has a different meaning and purpose. My friend Johnny says that in the Anglosphere women have submilinally created a "sexual cartel" which they control. Part of that control is in defining other women who like sex just for its own sake as sluts. IOW, a woman who likes sex with her bf or husband is OK but one who likes sex just because she likes the act and gives it to whomever she wishes is - a slut. I suspect we have all experienced the results of this shaming attitude.

So Filipinas are pissed off at other Filipinas cause she might be taking her man. Western women call each other sluts because the sluts are ruining their good thing.
davewe
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Postby Winston » July 9th, 2012, 6:02 pm

Davewe,
So you are admitting now that you did NOT get free casual sex with middle/upper class Filipinas? If so, then why did you say that your experiences support what nightwatchsf said? That was a technical error on your part. That's why I called it. Nothing against you personally. You also seem gullible in that you believe everything you hear. How much money have you lost to big talking claims of salespeople?

You forget that most western men lie about their experiences/accomplishments. Also, an anonymous poster on the internet is not a credible source, technically speaking.

To all:

Not a single credible expat source about the Philippines says what nightwatchsf says. Not one. Let's count:

- Ladislav
- Mr S
- Larry Elterman
- And me of course

None of these credible expat experts in the PH says that getting free casual sex with middle/upper class Filipinas is easy. I'm sorry, but anonymous posters do not count as "credible sources". You understand that don't you?

Did you listen to Larry Elterman's two interviews with Steve Hoca that I linked earlier? He is a bit negative and cynical, but realistic. You can't get something for nothing, unless there is true love/romance/chemistry involved, which is special and rare, not something that is easy to just "pick up" anywhere. Sure, you can get poor girls to sleep with you for free too, after a while since they too will hesitate a little. But with no strings attached?

Bottom line: Whether nightwatchsf's claims are true or not, they are NOT true for most expats. It is NOT easy to date middle class girls in the Philippines and it is NOT common for expats at all. In fact, EVERY expat I've talked to and met in the Philippines, have said the same things:

1. Only poor girls want them. They always need money.
2. Filipinos with money don't invite them anywhere or to any barbecues at their place.

In every restaurant I go to, it is highly segregated. I always see:

1. Middle class Filipinos with other middle class Filipinos.
2. Foreigners with other foreigners.
3. Foreign guys with low class Filipina girls that can't afford to pay for anything, sometimes with their families as well, who are all being treated by the foreign guy.

This is consistent in every restaurant you go to.

You can test this fact yourself. Go to Friendster and try to chat up the middle class Filipinas there. Or go to SM Malls in the Philippines and try to chat them up cold. Or on Philippines Airlines. If they can afford to fly and eat out at restaurants without asking someone to pay for them, then they are middle class and just as snobby and stuck up as in America.

NOTHING nightwatchsf said disproves this testable fact.

Bottom line: It is NOT easy to pick up middle class Filipinas, so if nightwatchsf claims this, then he is being HIGHLY DECEPTIVE.

Oh and I agree with WorldTraveler, a friend I know and hung out with before, that foreign girls in the PH are not easy at all. First, they tend to be masculine and unattractive. But if they are college girls, then they are in groups of other foreign college students and not looking to meet anyone. Also, Philippines doesn't attract hot white girls, and the hot white girls that go there are in groups and not looking to meet anyone. The backpacker girls tend to look unattractively and manly.

Listen to what this down to earth middle class Filipino guy told me about middle class Filipinos. It's very realistic, nothing like the BS "girls are easy" claims of nightwatchsf:

http://www.happierabroad.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8870

W:
So what is the middle class culture like? Is it similar to the middle class culture in America? I assumed it was, but it seems different somehow.

