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Has Hitler been overly demonized and misportrayed?

If you're a history buff, love to talk about history and watch the History Channel, this is the board for that.

Moderators: jamesbond, fschmidt

Re: Has Hitler been overly demonized beyond what he deserves

Postby droid » Mon Dec 14, 2015 1:19 am

Winston wrote:
fschmidt wrote:So should my dogs spend their time seeking truth or watching for intruders and barking at them? The average person is not significantly brighter than my dogs, so why should the answer be different for them? The average person is capable of working in a factory, but not finding truth.
The road to hell is paved by morons seeking truth. In a stable sane society, morons just accept traditions that worked for their ancestors.


So are you saying that it's better to be a dumb ignorant conformist who just follows tradition than a truth seeker? Do you not mind living in falsehoods and lies?


fschmidt set a semi straw man trap and you fell for it Winston. He postulated truth-seeker=moron.
Nobody is talking about the average person seeking truth. It's about Winston's OP and following a logical discussion and trying to acquire further information.

"In a stable sane society, morons just accept traditions that worked for their ancestors"

Thus an appreciation for NS traditionalism for the masses is logical, as opposed to morons seeking marxist "progress". See the logic?

fschmidt wrote: One should know math through calculus. Then study the sciences: physics, chemistry, and biology. And then comes history which can only be learned from primary sources. Secondary sources, like those you linked to in this thread, are worthless.


Calculus, math and other exact sciences, agree with that as they can be proved experimentally. But history is subjective and you sneak some deception here, I presume because of your obvious personal bias :wink: "Primary sources"? LMAO we all now which ones those are. You're either acting in good faith here and your logic is failing, or you are deliberately trying to swindle.
1)Too much of one thing defeats the purpose.
2)Everybody is full of it. What's your hypocrisy?
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Re: Has Hitler been overly demonized beyond what he deserves

Postby Winston » Tue Dec 15, 2015 5:42 pm

fschmidt wrote:
Winston wrote:So are you saying that it's better to be a dumb ignorant conformist who just follows tradition than a truth seeker?


For most people, yes. Tradition is likely to be closer to truth than the conclusions of an individual who is stupid or ignorant. If you want to seek truth as an individual, you must make sure that you have adequate intelligence and knowledge first.

I would say that the minimum intelligence should be the Mensa standard of being in the upper 2%. Intelligence is not static, it can be raised. Physical exercise is the first requirement, to make your mind active enough. Then comes mental exercise like math, chess, or Go.

Once one has adequate intelligence, one should start gaining knowledge. One should know math through calculus. Then study the sciences: physics, chemistry, and biology. And then comes history which can only be learned from primary sources. Secondary sources, like those you linked to in this thread, are worthless. After learning history, one is ready to start studying religion which is the last thing one should study.

All this is a lot of work, and isn't necessary for most people. Most people should simply pick an existing tradition and follow that.


Yes many traditions work for the masses. But what about stupid modern customs like having to buy a diamond ring in order to get engaged or married? That's a stupid 20th Century custom created by the diamond cartel and its marketers, which is totally unnecessary and a waste of a man's money and didn't exist before the 20th Century. Do you advocate following customs like that? Or the stupid 18th Century European tradition of pistol duels to settle personal feuds between two men? Do you support stuff like that? Or what about the Medieval feudal traditions where the peasant classes were oppressed and impoverished? Or the Catholic tradition of executing people who spoke out against it? Etc?

These are extreme examples, but you see what I mean. I'm sure most traditions were wise and based on good sound reason though. But don't you think that some traditions are outdated? Shouldn't you evaluate this on a case by case basis?

What? You don't need to be in the Mensa standard of being in the top 2 percent of intelligence to be a critical thinker or to study history or to read source documents. All you need is common sense and awareness and basic education in reading and writing. Besides, there are different types of intelligence. The education system considers students who memorize information quickly and repeats them on tests to be intelligent. Critical thinking intelligence is different from simple rote memorization. There is also the factor of awareness, wisdom, intuition and being able to see the big picture, etc. Some are also able to see through bullshit and are not brainwashable. Some are just misfits and so they are looking to embrace anything alternative.

