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Americans in Movies vs. Real Life

Discuss culture, living, traveling, relocating, dating or anything related to North America. For those looking to relocate within the US or Canada, discuss your experiences and pros/cons of each domestic region.

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Americans in Movies vs. Real Life

Postby ladislav » Mon Dec 17, 2012 9:48 pm

Winston had a post about a year or two ago which I cannot find- buried too deep on this forum. But, basically, what he was saying is that Americans in movies look and act totally different from those you meet in real life. In movies you have warm, heroic, passionate and romantic people who are very open and expressive. They talk a mile a minute and are extremely friendly, always making eye contact. Americans in films are fun-loving and happy people, except for those brief moments when they combat injustice.

So, when you ask foreigners abroad , especially E/SE Asians about Americans, their faces light up with endearment:

"Oh, Ame-e-e-ricans! So warm, so open!, so-o- friendly. Unlike our people, the ( put some E/SE Asian nationality here)."

"Americans are bright- eyed and jovial people! Unlike us, the..."

"Americans are so expressive and emotional! So romantic! I wish I could have a great American boyfriend!"

When these foreigners arrive in America looking forward to meeting this super open and friendly, grinning race, the shock is often horrible. The Americans act, well...kind of like the British. They talk quietly or not at all, look aloof and mistrustful, mind their own business, no one talks to strangers; and it is so hard to make friends. They are not emotional or friendly at all. Most people just work, work, work and look tired and not " bright- eyed". And the majority is racist as hell, too, and does not like mingling with non- Anglos. Or any stranger, period.

"But I thought..."

As my Southern boss used to say:

"Then you thought like the biddy; who thought he'd fa*ted but sh*tted".

So, Winston was racking his brains over why it is like that.

I think I might have the answer.

When the USA was started, most settlers and immigrants were from Great Britain ( mostly English) and they wanted to build a new, better version of England. So, with all this melting pot and land of immigrants stuff being taught, the core of US culture is well, English. So, the people kind of use English behavior and values as models even though they do not realize it.

Hollywood otoh was started by Jewish refugees from the Russian Empire ( its provinces of Ukraine, Poland, Lithuania, Latvia; and some were actually from Russia proper). I was listening to one director speaking on this subject and he said that when those Jews arrived, they were expecting a whole different country and America did not turn out to be what they expected.

So, they went about creating a whole new on-screen America patterned after...shockingly- Russia ( or its colonies of Poland, Ukraine, the Baltics etc). In other words, they wanted to create a better Russian Empire on screen. The whole thing did shock me because I thought American characters acted very Russian/Slavic- romantic, free, intellectual, given to self oblivion and hedonism, believing in true love, and poetic.

Judging by the content of the movies, they wanted to see a new Russian Empire which would treat Jews as citizens and members of society ( in Russia they never were) and the Wild West with its villains riding through towns and people, including the Indians getting killed was basically the recreation of pogroms and the life in the Cossack Slavic land.

When characters spoke, not only they acted Russian/Slavic-like but they spoke fast and conveyed a lot of information in long verbal diarrhea bursts- this is how Jews speak and this is not how Anglos talk at all.

This slowly became a pattern and a tradition in Hollywood when writing scripts, and even non Jewish directors would be following it later simply because now it was an established norm. Making a movie about an average American who just works, works, works, who looks tired and is a man of very few words would be boring, too.

So, in the movies you basically had people who acted like Slavs and talked like Jews. Even if they looked like Tom Cruise.

So, Winston, this may be the reason behind it.
Last edited by ladislav on Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:41 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby abcdavid01 » Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:45 pm

Fascinating. I'm always more interested in interpretative history than history for its own sake.
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Re: Americans in Movies vs. in Real Life

Postby Banano » Tue Dec 18, 2012 1:03 am

ladislav wrote:Winston had a post about a year or two ago which I cannot find- buried too deep on this forum. But, basically, what he was saying is that Americans in movies look and act totally different from those you meet in real life. In movies you have warm, heroic, passionate and romantic people who are very open and expressive. They talk a mile a minute and are extremely friendly, always making eye contact. Americans in films are fun-loving and happy people, except for those brief moments when they combat injustice.