V:
-Philippine middle class is almost like those in the US except for the material possesions. They have a car but not a luxury one. They have a house but not a mansion. They can afford to send their children to top tier colleges but not to foreign colleges. They can afford to eat out once in a while with the whole family in a decent restaurant but not everyday. The middle classes are usually middle to upper management of the top 1,000 corporations in the Philippines. Some are small business owners. It is harder to become an upperclass with the price difference in material possession. The cheapest Mercedes here C180 goes for $50,000 while the top of the line S500 goes for $200,000. They don't even have a c180 in the States since the car is underpowered. Plus the fact that the average salary of a mid level manager is less than $20,000 annually after tax. To be an elite you have to be a high ranking politician or cabinet member or a very successful business owner.

W:
I've noticed that many middle class women in the Philippines get offended easily and will argue about little things without valid reasons in a sort of arrogant tone. Do you notice that too? Why are they like that?

V:
I think it is because they are insecure. Specially those that assume you have a pre-conceived notion about the women in their country. They want to show you that not all women in their country are docile or quiet or something like that. In fact most women when married are the opposite. Normally the middle class are aware of your notion because it is a reality here. We export labor all over the world. Both unskilled and skilled. We export "entertainers" (sex workers) to Japan. Nurses to the US and England. Engineers and mechanics to the middle east, domestic helpers to Hong Kong and Taiwan and a lot of sea men all over the world. They are aware of the status of Filipinos specially the women in the eyes of the world so they can be a bit defensive. The lower class however are not that well informed or they simply do not care. As long as they can make a living and care for their families they are happy.

W:
Middle class women tend to be bigger on political correctness than men. Do you ever notice that? But poor Filipinas don't seem to be politically correct at all.

V:
- Well political correctness comes with education and exposure to situation where it is a necessity. Poor ones don't get the chance.

W:
I assumed that nurses are middle class, cause I heard that only middle class families can send girls to nursing school?

V:
Actually nursing is the most taken up course in the past decade. The government knew that the developed world's population is aging and will require a lot of nurses specially those that can communicate in English. That is why there are a lot of student wanting to be nurses because that promises a brighter future. In order to secure their child's future the parents send them to nursing school even if they have to borrow money. But most have relatives abroad who are helping through remittances.

W:
I would prefer to hang out with middle class people, since they are more educated, like you, but they are not as easy to meet. They are pickier and more cliquish. You kind of have to have connections to meet them, and even then, you still gotta try to "fit in" which takes effort. It's not as easy as jiving with the lower class.

V:
-What you say is entirely true. Just like the middle class have a hard time fitting in with the lower class provided they are from the same culture. First of all the language used by the middle class is different from the lower class. The behavior and manners are different. Point of view and interest also.

Actually, the Filipino middle class is harder to approach unless you are an obvious foreigner. The middle and upper class are more paranoid. They are the least to help in case of an emergency and I don't blame them. Over the years, crime and danger have produced a generation of mistrustful citizens specially in the big cities. There are scams, petty and violent crimes everywhere. If a middle class person is approached by someone that looks Filipino he already has his guards up. I'm sure people in mexico can relate. hehe.

The only way to get to know the middle and upper class are if you work with them or are neighbors in the same gated community. If you are neighbors in an insecure communtity the minute you walk towards him he will probably has his guards up already. They also are not sociable outside their their social circle. Middle class group don't mingle with other middle class group unless they have a common denominator like they are in a company party. Filipinos are only friendly when they meet their co-citizens abroad.

W:
This is why in the SM Malls, usually the sales girls are friendlier, cause they are poor, but the girls shopping there with their own money are not very approachable. It seems that money changes a girl more than it does to a guy.

V:
Like I said above, the middle class are really snobs unlike what I see in the States and Europe. I think the middle class has always been like that and not because they know they have money. But it's true that some noveau riche have a change of attitude. They start looking down on those lower than them. But I think that happens all over the world particularly China with over night millionaires in abundance.

W:
I also can't figure out something. Since most people are poor, how do all the SM Malls stay in business? If the average salary is 200p a day in the PH, who are the people who buy all the 1000p jeans and 400p shirts in SM that keep it in business? There must be a huge middle class population that I don't see?