It also depends on who you listen to and who you read. If you listen to the government, you will have different knowledge and intelligence than someone who listens to alternative sources like David Icke. Both sources contain truths and falsehoods, but have very different views of the world.

I don't agree with you though, that one has to study math, science, calculus, chemistry, etc. to be a truth seeker or critical thinker. On what logic do you say that? In reality, most people are only good in one or two subjects. You don't need to study so many left-brained subjects to be a critical thinker. All you need is common sense. On the contrary, those who study so many textbook subjects will be left-brained memorization machines and end up simply believing in whatever bullshit the establishment tells them. So you got that wrong.

All you need is a little wisdom, common sense, awareness, ability to think and reason for yourself, and not be too stupid. What's wrong with that? Also, you should know that very often, truth is stranger than fiction, and many truths are hidden, so as a truth seeker learns more and more things, he or she will appear to be crazy in the eyes of the ignorant masses. Did you take that into account?

Excuse me but the sources I cited above were PRIMARY sources. For example, the book "Mein Side" I posted above was of Hitler's own words and speeches that the Western media NEVER lets you hear. They were of Hitler's words himself. His own words definitely constitute a PRIMARY SOURCE. Don't you think? So then yes, that is a valid primary source to study, in order to determine the truth of what he said, and if he has been misportrayed by Western official history. Don't you see the obvious logic in that?

I know you have a bias against Hitler and the Nazis. But come on now. Be fair. Don't you agree that it's wrong and unfair to only present one side of the WWII story? Why do you advocate that only one side be told?

Also, Jewish elites and insiders such as Benjamin Freedman and Henry Ford have exposed what really happened during WWI and WWII. They ran in elite circles and were insiders. So they would have had access to primary sources and been in the know. Doesn't that matter to you? So why not listen to what they have to say and read their books on the matter?

You don't need to be a math genius to read their books or just to study history or even to study what different people have said. Right? Average intelligence is enough to read books on both sides. So again, your statements aren't logical. Can you please explain your logic?

Are you advocating that we just believe the official version of WWII, that the Nazis and Axis Powers were the bad guys trying to take over the world and the Allies were the good guys that saved the world from their tyranny. Etc? And that's that? Do you advocate such a cartoonish version of history?

Also, do you not believe that lies should be exposed? For example, any critical thinker knows that the claim of 6 million Jews dying in the Holocaust was exaggerated. In fact, the 6 million number was thrown around in World War One as a Jewish casualty figure and even in the 1800s, because 6 million is a Jewish Kabbalah number. Didn't you know that? Are you less educated than conspiracy researchers about the Jewish Kabbalah? So that number is obviously a gross exaggeration and lie. So why do you not agree that it should not be propagated anymore? Don't you have a moral conscience against lying? Especially since you are advocating that society return to traditional moral values based on religion?

Please explain honestly, logically and clearly. Thanks.
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Re: Has Hitler been overly demonized beyond what he deserves

Postby fschmidt » Tue Dec 15, 2015 9:15 pm

By "a tradition" I mean a complete cultural tradition, not just one custom. As I have said many times, most people are no more capable of finding truth than my dogs are, so they shouldn't try. You haven't provided any evidence that the average person is capable of finding truth.

Science is important because it teaches logical thinking. No one who has studied science would believe such nonsense as the earth being flat. Anyone who believes that the earth is flat has proven himself to be totally out of touch with reality, and I pay no attention to his other beliefs.

Yes "Mein Side" is a primary source. I am glad you at least included one. Of course modern superficial culture distorts Hitler as it distorts everything. I don't really care since my view of Hitler is based on Mein Kampf and so I think my view is fairly accurate.

I have no reason to believe that the Holocaust number of 6 million is wrong, but I haven't researched the question. One reason I haven't bothered is that most Holocaust deniers are long-winded conspiracy idiots. If someone presented a concise logical argument against the 6 million number, I would consider it.
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Re: Has Hitler been overly demonized beyond what he deserves

Postby OutWest » Wed Dec 16, 2015 12:19 am

fschmidt wrote:By "a tradition" I mean a complete cultural tradition, not just one custom. As I have said many times, most people are no more capable of finding truth than my dogs are, so they shouldn't try. You haven't provided any evidence that the average person is capable of finding truth.

