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Why do expats charge US rent prices in the Philippines?!

Discuss issues related to business, finance, taxes, investments, cost of living in different countries, etc.

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Rock
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Post by Rock » November 1st, 2010, 6:17 pm

Winston wrote:What about my question below?

"I've met a lot of guys who inflate every single number in their life, both in their assets and expenses, as if being a big spender was something to be proud of. Every little thing they bought, they claim, seems to cost a ton of money. Why are so many guys like that? It's so shallow and unspiritual and unintellectual. Sick.

I had a friend who would double or trip anything that I said. For example, when I said "My braces cost $2000" he would say "Oh that's nothing. Mine cost $10,000". Why do guys do that? That's so stupid!"
Yea, I've met these types too. My guess is that most of them are insecure in some way and use 'big talk' as an attempt to impress those around them. Its just a form of bragging which comes natural for too many.




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ladislav
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Post by ladislav » November 1st, 2010, 8:56 pm

globetrotter wrote:Americans are accustomed to paying those prices and trust an American more. Language, experience, local knowledge and know-how go a long way.

White, Anglo-Saxon, Protestant Americans are the most cut-throat group on this planet. Even when they expat to another country, they don't look out for each other and will slit each others throats to make a dollar. In the US they don't stick together at all. This is one of the crazy RadFem ideas that drives most MRA types nuts; Men don't look out for each other, they are trying to rip each other off.

I don't get bothered by these liars, con artists and sociopaths, but then again I radiate a 'Don't f**k with me, I have seen it all' vibe. They move on and look for an easier kill.

This works if there are rules to play by. Competition makes many rich and most middle class. Remove the rules, however, and then you get the Current Collapse.
This is one of the reasons why Mafia could flourish in the US and not so in Argentina or Brazil. If a Mafiosi f%^ks up an WASP the others would not help him at all.
And this is also the reason why the Jews and even the Chinese could prosper in the USA. There is no "group" to compete with.
A brain is a terrible thing to wash!

wuxi
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Post by wuxi » November 1st, 2010, 11:28 pm

globetrotter wrote:White, Anglo-Saxon, Protestant Americans are the most cut-throat group on this planet. Even when they expat to another country, they don't look out for each other and will slit each others throats to make a dollar. In the US they don't stick together at all. This is one of the crazy RadFem ideas that drives most MRA types nuts; Men don't look out for each other, they are trying to rip each other off.

I don't get bothered by these liars, con artists and sociopaths, but then again I radiate a 'Don't f**k with me, I have seen it all' vibe. They move on and look for an easier kill.
Good point globetrotter. You've just desrcibed most of the people in my family, no wonder I hate family reunions.

Getting back on topic. In asia theres always two prices one for foreigners and one for locals. You really need a local person that knows the philippine real estate market well and you can trust before you start making offers on a property. They'll know if your getting ripped off or not. Just remember, its a buyers market so be patient.

globetrotter
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Post by globetrotter » November 2nd, 2010, 10:53 am

"I don't think listing a property at any price is a misrepresentation unless its accompanied with untruthful descriptions or information."

Of course you don't.

Your attitude is why the USA is imploding.

Everyone began to think like you.

Consider that your position IS misrepresentation (and immoral, illegal, unethical, lying, wrong, sociopathic, grifting, scum-bag-ish, etc...) and that it is causing the coming Deflationary Depressionary Collapse.

You have lived in Socal / L.A. / OC / San Diego for too long.

It has done what it does to most people - it has affected your sense of right and wrong, you don't even know it, and you assuredly will argue this point with me.

Rock
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Post by Rock » November 2nd, 2010, 5:55 pm

globetrotter wrote:"I don't think listing a property at any price is a misrepresentation unless its accompanied with untruthful descriptions or information."

Of course you don't.

Your attitude is why the USA is imploding.

Everyone began to think like you.

Consider that your position IS misrepresentation (and immoral, illegal, unethical, lying, wrong, sociopathic, grifting, scum-bag-ish, etc...) and that it is causing the coming Deflationary Depressionary Collapse.

You have lived in Socal / L.A. / OC / San Diego for too long.

It has done what it does to most people - it has affected your sense of right and wrong, you don't even know it, and you assuredly will argue this point with me.


Have you lost it man? Who gave you the monopoly on moral judgment? My position is the way capitalism (an imperfect system) operates. And frankly, if you think it’s so immoral, you’re probably in the wrong country and don’t even realize it.

Do you really doubt that the majority of people in China wouldn’t sell a property for as much as they could get (even 1,000 times more than they paid)? You think opportunistic capitalism only exists in the States? Just look at all the property bubbles which have occurred in China, HK, Taiwan, and Singapore. And how do you value a property anyway? If you were selling a property in a hot area and a motivated prospect offered you US$500,000 even though you only paid US$100,000 and believed it to be worth US$200,000, would you really offer it to him for that (US$200,000).