So, when you ask foreigners abroad , especially E/SE Asians about Americans, their faces light up with endearment:

"Oh, Ame-e-e-ricans! So warm, so open!, so-o- friendly. Unlike our people, the ( put some E/SE Asian nationality here)."

"Americans are bright- eyed and jovial people! Unlike us, the..."

"Americans are so expressive and emotional! So romantic! I wish I could have a great American boyfriend!"

When these foreigners arrive in America looking forward to meeting this super open and friendly, grinning race, the shock is often horrible. The Americans act, well...kind of like the British. They talk quietly or not at all, look aloof and mistrustful, mind their own business, no one talks to strangers; and it is so hard to make friends. They are not emotional or friendly at all. Most people just work, work, work and look tired and not " bright- eyed". And the majority is racist as hell, too, and does not like mingling with non- Anglos. Or any stranger, period.

"But I thought..."

As my Southern boss used to say:

"Then you thought like the biddy; who thought he'd fa*ted but sh*tted".

So, Winston was racking his brains over why it is like that.

I think I might have the answer.

When the USA was started, most settlers and immigrants were from Great Britain ( mostly English) and they wanted to build a new, better version of England. So, with all this melting pot and land of immigrants stuff being taught, the core of US culture is well, English. So, the people kind of use English behavior and values as models even though they do not realize it.

Hollywood otoh was started by Jewish refugees from the Russian Empire ( its provinces of Ukraine, Poland, Lithuania, Latvia; and some were actually from Russia proper). I was listening to one director speaking on this subject and he said that when those Jews arrived, they were expecting a whole different country and America did not turn out to be what they expected.

So, they went about creating a whole new on-screen America patterned after...shockingly- Russia ( or its colonies of Poland, Ukraine, the Baltics etc). In other words, they wanted to create a better Russian Empire on screen. The whole thing did shock me because I thought American characters acted very Russian/Slavic- romantic, free, intellectual, given to self oblivion and hedonism, believing in true love, and poetic.

Judging by the content of the movies, they wanted to see a new Russian Empire which would treat Jews as citizens and members of society ( in Russia they never were) and the Wild West with its villains riding through towns and people, including the Indians getting killed was basically the recreation of pogroms and the life in the Cossack Slavic land.

When characters spoke, not only they acted Russian/Slavic-like but they spoke fast and conveyed a lot of information in long verbal diarrhea bursts- this is how Jews speak and this is not how Anglos talk at all.

This slowly became a pattern and a tradition in Hollywood when writing scripts, and even non Jewish directors would be following it later simply because now it was an established norm. Making a movie about an average American who just works, works, works, who looks tired and is a man of very few words would be boring, too.

So, in the movies you basically had people who acted like Slavs and talked like Jews. Even if they looked like Tom Cruise.

So, Winston, this may be the reason behind it.




good analisys

'no one talks to strangers'..you could say nobody talks to neighbors, even if they do its superficial (weather topic)

Hollywoods powerfull mass propaganda factory created false image of American men and life in US..the rest of the world fell for it
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Re: Americans in Movies vs. in Real Life

Postby ladislav » Tue Dec 18, 2012 1:09 am

good analisys

'no one talks to strangers'..you could say nobody talks to neighbors, even if they do its superficial (weather topic)

Hollywoods powerfull mass propaganda factory created false image of American men and life in US..the rest of the world fell for it


But the real reason was probably because the Jews who came from Russia ( or its colonies) wanted to recreate Russia in movies to make America look like it was very similar to a Slavic country. Probably because they loved Russia so much. And they thought America would be an improved version of it. But it was just a very anal Protestant Puritanical convent. So, they made a simulation of what they wanted for the country to be like so that, at least on screen, they would feel at home.
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Re: Americans in Movies vs. in Real Life

Postby Jester » Tue Dec 18, 2012 2:00 am

ladislav wrote:But the real reason was probably because the Jews who came from Russia ( or its colonies) wanted to recreate Russia in movies to make America look like it was very similar to a Slavic country. Probably because they loved Russia so much.