Science is important because it teaches logical thinking. No one who has studied science would believe such nonsense as the earth being flat. Anyone who believes that the earth is flat has proven himself to be totally out of touch with reality, and I pay no attention to his other beliefs.

Yes "Mein Side" is a primary source. I am glad you at least included one. Of course modern superficial culture distorts Hitler as it distorts everything. I don't really care since my view of Hitler is based on Mein Kampf and so I think my view is fairly accurate.

I have no reason to believe that the Holocaust number of 6 million is wrong, but I haven't researched the question. One reason I haven't bothered is that most Holocaust deniers are long-winded conspiracy idiots. If someone presented a concise logical argument against the 6 million number, I would consider it.


You have far more patience than I have...
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Re: Has Hitler been overly demonized beyond what he deserves

Postby Winston » Mon Dec 21, 2015 10:56 pm

fschmidt wrote:By "a tradition" I mean a complete cultural tradition, not just one custom. As I have said many times, most people are no more capable of finding truth than my dogs are, so they shouldn't try. You haven't provided any evidence that the average person is capable of finding truth.

Science is important because it teaches logical thinking. No one who has studied science would believe such nonsense as the earth being flat. Anyone who believes that the earth is flat has proven himself to be totally out of touch with reality, and I pay no attention to his other beliefs.

Yes "Mein Side" is a primary source. I am glad you at least included one. Of course modern superficial culture distorts Hitler as it distorts everything. I don't really care since my view of Hitler is based on Mein Kampf and so I think my view is fairly accurate.

I have no reason to believe that the Holocaust number of 6 million is wrong, but I haven't researched the question. One reason I haven't bothered is that most Holocaust deniers are long-winded conspiracy idiots. If someone presented a concise logical argument against the 6 million number, I would consider it.


Can you give an example of a complete cultural tradition? There are many traditions. Some are oppressive and unnecessary. You can't say that all traditions are good.

I'm not sure you can say that most people are incapable of finding truth. Perhaps they are just not interested in truth. Have you considered that? Most people don't like heavy deep subjects. They just want food, comfort, a job, a family, etc. They prefer to watch sports or something light hearted like a comedy.

But conspiracies aren't anything complicated that a person of average intelligence can't understand. A conspiracy is merely an organized plot by powerful people, which is very realistic and plausible. Why is that too hard for average people to understand. It isn't. Why are you trying to make it out to be more complicated than it is? That's not logical.

Even George Carlin ridiculed your position when he said in his comedy acts that it's stupid to disbelieve that powerful people can get together and organize a plan. Even he had more common sense than you. Why?

The flat earth thing is another topic and you do not have a basis of using it to discredit anyone when you have done no research in it. You don't have evidence of a ball earth and neither you nor anyone else have provided evidence for one, even though you've been challenged to provide evidence many times. On the other hand, there is a lot of evidence for a flat earth that outweighs the evidence for a ball earth. That's the bottom line. The details are listed in the flat earth thread here. Again, you should humble yourself and not have that typical American know-it-all attitude of the male ego.

Science is not about ridicule. It's about logically weighing the evidence on both sides or the evidence for a theory and testing it. You haven't done any of that. So you should not talk about science.

Well if you read Mein Kampf, then you should know that it does not make Hitler out to be a villain like he is portrayed. It is not mostly filled with anti-Jewish rhetoric that you might expect. It is mostly a criticism of the German aristocracy. If you read it, you'd know that.
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Re: Has Hitler been overly demonized beyond what he deserves

Postby Winston » Mon Dec 21, 2015 10:57 pm

Fschmidt,
The 6 million victims of the Holocaust claim was mentioned long ago in the Holocaust threads here. See these links that make it obvious why that number is exaggerated. Even Europeans no longer believe in the 6 million victims claim. Only delusion Americans still do (like you?).

https://www.stormfront.org/forum/t790421/

Ten proofs against Six Million Jews murdered in ‘the Holocaust’

1. The actual number of Jews under German regime never exceeded 4.5 million.
2. Jewish-stated numbers of Jews in the World before and after the War.
3. Demographic impossibility phenomenon: number of Jews before and after the War.
4. Jews emigrated and taking refuge to the Soviet Union.
5. An empirical-statistical approach.
6. Number of Jews who applied for survivor pensions.
7. Retro calculation survivors 1945, based on the number of living survivors in 2004.
8. Unproven "gas chambers" and "mass gassings”.
9. Lack of remains, mass graves and ash quantities make ‘Six Million’ implausible.
10. Ratio of Jews killed in camps/elsewhere.


