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Why America can't be a Christian Nation and a Free Country

Discuss religion and spirituality topics.

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Why America can't be a Christian Nation and a Free Country

Postby Winston » Sat Jul 24, 2010 4:11 pm

http://intellectualexpat.blogspot.com/2010/07/how-can-america-be-christian-nation-and.html

How can America be a Christian Nation and a Free Country at the same time?

Patriotic God fearing Americans often tout that "America is the land of the free and the epitome of freedom" yet that it is also "a Christian nation" or at least based on Christian ethics and values.

Though there is debate over whether the Founding Fathers were Christians or Deists, America is still seen by many as being founded on Christian principles and ideals, which are ingrained in our culture, ethics and morals.

Yet the slightest cursory glance at the Bible and Christian faith reveals that it is inherently fascist in nature. The Bible teaches that if you do whatever you want or live your life however you want, you are living in sin and rebellion against God. Throughout the Bible, the message is that if you don't obey God and follow his commandments, you will be punished and damned. The Christian message is that freedom is evil, while obedience and giving your life and will to God is good. Likewise, in fascist Nazi Germany, anyone who didn't obey was shot or imprisoned. Dissension was not allowed. Fear of punishment was the motivator. Therefore, Christianity is essentially a "fascist religion".

Christianity and Fascism share the following core attributes:

a) Obey or be punished.
b) No independent thoughts. Must think with the hive.
c) No tolerance for dissension or free speech.
d) Your God or dictator is to be feared, for fear keeps you in line and protects authority.
e) The use of fear and guilt as psychological control mechanisms.
f) The view that the individual is weak and powerless, and his/her life is without purpose, unless aligned to serve a "higher power" (e.g. God, tyrant or dictator).

Now this isn't to say that Jesus himself was a fascist. Assuming he existed (which is not a proven fact), he could very well have been a well meaning person spreading a good spiritual message to help people. It's what the Church and elite power structure DID with his name and the religion around him that they established that turned Christianity into a fundamentalist religion and a fascist form of control over others.

So anyway, how can you believe in religious fascism and a "land of the free" at the same time?! How can you deem freedom as the highest value yet preach a religion where freedom is considered evil and obedience to God is the only good? How can you claim the right of free speech yet support a religion that doesn't allow dissension? You can't. It's a total contradiction. Yet they preach it nonetheless. It's another example of Orwellian "double think". Therefore, living with the ideals of freedom and fascism at the same time is a Catch-22.

This is just the tip of the iceberg. When you look deeper, the contradictions become even more numerous.

For example, how can you support the American value of individualism and at the same time the Christian belief that the individual is nothing unless he/she submits to the Christian God and obeys him? If you truly believed in individual free will, you cannot endorse the punishment of individuals who freely choose not to surrender to the "hive mentality" of the Christian Church. There's no way around it if you think about it. (but then again you are not meant to think about it, only to obey all that you are told)

Furthermore, as the Apostle Paul said in his Epistles (Romans 6), we are "slaves to sin" before accepting Christ. But once you accept Christ and start following God's commandments, you are "set free" from sin and become "slaves to righteousness" as Paul put it. In other words, when you are free, you are "slaves to sin", but when you submit your will to God and give up your freedom, then you are "set free from sin"! How can you be "set free" by submitting to fascism?! What could be more ridiculous than that?! Golly. The mind control here couldn't be more obvious.

Also, how can you preach the "love of God" and the "fear of God" at the same time? You can't love and fear something at the same time. Love and fear are totally different vibrations of energy that are not compatible. Fear operates on a lower denser vibration while love is on a higher faster more dynamic frequency.

Moreover, these same "religious patriots" also declare Capitalism to be based on the Christian values and principles of hard work and virtuous labor. Yet Capitalism teaches that greed and the accumulation of wealth is a GOOD thing, and encourages self-interest as a primary motivator of the free enterprise system. But on the other hand, the Bible teaches that greed is a BAD thing and leads to sin and destruction, which is taught in many examples and parables in the Bible. As Jesus said, "It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

Though Bible verses can be interpreted in different ways, there is no question that greed is taught to be a bad thing in the Bible. So again we have two mutually exclusive values. Yet these religious patriots don't see it or reconcile it. They are under mass mind control too, and are not as free as they think they are.