I personally know of three cases of Russian and Ukrainian Jews who are not at all interested in Israel and look to Russia/Ukraine as their cherished homeland. All are grandkids of Jews who came here to escape civil war or Communism. Two of the three told me outright that their families experienced no oppression under the Tsar, and left only because of Communism.

All three are very very "Jewish", in appearance and mannerism. Two are religious, one an atheist.

Many of us, Jew and Gentile. have been lied to.
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Re: Americans in Movies vs. in Real Life

Postby Jester » Tue Dec 18, 2012 2:01 am

Jester wrote:
ladislav wrote:But the real reason was probably because the Jews who came from Russia ( or its colonies) wanted to recreate Russia in movies to make America look like it was very similar to a Slavic country. Probably because they loved Russia so much.


I personally know of three cases of Russian and Ukrainian Jews who are not at all interested in Israel and look to Russia/Ukraine as their cherished homeland. All are grandkids of Jews who came here to escape civil war or Communism. Two of the three told me outright that their families experienced no oppression under the Tsar, and left only because of Communism.

All three are very very "Jewish", in appearance and mannerism. Two are religious, one an atheist.

Many of us, Jew and Gentile, have been lied to.
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Re: Americans in Movies vs. in Real Life

Postby Jester » Tue Dec 18, 2012 2:16 am

ladislav wrote:
Hollywood otoh was started by Jewish refugees from the Russian Empire ( its provinces of Ukraine, Poland, Lithuania, Latvia; and some were actually from Russia proper). I was listening to one director speaking on this subject and he said that when those Jews arrived, they were expecting a whole different country and America did not turn out to be what they expected.

So, they went about creating a whole new on-screen America patterned after...shockingly- Russia ( or its colonies of Poland, Ukraine, the Baltics etc). In other words, they wanted to create a better Russian Empire on screen. The whole thing did shock me because I thought American characters acted very Russian/Slavic- romantic, free, intellectual, given to self oblivion and hedonism, believing in true love, and poetic.

Judging by the content of the movies, they wanted to see a new Russian Empire which would treat Jews as citizens and members of society ( in Russia they never were) and the Wild West with its villains riding through towns and people, including the Indians getting killed was basically the recreation of pogroms and the life in the Cossack Slavic land.

When characters spoke, not only they acted Russian/Slavic-like but they spoke fast and conveyed a lot of information in long verbal diarrhea bursts- this is how Jews speak and this is not how Anglos talk at all.

This slowly became a pattern and a tradition in Hollywood when writing scripts, and even non Jewish directors would be following it later simply because now it was an established norm. Making a movie about an average American who just works, works, works, who looks tired and is a man of very few words would be boring, too.

So, in the movies you basically had people who acted like Slavs and talked like Jews. Even if they looked like Tom Cruise.

So, Winston, this may be the reason behind it.


+1.

HA rules. Free speech, freedom, romance... and now film criticism. YES. I have seen Russian films, and yes, Hollywood from the 1920's to the 1940's did indeed reflect Russian romanticism and sentimentality.

Congratulations in using your eyes for original observation, rather than blindly accepting conventional wisdom.

BTW, for the record, I do enjoy the terse, laconic Teutonic/Spartan/Aryan/cowboy speech of a character like Dirty Harry or The Man With No Name in "A Fistful of Dollars". But as you state, early Hollywood was quite romantic, quite different.

I remember a statement by the child/adult actor (and MGTOW ;) ) Robert Blake, who said he missed "the JEWISH quality" of old Hollywood films. I thought he was just kind of being nostalgic while also genuflecting to/kissing Hollywood-Jewish ass. But now based on your post, I can see he was right.