Scanned copies of MANY newspaper clippings alleging to "6 million Jewish victims" BEFORE World War II:

https://www.stormfront.org/forum/blogs/u136272-e3168/
http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/?p=24369

Some examples:

1902-
The tenth edition of Encyclopedia Britannica (under its entry on 'anti-semitism') references "six million Jews" of Rumania and Russia being "systematically degraded"

Image

1905-
A Jewish preacher declares that if the (Jewish-led) Communist uprising in Russia succeeds in overthrowing the Czarist government, Zionism would no longer be needed

Image

1906-
A Jewish publicist cries wolf to (ironically enough) GERMANY that there was an impending Holocaust of "six million Jews" in Russia during the aftermath of the first Communist uprising there. This lame sob story was nothing more than a ploy to cover up the fact that the Communist uprising that took place in Russia a year earlier (1905) was the handiwork of his fellow Jews who perpetrated widespread atrocities against Russian patriots (anti-Communists) who didn't want a despotic Judeo-Bolshevist government.

Image

1910-
In the American Jewish Committee's annual report it is claimed that since 1890 Russia has had a policy to 'expel or exterminate' six million of its Jews.

Image

1919-
Shortly after WW1 Jews claim a Holocaust of "six million Jews". It doesn't fly too far, nobody buys it.

Image

Image

Image

1921-
White Russian patriots gain ground on the Jewish Bolshevik usurpers of their nation. In a vein attempt to disguise their heavy involvement in murderous Bolshevism, Jews reel out the "six million" myth once again.

Image



271 references to 6,000,000 Jews prior to the Nuremberg Trial announcement
http://winstonsmithministryoftruth.blogspot.com/2012/02/145-references-to-6000000-jews-prior-to.html

Image

Could this be the reason for the 6 million number?
http://www.thebirdman.org/Index/Jews/Jews-History&ScripturalOriginOfThe6MillionNumber.html

Finally, here is the 1933 newspaper announcement that the Jews had declared war on Germany that you wanted to see. So you see, the Jews declared war on Germany FIRST, not the other way around as you've been led to misbelieve. They called for a boycott of German goods too.

Image
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Re: Has Hitler been overly demonized beyond what he deserves

Postby Winston » Wed May 04, 2016 8:06 am

Why Hitler Wasn't Evil - In this video, a little girl explains why Hitler was a great man and a good man, and why what you've heard about him are nothing but lies.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnSHToaGRF8[/youtube]
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Re: Has Hitler been overly demonized beyond what he deserves

Postby Eric » Wed May 04, 2016 1:26 pm

Anyone who claims that you're an idiot or longwinded and refuses on those grounds to debate you or to see/hear your side of an argument (on the holocaust) - is a Kosher certified moron. They instantly become a fool, thinking themselves wise.

America is full of these Kosher certified idiots. You'd think they put it in the water - but it's really just years of destructive education.
Try admitting that you have trouble facing reality, that might be a little more accurate?

Don't waste your time with people who are fools, they will never increase in anything.

fschmidt has such an aversion to reality, he wants to escape to a Mennonite camp to avoid anything that remotely contradicts his world view. Any normal person can see how insane that is, but let him do it.
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Re: Has Hitler been overly demonized beyond what he deserves

Postby Moretorque » Sat May 07, 2016 6:41 pm

Actually I used to fall for the divide and conquer garbage erected to herd us. Our rulers have all this set up the way they do to deflect all attention away from the fact they get everything for free and rule the world with a dishonest counterfeiting operation....

"Allow me to issue the currency and I care who not makes the laws"

They figured this long ago and most are still to stupid to figure.
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Re: Has Hitler been overly demonized and misportrayed?

