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Visiting the Mennonites

Discuss religion and spirituality topics.

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Adama
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Re: Visiting the Mennonites

Post by Adama » April 6th, 2017, 3:15 pm

Just re-reading this and now I recognize, some people are just not worth conversing with on any level, because they are incapable of understanding, making it a waste of time and effort.
Last edited by Adama on April 3rd, 2018, 5:29 pm, edited 3 times in total.




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Adama
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Re: Visiting the Mennonites

Post by Adama » April 6th, 2017, 4:12 pm

MrMan wrote: I didn't say one had to give thanks in everything to be saved. That's your conclusion, drawn by applying your own interpretation techniques, not mine. There are many things that are the will of God. It is the will of God for us to believe in the Messiah. It is the will of God that we be sanctified and abstain from fornication. It is the will of God that we give thanks in everything.

This whole statement is nonsense and contradicts even itself. You have no idea what you're even saying.

If we must do the Will of God (which you conflate with the same meaning as The Will of the Father) to get into heaven, and you are quoting scripture that says the Will of God is to abstain from fornication and give thanks, then you are saying that giving thanks is necessary to get into heaven.

See, you have no clue. You even deny you've said something, blaming me as interpreting incorrectly, and then you go on to say that which you have denied saying. In the very same breath.

Now this is highly interesting. Sad, but interesting.
One day, many will call Jesus Lord. Even though they think of Him as Lord... which means they might even claim to believe in Him... they will be rejected.
Yes, they claimed to believe in Him but they did not. They believed in their MANY WONDERFUL WORKS, such as casting out devils and such. They never believed in him but in themselves. Sad. That's why He rejects them. He never knew them because they never believed in Him, only in their own works, believing their works would save them, and not Christ.

Matthew 7

21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

He never knew them because they believed casting out devils, preaching and doing wonderful works is what saved them, rather than simply trusting in Christ. It's simple. They trusted themselves and their works, not Christ. It is right there.

This is the will of the Father:
John 6
37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

MrMan
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Re: Visiting the Mennonites

Post by MrMan » April 6th, 2017, 6:41 pm

Adama, Jesus is the Son of God. When He spoke of the will of God, He spoke of the will of HIs Father.

Look at that passage again in Matthew 7. It says more than you pointed out. Jesus said He never knew them. He also said they were workers of iniquity. Another translation says lawlessness.

If they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh, what does the life of a believer look like?

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Adama
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Re: Visiting the Mennonites

Post by Adama » April 6th, 2017, 6:54 pm

MrMan wrote:Adama, Jesus is the Son of God. When He spoke of the will of God, He spoke of the will of HIs Father.

Look at that passage again in Matthew 7. It says more than you pointed out. Jesus said He never knew them. He also said they were workers of iniquity. Another translation says lawlessness.

If they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh, what does the life of a believer look like?
You only say this because you believe works save a person: Lordship salvation is what you believe, not faith alone. You're deceived and deeply confused. Yes, they were workers of iniquity. Now if you read Romans 4 which I quoted before, it says that our iniquities are forgiven once we believe in Christ.

Romans 4
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
6 Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works,
7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.

Sins are covered past, present and future simply by believing in Christ. Works has nothing to do with salvation. If it did, it would say so clearly in everyplace. Sin is not imputed to the soul of the believer.

That is further proof that they were not believers (referring to the ones in Matthew 7 which Christ rejects). They believed that they could save themselves through good works, but they were also doing works of iniquity. That's what happens if you justify yourself instead of believing in Christ.

If a person has believed in Christ, then He knows them. His Spirit, the Holy Ghost indwells them. If a person has not believed, they don't have the Spirit of God. Therefore Christ doesn't know them. Once a person believes (by faith alone in Christ and not in their own works), they are sealed with the Holy Ghost. He never leaves them. He promised He wouldnt, not for any reason.

John 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

They never knew Christ. Cause He promised He would never cast them out for any reason. Simple. Ephesians 4:30 And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

Once again, you've rejected the truth and simplicity of Christ to follow after Lordship Salvation. That's why you don't understand anything and speak out of both sides of your mouth, even contradicting your own words in one breath.
MrMan wrote:Adama, Jesus is the Son of God. When He spoke of the will of God, He spoke of the will of HIs Father.
Now this must be just a little game. When did Jesus talk about the "Will of God"? I have only found one instance of where Christ directly says "the will of God," and that is in Mark 3:35, and that verse is not a salvation verse. Yet there are verses in John 6 that directly state what the Will of the Father is (and they are salvation verses: i.e. Believe in Jesus Christ and you have eternal life). There is no inference necessary for the verses in John 6: 36-40. There are some great inferences needed for a person to assume a parable that Jesus made about a man and his sons to make it into a picture of salvation. Even then, the fact that a person is taking their salvation doctrine from a parable, rather than from clear statements made by Christ Himself, shows an astonishing level of blindness. We can learn lessons from parables but we don't get doctrine from parables. Doctrine comes from clear statements.

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