About the Philippines...

[Rock]

This post from Ladislav is again so funny.
I heard your not the youngest but your texts are the cool and funny:

"Thailand is even more into money than the Philippines. And a Chinese looking guy who does not drive a BMW the size of Battlestar Galactica and does not own a factory will not garner much attention there. Most Chinese families in Thailand are rich after generations of mixing noodles for 40 years 15 hours a day every day."

Battlestar Galactica, cooking noodles for 40 years....

To Winston:

I am really new to this forum but it would be definitely boring if
Winston would be content. Then I think there were no stories of interest.
It looks like that this forum is essentially linked to his personality.
I think he is really funny. Also his friend and "friends" are so funny.
You guys are like a funny family. I like it

I think really Winston can score higher. I would like to see him with this one
chinese princess which he posted. This girl looks chinese with a litte russian
and turk. Very sweet. I don´t think it will be easy. That would be expensive.
And you will need a lot of game that is style skill and so on.

This all is so funny. It´s like Star Trek, fictional and real at the same time.
Maybe big Winston has only established only 2 per cent of his potential.
I mean he could open a resort for happier abroad guys of the world.
Maybe in Thailand as the main domain and then franchise throughout the world.
"Playboy-wellness-resorts-Winston"

I think that Winston is 5 years in Phil is not so bad. I like the idea of planing and
saving money to make save steps and not heading headless into some walls. That´s
what´s million guys do but Winston is different and this site is the evidence.

Go Winston !!

Great post. I think your opinion about the forum and Winston is interesting and may be accurate. We are kind of like an online family, lol. As you may know, Winston likes Europeans a lot too. I bet he would live there too if it weren't for the high cost of living and generally low level of local female sexual interest in guys like him.

[Winston]

Winston, I don't understand something...Why are you looking for a middle class Filipina and you have Dianne? It would be different if you were single. I am just curious.

Um isn't it self-explanatory? The short answer is that I am polyamorous and thrive on the excitement and adventure of forming new relationships with women, and the variety it brings to life. Variety is the spice of life. I thought that was obvious a long time ago?

But to bring things deeper:

Plus I'm not happy being shacked up with a girl from a family that can't even afford to eat at McDonald's. That's a big shame to me. I'd rather be associated with a normal family - one that has a house, business, cars in the garage, etc. That's the normal kind of family I'm used to seeing. What I see in the Philippines is a total aberration to what I consider a normal family. And I don't like being a part of it. It's a social disgrace for a man to move down in his associations rather than up. No Chinese person would like that either. All my ethnic Chinese friends told me that it is a shame to shack up with a partner from a lower class culture.

So I'm seeking alternatives. And since I've discovered Chinese women from my own ethnic roots, I've realized that Chinese women are far better. They are better with money, more responsible, intelligent, organized, more evolved, higher quality, have whiter skin, look better, etc. Besides, it feels better to be with a woman from your same roots. There is an energy vibe that resonates more at the same frequency when you are with her. Thus I am far more equally matched with them than I am with Filipinas. Plus their food is better and their families are more generous.

Anyhow, I'm sorry but wants and desires are not consistent or simple. Desires are neverending, so there can never be an endpoint where you are satisfied and content and have no more conflict or struggle. That's how it is with the nature of desire. It may be that I am destined to be a neverending searcher. Who knows.

[Winston]

Great post. I think your opinion about the forum and Winston is interesting and may be accurate. We are kind of like an online family, lol. As you may know, Winston likes Europeans a lot too. I bet he would live there too if it weren't for the high cost of living and generally low level of local female sexual interest in guys like him.

Or online clique. lol. I don't know though. In Europe, if I go places where I'm a novelty, I could get lucky and meet girls with an exotic fetish. lol. It's not the cost that's holding me back, but time too, and me having too many projects at the same time going. I'm sure if I really wanted to, I could just rent a dorm room in Europe or something. But I'd want to travel too, so I could just stay in hostels everywhere as well. There are plenty of them for $20 a night in Europe.

[Winston]

Based on what I know about you, I predict that if you go to China, you may be able to attract some cute or even hot local females, especially if you get your act together. But, the locals will probably annoy you even more than the Taiwanese do after you spend some time there. Your experience will of course vary depending on where you go but I think the people are generally on a different wavelength than you.

Why would China be easier than Taiwan? Aren't they both from the same ethnic roots? Mainland Chinese do seem a lot more open and relaxed. But why would I do better there? Is it cause there are many poor women there who are more desperate and like foreigners and ABC's there, and are less picky with looks? Or because they are more open and less reserved? Or because my value is seen as higher there?

How come I have a lot higher response and interest rate from mainland Chinese women on DateinAsia, than I do with Taiwanese women on that site? Some people seem to think that Chinese and Taiwanese are the same, but it doesn't seem like it, does it?