Here's another oddity. We are taught in schools that man arouse from Evolution and random mutations of nature. Yet we have "In God We Trust" on the dollar bill, the swearing of Bibles in the courtroom, the words "one nation under God" in the pledge of allegiance, and virtually all politicians and US Presidents professing to believe in God (since Atheists can't get elected). And good citizens are expected to go to church too. Another Orwellian double think?

You gotta remember that religion was set up not to free you, but to contain you. And authority is set up to control people, not to serve them. This is why fascist religions like Christianity and Islam constantly seek to convert and dominate others, both in their homeland and abroad, for that is the inherent nature of fascism and tyranny. It's all about control and conquest, not just of lives, but of minds as well.

Religion limits and closes your mind into a rigid belief system that EDITS OUT any new information that doesn't fit into it. It restricts you from seeing reality and others the way they are, removing objectivity and clarity of thought. Yet you are sold the opposite, that religion will "free you". If that isn't mind control and brainwashing, then I don't know what is.

Learn to free your mind, and you will recognize anything in disguise that tries to enslave and control you, and see through their lies.

For more on how Christianity and other fascist religions are used as mass mind control, listen to David Icke's dissertation on it here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8zohMUaUog
Last edited by Winston on Tue Aug 03, 2010 3:37 am, edited 6 times in total.
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Re: How can America be a Christian Nation and a Free Country

Postby Nate » Sat Jul 24, 2010 4:36 pm

Fascism is not a generic term for any authoritarian system, except among the uneducated. You might do well to educate yourself as to what fascism is- it is a specific economic/political system.
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Postby MrPeabody » Sat Jul 24, 2010 5:43 pm

Christianity has become corrupted, just like any other large organization. The philosophy can be used either to liberate or to oppress depending on who delivers the message.

Read the below speech by William Jennings Bryan where he uses Christian principles and the Constitution to argue against Imperialism.

http://www.greatamericandocuments.com/s ... alism.html
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Postby gsjackson » Sat Jul 24, 2010 8:34 pm

Most any historian of ideas would tell you that the whole idea of freedom as a political construct grew up along with Protestant individualism. There was a strong strain of this Protestant individualism in the U.S. as it emerged as a country, but there were always elements of more fundamentalist beliefs. The constitutional convention only narrowly came down in favor of Enlightenment values, rather than taking a more theocratic path. Individualism flourished in the U.S., relatively speaking, given that it was at one time the world's most literate nation, filled with readers who were in the habit of thinking.

But individualism, thinking for yourself, is a tough row to hoe. The concept didn't survive the libertinism of the 1960s, when millions of people found individualism leading them down the road of self-destruction, and retreated into a fundamentalist viewpoint that spelled morality out very clearly in black and white terms. As I've said before, this is one of the reasons American culture became so barren in the last 40 years -- basically because everyone withdrew from it into narrow, supportive subcultures, such as evangelical/fundamentalist Christianity.

The critique Winston is rehearsing is a Nietzschean/post-modern notion that all discourses that set up a hierarchical scheme, i.e., authority, are essentially means of exercising control. This viewpoint doesn't indict Christianity, or other religions, any more than it does any good/bad scheme of values. Certainly, if you look at the primary examples of tyranny in the last century -- Hitler's Germany, Stalin's USSR, Mao's China -- none of them were rooted in religious belief.

The more relevant tension for purposes of the social decay discussed on this website is, IMO, the ongoing tension in the U.S. between individualism and community. Somehow, in mis-managing this tension time and again, we've managed to destroy both.
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Postby Winston » Sat Jul 24, 2010 10:47 pm

If you dig deep into the origins of Nazism, you will find that it does have occult roots. The swastika is an ancient occult symbol in fact.

Read some of Michael Tsarion's work for more detail.

In fact, it is likely that Hitler didn't die in the bunker, and that he escaped. The groups that funded both the Allies and Nazis let him get away it seems.

