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Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Faith via Grace, NOT Faith Alone!

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Adama
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Re: Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Grace, NOT Grace Alone!

Post by Adama » June 8th, 2018, 4:23 pm

Winston wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 12:44 pm
Here are many Bible verses, about 40, that say you have to keep the commandments and obey God and do "righteous works" to be saved and maintain your salvation, which is by works too, not just by faith alone. Apparently, Adama doesn't seem to know his Bible very well.


“For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the DOERS of the LAW shall be justified!” (Romans 2:13)

“God will repay each person according to what they have done. To those who by patient continuance in doing good, he will give eternal life. But for those who are self-seeking and reject the truth and follow evil, there will be wrath and anger” (Romans 2:6-8)

“I (Paul) preached first to those in Damascus, then in Jerusalem and throughout all Judea, and also to the Gentiles, that ALL must repent of their sins and turn to God – proving they have repented by doing good WORKS” (Acts 26:20)

“Do you not know that the wicked will NOT inherit the Kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral, nor idolters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor verbal abusers, nor swindlers, will inherit the Kingdom of God” (I Corinthians 6:9-10)

“A man who already has gone through the Jewish ceremony of circumcision, before he became a Christian, shouldn’t worry about it; and if he hasn’t been circumcised, he shouldn’t do it now. It doesn’t make any difference at all whether a Christian has gone through this ceremony or not. But it makes a lot of difference whether he is pleasing God by keeping God’s commandments. THAT is the important thing!” (I Corinthians 7:18-19)

“And being made perfect, Jesus became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that OBEY him!” (Hebrews 5:9)

“If thou wilt enter into life, keep the Commandments … Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself” (Matthew 19:16-21)

“Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself … This DO, and thou shalt live” (Luke 10:25-28)

“Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother” (Luke 18:18-22)

“Go and make disciples of all nations … and teach them to OBEY everything I have commanded” (Matthew 28:19-20)

“I now realize God shows no favoritism, but He accepts from every nation the one who fears Him and DOES what is right” (Acts 10:34-35)

“Therefore we LABOR that we may be accepted of Him. For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that everyone may be recompensed for the things done in his body, according to what he has done, whether it be good or bad” (II Corinthians 5:9-10)

“For he (Jesus) whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: For God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him. The Father loveth the Son, and hath given all things into his hand. He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that OBEYS not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him” (John 3:34-36)

“And hereby we do know that we know Him (God), if we KEEP His commandments. He that saith, I know Him, and keepeth not His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him” (I John 2:3-4)

“Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed: And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free” (John 8:31-32)

(Note that Jesus said that you have to CONTINUE in his word, in other words, maintain your salvation by following his teachings. If you were "once saved always saved" why would you have to continue in his word to be saved?)

“But in every nation he that feareth Him, and WORKETH righteousness, is accepted with Him” (Acts 10:35)

“Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls. But be ye DOERS of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves. For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a DOER, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass: For he beholdeth himself, and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was. But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a DOER of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed. If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man’s religion is vain. Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and the widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world” (James 1:21-27)

(As you can see, you have to be DOERS of the Word, not just believers of it.)

"Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works. Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble. But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead? Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar? Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by WORKS was faith made perfect? And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God. Ye see then how that by WORKS a man is justified, and not by faith only. Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way? For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also." (James 2:17-26)

(As you can see, belief is not enough. Even the demons believe. WORKS are what justify a man, it says.)

“Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us” (Hebrews 12:1)

(Why would you have to "run the race" if you are saved forever? If you are saved forever then aren't you already at the finish line?)

“Therefore whoever heareth these sayings of mine, and DOETH them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not; for it was founded upon a rock. And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and DOETH them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it” (Matthew 7:24-27)

(Notice it doesn't say that believing alone will build a strong house and foundation, but that doing is required.)

“But the mercy of the Lord is from everlasting to everlasting upon them that fear Him, and His righteousness unto children’s children; to such as keep His covenant, and to those that remember His commandments to DO them” (Psalms 103:17-18)

“But thou, O man of God, flee these things; and follow after righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, meekness. Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, whereunto thou art called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses” (I Timothy 6:11-12)

(The term "lay hold on eternal life" sounds like YOU have to hold onto your eternal life. If it was forever and impossible to lose, why would you have to "hold onto it?")

