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Also, if a girl talks about all this buying a house nonsense and other material topics, don't be visibly flustered by it. Just stay cool and smoothly change the topic. It might just be a test of your mettle, to see whether or not you are willing to submit to the provider role and too weak too assert your value as a man. Act like it's a non-issue. If she keeps coming back to it, you know she's a hard-core calculator and probably not worth wasting your time on. But if can get her to submit to your lead, it can still be alright.
Some Chinese guys may trick girls into thinking they will do all these things but later just bolt. There's a lot of suspicion and doubt. Girls there are probably not nearly as trusting as Filipinas, especially in places like Shenzhen. If you become one of these tricksters, you will have future bad karma to deal with.
I mentioned getting respect. Does respect = attraction??? No! But, it helps, it really does. And on borderline marginal cases, it can be the make or break factor.
If a girl is considering you as a romantic prospect, getting her respect and admiration can be a DEAL MAKER while putting her off by annoying her can be a DEAL BREAKER. Chinese girls seem to be more left brain dominant than girls in many if not most other cultures. So these rational factors do have a material impact on results even in the realm of romance.
You're in Mainland China. Don't forget that.
Wow Rock, you really have great insights into the minds of Chinese women! As a man who's dealt with Westernized and mainland Chinese women for 30+ years in the U.S. and abroad, I can tell you that Rock's insights are spot on.
Hopefully your friend Winston will take your advice to heart and implement tactics that work best for him.
I'm sure if I gave him any advice on anything like this, he'd be jumping through the monitor and down my throat already, yelling and screaming at me, calling me an asswipe and stupid ass.
From my limited experience with chinese women I can say that they are the least romantic and most pragmatic women out there and I dont find those traits particularly attractive. They are walking calculators.
Wow. Tonight me and zboy walked around and cold approached girls on various streets around my hotel area in dongguan. We got about 5 or 6 phone numbers and wechat contacts. That's a record high. I never got that many in one day before.
The girls do seem more relaxed here in dongguan as zboy claimed, and sweet as well. One of them even started talking to us in McDonald's when she heard us talking about girls in English. Lol
But it's a lot of work and time trying to maintain chats with multiple girls and building kino, as rock would say.
Smallcheese, no that's not true. Rocks advice was more constructive. But yours is condescending and full of false assumptions and blaming and bashing. You can't compare you and him at all. I do not lash out unless you do first. I am a mirror. You do not realize how you are coming across. Most of your advice is actually bashing based on wrong assumptions, not helpful advice.
Rock said your advice about projecting money and power in the sugar daddy role was a bad one. Remember?
Banano, yes plenty of fish covers all countries including Asia and China. You can do a search yourself on there. http://www.pof.com
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"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
Winston's been taking a lot of stick on this thread but I must give him at least some credit.
Winston has very thick skin and is pretty brave in cold approaching random women on the streets. No matter how awkward or seemingly inappropriate the situation, little seems to phase him and I think he should get credit for that. He has cold approached tons of women in Shenzhen and taken his fair share of rejections but has also gotten a fair number of wechat contacts from girls here that way. No matter how random the situation or 'busy' a look the girl may have, as long as he thinks she's cute he will say something to her. Granted he may not always do it in the sleekest or smoothest of ways, but you don't always have to in China - there is a higher level of instant familiarity among strangers than there is in say, Singapore or the U.S.
The girls don't always fully get what he's saying because of his less than perfect Mandarin but then I come in and make conversation with the girl and explain what Winston's trying to say and then the girl starts warming up to us. For instance the other day on the street, he randomly approached this cute girl with a luggage bag on the street in the Guomao area in Shenzhen (busy downtown part of Shenzhen). It was the most random thing but she was quite responsive to us and then asked us if she could borrow a mobile phone because hers was out of battery. So I lent her mine and then she told us that we should have a drink together, we then sat together at the nearby KFC and talked. Before long we then invited her to have dinner with us together at a nearby Italian restaurant and she readily agreed. We got her wechat contact and over the last few days I've been having talking a lot to her and just like that she becomes another decent dating prospect. Credit where credit is due, Winston is actually a pretty good wing-man in a place like China despite the language handicap!