BTW, I just arrived in Shekou yesterday evening straight off the boat from HK International Airport. When I walked out of the pier area, a Chinese private taxi offered me a ride to my hotel (just 5 minutes away) for 150 RMB. Of course I opted for a local metered taxi (cars just as new and nice) which cost only 10% of that (15 RMB). But if other customers choose to take him up on his service instead of walking out the street and flagging down a taxi, so what? I'm sure he gets some customers or he wouldn't be doing what he's doing.

And final question/point: When did I live in Socal/LA/OC (whatever the hell that is)/San Diego? I’ve spent most of my adulthood on the other side of the planet and hail from the Midwest. You’re the one from LA area, not me.

momopi
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Post by momopi » November 3rd, 2010, 8:13 pm

He's referring to the kind of Californians who think like this:

http://www.irvinehousingblog.com/blog/c ... -contract/

You fence-sitters are failing to fulfill your part of the California Social Contract. Your failure to continue buying homes is disrupting the social order, and it is causing those of us who bought before you psychological, emotional and financial damage. It is time for you to get off the fence and buy -- NOW!!!

In any social contract, you give up something personally for the greater good. When those of us who bought before you purchased our homes, we had to commit unrealistic percentages of our income to housing, lie on mortgage applications, and take out financing on unstable mortgage terms in order to do our part for the continuing social good. We made these sacrifices willingly because the benefits of maintaining the social contract are worth the price we paid. Look what those who bought before us received in return:

* Dramatic increases in wealth through home equity. I think we can all agree this is desirable. You want to be rich, don't you?

* The ability to spend more than what is earned through productive activities like work. Think of all the BMWs, Mercedes, vacations to Maui, Coach bags, designer jeans, Rolex watches and other items purchased with home equity lines of credit. Don't you want to double your spending power?

* The ability to buy furniture and home improvements without saving or spending income. Your house should be a self-sustaining asset which provides the ability to maintain itself with perpetual appreciation. Who wouldn't want that?

* We provided all of this to the buyers who came before us, and all we ask is that you do the same for us. Isn't this a fair bargain? Don't you want the same for yourself? Won't the next generation of buyers we willing to do the same?

Some have argued it is our fault that the social contract is falling apart. If we recent homebuyers had simply made our payments, the contract would not have been broken. This is rubbish. The lenders failed us. They knew we couldn't make those payments when we took out the loans. They knew we were lying on our loan applications. They knew they were going to have to provide opportunities for serial refinancing of ever increasing amounts of debt. They failed us. They are the ones who broke the social contract, not us.

The tightening of credit just means you will have to make more significant sacrifices to keep the social contract. You may need to borrow money from family members or solicit larger gifts. You may need to become more creative in your attempts to inflate your income or assets. All we had to do was sign some fraudulent paperwork, but you may have to forge some documents or buy a seasoned credit line or find a hard-money lender who doesn't record the debt (loan sharks.) It is going to be tough, but look at the benefits listed above. Isn't it worth the sacrifice?

It is time for you to buy now. Trees really can grow to the sky; prices really can go up forever -- if you hold up your end of the California Social Contract. To paraphrase Winston Churchill,

Let us therefore brace ourselves to our duties, and so bear ourselves that if the {California Social Contract} last for a thousand years, men will still say, 'This was their finest hour.'

This is your chance to stand up for what is right and perpetuate a system that is beneficial to our society. History will remember what you do. Will you be the generation that lived up to its duties, or will this be the end of the world as we know it?

You decide.



=======

I was an admin at IBH for 3 years, and we told people not to buy until after the market correction. Boy did we have some angry visitors.

zzzz
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Post by zzzz » November 3rd, 2010, 11:32 pm

Angeles and the Philippines in general seems over priced online for what you get for housing. Do Filipinos not know how to use the internet or something? I found a few prices which seemed reasonable but overall I was shocked by how few choices there are and how much they are listed for. Compared to say Pattaya Thailand where you can find many choices online for much, much cheaper often listed by expats. Here's a random example I found on google really quick - http://www.pattaya-addicts.com/forum/to ... utilities/ good luck finding anything like that in Angeles for similar prices online.

Oh, and in general I think most expats and mongers tend to stretch the truth a lot. Getting laid by a many different women a month tends to inflate a guy's ego. I'm guilty of this myself but I try to keep my ego in check. If that guy is spending $19,000 and only making $600, that sounds pretty bad and outright risky.

globetrotter
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Post by globetrotter » November 4th, 2010, 9:03 am

"He's referring to the kind of Californians who think like this:"

They number in the Millions.

I believe that there is no one in Socal who has made good money, who is not an immoral weasel.

In my 5 years there everyone I met engaged in the same behavior - from $10/hr temp girls working in the office to firms where the owner's net worth was about $12 million. Everyone there thinks they are justified, they all think it's normal, and they think that everyone ELSE behaves the same way.