I guess "Casablanca", everyone's favorite movie, would be a great example of what you're talking about. Windy Jewish speeches, tragic Slavic sentimentality, White (and Black) faces.
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Re: Americans in Movies vs. in Real Life

Postby ladislav » Tue Dec 18, 2012 4:47 am

Jester wrote:
ladislav wrote:. All are grandkids of Jews who came here to escape civil war or Communism. Two of the three told me outright that their families experienced no oppression under the Tsar, and left only because of Communism.

All three are very very "Jewish", in appearance and mannerism. Two are religious, one an atheist.

Many of us, Jew and Gentile. have been lied to.


Well, it is as luck would turn out. Some places were pogromized and some were not. It is the same with any minorities. Look at the Chinese in Indonesia- on many occasions, in many/ some places, hundreds and thousands of Chinese were subjected to looting and got killed, raped, etc, and in some places- they were not. This is where we get to the it-never-happened-to-me-therefore-all-is-cool-fallacy.

Some Jews did get lucky but some 2.5 million Jews migrated over to the US when the czars started passing decree after decree against them and sicking brigades of rioters to kill and maim them, so these ran away and set up Israel precisely because of the horrible pogroms, murders but primarily- no nationality given, enormous travel restrictions, quotas at universities, no future at all, etc.

Not every black person in the US was slave either, some had pretty good lives. But exceptions to the rule do not a rule disprove.

Also keep in mind that pogroms did not happen every day and there would be a lull that may last 50 years in which Jews would be left alone. And, some czars would allow some Jews to take important places- especially rich ones at banks, even in gov't offices. The ones who were willing to kiss a--and ingratiate. But the key word was 'some'. The majority lived like rats there.

So over 2 million people leaving their country of birth does not happen just like that. Of course, they loved the place where they were born, spent their childhood and grew up in, etc. But what if those countries want them out? Again, as I said, not all suffered the same fate. Some did not- for this or that reason- they were living in a less anti Semitic place, they looked less Jewish- some also had friends in high places, etc. But in the case of majority, they were treated as undesirable Middle Eastern aliens and were told to leave the empire.

You can love the country all you want but if it does not love you , what can you do?

Ukraine is a different place now, so is Russia and Poland. Now they have other minorities to take it out on.

Code: Select all
BTW, for the record, I do enjoy the terse, laconic Teutonic/Spartan/Aryan/cowboy speech of a character like Dirty Harry or The Man With No Name in "A Fistful of Dollars". But as you state, early Hollywood was quite romantic, quite different.

I remember a statement by the child/adult actor (and MGTOW Wink ) Robert Blake, who said he missed "the JEWISH quality" of old Hollywood films. I thought he was just kind of being nostalgic while also genuflecting to/kissing Hollywood-Jewish a**. But now based on your post, I can see he was right.


Later Hollywood movies would have to appeal to the now middle class working classes and these could not relate go the Euro-Jewish maudliness and intellectualism while the richer older aristocracy in the US appreciated them more.

Also, as the US education waned and the people became dumber and dumber, they would be turned off by the gayish Jewish long-windedness and Slavic sensuality. They could no longer relate to it. So people like Bruce Willis and later Paul Wahlberg became famous- swaggering working class thugs who, with violence and just a few words here and there would be making money, getting the gal and saving humanity.
An Iron Jawed Germanic person like Mr. Damon in Bourne Conspiracy would be their hero.

The Jewish character was still there, for a long time, though. Look at "Friends", for example or Three's Company, WKRP in Cincinnatti. M.J Fox, etc. Very Jewish.
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Re: Americans in Movies vs. in Real Life

Postby Jester » Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:20 am

ladislav wrote:
Well, it is as luck would turn out. Some places were pogromized and some were not. It is the same with any minorities. Look at the Chinese in Indonesia- on many occasions, in many/ some places, hundreds and thousands of Chinese were subjected to looting and got killed, raped, etc, and in some places- they were not. This is where we get to the it-never-happened-to-me-therefore-all-is-cool-fallacy.

Some Jews did get lucky but some 2.5 million Jews migrated over to the US when the czars started passing decree after decree against them and sicking brigades of rioters to kill and maim them, so these ran away and set up Israel precisely because of the horrible pogroms, murders but primarily- no nationality given, enormous travel restrictions, quotas at universities, no future at all, etc.

