Chinese Men Looking West for Brides

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Mr S
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Chinese Men Looking West for Brides

Post by Mr S »

http://chinawatch.washingtonpost.com/20 ... g-west.php
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/usa/2010-1 ... 534334.htm

Chinese men looking West
By Tiffany Tan | November 11, 2010 | No Comments

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The supposed materialism of Chinese women is putting off some Chinese men and driving them into the arms of Western women. Tiffany Tan delves deeper

"Chinese man fancies Western woman" was the title of the personal ad Li Lei posted online, in which he asked if any Western "ladies (in Beijing) are open to a long-term and serious relationship with a Chinese guy". And by "long-term and serious", Li meant marriage.

Marriages between Chinese men and Western women in China are noticeably fewer than vice versa, so why is Li taking the road less traveled?

After studying for a combined five years in the Netherlands and United Kingdom, the 30-year-old Beijinger discovered he preferred the personality of Western European women. He considers them more independent than their Chinese counterparts, less girlish and more straightforward.

Li puts extra emphasis on the last attribute.

"That's something I really love. If they want something, they just tell you," he says in British-accented English, his boyish face lighting up. "Although it is the nature of a woman to want somebody to figure them out, the key factor is the degree."

Besides writing personals, the trading company project manager also participates in speed-dating parties with foreigners and frequents international networking events.

Tony, a 28-year-old native of Hunan who asked not to use his real name, is also keen on Western women.

After two serious relationships with Chinese women, in which he got exasperated trying to figure out the reason why his girlfriends got upset, he decided two years ago that a North American or European woman would suit him better.

"Let's adjust the preferences," he remembers thinking at that point. Tony has worked as a data analyst at a multinational company for five years and has regular interactions with female foreign co-workers.

Tony and Li's preference for Western women, the men say, is also due to the growing materialism of Chinese women and the pressure to provide a new apartment for one's bride-to-be.

"In this situation, a foreign girl will say, 'OK, we can marry first before we have a house. We can work together to buy a house. There's not so much pressure on you. Both of us can bear this,'" Tony says, citing conversations with female foreign acquaintances.

Li says the spotlight on newlyweds' possessions is something that "distorts love in China".

Li and Tony's taste in women may put them in the minority, but their numbers are growing as more foreign women come to China and more Chinese men learn foreign languages and experience life overseas.

Fishbowl Events, a Beijing group run by foreigners and known for its speed-dating parties, has observed a marked increase in male Chinese participants in the past few years.

"In 2007, we had about 20 percent Chinese men," says Ola Zdzarska, co-owner of Fishbowl. "Now it is 40 percent.

"Some of them are really focused on foreign girls. When I see (evaluation) cards after the speed dating, I see they don't take Chinese girls seriously, because they just want to date foreign girls."

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Tristin Tang and Christina Gabe with sons Aidan (from left), Bowen and Landan. [Provided to China Daily]

Tristin Tang, 35, never imagined dating a Westerner, much less marrying one. He was intent on completing his doctorate in pharmacology when he met the niece of his American language partner during a vacation to his home province of Sichuan, in 2005.

Five years later, he and Christina Gabe of Denver, Colorado, are married and raising three boys in Beijing.

Tang and Gabe, who say people often mistake them for an American tourist and her guide, display the comfort of being both lovers and friends.

"We are similar in a lot of ways," says Gabe, 33, a former US Peace Corps volunteer and now a high school English teacher. "We both have a very dry sense of humor We're both interested in science, like biology was my major."

Tang pipes in: "We also both like outdoor activities," such as biking, camping, hiking and playing soccer.

The couple says bridging cultural differences remains a challenge - such as how much clothing on a child is too much, and how to treat a cold - but this has made them more vigilant about communicating effectively.

"Knowing that we have two separate languages has sort of forced us and also made us communicate more, whereas if couples (speak) the same language, they just assume that things are understood," Gabe says. "In some ways, I think this has been a benefit."

The husband and wife are on the right track, based on the factors that psychologists say make a successful marriage.

"Every relationship is about curiosity and communication and openness to learn and a willingness to accept," says Dr Alfred Chambers, a relationship-counseling specialist at Beijing United Family Hospital and Clinics.