I do agree with Rock though that perhaps Winston could come across as a little more decisive and leader-like when interacting with a girl - that is a very important signal of masculinity to a woman and therefore whenever on dates, no matter how difficult some choices may seem, I always try to make a decision as soon as possible - whereas I may not be as decisive if I was with a male-friend - I think that kinda thing is hugely important when on initial dates with a girl.
May also take a visit to Dongguan to visit Winston and Zboy1 soon - Zboy1 is very positive about the place and I would definitely like to see what it's like. To me it's all a matter of degree. Shenzhen is surely a far better place than feminist developed cities but Dongguan would probably be even better than Shenzhen in terms of friendliness and down-to-earth girls.
So credit where credit is due - Winston is actually a pretty bold cold-approacher, not the sleekest or smoothest but definitely brave and thick-skinned, and a great wing-man to have around
Last edited by ethan_sg on April 23rd, 2015, 10:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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I don't get it. If Winston is cold approaching and able to get numbers and even he said he is getting dates so what's the problem?
It's like a numbers game. For guys who are not too good looking has to play the numbers more. So the solution is to approach more.
So what's the complaint Winston. I mean if your getting dates or numbers as you claim your doing OK.
1) Getting out of the friend zone 2) Getting their knickers off....
From reading others post your supposedly a really good looking guy and Winston is your wing man. From my experience anytime I winged with a good looking guy the girl or girls tend to gravitate to the good looking guy so I get stuck just cock blocking anyone else trying to interrupt. I'm not saying that Winston shouldn't wing with you and I don't know how you guys set it up but maybe help out Winston by having the girl focus on him. My guess is anytime you guys go out because your better looking the girls prefer you and Winston is just the ice breaker and you probably use Winston as the ice breaker to break into set. Just my thinking.
To get out of the friendzone..from my experience you have to sex it up but slowly and not in a creepy way. For example even though you don't believe in PUA there are aspects that does work. You meet a girl and you say something funny for example and she is in good state high five her for example. It's the first touch later as you get closer touch her shoulder and lead her...as you walk down the street together which leads to hand holding.. before you go on a date always have a plan where to go ..what to do ..and interesting places to show or do..a .
You mentioned girls don't like to drink around you...one solution would be show her a bar that is unique and order two drinks ..wine or beer just order for her..this is where you lead and say cheers to something . If she doesn't drink she is being disrespectful and you should drop her. don't ask what a girl should drink ..unless if you guys decide not to drink or you decide not to drink.
In that case kino and slowly build connection..however you have that language problem. You should ask zboy how he does it.
You already have a highly negative opinion of me. My point was that even if I gave you constructive advice like Rock's, it wouldn't matter. If you replaced Rock's name on the comments with my name, I believe that you would automatically assume that it was going to be condescending or bashing in some way. And you would gloss over the words that were written and react by immediately dismissing the advice or start cursing at me or start insulting me or start calling me names.
Why do I believe that? Where's my proof? Look at the threads. You've done that several times already, with me on this thread and with others on other threads.
Even before talking to me, you've already stated on this forum that you don't think I'll be down to earth. You think I'm too condescending. You think I won't be mature. So your opinion of me has already been formed without ever meeting me or talking to me first. What are you trying to prove by talking to me? That you're a fair, objective and open minded person? Who are you trying to fool here? Your mind is already made up about me. I don't believe you'll be open minded and fair but I'm still willing to talk to you.
Or maybe you want to talk to me so that afterwards, you can tell this forum that you were right all along. That I'm not down to earth. That I am condescending. That I'm immature. You can then proclaim that you tried your best and gave me a fair shot. Are you that devious? I don't know. Maybe. Maybe not. I've never met or talked to you so I can't really say. In any case, I'm still willing to talk to you if you'd like.
Talking about maturity, I'm not the one who said you were dumb. I'm not the one who called you an asswipe. I'm not the one who called you a stupid ass.
If I'm wrong about that, please show me where I resorted to cursing and name calling with you. Using language like dumb ass or asswipe. You can't because I don't act that way on forums or in real life. That's not who I am. That's not in my DNA.
I think in real life you would be cursing and using foul language as part of everyday conversation because that's part of your personality. That's who you are. Is that true?
In real life, if you met someone like me who you vehemently disagreed with and you felt that that person was putting you down, would you call that person an asswipe to his face? Would you call him dumb? Would you call him a stupid ass?
