Have you found nightclubs to be really negative places?

[steve55]

[tre]

[steve55]

Every single person on this earth has things that they can change for the better. I know I do...and always will. To think otherwise is just prideful and it WILL bite you in the a** eventually.

I agree with you. But it seemed to me that you were INSINUATING that the problem is with the guys here and not the American women. This is the feminist mantra by the way, which is the idea that if you are having problems in the US dating scene its because of you!! Now, I will grant that in some cases, that is true. If a man is letting himself fall part, turning into a fat ass couch potato and doesn't groom or shower himself etc , then yea, that can be true for some, but this is not the case with most.

Now, of course we all agree with you that people can always better themselves. That's a whole different point and is a universally accepted given that doesn't even need to be mentioned really because of its truth. No man will argue with you on. But given the backdrop that this is a international dating forum of guys claiming to look abroad for BETTER women, it would seem that saying such a thing here would definitely imply you meant otherwise, but as I said, ok, since you clarified that is not what you meant, I digress, and it was a misunderstanding. Yes, your statement that people can better themselves is a harmless generically true statement that no one will disagree with.

I just stated (as fact) that they are no angels. You will find that out soon enough, I'd bet $$ on it.

No one here is saying they are perfect and that they make no mistakes or will never have issues. (i.e. Latinas and their jealousy, ohh lala) Show me where anyone said that, I certainly never have, Winston has never made that claim either. So Tre, where did you get the idea that anyone here said that foreign women are perfect angles? Did I miss a post here where people were saying they are PERFECT ? You can keep your money, no one here is making that claim,...non issue.

BUT sir, I will take your bet on the fact that marriages with foreign women are FAR MORE SUCCESSFUL than marriages to American women. Will you make that bet with me? I will give you fair warning that the odds are against you if you take me up on that bet...as per USCIS stats.

As per the USCIS (United States Citizens Immigration Services)
“It is interesting to note that, based largely on data provided by the agencies themselves (along with the Commission on Filipinos Overseas report cited above), marriages arranged through these services would appear to have a lower divorce rate than the nation as a whole, fully 80 percent of these marriages having lasted over the years for which reports are available." (Source http://www.aila.org/content/fileviewer. ... kid=151742)

CAMPBELL LAW REVIEW.
Source: Campbell law review on the success rate of International marriages
"Between 4,000 and 6,000 marriages in the United States are arranged through IMBs each year, yet represent only 0.004% of all marriages in the United States.These marriages have over an eighty percent success rate as opposed to a mere forty-nine percent success rate in the United States as a whole."
(Source http://law.campbell.edu/lawreview/articles/29-2-311.pdf)

I trust your research and "stats" about as much as I trust your website info. I WOULD trust info from those members here that actually have LIVED FOR YEARS in the countries they claim to know something about

LOL. Ok then, well, if you choose to ignore the experts and professionals and stats and facts (especially the 20% divorce rate which you still haven't addressed) and put more weight on your own personal judgment of what you've heard from others then that's fine. By the way, I'm not suggesting to disregard forum board comments or to ignore expat inputs. Winston and I also have extensive travel experience abroad and we also know people who live abroad just like you know people, and Winston has lived abroad in the Philippines for years, and his opinion matches mine on this. It is striking how you interpret the x pat forum information on this subject completely differently than Winston and I, and Winston in particular has years of experience living abroad. How funny. So, if you are going to strictly go by what people who live abroad have told you, and throw away the experts and stats and facts, then so be it. We'll have to agree to disagree on that. This has been a great discussion or debate on the subject and I'm happy to let it stand as is and let others decide for themselves.

If you want to have a 50-60% chance of divorce by marrying an American women, go for it. I like the 20% odds of divorce much better.

I want REAL, LEGITIMATE information

Hey, I'm not saying to totally ignore and throw out what people say in forums, but that is so vulnerable to personal interpretation. Stats, facts, and expert research is not. However, I do take into account expat forum comments with what the experts say, such as the United States citizens immigration services 20% divorce rate stat when men marry foreign women. Hey, at the end of the day, the divorce rate is all telling isn't it? How do you answer the super low divorce rate??