Not every black person in the US was slave either, some had pretty good lives. But exceptions to the rule do not a rule disprove.

Also keep in mind that pogroms did not happen every day and there would be a lull that may last 50 years in which Jews would be left alone. And, some czars would allow some Jews to take important places- especially rich ones at banks, even in gov't offices. The ones who were willing to kiss a--and ingratiate. But the key word was 'some'. The majority lived like rats there.

So over 2 million people leaving their country of birth does not happen just like that. Of course, they loved the place where they were born, spent their childhood and grew up in, etc. But what if those countries want them out? Again, as I said, not all suffered the same fate. Some did not- for this or that reason- they were living in a less anti Semitic place, they looked less Jewish- some also had friends in high places, etc. But in the case of majority, they were treated as undesirable Middle Eastern aliens and were told to leave the empire.


As I have stated elsewhere, since the foul attempt by hate-filled Jews, in the U.S. and Israel, to frame Ukrainian-American Ivan Demjanjuk, with multiple Jews captured on camera giving murderous, false testimony, I no longer believe any allegations of past persecution by Jews.

Regarding Soviet sources, I listen but do not believe. They tell some truths, and they tell some whopping lies. Same with Anglo-American sources.

I DO believe oral history, passed down from person to person. My own family sources have always checked out. So if your report of pogroms is based on oral history from those in your own family, not history taught in Soviet schools, and not Jewish propaganda movies about Feivel the Mouse etc., then I would be prepared to believe you.



ladislav wrote:
You can love the country all you want but if it does not love you , what can you do?



Indeed a great many of us feel that way now.

ladislav wrote:
Later Hollywood movies would have to appeal to the now middle class working classes and these could not relate go the Euro-Jewish maudliness and intellectualism while the richer older aristocracy in the US appreciated them more.

Also, as the US education waned and the people became dumber and dumber, they would be turned off by the gayish Jewish long-windedness and Slavic sensuality. They could no longer relate to it. So people like Bruce Willis and later Paul Wahlberg became famous- swaggering working class thugs who, with violence and just a few words here and there would be making money, getting the gal and saving humanity.
An Iron Jawed Germanic person like Mr. Damon in Bourne Conspiracy would be their hero.

The Jewish character was still there, for a long time, though. Look at "Friends", for example or Three's Company, WKRP in Cincinnatti. M.J Fox, etc. Very Jewish.


The audience grew dumber and coarser, yes. But the intellectuals also threw off constraints. Jewish studios used to produce movies that would pass muster with Christian/Catholic censors. Without censorship, and without studio control, we got depressing garbage, beginning in the late 40's, accelerating in the 50's, ubiquitous in the 60's. Film noir, glorification of adultery and rape, tough guys rather than heroes, etc.

What I am saying is that those Russified Jews did their best work when constrained by Christian values.
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Postby ladislav » Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:06 pm

Yes and also, in the USSR they were constrained by Slavic values and by Communism. Kind of similar. There were some differences, though. You can see quite a few old Hollywood movies with actors who look very Semitic - very Jewish but who would sport English names.

Now, the Slavs are not as uninformed and they would not buy anything like that- a curly, long nosed Semite with a name like Ivan Smirnoff won't fly- the Slavs' eyes are much sharper. They did have 'some' token Jewish actors provided they did not look too Semitic and were not too dark. A Paul Michael Glaser look would not be acceptable there, Joan Rivers- maybe. The names would also have to be changed- they would not want an Abraham Goldstein on the screen but they would also not want them to have pure Slavic names so they kept it somewhere in between. Like Mark Bernes, for example.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zsYzpL-29aI[/youtube]

Here is a clip from The Shining Path- a number one Soviet Propaganda Film. Do notice that bar the language and the ambience, the actors look almost like Hollywood ones. And the main protagonist must be a blond Scandinavian- the blood of the Rus' vikings.
Note how maudlin she acts.
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Postby Billy » Wed Dec 19, 2012 11:20 am

no i don´t know. mr. s put down a map of emotional counries. there the anglo countries were often the most emotional. only topped by some sa countries and pi.