“And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels, in flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that OBEY not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power; when he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day. Wherefore also we pray always for you, that our God would count you worthy of this calling, and fulfill all the good pleasure of His goodness, and the work of faith with power: That the name of our Lord Jesus Christ may be glorified in you, and ye in him, according to the grace of God and the Lord Jesus Christ” (II Thessalonians 1:7-12)

“Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling” (Philippians 2:12)

“And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. For ever one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. But he that DOETH truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God” (John 3:19-21)

“For a good tree bringeth not forth corrupt fruit; neither doth a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. For every tree is known by his own fruit. For of thorns men do not gather figs, nor of a bramble bush gather they grapes. A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good; and an evil man out of the evil treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is evil: for of the abundance of the heart his mouth doth speaketh. And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and DO not the things which I say?” (Luke 6:43-46)

"If ye KEEP my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father’s commandments, and abide in His love. These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full” (John 15:10-11)

(Notice Jesus says you gotta KEEP his commandments, not just believe in him alone.)

“Beloved, follow not that which is evil, but that which is good. He that doeth good is of God: but he that doeth evil hath not seen God” (III John 1:11)

(What if a Christian does evil, or a non-Christian does good?)

“And ye shall be hated of all men for my name’s sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved” (Mark 13:13)

(Why would you have to "endure to the end" to be saved, if you are saved forever once you "believe" in Jesus and "accept" him?)

“Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect” (Matthew 5:48)

“For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law; For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the DOERS of the law shall be justified” (Romans 2:12-13)

(So you see, DOERS are the ones that are justified, not believers.)

“Blessed are they that DO His commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city” (Revelation 22:14)

(Sounds pretty clear cut, that you have to DO his commandments, not just believe in him.)

"Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God." (Galatians 5:19-21)

“Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world. And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that DOETH the will of God abideth for ever” (I John 2:15-17)

(Sounds like it's saying that if you DOETH the will of God, you will live forever. Not just believe alone.)

“If ye love me, keep my commandments. And I will pray the Father, and He shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you” (John 14:15-18)

(Jesus seems to be saying that if you keep his commandments, he will send the Holy Spirit to you. He didn't say belief alone was enough.)

“Lord, I have hoped for thy salvation, and done thy commandments.” (Psalms 119:166)

“Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep His commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil” (Ecclesiastes 12:13-14)

"And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not." (Galatians 6:9)

“If a righteous person turns to sinning and ACTS like any other sinner, should he be allowed to live? No, of course not! All his previous goodness will be forgotten, and he shall die for his sins” (Ezekiel 18:24)

“Do you think I like to see the wicked die? Of course not! I only want him to turn from his wicked ways and live … If a wicked person turns away from his wickedness and OBEYS the law, and DOES what is right, he shall save his soul” (Ezekiel 18:23,27)

As you can see, these 40 verses say you have to DO God's will, OBEY God's teachings, follow God's commandments, and continue to LIVE a righteous life in order to be saved. It's spelled out in plain English. Thus one must conclude that you gotta do BOTH, obey God and live righteously, as well as receive God's grace of eternal life through Christ, in order to be saved and stay saved.

Gabriel Ansley explains here why "believing" that Jesus died for you alone is not going to get you saved.

http://10lovecommandments.com/salvation ... ose-again/

Here he explains why you having to "accept Christ" is a fallacy. The truth is, God has to accept YOU.

http://10lovecommandments.com/salvation ... al-savior/

Here he explains how the parable of Moses and Exodus exemplifies the Salvation Equation.

http://10lovecommandments.com/salvation ... s-parable/

Index of his Salvation Equation proofs.

http://10lovecommandments.com/salvation-equation/

Also, here are Bible verses that say that you can LOSE your salvation if you turn away!

http://10lovecommandments.com/salvation ... tion-osas/

“For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandments delivered unto them. But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire” (II Peter 2:20-22)

“The seed on stony soil represents those who hear the message and immediately receive it with joy. But since they have no root, they last only a short time. For when trouble or persecution comes because of the word, they quickly fall away” (Mark 4:16-17)