You know that its not legal to get a divorce in the Philippines right? Obviously not....such a "guru" you are

Your comment proves absolutely nothing. And i never claimed to be a guru. But yes, I do know that. But I wasnt addressing that. I was ONLY stating that Filipinas DONT PERSONALLY BELIEVE IN DIVORCE and that was my sole point. I was not commenting about the laws of divorce. If you knew Filipinas well, you would know that they are fervently against divorce and they will not invoke the law as the reason for having that stance. GO talk to some Filipinas and see this for yourself. Ask them that. It is a personal stance, not because the law says its illegal.

Also, divorce is legal in all other countries of the world, yet, the divorce rates in these countries is much lower than the US. It's the highest in the US. Now, is that partly because the women are not as financially able to support themselves n other countries, yes, of course!! But there are clearly other factors too that are unique to the USA. Foreign women simply have better value sets. Yes, there are things that make them that way. But who cares what the reasons are behind it? At the end of the day, they DO have a better value set about marriage and that's what matters. The US , especially the women, have a different value set towards marriage. They dont respect it and dont view it as something sacred and greater than themselves . In general, foreign women do. And by the way, financial independence doesn't explain all of the difference in divorce rates. It's also America's individualistic attitudes and especially feminism that are behind this poor view of marriage. (See this social psychologist's quote below on how feminism increases odds of divorce, note he uses the word EVIDENCE, though I know you don't believe in "evidence" but others here might)

There is evidence that women with traditional sex role attitudes are indeed less likely to divorce than those with feminists attitudes (The American Paradox, pg 45-46)

CAN'T divorce the ones they marry....even if they want to. That doesn't mean they stay together. Again, why don't you know this?

Yes, I do know all of that. I didn't say otherwise. You did, not me. Again, my point is that she said what she said because they have a fervent personal belief against it, not just because it's against the law. My point was nothing beyond that. Now, is it likely that the fact it is against the law heavily influence their values on marriage, HELL YES!!!!! I agree with you, but its only 1 factor , it also has a lot to do with the fact they are very religious too, FAR MORE Than we are. Filipinas invoke god's name all the time in their dating profiles (god bless, god willing etc) whereas American women NEVER DO! That shows the difference in spirituality which makes them better quality women. At the end of the day, what's it matter what's behind the cause of their stance against divorce??? Right? What matters to men is that they are FAR less likely to divorce.

Women divorce men because the LAWS in their country allow them to make out like a bandit. The USA is bad for that...very bad. But, Singapore and some other countries are worse and infidelity is just as bad or worse in those countries. Women stay with men they hate in some countries because it doesn't make logical sense to leave or are punished for doing so....not because they want to stay.

100% agree with you. Again, none of this changes the fact that Filipinas don't believe in divorce. I was making no assumptions beyond that fact. Yes, we could get into a debate as to why that is, but as it is, I agree with you that the law is a important reason. But laws can shape personal beliefs too and so be it. What I care about is the end result of who the person is. If laws played a part in that personal belief, so be it.

The typical American women doesn't take care of themselves, they don't work out, they dress like slobs....they are monsters! Many would rather sit in a Sports Jersey and watch the game while drinking beer and eating pizza with the guys. Many women have become masculine here, don't care what they look like and think YOU should like them no matter what.