"But when there's different cultures, there's just more things to learn and so we need more curiosity and acceptance and patience," he says, stressing it is a life-long process.

Before a couple marries, Chambers says it is important to discuss crucial topics such as: roles and basic assumptions regarding parenting, money, sex and family, including in-laws.
Traditional roles and expectations are two reasons why there are fewer unions between Chinese men and Western women.

"A Western woman will not fit the traditional role of a Chinese wife," which includes being obedient to her husband and in-laws to give them face, says Chambers, who has worked in Taiwan and the mainland for a decade.

"Traditionally, a Chinese man will want a woman who is more submissive and listens and sort of follows her duties - whether it's cooking or sex," the clinical psychologist says. "Western women will be more open, aggressive, assertive sexually."

Men like Li Lei and Tony may be different in their dating outlook, but in other ways they are just your average Chinese guys.

Both are quite shy making new acquaintances. They have parents who would still prefer a Chinese daughter-in-law because of the language and culture gap.

And at the end of the day, each man just wants to find the woman who's right for him.
"The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane." Marcus Aurelius, Roman Emperor and stoic philosopher, 121-180 A.D.


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ladislav
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Post by ladislav »

The world has gone flip flop. Now, where exactly are these guys going?
A brain is a terrible thing to wash!
Repatriate
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Post by Repatriate »

ladislav wrote:The world has gone flip flop. Now, where exactly are these guys going?
Chinese men that can go overseas are ridiculously loaded. It's millions (dollars wise) compared..they will find a reasonable substitution.
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Winston
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Post by Winston »

I've deleted the other thread I started about this same news story since it's a duplicate thread. I'm also gonna move this thread to the "News and Current Events" section.

Here was my comment on it in the other thread:
God these Chinese men must be stupid.
Here was Repatriate's response to that:
It's not entirely stupid. I have met western women with the most unusual fob husbands ever. Usually the white western women are from a upper middle class educated background and wanted a complete change from their own family/lifestyle. These individuals are rare but they know what they want. Asian-Americans are considered too "westernized" for their particular standards.
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momopi
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Post by momopi »

My first GF in college was white and she specifically wanted a "very Japanese" boyfriend. But she was tall (5'10"?) and I was the tallest Asian guy she could find. I found out later that she was an otaku. ;p

There are several Taiwanese guys in my neighborhood who are 1.5 gen and married to white girls. I repost one guy's blog to this forum from time to time. From observation, the white American girls who date and marry Asian men in my area are not the bling bling type, they tend to be highly educated and prefer to dress down and not use a lot of make up.

To cite an example, they tend to look like this:

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If the girl above was blonde and younger w/smaller chest, she'd look very much like the GF of this 1.5 gen Taiwanese guy I know. She is currently in med school I think.
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Post by ijohn »

Chinese women do tend to have a lot of expectations from their partners materially. Many are looking for prizes not partners. It is not uncommon for the man and woman to not have much to say to each other outside of the proscribed duties. There is a lot of pressure to conform.

For the chinese man the more open earthen woman from the west might seem like a better companion. They might have more to talk about. These guys have found partners among travellers who are not likely to believe all the hollywood crap. Also these earthen women will probably not be the kind who are conventionally well dressed or maybe even conventionally good looking.

But in general it is safe to say that most people, men or women, whichever culture are looking for prizes not partners. How do you find someone who is looking for a partner? Firstly you have to ask yourself, are you looking for a prize yourself? If you are then you won't find a partner. If you are looking for a partner then you would probably be less focussed on looks and more concerned with the girls personality. What will your day to day life be with her? What will the family album look like in thirty years or so?

Earthen women who want partners do exist even in the west. Wherever you are you have to be able to notice them though. You have to not give energy to why the hot/popular girl is not noticing you and care about the girl who is. You have to able to notice her in a crowd.
momopi
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Post by momopi »

ijohn wrote:Chinese women do tend to have a lot of expectations from their partners materially. Many are looking for prizes not partners. It is not uncommon for the man and woman to not have much to say to each other outside of the proscribed duties. There is a lot of pressure to conform.

For the Chinese man the more open earthen woman from the west might seem like a better companion. They might have more to talk about. These guys have found partners among travelers who are not likely to believe all the Hollywood crap. Also these earthen women will probably not be the kind who are conventionally well dressed or maybe even conventionally good looking.