Postby Winston » Tue Jun 21, 2016 10:05 am

Here's a shocker. Did you know that Napoleon Bonaparte, who conquered Europe a century prior to Hitler, was also demonized and mischaracterized by history for similar reasons that Hitler was. See the book description below.

https://www.amazon.com/Napoleon-Old-New-World-Orders/dp/1523257067/

Image

Napoleon vs the Old and New World Orders: How the Rothschilds Conquered Britain & France

We all know, at least vaguely, the story about Napoleon Bonaparte. You know -- the one about the self-professed son of a republican revolution against monarchy, who then installed himself as a monarch. Napoleon was, we are told, an egomaniacal tyrant with "short man's inferiority complex" who tried to enslave the European continent. Led by the brave British, a coalition of “The Good Guys" banded together to thwart the ambitions of the great “usurper” and trouble-maker of Europe. There is just one problem with this official narrative of the giant historical figure of the 1800’s. To put it gently – it’s a damn lie. (surprise – surprise). Now, one can easily understand the reason for the propagation of lies and slanders aimed at Napoleon being perpetuated by the entrenched monarchies of Europe at the time. Quite simply, Napoleon’s philosophical vision of good governance (which we will explore later on) posed a direct threat to their ‘Old World Order’ of running things. Oddly enough, long after the old monarchies have either gone extinct or been neutered, the name of Napoleon Bonaparte still carries a negative, though diminished, stink to it. This seems very strange – that is until we realize that the forces behind the ‘New World Order’, which were already in operation at the time, had just as much reason to oppose Napoleon as the old Royal Houses of Europe, such as the International Bourbon Family, did. You see, Napoleon, like the early Illuminati / Jacobin Reds may have opposed the Vatican-affiliated French Monarchy, but unlike the controlled agents of the Rothschild New World Order gang, Napoleon was not an anti-Church atheistic Jacobin per-Communist by any means – not even close! Indeed, had Napoleon been able to withstand the numerous coalitions arrayed against him, both the ‘Old World Order’ and the “New World Order’ would have been put “out of business” a long time ago. And that is why this illustrated historical summary is titled: ‘Napoleon vs the Old and New World Orders’. Enjoy the show.

About the Author

M. S. King is a private investigative journalist and researcher based in the New York City area. A 1987 graduate of Rutgers University, King's subsequent 30 year career in Marketing & Advertising has equipped him with a unique perspective when it comes to understanding how "public opinion" is indeed scientifically manufactured. Madison Ave marketing acumen combines with 'City Boy' instincts to make M.S. King one of the most tenacious detectors of "things that don’t add up" in the world today. Says King of his admitted quirks, irreverent disdain for "conventional wisdom", and uncanny ability to ferret out and weave together important data points that others miss: "Had Sherlock Holmes been an actual historical personage, I would have been his reincarnation." Among other works, King is also the author of: • The Bad War: The Truth Never Taught About World War 2 • Planet Rothschild (2 Volumes): Forbidden History of the New World Order • The War Against Putin: What the Government-Media Complex Isn’t Telling You About Russia. • The REAL Roosevelts: An Omitted History King’s website is TomatoBubble.com and his Author page at Amazon.com is ‘M S King’. His other interests include: the Animal Kingdom, philosophy, chess, cooking, literature and history (with emphasis on events of the late 19th through the 20th centuries).
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Re: Has Hitler been overly demonized and misportrayed?

Postby starchild5 » Thu Jun 23, 2016 6:46 am

But Winston...He was clearly a freemason, even look at the picture you provided....hands under the jacket..Is a freemasonic sign...How many of your picture or mine or any of the forum members picture has these sorts of weird photos. :)

Image

They are masters of manipulating, backdating history. Making good guys bad, bad guys good as humanity moves on.

Before knowing God. We must know Devil. People are easily fooled by devil because they really do not know how incredibly powerful he is.

These people who rule the world are NOT HUMAN. They are incredibly smart.

They can fool humanity easily as they control the past, they can do anything with past figures they created by subverting history.
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Re: Has Hitler been overly demonized and misportrayed?

Postby Winston » Tue Apr 18, 2017 12:41 pm

Wow look at all these happy photos of Hitler and the youth in Germany. How come you never see such photos in Western media? And listen to what the man says about what it was like to live in Germany under Hitler as a youth. It's very touching. A true paradise.