WOW, well, at least we agree on something. LOL. Perhaps you arn't a feminist in disguise,

You are here to protect your personal interests and the $$ you invested in your website. You want to sell your shit to others so that you can head abroad to live your dream.

hahaha. You have no idea. Let me blow you away with these facts which I know you never expected as possible. LOL. I've never made 1 penny off my site in the 2 years it's been up. lol. Yes, my site has been up for almost 2 years!! I've never even tried to. I've not even yet registered it with google ad sense which is where the easy sure money is at. Google ad sense is usually the first thing guys do when they put up sites. Based on my current traffic, I could have been making money years ago. I just last week for the first time put some banners up. The banners are more to help guide men to some dating sites that can help them start on their journey. And the ads help my site look more legit and nicer too. In fact, 80%of my banners I just put up are ads of photos of foreign women which I chose those types of banners as the majority of my ads in order to motivate the guys and make my site much more aesthetically pleasing (aka: eye candy), not based on which banners will most likely make the most $$$. I've never cared about making $$, it has never been my priority. Guys who have known me since day 1 know this about me. Ask Winston, ask Steve Hoca, ask Mark Davis of European Dream connections. All these heavy hitters know me well on a personal level, and will attest to my sincere passion, or in fact, attest to my burning desire to help others, not to make money. Though, I think it's not a bad idea to make some $$, it's not an evil thing to do so. But if it was a priority, don't you think I would have started on all that 2 years ago, or at the start, or much sooner than last week? Good try brau, but no dice. Though I can't blame you for trying to go there as it probably seemed a very safe accusation on your end since it would be very rare for someone to go through all the efforts I have (just look at how extensive my site is) without $$ being a big driver. But yes, I'm different than most in that way.

Ya see, I have been traumatized by how hard the dating market is in the US such that it has caused me to still be single at 46 yrs old. I blame the toxic dating environment of the US and the obesity epidemic causing too much competition for the ht/wt prop women. I blame it on women in the US not needing men. I am passionate to help other men not to have to stay single all their lives like I did (not by choice). I'm like the cancer patient who wants to help others also going through cancer. I have a true desire to save men in their mid 30's and 40's from being deprived of the right to find love and have a family without having to be forced to do so with narcissistic, materialistic, masculine, obese sweat pant queens who give you a 50-60% chance of divorce.

If you were truly a guru, then this would be a great service...but you are not.

Again, you know not what you are talking about. First off, I never said I was a "know it all" or "guru". I don't think I act like it either. Maybe other board members can chime in and comment if I come across that way. If they say I do, then I digress. However, I do provide stats, facts, and expert quotes as I find these as carrying more weight than just personal opinion which is subject to personal interpretation. Back on point, Happier abroad Board member DarrenFW says I am personally responsible for helping him see the light about foreign women and he attributes his being happily married to a Filipina (with a baby due any day now), to my and Winston's material. He specifically said that my dating profile comparison chart hit home with him and was the turning point for his decision to go down this path. Message him here yourself and ask him. Ask Winston, he knows DarrenFW said this too. Also, Winston will confirm that I am personally responsible for one of my co workers being happily married with a baby girl now. I showed my co worker this material on my site and how foreign women are truly different and he credits me 100% for his marriage today. He never thought of it till I brought it up. These are marriages (and the resulting babies) that I know of that I directly played a role in. How many others are out there that we don't know of who visited my site (or Winston's) who are now happily married? I don't know but I'm VERY HAPPY with the two lives that I know about that I have changed . Two known cases may not be much, but to me, it's extremely rewarding. Just being able to change 1 life is everything to me.

I'm not the only one here that has called you out on your "facts", exaggerations and you know that.

No I don't know that. Please enlighten me?? If anyone has called me out on my stats and facts, show me where. If you are able to find one case of that, then I will give you credit. But honestly, as it is I don't recall this ever happening here. I'll wait for you to get back with me on that.

And what's there to call out anyways? All I do is quote expert statements and stats and facts. What do you mean by calling out? lol. Do you mean that they believe stats, facts, and expert opinions are irrelevant? If so, then so be it. People can choose to ignore it. I just put it out there for review for each person to decide for themselves how much they want to believe it. By the way, have you read the positive comments others have made about Winston's site which is basically the same points that my site makes? Our sites are mirror reflections of each other. There are a lot of guys who fully believe in the points Winston and I make here. Maybe you dont, ok. That's fine.