I highly doubt it. You don't strike me as someone courageous enough to say things like that to someone's face.
The anonymity and safety of an online forum allows people the opportunity to say things that they normally wouldn't say to a person's face. It emboldens them to be nastier and meaner to people, acting in ways they would never act like in real life for fear of reprisal. It enables cowards to act brave and courageous because there's no threat of physical harm or retaliation. Some people choose to remain respectful and professional in conversing with others in an online forum. Others do not.
Hey, this is your forum and your web site. So you can act however you please. If you like to curse out people you've never met before because you don't like what or how they say something to you, then you can do that.
But I'll never stoop to your level and do that to you. And yes, that is condescending.
P.S. If you and Rock believe that my advice about projecting money and power was bad, that's fine. I only offered my opinions. You can take it or leave it. At least I tried to answer your question.
I'm curious. Why can't you just say that you think my advice was bad and leave it at that? Why do you have to invoke someone else's name if you disagree with what someone says? Does using the name of a trusted friend like Rock or Ethan make you more credible?
Hey thanks zboy1, i respect your input, you have orders of magnitude more authority on this, I was there only for a week.
The dorky guys I saw were formally holding hands with their girlfriends, that's all the information i had i guess.
But to clarify, are you saying dorky guys generally can get casual sex/one night stands? It's kind of confusing since some guys here say things are mostly marriage oriented or whatnot.
I mean I think we are being ambiguous about the concept of "scoring" in this thread. Some are referring to casual sex and others are referring to finding a wife.
*Also, hey smallcheese not to nose in but i stand by what i said, try to drop it, it's too much, too personal, and too convoluted. Down the road you'll read your old posts and see what i'm saying. i've gone myself through the stage of 'enjoying' micro-detailed debates already.
1)Too much of one thing defeats the purpose.
2)Everybody is full of it. What's your hypocrisy?
This post brings up a VERY GOOD POINT.
Winston REALLY HAS NOOOOOOO EXPERIENCE WITH WOMEN.
That's why he fails with them.
He never really reached that point of having a serious girlfriend in high school and college and dating casually in his 20's and 30's and then being in a committed relationship and having kids.
When has Winston ever focused his effort on women?
Does Winston know anything about women's hobbies?
About childrearing? How they love relationships? Why they watch soap operas?
Why they like love stories?
He's like a child who never progressed past the age of 12.
He even describes himself that way.
For Winston, women are an alien race and alien culture.
Like how white americans might view Indian food.
He just sees the surface but doesn't truly understand.
I don't think i've EVER seen Winston post anything about women here.
He's an outsider.
Winston KEEPS SCREAMING, see? Other guys think i'm normal!!
Now how about we try asking women?
Let's put Winston on five blind dates.
Then LET"S ASK THE WOMEN, WHAT THEY REALLY THINK OF HIM?
Let the truth come out.........'
It doesn't matter WHAT the men think...
Remember who are you trying to date?
You're not thinking LOGICALLY, on the most simplistic level of all.....
Thanks Droid, I appreciate your advice.
I understand what you're saying but I don't appreciate people cursing me out with foul language when I never use that kind of language against them. I don't back down from bullies in real life so I certainly won't back down here.
I guess I'm old fashioned that way and I try to respect others and be civil, even if I vehemently dislike what they say or how they say it. I don't resort to name calling or cursing to try to get my points across.
I thought this forum had more class and dignity than others like Rooshv. But maybe on this forum, people are used to Winston cursing at people or calling them dumb. I don't post that often so I guess everyone here is ok with it? Everyone here approves the use of foul language and cursing at commenters?
If so, then this is probably the wrong place for me to try and help others with my experiences living abroad. It's ok, no big deal. I'm still happier abroad
Here's the thing, Winston.
There's even been famous tv drama shows about ugly, nerdy, undesirable guys getting beautiful women.
I'll bet a huge sum of money that you can't even name 2.
There's 2 very good examples that i think you should watch.
But i'm not gonna reveal them to you yet.
You JUST don't deserve them yet.
You've gotta do a little work, and if you start to progress, maybe you'll get some tips.
Have you ever really watched ANY Asian TV Drama or Movie?
Last edited by celery2010 on April 24th, 2015, 5:16 am, edited 1 time in total.