This forensic expert on History Channel recently examined the skull piece in Russia that was supposed to belong to Hitler, and using DNA testing, found that it belonged to a female. It could not have been Eva Braun either since it had a bullet hole in it, and Eva poisoned herself, she didn't shoot herself.

See that History Channel documentary here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iM5fCI0YWRc

Remember, the job of authority is not to tell you the truth, but to control you, by whatever means necessary.

When you dig in the sources, you find out that official history leaves out A LOT of things.
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Postby MrPeabody » Sun Jul 25, 2010 4:41 am

William J. Bryan was a good example of a deeply Christian man who actually stood up for the poor and downtrodden, unlike today where big religion supports the rich and powerful. He opposed US imperialism in the Philippines and advocated for their self rule. Bryan also opposed evolution in the Scopes trial. Although he could be accused of not being a good scientist, his real concern with evolution was the dogma of Social Darwinism being developed at that time. After reading several books related to Social Darwinism, Bryan made up his mind that evolution was the greatest threat to America. He could be criticized for bad science, but Bryan anticipated the Nazis, eugenics and the scientific dictatorship that guys like David Icke and Alex Jones are complaining about. A world being ruled by elites who only view the rest of us as genetic material will end up being more brutal then the middle ages. Also, as a historical note – Bryan was frequently attacked as cowardly by the Republicans for his antiwar beliefs and he is the cowardly lion in the Wizard of Oz.



"the Darwinian theory represents man reaching his present perfection by the operation of the law of hate&—the merciless law by which the strong crowd out and kill off the weak. If this is the law of our development then, if there is any logic that can bind the human mind, we shall turn backward to the beast in proportion as we substitute the law of love. I choose to believe that love rather than hatred is the law of development."

- William Jennings Bryan
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Postby skeptic » Sun Jul 25, 2010 5:01 am

First of all, American is not really a nation, but a country of immigrants (and their descendants). Second of all, while Christians constitute the majority of religious population in the U.S., there is a significant proportion of people of other faiths living here. In order to provide religious freedom and equality, the separation of church and states exists. But it's not meant to diminish the role of religon in life of any American.
You can run away from America, but you CAN'T run away from yourself.
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Postby momopi » Sun Jul 25, 2010 9:09 pm

I'm one of those arrogant people who refuse to believe that the universe was created for my own benefit, and therefore religion is mostly horse crap.

However, if you're the type who needs "faith", I would suggest joining the Quakers (Religious Society of Friends).

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Postby Winston » Tue Aug 03, 2010 2:53 am

Here's another oddity:

We are taught in schools that man arouse from Evolution and random mutations of nature. Yet we have "In God We Trust" on the dollar bill, the swearing of Bibles in the courtroom, the words "one nation under God" in the pledge of allegiance, and virtually all politicians and US Presidents professing to believe in God (since Atheists can't get elected). And good citizens are expected to go to church too. Another Orwellian double think?

Another Orwellian double think?
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Postby Linc4Love » Tue Aug 03, 2010 4:30 am

Too much order in the universe for it to have resulted from a series of random events. Nobody has to believe in God or a specific interpretation, but I pity the person who believes in nothing. That's how communism and state atheism gets started.
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Re: Why America can't be a Christian Nation and a Free Count

Postby Winston » Mon Dec 22, 2014 2:22 pm

America is not a Christian nation because:

1) most of the founding fathers were not Christians, but deists and Freemasons. See the documentary "Hidden Faith of the Founding Fathers" on YouTube on below.
2) America and capitalism teaches that greed is good, but the Bible teaches that greed is evil.
3) The American concepts of freedom, individualism and democracy are considered evil and Satanic in the Bible, which preaches that only obedience to God and righteousness is good. But freedom is NEVER condoned in the Bible.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xU24fJ4NQxo[/youtube]
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Re: Why America can't be a Christian Nation and a Free Count

Postby Moretorque » Mon Dec 22, 2014 10:15 pm

After what I have learned over the last 13 years being on the net I am real skeptical about anything I see or read unless it is a true source written from that era and I am still skeptical.
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