“The seed that fell among thorns represent those who hear God’s Word, but all too quickly the message is crowded out by the worries of this life, the lure of wealth, and the lust for other things, so no fruit is produced” (Mark 4:18-19)

“If a righteous person turns to sinning and acts like any other sinner, should he be allowed to live? No, of course not! All his previous goodness will be forgotten, and he shall die for his sins” (Ezekiel 18:24)

“Do you think I like to see the wicked die? Of course not! I only want him to turn from his wicked ways and live … If a wicked person turns away from his wickedness and obeys the law, and does what is right, he shall save his soul” (Ezekiel 18:23,27)

“Repent, and turn from your sins while there is yet time. Put them behind you and make you a new heart and a new spirit. For I have no pleasure in seeing you die, says the Lord God. So turn yourselves and live!” (Ezekiel 18:30-32)

Like I said, at the end of the day, people believe what they WANT to believe and choose the belief that is the most ATTRACTIVE to them, not the one that makes the most sense or is best supported by the evidence. This includes Christians too of course. Of course believing that "once saved always saved" is more attractive and popular and makes one feel more secure than that they can lose their salvation if they turn from God. Everyone wants to believe that their position in heaven is already secured, because that sounds better and feels better and gives people a sense of SECURITY and guarantee. But that's not what the evidence from the Bible says. But people don't follow evidence. Most people are not truth seekers. They believe what feels best and is the most attractive and pleasing to them.
Romans 2 is specifically about hypocritical people, who claim to teach others but refuse to do it themselves.

Repentance doesn't save a person. A person should definitely repent of their sins. However repentance doesn't save because they are works. It is faith that saves. Just as a person can go sprint a marathon everyday for life and still be saved, so a person will be repenting daily for life and still be saved. As long as they realize, it's their faith in Christ that won them salvation, not anything they've done for themselves.

People will be judged by their works. For the unbelievers, their rewards in hell will be determined by their works. For the saved, their rewards in heaven will be determined by their works. That is, hell and heaven are already determined by whether or not they have trusted in Christ. However, the level of rewards within each world will be determined by a person's works.

Apparently some people don't know what a salvation verse is. Let me say clearly here: A salvation verse has a structure. It goes like this:

Believe and be saved; believe and have everlasting life; He that believes is saved; saved by faith.

If a verse doesn't state anything about eternal life, everlasting life, the Kingdom of God, being born again or regenerated, then it is probably not a salvation verse. People should not attribute verses that have nothing to do with salvation with eternal life.
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Re: Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Faith via Grace, NOT Faith Alone!

Post by Winston » June 8th, 2018, 4:33 pm

Btw if you want to use human logic and say that salvation cannot be of both faith and works, then I could use human logic and say: Jesus can't be the Son of God and God himself at the same time. That's a logical contradiction. Yet the Christian church says you gotta accept that on faith, for it's beyond human intellect. Any God that you can understand is no God, Adama. Any deity is far beyond your intellect, comprehension of logic.
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Re: Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Faith via Grace, NOT Faith Alone!

Post by Adama » June 8th, 2018, 4:43 pm

1. Salvation is free.
2. Salvation is a gift.
3. All a person must do to receive it, is believe that Jesus is the Son of God.

Some people can't believe that salvation can be free and unearned.
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Re: Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Faith via Grace, NOT Faith Alone!

Post by Adama » June 8th, 2018, 4:44 pm

Winston wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 4:33 pm
Btw if you want to use human logic and say that salvation cannot be of both faith and works, then I could use human logic and say: Jesus can't be the Son of God and God himself at the same time. That's a logical contradiction. Yet the Christian church says you gotta accept that on faith, for it's beyond human intellect. Any God that you can understand is no God, Adama. Any deity is far beyond your intellect, comprehension of logic.
A person can say whatever they want, Winston. Whether it is correct is a different matter.
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Re: Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Faith via Grace, NOT Faith Alone!

Post by Winston » June 8th, 2018, 4:46 pm

Adama wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 4:44 pm
Winston wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 4:33 pm
Btw if you want to use human logic and say that salvation cannot be of both faith and works, then I could use human logic and say: Jesus can't be the Son of God and God himself at the same time. That's a logical contradiction. Yet the Christian church says you gotta accept that on faith, for it's beyond human intellect. Any God that you can understand is no God, Adama. Any deity is far beyond your intellect, comprehension of logic.
A person can say whatever they want, Winston. Whether it is correct is a different matter.
True. But that applies to YOU too. Agreed? And to other fundamentalists as well.