I never said women in the USA are better than foreign women. I just stated that they are no angels...which is completely true.

Yes, I agree with you on that statement. But they are BETTER, FAR BETTER than American women which is my point. See the super low 20% divorce rate with foreign women for proof. At the end of the day, the divorce rate tells all doesn't it?

When you bring your foreign bride to the USA, she will become an American. You can hide her all you want, but you can't restrict her freedom or you go to jail. Unless YOU have true value to her, she can lawfully divorce you.

Wow, you sound like a feminist. lol. Do you know that? lol. Are you sure you're not a feminist female in disguise here? LOL. That's what feminists always try to say about guys who marry foreign women. It's a shaming tactic. So, you've bought into that too? I know of no one who has ever mentioned wanting to do that nor done that. Yea, it's the old "keep them in chains" accusation. Neither DarrenFW nor my co worker do that with their wives. We fully believe in letting them do anything they want, get cars, go to work, etc etc. just like anyone else. Now, to your point,....yes, they will change some. I'll grant you that. But it has been my experience in looking into this subject that most do not change enough to be like an American woman. They generally keep their good values, stance against divorce, and generally take care of their man better than American women. Now, I'll give you credit that there are some really nasty foreign women who have turned into complete nightmares and materialistic cheating greedy biatches. There are nightmare stories out there, but these are the very slim minority. Just look at the 20% divorce rate for proof of that being the minority situation.

God's gift to all women in the world....the perfect man with nothing to improve.

Was that directed at me?? Yikes! I don't recall claiming perfection. I think I clarified that there was a misunderstanding between us on this. I got the impression you were telling guys here that they might be the problem and just need to improve themselves and not American women. But you clarified that this is not at all what you meant, so it's been put to rest.

They truly have something to offer the woman they are with.

Ok man, you talk about not wanting to throw insults? I take that as an insult. So far I have refrained from any direct personal insults towards you. However, I'll grant you that I did say the words "quit lying" towards you which I do apologize for because no, I don't think are intentfully lying. I made a bad choice of words in the heat of the moment without thinking. I should have said the word "misinformation". Look, sorry if I've antagonized you, I can see you are starting to get upset at me. It's just that it's mind boggling some of the things you've said (some of it sounds like the feminist drivel we hear from time to time) and you do seem to have a rather fervent desire to defend American women on things that seem to me to be very non defensible in light of clear cut evidence to the contrary. But anyways, perhaps I have over reacted to it. I need to respect your right to an opinion without reacting so fervently to it. But I do refrain from insults as I don't believe in personal attacks. I'll try to tone it down and besides, I think we're pretty much done with what we have to say anyways. You have the right to voice your opinion and we all respect that here. And I have voiced mine. We'll let the guys here come down on this issue where they may. Who knows, maybe guys will agree with you. Maybe the guys don't believe in any of the stats, facts, and expert opinion I have provided. That's fine if so. Im not here in some type of competition with anyone. I'm here to CHANGE LIVES! And when someone says something that seems so misleading or incorrect , I can get passionate about countering it with stats, facts, and sourced expert opinions. But at all times, I try to stay away from attacks and personal insults.

There are many guys here that have been successful, but they are different than you are. They give free advice

My advice is free too. And after 2 years of having my site up, my very first banner ad just went up last week. Money is not important in my cause. Winston even knows this about me, ask him. Though, you are correct, I haven't been successful in finding the right girl as of yet but hoping for the best this time.

[tre]

It seems our debate has become a little heated due to a few misunderstandings. I stand corrected on the $$ part...props to you for offering free information. I think one SHOULD make some $$ after putting in all that hard work. I think eventually you will if you keep adding to the site, which you should IMO.