The morals and values of everyone in California are totally f***ed up.

globetrotter
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Post by globetrotter » November 4th, 2010, 9:20 am

"Who gave you the monopoly on moral judgment?"

This is what ALL sociopaths say to self-justify.

I can judge who-the-f**k and what-ever-the-f**k I want to judge.

Taxi drivers all over the world try to rip you off. This has happened to me all over the USA, so China is on equal footing. You would think the USA would aspire to be BETTER, eh? Nope. USA is now just like China, except poorer and cannot save any money.

"And how do you value a property anyway?"

This is the exact and precise moral and ethical relativism that is currently destroying the US economy. You value it based upon non-bubble cash flows, on legitimate local comps that are not lies from other local agents helping to prop up everyone's commissions, from RRE Agents who do not lie and tell locals that the FSBO down the street has mold.

I have taken my money and I have gone home. You and the other amoral actors in the USA can continue to destroy what's left of America. I will watch and sit on my cash and take my chances with a depreciating US dollar and the exchange rate.

"If you were selling a property in a hot area and a motivated prospect offered you US$500,000 even though you only paid US$100,000 and believed it to be worth US$200,000, would you really offer it to him for that (US$200,000)."

If you had a moral and ethical core you would not rip someone off to enrich yourself. Anyone with two brain cells who was not in full on greed mode from 2003 to 2008 could plainly see that USA RRE and CRE was in a bubble and that the game was a mad rush to not be the last guy holding the bag when the bubble popped.

Australia, Vancouver and all Tier 1, 2 & 3 cities in China are currently in a bubble, which is why I won't buy anything until this settles out. Anyone with smarts who is not a greedy bastard can see this.

2,188 CNY per m2 in a 4th tier city in a brand new 32 storey hi-rise when most new construction in China lasts for 6-10 years and the local average wage is 750 CNY PER MONTH? Save for 20 years to buy an apartment in a building that will be demo'ed in 10?!!

Come on - the seller is ripping off anyone who buys and you f***ing know it. Any flipper is trying to get some sucker to be holding the bag when the bubble bursts and you know this as well.

Thanks for making my point.

I used to work with guys like you, I used to be like you - I did not like it, so I bailed on earning big money and being a success. The lying, the dissemblement, the misleading, the omissions, the commissions, the f***ing over the other guy before you got f***ed over - I am too intelligent to ignore these things just because I am the benefactor and stand to make huge sums of cash.

momopi
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Post by momopi » November 4th, 2010, 6:07 pm

Three kinds of residental real estate investors: cashflow investor, rent saver, flipper.

A cashflow investor will buy real estate to obtain predictable, consistent cashflow.

A rent saver will buy real estate when it's cheaper to buy than rent. In addition, a 15/30 year fixed rate loan means your monthly payment will not go up (except for taxes).

A flipper will buy real estate based on speculated future appreciation, usually short term.


The roof over your family's heads should not be considered a speculative investment. It can be considered as part of savings, since a portion of your payments is going toward equity, which builds over time. When home buyers (not investors) start buying homes based on speculated future appreciation en mass, you end up with an out of whack RE market.

This problem is compounded by the fact that home purchases, like new car purchases, are often based on emotional decisions rather than logic. When you're buying a home to live in, you want a home that you "feel good" in. So another property might make better financial sense, but if you hate it, you wouldn't want to live in it. Combine this emotional reasoning with speculative flipping behavior, and you get CA/FL RE market in 2002-2006. Simple (and dumb) greed, not complex sociopathic behavior, is the main culprit.

On the other end of the spectrum, you have the extreme bitter renters, who were priced out of the market. During the period of rapid RE appreciation, no matter how hard they saved, they couldn't catch up to the rising prices. Then you had to deal with smug home buyers rubbing it in ("I told you so"). The combination of envy, spite, resentment, & failure to achieve the white-pickett fence American dream boiled into crab mentality ("if I can't have it, neither should you") and desire to take pleasure from the misfortunes of others, so they can later pity them. This (non-sexual) sadomasochism mindset, and a desire to pity that masquerades as compassion, is the other extreme of the mental imbalance.

A cashflow investor, and rent-saver investor will only buy RE when the numbers add up. When you buy RE at over-inflated prices, you're holding your hands out for a knife drop. When the RE bubble pops, the knife drops and you become the knife-catcher. As the value of your home equity drops, knife-catchers bleed from their knife wounds until they decide to let go. Government intervention cannot stop this bleeding, it can only slow the blood flow. Loan modifications designed to prevent foreclosures keep home buyers/owners in homes that they couldn't afford in the first place, and after paying excessive portions of their income in mortgage payments, it leaves them with less disposable income for savings and spending. The end result is that you actually hinder economic recovery.

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co1986
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Post by co1986 » November 10th, 2010, 9:07 am

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globetrotter
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Post by globetrotter » November 10th, 2010, 11:32 am

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