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I came across this site through an article on here bashing PUAs and saying how their techniques will not work if a woman is not already attracted to you, but suggesting that traveling abroad is the real solution.
I am just wondering, why exactly would traveling abroad be the solution then? If women in the U.S. aren't attracted to you, then why would women abroad be? Is it just that they have "family values" and are looking for a "good husband" as opposed to a guy they are attracted to? Because if that's the case, it's not a solution for men who want to make women ATTRACTED to them. For me it's not about settling down with a nice girl, I actually want women to feel turned on by me and not just settle for me because they aren't picky.
Also, I have to ask, which countries are we talking about here when we say the dating scene is better? My friend who went to the U.K. was actually saying that people in the U.S. are so much more friendly whereas in the U.K. they barely ever talk to strangers. Are we just talking about Eastern Europe, Latin America and Asia?
Travelling abroad would be a solution for the reasons mentioned many times in various places on this website. If you want the satisfaction / conquest of making a woman attracted to you (who wasn't attracted to you before), and you live in a western country, then you're already in the right place. Just do whatever you have to do. That's all I have to say.
But the thing is, I don't see why women in other countries would be anymore likely to be attracted to me. Based on what I have read on the topic, guys seem to be saying that foreign women are just more "open" to advances from guys in general whereas American women are more apprehensive. But these guys also seem to admit that when American women are attracted to you, they will be just as open and you won't have the the same problem as when they're not. So if a guy is ONLY open to women who are attracted to him, then what difference would a foreign woman make?
To clear up your confusion you need to read the articles and the comparisons between western and foreign women. If you've read them already, then I don't understand why you're confused.
When western women are attracted, of course they open up. But there are two differences between western and foreign women in this regard. Firstly, western women's mentality is by default closed (hence PUA). Foreign women's mentality is by default open, or at least half open (hence no PUA in those other countries - there's no need, there's no ice to break). Secondly, whereas western women will most likely tend to be already more open to a super high status guy, a foreign woman is not so materialistic, picky and entitled.
Net result :
Western women : If you don't come across as super alpha, you're a walking shadow to her, and you better come up with something amazing, and she'll test you all the way.
Foreign women : The only standard to live up to is to not be an assh ole. Anything above that is a bonus, and very much appreciated.
Let me give you a clue as to the difference. I'm a member of okcupid. I've been a member since about november 2012. At first I only sent messages to females near where I live. Result : Almost nothing. Now, I only send messages to filipinas. Result : Lots of conversations, and lots of visits to my profile, and lots of messages from them initiating conversations. They're easily impressed, they appreciate anything nice you say about them, and they really show an interest. They are attracted to niceness.
Non western women are real. They behave like women should, in every way. Western women are fake. Damaged, spoiled (in every sense), ruined.
Interesting. I could see how that would be true. But I have to ask, by the west you mean the US, Canada, Austraila and western Europe right? So this would include the UK, France, Germany, Spain, etc. right? And when you say women are more open in other countries, does this include ALL non-Western countries? I usually hear guys talking about Eastern Europe, South America, and the Phillipines. What about the rest of Asia? India? Africa? Also, I am wondering about black Latinas. In my experience, it seems African American women are the epitome of western bitchiness. White American women have nothing on them.
Western usually refers to mainly white, english speaking countries. That means US, Canada, UK, Australia, New Zealand. It could also include Scandanavia (particularly Sweden). I guess some people would also count most western countries, but I personally would not include Spain, Portugal or Italy. Southern Europeans are different, I think.
It's not an exact term, it can be flexible I suppose. For example some people might include Germany, others not so much.
Not all non-western countries are considered good in terms of the women. For example India is considered by some to be a terrible, increasingly feminist country, whereas others might have different experiences there.
Personally I'd say that Latin America, South East Asia and Eastern Europe are the desirable places. Africa is a huge place of course so it's hard to generalise. If I had to guess I'd say north Africa is probably best, but I really don't know. Black latinas I don't know, but I'd assume that they're ok. They certainly have a very different vibe from black girls in english speaking countries. Some people don't consider China / Japan / S. Korea to be good, others are less critical, especially of China since it's so big, and it borders Indochina (which is generally considered good).
So the term western and non-western is very loose. It's just a generalisation. Some people use the term feminized and non feminized.
Some people say that generally European women are better, but unfortunately they tend to include the UK, which I think is totally incorrect as I find UK women to be appalling. I live in London and I don't get a good vibe from them. I really think that those who talk about finding good women and who criticise US women seriously underestimate just how bad UK women are. The emphasis is always on the US. The UK is just as bad, it's just that in the US things tend to be a bit more obvious and noticeable.
Interesting. I certainly wouldn't call Japan, Korea, and China feminized, but there could be problem because of a lack of openness to dating foreigners. The same goes for the Middle East; DEFINITELY not feminized, but most women there aren't open to dating outside of their ethnic and religious group. I've honestly never heard of India being feminist, I've heard quite the opposite. About Southern Europeans being different I hear that sometimes, but I've also heard Italy being lumped in with the UK and France as being part of the feminized west.
However, again, when we say these foreign women are more open to being approached by men, we are only talking about men they are NOT attracted to. Because, from what I see, if a western woman is attracted to a guy already, she will be very open to being approached by him. I personally wouldn't want a relationship with a woman who isn't attracted to me. I would rather use PUA techniques to make her attracted to me, otherwise I'd want nothing to do with her.
You're right. Don't travel abroad. Save your money. An AW will eventually choose you.
You're only looking at one factor. Other factors are that foreign women are higher quality and more normal and natural.
Compare American women from the 1950's with now, and you'll see what I mean.
Have you seen the 15 benefits of foreign women page?