V:
Most people are poor. The minimum wage in the city is P404 and I think P367 for those in the province. Of course that is the official rate but many will work for a lot less. The employers who do that are usually small though.

The Philippines has a population of about 90 million with about 10% of that working abroad. That makes 1 in every 9 Filipinos having a source of income from abroad. SM malls number around 39 I think with more on the way. Of the 39 about 10 to 12 caters to the middle to upper class the rest are not doing so well relatively. You will notice that those that are located further out the city will have mostly restaurants instead of specialty stores. Majority still relies on the so called sari-sari stores or filipino convenient stores. But those that you see that can afford but does not look middle class (because they are there on a weekday instead of the office) most probably have an immediate relative abroad sending money home for her to spend unwisely on clothes. hehe.

W:
Most foreigners only meet lower class Filipinas, not upper class ones, it seems. Poor girls are the friendliest I guess, which kind of sucks.

V:
-Again it is because of the protective nature of the middle to upper class. But the poor ones are the ones easiest to please. A simple gift or inexpensive dinner will usually suffice. Middle to upper class one are picky and want to be seen in expensive restaurants. But not all are like that. Those that you meet through work will usually be more concerned of your welfare.

I also forgot to mention, the upper classes are usually not into foreigners for fear of being mislabeled as a hooker. But I think you already know what I mean. Women specially those that go out with a white man are frowned upon. The man might not have a clue but the girls know it and it is just necessity that is keeping them from showing they are uncomfortable. They are usually the indigenous looking ones that attracts the eye of the white man.
Last edited by Winston on July 11th, 2012, 6:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Questioning nighwatchsf

Postby lavezzi » July 9th, 2012, 6:42 pm

davewe wrote:But the word "slut" in Western cultures has a different meaning and purpose. My friend Johnny says that in the Anglosphere women have submilinally created a "sexual cartel" which they control. Part of that control is in defining other women who like sex just for its own sake as sluts. IOW, a woman who likes sex with her bf or husband is OK but one who likes sex just because she likes the act and gives it to whomever she wishes is - a slut. I suspect we have all experienced the results of this shaming attitude.

So Filipinas are pissed off at other Filipinas cause she might be taking her man. Western women call each other sluts because the sluts are ruining their good thing.


You really believe the concept of a slut is a recent Western conception and in the West previously and everywhere else in the world currently women were and are free to f**k dozens of random men without condemnation? lol
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Postby davewe » July 9th, 2012, 7:07 pm

Winston wrote:Davewe,
So you are admitting now that you did NOT get free casual sex with middle/upper class Filipinas? If so, then why did you say that your experiences support what nightwatchsf said? That was a technical error on your part. That's why I called it. Nothing against you personally. You also seem gullible in that you believe everything you hear. How much money have you lost to big talking claims of salespeople?


I refuse to get into the same foolish back and forth debates you have with Rock about Taiwan and Repatriate about everywhere. You crave this sort of confrontation and consistently stoop down to low level name calling to prove your points. This is not the first time you've done it with me.

I merely said I liked and agreed with much of what nighwatchsf said. Actually what I said was that while I thought is was somewhat over the top it was more accurate than the posters who bash everything about PI. And I said that my thoughts were based not on just gullibly believing whatever nonsense anyone writes (after all you write more than anyone else) but were based on my personal experiences.

This was a really nice thread on Will's trip experience. It's now been hijacked into nonsense about who is or who is not middle class and whether a guy can get them or not. Notice that Will has not returned to his own thread. Apparently he's smarter than I am :)
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Re: Questioning nighwatchsf

Postby davewe » July 9th, 2012, 7:22 pm

lavezzi wrote:
davewe wrote:But the word "slut" in Western cultures has a different meaning and purpose. My friend Johnny says that in the Anglosphere women have submilinally created a "sexual cartel" which they control. Part of that control is in defining other women who like sex just for its own sake as sluts. IOW, a woman who likes sex with her bf or husband is OK but one who likes sex just because she likes the act and gives it to whomever she wishes is - a slut. I suspect we have all experienced the results of this shaming attitude.