But in general it is safe to say that most people, men or women, whichever culture are looking for prizes not partners. How do you find someone who is looking for a partner? Firstly you have to ask yourself, are you looking for a prize yourself? If you are then you won't find a partner. If you are looking for a partner then you would probably be less focused on looks and more concerned with the girls personality. What will your day to day life be with her? What will the family album look like in thirty years or so?

Earthen women who want partners do exist even in the west. Wherever you are you have to be able to notice them though. You have to not give energy to why the hot/popular girl is not noticing you and care about the girl who is. You have to able to notice her in a crowd.
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globetrotter
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Post by globetrotter »

I say let the Chinese men take away those 10's of millions of American women, bring them to Henan, and have them deal with Chinese life.

It's only fair...
ijohn
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Post by ijohn »

We are shaped by different occasions in our life and one of these is our early adolescence. This is a time of great fantasy and also great dissapointment too for most when they realize that they are not at the top of the social totem pole, they are not going to be popular, the popular girl is not going to give them attention. Most get over it recognizing that the people they had sought to be popular with might not be quite worth the trouble and focus on making a life instead. Some unfortunate souls do end up spending their adult lives trying to undo their adolescent experiences, often unconsciously, without even realizing it. How many people have thrown their lives away trying to move the pieces around trying to bag that popular girl? Disdaining or not noticing the ones who they could actually have built happy lives with? All sex gets stale after a while. Looks fade and people get used to them.

If you are still chasing the popular girl and have gotten weary of it, it would be useful for you to ask yourself how much better your life would be if you didn't care about that, if you didnt have to give becoming popular your energy, if you were capable of appreciating the not so popular girl's care and attention.
globetrotter
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Post by globetrotter »

ijohn wrote: How many people have thrown their lives away trying to move the pieces around trying to bag that popular girl? Disdaining or not noticing the ones who they could actually have built happy lives with? All sex gets stale after a while. Looks fade and people get used to them.

If you are still chasing the popular girl and have gotten weary of it, it would be useful for you to ask yourself how much better your life would be if you didn't care about that, if you didnt have to give becoming popular your energy, if you were capable of appreciating the not so popular girl's care and attention.
Anyone on this site still living a High School dynamic needs to grow up, today.

Holding any grudge or grievance, past the age of 19, over how you were treated in HS is immature and stupid.

Move on.

High School is over.
ijohn
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Post by ijohn »

While there some good cultural observations and lamentations are not some of the complaints on this site that waspy type women are cold and disinterested or that wannabe-wasp twinkie women are universally shallow and horrible?

If you are wasp yourself looking at the ruin of waspy type family and community life then that focus makes sense.

If you are not then something else is going on. There is the need to conform, to be a part of the majority tribe, to be accepted by them, to belong with them - they are the people whom you see on TV, whose lifestyles get embedded in your sub-conscious. This is a deeply primal instinct and often people act it out unconsciously barely being aware of what they are doing. Those who are conquered always want to be like the conquerers. But you can't belong; waspy type people will never consider you a part of their setup. This is the extra factor you have to contend with in America that you will not experience in another culture or you will experience with much less intensity. In other countries either you are in the majority or if you start as a minority you will get eased into the fold.

But America is a vast land with all kinds of different people and different sub cultures. There are people from minority tribes/races who simply do not care what the majority wasps/wannabe wasps are doing. They focus on their own groups, their own lives and thrive and prosper. They don't judge their own group as inadequate. They don't judge the beauty of their own women/men as inadequate. Only a few of their women buy into the feminist ideological outlook if at all and usually it is very fake; an added on jargon to try to become more waspy.

If you are of those who has felt and given energy to this need for belonging with the majority that you can never have fufilled then you have work to do. You simply have to get over this need. Even if you end up spending your life in some other part of the world you will still face problems because of this need. It will take some work, but it can be done. You will be surprised how good your life will be when you do. It doesn't mean you will end up being ok with not having people at all. It means you will drop the spurious filter that the people who show interest in you must be of a certain kind in order for you to feel good. You will drop the need for that kind of validation. You will relish the people who do show interest in you.
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