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"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
There are factors too numerous to mention that we've discussed a million times over on this forum but i'll try to sum it up:
Different culture and values. For minority men this is very important because being of a non-white race can be a significant dating disadvantage in the U.S. For typical white guys they usually desire a better quality female with more traditional values.
Better ratio of good looking women to men. Notice I said _good looking_ because the U.S. has one of the highest obesity rates in the world so finding available single women who aren't pear shaped or flabby is difficult. I think you can find way more attractive men with decent incomes in the u.s. than vice versa. The female quality just isn't available in America.
Economic advantage. If you're seen as having better than average wages compared with the locals etc.. your status goes up. It's kind of like how some women only date upper to upper-middle class guys with prestigious jobs in the U.S.
Btw, countries in the anglosphere (U.K., U.S., Canada, Australia, NZ, etc..) are too similar to each other. The women are pretty cold in these countries and follow the same cultural patterns. That's why when we talk about going abroad we are mostly talking about the non english speaking parts of the world.
Yes I read the 15 benefits. Some of them may be true, but others aren't really factors for me. While I generally tend to prefer non-white or mixed women, I don't find white American women any less attractive than white Eastern European women. As for the stuff about family values and being marriage-minded, that is actually NOT what I am looking for AT ALL. I am a 25 year old looking to enjoy casual dating experiences, like the ones I didn't get to enjoy in college. Actually, one of the reasons I am turned off by American women 24+ is that they start to become more marriage-minded. I want to just have a fun time with hot girls who don't expect me to commit to a long term relationship with them. And I feel like unless they are actually attracted to you, they won't be. I think that when women date guys they are not attracted to, they are either looking for a serious relationship or money.
Wrong forum - http://www.rooshv.com/
You're in sowing wild oats mode which is perfectly okay.
Here's the general problem with dating in America. Women especially halfway decent looking women are always comparing you to the last/next guy.
For example, women will have a bad experience with nice guy, so they'll start looking for more douchebag types, this so-called "Edge" they are looking for.
You rarely have women overseas looking for an guy with an edge and even so those women are easily spotted.
Women who are used to dating douchebags have a hard time looking for nice guys as they don't want the stereotypical "nice" guy who girls walk all over.
The minute you do something the douchebag would never think to do, they assume either you are that stereotypical nice guy or trying too hard to impress here, also a turnoff.
The final problem is the so-so looking women usually overweight or not very attractive without the help of heavy makeup and push-up bras; have an entitlement problem, I'm sure you have seen this.
My questions for you are -
1) Why did you struggle dating in college? It is assumed considering all the stuff that happens on campus, that if you can't get laid something is wrong with you. I will back that up by saying I have personally and my friends have gone onto college campuses, major colleges such as San Diego State and bang students with ease.
We're not even enrolled in those schools....
2) Assuming your out of college and are working a solid job, what are the problems now?
I will say based on some pretty solid research that if you're White and don't have some sort of advantage over the next guy, IE make 6 digits or better looking, you're going to have problems dating in America. Chances are you're being overlooked and at the same time aren't meeting enough women.
Dating in America is very much a numbers game. If you don't hit enough targets and the easiest way to do that is online, you won't have a large enough sampling to gauge what issues you have dating.
The owner of the web site is working on other projects and busy with the woman he met online so he doesn't update it very much, but the principles still apply.
You'll need to use marketing approaches with women here, first by identifying who your target is...
Frankly that is too much work to end up with a woman here especially if all you want to do is "date" (semi-committed relationship with sex).
So my suggestions are minimize your negatives. If you are short there isn't much you can do about it. But working out to have to be fit not muscle bound would also help. Learning to dance will also help, don't be the shy guy holding up the wall, have the confidence to ask a woman to dance because you can dance without the help of spirits.
Keep first dates super basic, f**k the women that call you cheap, who cares!
Finally I will close with this...
Women may not be getting bombed in real-time like they do online because the fear of rejection is strong for men.
You have two directions to go.
1) Join some type of social club and I don't mean 24hr Fitness. I am saying something cultural...
2) Check out that course and join a bunch of web sites.
3) If your in some god forsaken part of the country, MOVE!
Foreigners in China were so rare that there was a huge novelty factor at work. But really it came down to the numbers game as well. There are simply so many more people in China than anywhere else (asides from India I guess).
Kuala Lumpur was quite a big city, but the population was 25% less than my first Chinese gf's "small" Chinese city.
I struggled dating in college because the friends I hung out with weren't the types of guys who went out to places where I would have a chance to meet girls and I was somewhat reserved and didn't know how to go about meeting new friends. The few girls I did meet through my friends, I was not interested in.
Are you saying college girls are easier to get into bed than other women? I never really got that impression. Were you and your friends under 25 and somewhat good looking? Because if not, it would surprise me that you'd have an easy time banging college girls.
Well, I don't really have a solid job, and I am planning on going back to take more classes. But my problem now is really the same problem I had in college.
I'm confused by the bolded. Have you actually SEEN Eastern European women up close?
I'm guessing you haven't dated/been close friends with white American girls that are considered hot. When they take off their makeup, they look like shit, for the most part. Of course, there are exceptions, but these exceptions are few and far between.
Look man, I'm close to your age (26) and I've done as well as can be hoped for in the US. I did PUA for a long time and hooked up with a wide range of girls. Ever since I've been traveling overseas and talking to girls from those countries, my eyes have been opened.
I used to go clubbing many nights a week (and I used to have a good amount of success with women on those nights, more than most guys I know). Now, I just sit home, talk to girls from other countries, focus on my work, and save up for the day when I could actually move overseas. Yes, it's THAT much of a difference.
It should be said though that I've always planned on moving overseas, as I like to travel. I just never really knew exactly where until now.