So Filipinas are pissed off at other Filipinas cause she might be taking her man. Western women call each other sluts because the sluts are ruining their good thing.


You really believe the concept of a slut is a recent Western conception and in the West previously and everywhere else in the world currently women were and are free to f**k dozens of random men without condemnation? lol


Nope I did not say any of that. It sounds like you are bringing your own moral judgments into this. That's your right I suppose.

I do believe that just as we men have the right to have sex with whomever we choose (random or planned) women should also have the right to have sex with whomever they choose. I know that is not a universal view and that there are many cultures where men have the right to do what they want but women don't. I am far from a feminist but when it comes to an individual's body and who they share it with - then yes I believe we have the right to do what we wish.

As to condemnation, I do not believe in condeming anyone for their choices. I may not agree with them, but condemnation implies a moral or religious judgment that I dont feel. Sleep with whomever you want; dont sleep with whomever you want - that's your right.

IMO, feminists have inadvertently usurped the word slut, not because they are moral or religious, but because if they can shame women into not have sex when a woman wants to, they can protect the "cartel". What's the purpose of this cartel? To get a man's money. Sex = marriage = divorce = I get all his cash.
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Postby Repatriate » July 9th, 2012, 8:43 pm

Nightwatch is pretty accurate in his assessment of the Bangkok scene. I'm not sure about the Phil but he hasn't been entirely wrong about Thai women. There are some things that reveal his inexperience as more of a long stay tourist but he didn't represent himself as anything otherwise. So, on that end i'll vouch for him somewhat. I don't think Davewe has been inconsistent with anything either.

I know people in Thailand (myself as an example) have dated middle and upper class girls before. It's not anything particularly special to be honest you just have to go to the extra trouble of courting these women. The most important thing to Thai women in this economic bracket is longevity. If you show that you are going to be in Thailand long term, have honest intentions, and you're not a philanderer then they are all yours.
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Re: Questioning nighwatchsf

Postby WorldTraveler » July 10th, 2012, 5:27 am

davewe wrote:
WorldTraveler wrote:There ares some things I do know about the PI, and these things in your above quote are totally incorrect and I wonder where you've visted to come up with a statement like these. You say Filipinas never call each other SLUTS. This has to be the most false statement I've ever heard. I've heard Filipinas call girls sluts all the time! Just last night I mentioned to my Filipina GF that my friend is dating a girl from Leyte. The first thing out of her mouth is that girl is probably a slut and using him. You say "girls don't viciously backstab each other" I have to totally disagree with this statement too. I find Filipinas some of the most jealous girls in the world!

This is an interesting point and I agree but with a big caveat. Women in PI call each other names, backstab and do God knows what else to each other. As you say they are very jealous. My gf irrationally hates the couple of other Filipina friends I have, calls them names and has no interest in ever meeting them. There is no sense in my telling her that the Filipina in question has a Fiancee - she is positive the girl is after me and will have nothing to do with her.

But the word "slut" in Western cultures has a different meaning and purpose. My friend Johnny says that in the Anglosphere women have submilinally created a "sexual cartel" which they control. Part of that control is in defining other women who like sex just for its own sake as sluts. IOW, a woman who likes sex with her bf or husband is OK but one who likes sex just because she likes the act and gives it to whomever she wishes is - a slut. I suspect we have all experienced the results of this shaming attitude.

So Filipinas are pissed off at other Filipinas cause she might be taking her man. Western women call each other sluts because the sluts are ruining their good thing.


Slut has a nasty connotation in the Philippines. I watched a girl I know knock another girl off her chair after she was called a SLUT! The Philippines is hardly a society that glamorizes promiscuity and a girl will quickly be called a slut if she leads that kind of lifestyle!
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