First off, I don't trust the government...ANY government. I don't trust their stats either. The lies they spread through the media causes many problems. They effectively brainwash their citizens with it. The unconstitutional and damaging laws and regulations also cause many problems. Feminism is caused by government regulation and law. It empowers women to grab men by the balls (or cut them off in some cases). I can find many "experts" on the same topic with contradicting "facts". These "facts" change all the time too. Some are getting paid to push an agenda and some are not. It is left to the reader to sift through a lot of BS to find actual proof. I question everything I read. An honest person abroad who is living in the country for many years is a much better source of knowledge on living in that particular country IMO.

One thing that was painfully obvious in my visit to the Philippines, having a gf (over 4 years) from the Philippines and years of interacting with many on a regular basis is that the people are abused by their government in an extreme way. Politicians take all the money and leave the people impoverished and uneducated. They are easily brainwashed and the majority is...even worse than in the USA. If you are a celebrity or from a famous family, you can be a politician no matter what you do or say. Yes, most Filipinos are Catholic. They go to church. But they sin like nobody's business. People from all over go there to hook up with women....they aren't living their religion. I've seen so many married couples that split up and want to get married to someone else...but can't. Some move to the USA and get married to someone else legally while STILL married in the Philippines. I've seen posts on Facebook (I have many Filipino friends that live IN the Philippines), begging the government to allow divorce. It's common, very common....but there are obviously many who are happily married. Also, there are two groups of Filipinos....rich and poor. There really isn't a middle class. Depending on which group you associate will effect your opinion of Filipinos as they are much different than each other.

I am no Feminist....lol. I've had problems with American women from the time I wanted to have a gf in high school. They love you one day and then hate you the next...enough to drive you crazy! I'm also VERY critical of obesity in general. However, I do not isolate women in this....men need to get their shit together here as well. If one looks like shit and doesn't take care of themselves, they shouldn't expect much....regardless if you are male or female. Much of what makes you think that I'm Feminist is that I expect PEOPLE to improve themselves instead of blaming everything else. You are correct that there are MANY men that have found happiness with a younger foreign woman after being raked over the coals by the monster western women. However, I've seen quite a few instances of men that complained that women are no different abroad after spending all their money to get out there. I suspect those particular men are the problem. I see men everyday that have no business looking for anything until they get their shit together. This is not Feminist, this is helping them succeed with women, with health and with greater realization of their potential.

Many of my rants outside of this forum are of American Citizens in general. Much of my pain and inconvenience is caused by them. Their ignorance is annoying, their priorities are f***ed up....I want OUT OF HERE....lol.

Anyway, I apologize for anything I said that may have offended. I do get heated at times as years of the BS here has made me an angry person:)

[steve55]

No worries. Our passions about this subject have hopefully provided two interesting point of views for others to think about . And yes, in many ways, Filipinos don't follow their religion. Some Filipinas claim to be very religious yet will shag at the drop of a hat. Lol. On the other hand, I've never met so many virgins in my life as in the Philippines. My 35 yr old x fiancé was a virgin when we met (she made it here with me to Dallas on a k-1 fiancé visa but things didn't work out in the end which is a whole nother topic of discussion. She ended up marrying another American 2 years after me and is living happily now in Washington state) . I'm sure you've observed this virgin tendency too? The Phils has so many girls in their upper 20's to mid 30's who are still virgins which is near impossible to find in the states. But yea, the Filipinas who do shag, will shag super easily. You don't really have to work on those types for long to get there. Lol. But either way, at the end of the day, they just seem so much kinder and spiritual than American women as a whole. And the most beautiful Filipinas have no stuck up attitude either. The humbleness of Filipinas is just out of this world. And another thing, Winston and I seem to see nothing but long term happy couples when we tally up the American/filipina married couples that we know of and it seems to me that it's the same with American Latina marriages too. However, I'm not so sure about the American Russian marriages. If I ascertain what I've heard about American russian marriages, I don't get as positive of a vibe. I think that the Russian culture is too much different than ours which can make it harder for these marriages to work and harder for the Russian women to adjust to western culture. And I get the impression that Russian women are just as materialistic or almost as materialistic as American women are. So, for this reason, I've not really developed an interest in them.