Ignoring 40 Bible verses that don't agree with you doesn't erase them or make them go away. Agreed?
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Re: Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Faith via Grace, NOT Faith Alone!

Post by Adama » June 8th, 2018, 4:53 pm

Winston wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 4:46 pm
Adama wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 4:44 pm
Winston wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 4:33 pm
Btw if you want to use human logic and say that salvation cannot be of both faith and works, then I could use human logic and say: Jesus can't be the Son of God and God himself at the same time. That's a logical contradiction. Yet the Christian church says you gotta accept that on faith, for it's beyond human intellect. Any God that you can understand is no God, Adama. Any deity is far beyond your intellect, comprehension of logic.
A person can say whatever they want, Winston. Whether it is correct is a different matter.
True. But that applies to YOU too. Agreed? And to other fundamentalists as well.

Ignoring 40 Bible verses that don't agree with you doesn't erase them or make them go away. Agreed?
Is everything null to you? The Bible is mistranslated from Greek?? Believe really means obey?

A salvation verse says the person believes to be saved, or believes to have eternal life, or believes to have everlasting life, or that a person is saved by faith. A salvation verse has a very basic structure and is straight to the point.

The verses which you posted are not about salvation.
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Re: Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Grace, NOT Grace Alone!

Post by Adama » June 8th, 2018, 5:03 pm

Winston wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 11:54 am
Funny quotes by Mark Twain about heaven.

http://www.twainquotes.com/Heaven.html

"Heaven goes by favor. If it went by merit, you would stay out and your dog would go in."
- Mark Twain, a Biography
Twain just said salvation is free. Grace means unmerited favor, meaning it is unearned. Merit means it is earned. Favor = grace = free = gift. Merit = earnings = work.
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Re: Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Faith via Grace, NOT Faith Alone!

Post by TruthSeeker » June 8th, 2018, 5:07 pm

You guys are going around in circles.

If someone believes in Jesus Christ they are saved.

If someone believes in Jesus Christ + works they are still saved because they believe on Jesus Christ.

Case closed.

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Re: Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Faith via Grace, NOT Faith Alone!

Post by Adama » June 8th, 2018, 5:24 pm

Many are called. Few are chosen.
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Re: Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Faith via Grace, NOT Faith Alone!

Post by Winston » June 8th, 2018, 5:27 pm

Adama wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 4:53 pm
Winston wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 4:46 pm
Adama wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 4:44 pm
Winston wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 4:33 pm
Btw if you want to use human logic and say that salvation cannot be of both faith and works, then I could use human logic and say: Jesus can't be the Son of God and God himself at the same time. That's a logical contradiction. Yet the Christian church says you gotta accept that on faith, for it's beyond human intellect. Any God that you can understand is no God, Adama. Any deity is far beyond your intellect, comprehension of logic.
A person can say whatever they want, Winston. Whether it is correct is a different matter.
True. But that applies to YOU too. Agreed? And to other fundamentalists as well.

Ignoring 40 Bible verses that don't agree with you doesn't erase them or make them go away. Agreed?
Is everything null to you? The Bible is mistranslated from Greek?? Believe really means obey?

A salvation verse says the person believes to be saved, or believes to have eternal life, or believes to have everlasting life, or that a person is saved by faith. A salvation verse has a very basic structure and is straight to the point.

The verses which you posted are not about salvation.
http://10lovecommandments.com/salvation ... ose-again/
Believe Means Obey

See, somehow the idea got started that the word “believe” in the New Testament means to believe in what Jesus DID for us, meaning died and rose again. For example, I was taught my whole life that the word “believe” in John 3:16 meant … “if I believe Jesus died for me, I will obtain everlasting life.” You know the verse:

“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten son, that whosoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life” (John 3:16)

See, I was always told this meant “believe he died for me”. But this isn’t true! The Greek word translated “believe” in John 3:16 is the same one used all over the New Testament for “believe,” and just 20 verses later in John 3:36 we see it used again. But this time we get the opposite to “believe not” used in the same verse, and guess what the Greek word for “believeth not” means? The word is “apeitheo,” and it means: to disobey! In other words, the word “believe” means to OBEY. So every time you see the phrase “believe in the son” “believe in Jesus” “believeth in him” “believe in his name,” it always means the same thing … it means to OBEY Jesus, which means to OBEY his teachings. And we’ve already learned ALL his teachings were based on keeping the 10LC. So, in other words, to “believe in him” means to “keep the 10LC”.
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Re: Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Faith via Grace, NOT Faith Alone!