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Re: Has Hitler been overly demonized and misportrayed?

Postby Kradmelder » Tue Apr 18, 2017 12:53 pm

Anything or anyone good for white people, that didn't enrich jew banks, and that led to prosperity, must be crushed by the international cabal and demonised. Removing the jews from positions of control and choke points in the economy was Hitler's only move that led to war against him. But then again, if he hadn't done that Germany would have remained under crushing payments and hyper inflation while Hoggenheimer got rich.

What Hitler did would be like the USA ditching the Fed., removing citizens of Israel from the white house and charging them with espionage, and eliminating jew swindles like junk bonds, derivatives, money swaps and all other kikery adding no value and only funneling money to jews. Jews would declare total war against the USA.
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Re: Has Hitler been overly demonized and misportrayed?

Postby Wolfeye » Fri Apr 21, 2017 12:47 am

Well, right off the bat, him being vegetarian & all that is NOT a sign of not being brutal/violent/dictatorial. Plenty of what's now called "leftist" people are like that, just in a subtle way.

As for the Germans, in my opinion, they're not as intelligent as one might believe. They usually stick to an idea, even if it's a bad one- for instance. There actually seems to be a very heavy "thought termination addiction" with them. The situation of anything that shortens the cognitive processes being addictive to someone (whether it's blindly following orders, sizing something up as a cliche even when it's not, blindly trusting certification, even being supportive of contradictions & things that don't make sense- since it has that pleasant "zeroed out" feeling that comes with something cancelling itself out).
Another noticeable trait with the Germans is arrogance, which leads to them not catching their own mistakes (like it does for pretty much anyone anyone). Sometimes it's subtle, but not specifically announcing their sense of superiority is not the same thing as it not being there & a lot of things that Germany has done in the past 100 years or so ARE an arrogant thing to do, even if a self-compliment isn't included. It certainly seems like they're now trying to invade other countries by proxy & also seem to be building an army to do it.

The fact that 6 million Ukrainians died in the Holodomor & it wasn't mentioned nearly as much as the 6 million Jews that died in the Holocaust is appalling. The torture & extermination of the tribal people in America is mentioned less, as well. Iraq & other countries are "exceptions" to reality because America is, supposedly, an "exceptional" nation- "exceptional" to reality, I suppose is the presentation. There is no something happening yet not occurring, though. A major issue in America- it's like a kid lying with their fingers crossed!

I really believe there was a lot of malice & insanity involved in the Third Reich. It's not it's entirely unique to Germany. A point worth mentioning is that America got a lot of it's style of doing things from Prussia/Germany (even before any nazi scientists were imported), so they are potentially likely to do a lot of the same type of things.
America DOESN'T learn from its mistakes. America DOES have a very insular society. America IS frequently very arrogant & dictatorial- the government is known for it domestically AND internationally, but it's NOT rare that the people jump at the chance to push someone around if they feel they can do it with impunity. America DOES seem to have something of an obsession with having machines to do things for them AND with having the money (which translates into some kind of "ethical score") to get those machines. "Judgemental" & "workaholic" are synonymous with BOTH cultures & even though those AREN'T traits that are exclusive to them, they are COMMON traits. The tendency to OMIT DETAILS is a constant (with the Germans, it's about the "New Germans" - with the Americans, it's generally about law enforcement or medicine).
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Re: Has Hitler been overly demonized and misportrayed?

Postby Adama » Fri Apr 21, 2017 10:32 pm

Hitler let the British escape at Dunkirk and did nothing while Brits bombed the Germans in the dark for months. He was also very reluctant to fight back against Britain due to racial solidarity (in his mind) but at the expense of Germans.

Germany also had deals with American industrialists, like Prescott Bush and Henry Ford.

Now I do question whether Hitler was just playing a role or not.

The Germans also were taught and brainwashed into treating Hitler as a God, even giving him Christ's place as savior. They lived and died for Hitler, saying they would die for their savior.

But also, Germany and the Jews were working together for Israel. It is called the Haavara agreement. They were exporting Jews to Palestine at that time. So the Third Reich was working well with the Jews. Why would they do that if they were only going to mass murder them? That makes it seem more likely that they were working together than working against each other.
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