though the work ethic is pretty strong with the americans the entertainment traits are also very strong. i think it comes from the different cultures. not only with the jews but also with the many different other cultures. for example the italian and roman element is maybe a great factor. from itallo western to robert de niro and al pacino there are many elements which make the american cinema and the personal traits of americans so successful.

people from "normal" countries will always feel one sided. the american culture is universal so everybody can relate to it.

movies like "tango and cash", "beverly hills cop", "bud spencer and terence hill", "a-team" represant the mix where everybody can relate.

in the best case the person has all the povitive traits. at worse vice versa...

so americans rule....
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Postby Winston » Wed Dec 19, 2012 3:12 pm

Ladislav, are you referring to this post:

http://www.happierabroad.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8955

You could have found it by entering "Americans in movies vs real life" in the Google search box above. That's how I found it.
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Postby Globus » Thu Dec 20, 2012 7:06 am

Movies have to portray American as friendly sociable and interesting people because if they were portrayed like they actually are the movies would be boring and depressing.
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Postby ladislav » Sun Dec 23, 2012 12:31 am

I DO believe oral history, passed down from person to person. My own family sources have always checked out. So if your report of pogroms is based on oral history from those in your own family, not history taught in Soviet schools, and not Jewish propaganda movies about Feivel the Mouse etc., then I would be prepared to believe you.


Pogroms have been widespread everywhere and against many groups. Some stark examples would be the anti Chinese ones in CA in the 1860es. People pulled out of their houses and killed by whites. The same goes for what happened to Koreans in Japan after a big earthquake in the early 1900s. Some 100,000 Koreans were killed because someone spread the rumor that they were poisoning the water. And the police and the army joined in the killing.

The same happened in Indonesia in 1997-8. The Chinese in many parts of the country were killed, raped, maimed, etc.

Then you had anti German pogroms in E Europe which actually gave Hitler the excuse to invade Czechoslovakia.

In most of those cases, pogroms were against people who were citizens and /or who were born and raised in the country.

Pogroms against Jews happened in the Russian empire on a regular basis and are well documented by local writers well before Soviets.

Chmelnitzky led many pogroms in Ukraine against the Poles and the Jews, not just the Jews and would skin Polish Catholic priests alive.

Attacks against white farmers in S Africa by groups of blacks are in fact pogroms. And ethnic cleansing in Yugoslavia was one big pogrom, too. With the help of he military.

But does it mean that every Serb pogromized every Croat and Bosniak and vice versa and at all times? No. There were places/time periods in those countries where/when massacres did not happen and where/when everyone lived in peace. Tesla for one, was Serbian by blood but he was born in Croatia. If you ask him about pogroms, he would say- "nothing like that ever happened to me". And he would probably look to Croatia as his motherland/homeland,

Others, who were in the wronger place in a wronger time, are now 6 feet under in that "homeland". Go and see the mass graves.

A very common occurrence in history, indeed.

So, just because these pogroms happened, it does not mean that they happened in every place in that country and that they happened to every single hated minority person who lived in that country. Some places were spared and nothing happened there.

So, you can meet Chinese people from Indonesia who were not in the critical area at the time and the locals did not bother them. Same with the Chinese on the W. Coast. Not everyone was killed or treated badly during that time. Some people were in some other place where things were going OK. So, if you meet them, they will say:

"Nothing like that ever happened to me".

This, however, does not nullify the sufferings and the deaths of people to whom it did happen and who were in a different area.
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Postby ladislav » Sun Dec 23, 2012 12:44 am

Winston wrote:Ladislav, are you referring to this post:

http://www.happierabroad.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8955

You could have found it by entering "Americans in movies vs real life" in the Google search box above. That's how I found it.


I did so in the search window. It did not come up. Or I did not see it among many many threads that came up.
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