Post by Adama » June 8th, 2018, 5:30 pm

The problem is that some people believe men. However, other people believe the Bible.
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Re: Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Grace, NOT Grace Alone!

Post by Winston » June 8th, 2018, 5:30 pm

Adama wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 5:03 pm
Winston wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 11:54 am
Funny quotes by Mark Twain about heaven.

http://www.twainquotes.com/Heaven.html

"Heaven goes by favor. If it went by merit, you would stay out and your dog would go in."
- Mark Twain, a Biography
Twain just said salvation is free. Grace means unmerited favor, meaning it is unearned. Merit means it is earned. Favor = grace = free = gift. Merit = earnings = work.
No Twain was saying that Salvation is by FAVOR, which means God has to like you, just like a woman or friend has to like you. It's subjective and based on his or her opinion. That makes sense. Why would God be a machine that treats everyone equally? Equality doesn't exist anywhere in science, nature or reality. It's a concept that low class people want to believe in to elevate themselves. And a weapon that dangerous communists and socialists use to push their agenda for a NWO.

Mark Twain was not a Christian or believer. If you read his works, you'd know that. He was a deist, just like the founding fathers were. His treatise "Letters from the Earth" indicate that he was very highly critical of Christianity.
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Winston
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Re: Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Faith via Grace, NOT Faith Alone!

Post by Winston » June 8th, 2018, 5:33 pm

TruthSeeker wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 5:07 pm
You guys are going around in circles.

If someone believes in Jesus Christ they are saved.

If someone believes in Jesus Christ + works they are still saved because they believe on Jesus Christ.

Case closed.
That would be nice. However, people like Gabriel Ansley are saying that if salvation by faith alone is wrong, then those who believe it are on a dangerous path to hell. So the "saved by faith alone" doctrine is satanic and can lead people to hell, especially those who think they can do any bad thing they want now since they cannot lose their salvation. So if the truth is that you can lose their salvation, then of course that's a very BIG issue in the Christian community. Think about it.
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Re: Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Faith via Grace, NOT Faith Alone!

Post by Adama » June 8th, 2018, 5:45 pm

Is the Hebrew word for believe also a mistranslation of obey? Because Genesis 15:6 says that all a person must do is believe the Lord and that imputes onto him righteousness.

A person cannot obey onto the Lord for righteousness. That would mean perfect obedience, which is not possible, and God has an absolute perfect standard that only Christ can fulfill according to righteousness, which is why He was manifested: to be perfect for us. Otherwise we could not enter into eternal life on our own by our works. Because we are fallen and mortal. Only Christ can fulfill the law. Which is why salvation is not by obedience. The level of obedience required cannot be attained by anyone except Christ.
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Re: Why Biblical Salvation is by WORKS and Faith via Grace, NOT Faith Alone!

Post by Adama » June 8th, 2018, 7:37 pm

Winston wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 5:33 pm
TruthSeeker wrote:
June 8th, 2018, 5:07 pm
You guys are going around in circles.

If someone believes in Jesus Christ they are saved.

If someone believes in Jesus Christ + works they are still saved because they believe on Jesus Christ.

Case closed.
That would be nice. However, people like Gabriel Ansley are saying that if salvation by faith alone is wrong, then those who believe it are on a dangerous path to hell. So the "saved by faith alone" doctrine is satanic and can lead people to hell, especially those who think they can do any bad thing they want now since they cannot lose their salvation. So if the truth is that you can lose their salvation, then of course that's a very BIG issue in the Christian community. Think about it.
For some reason people believe that because salvation is by faith alone that means that the person can do whatever they want, which is incorrect. God doesn't take away salvation, but He can cut their lives short, and send punishments in other ways.
A good man is above pettiness. He is better than that.

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