Chinese women also seem more impressed at my self-intro, self-described qualities and photo. Why is that? When I write the same to Taiwanese women, they will just politely respond (if at all) but not show any enthusiasm or interest. It's like they think "An ABC guy, big deal, so what?" Therefore, I disagree with Repatriate that Taiwanese women are into ABC's. I haven't met any one of them who are impressed that I'm an ABC. It does not give me any points or create any extra interest. All it does it make them ask the polite question, "Oh, well welcome to Taiwan. Are you here on vacation?" And that's all. There is no personal interest or desire to meet me or go out with me. That sucks. I don't know, something about Taiwanese women just doesn't flow and seems extremely stiff, in terms of vibe, personality, body, energy waves, etc. Very weird. I can't be the only one who notices that.

I also don't understand why Japan and Korea are often criticized for these same qualities of coldness by expats, but Taiwan is not, even though it has the same qualities. Why do expats and travelers give Taiwan a free pass, like it's holier than thou or too respectable to ever criticize? Very strange.

[Rock]

Based on what I know about you, I predict that if you go to China, you may be able to attract some cute or even hot local females, especially if you get your act together. But, the locals will probably annoy you even more than the Taiwanese do after you spend some time there. Your experience will of course vary depending on where you go but I think the people are generally on a different wavelength than you.

Why would China be easier than Taiwan? Aren't they both from the same ethnic roots? Mainland Chinese do seem a lot more open and relaxed. But why would I do better there? Is it cause there are many poor women there who are more desperate and like foreigners and ABC's there, and are less picky with looks? Or because they are more open and less reserved? Or because my value is seen as higher there?

How come I have a lot higher response and interest rate from mainland Chinese women on DateinAsia, than I do with Taiwanese women on that site? Some people seem to think that Chinese and Taiwanese are the same, but it doesn't seem like it, does it?

Chinese women also seem more impressed at my self-intro, self-described qualities and photo. Why is that? When I write the same to Taiwanese women, they will just politely respond (if at all) but not show any enthusiasm or interest. It's like they think "An ABC guy, big deal, so what?" Therefore, I disagree with Repatriate that Taiwanese women are into ABC's. I haven't met any one of them who are impressed that I'm an ABC. It does not give me any points or create any extra interest. All it does it make them ask the polite question, "Oh, well welcome to Taiwan. Are you here on vacation?" And that's all. There is no personal interest or desire to meet me or go out with me. That sucks. I don't know, something about Taiwanese women just doesn't flow and seems extremely stiff, in terms of vibe, personality, body, energy waves, etc. Very weird. I can't be the only one who notices that.

I also don't understand why Japan and Korea are often criticized for these same qualities of coldness by expats, but Taiwan is not, even though it has the same qualities. Why do expats and travelers give Taiwan a free pass, like it's holier than thou or too respectable to ever criticize? Very strange.

Let me answer your last question first. S. Korea / Japan vs. Taiwan. As far as white guys are concerned, Taiwan has got less of the bad and more of the good socially. More Taiwan girls are open to dating white guys than are Koreans or even Japanese. And the Koreans and Japanese girls who will date white guys are probably pickier about looks and/or socioeconomic standing than their counterparts in Taiwan. Taiwan probably has some of the negative qualities you refer to. But I'm pretty sure they are less pronounced than in S. Korea and Japan. And white foreigners are somewhat insulated as Taiwanese often go out of their way to treat them hospitably. Obvious foreigners (whites and blacks) will attract help form those who like to help them. On the other hand, ABCs like yourself blend right in as if you were local. So you miss out on this experience.

Culture, politics, upbringing, economic development (both personal and country level) all have a huge impact on the way people ultimately think and behave. Yes, genes are part of the equation. The total environment is the other part. Understand, Taiwan and China are 2 very different places. Taiwan developed a lot earlier and in close contact with the US. So many Taiwanese have attained their higher education in the US. The country is middle class heavy and has values fairly similar to what you would consider western middle class. OTH, China is a whole different can of worms. A generation ago, it was hard-core socialist and dirt poor. They have a huge wealth gap. Much of the rich got that way over just a few years. And the country has had a distant and low trust relations with the USA and western world in general. and don't forget the 1 child policy.

ABCs in Taiwan can do well. But it behooves them to look and act like one the sterotypes - fashionable, preppy, high educational and career achievement, from wealthy family business, etc. Freethinking, sloppy, non-conformist hippie types go against all this.

China is divided between 'haves' and 'have nots'. Its a lot more polarized economically than Taiwan. ABCs and Chinese from places like Taiwan, Hong Kong, Singapore, the US, etc. are generally considered as coming from the 'haves' category. That confers automatic status on you in China. This dynamic is much weaker in Taiwan. So someone like yourself may be considered a catch with many of the PRC women, especially if they are from families who don't have real estate or significant wealth. So at the first level, its not surprising that you are getting good responses in China. But fair warning. When it comes to deeper relationships, understand that Chinese are less westernized (in the good sense) than Taiwanese. And the women there tend to be tougher on bfs and husbands. There are more cold-hearted golddiggers you will have to weed-out but they are pretty obvious.

Anyway, I hope you get my points here.

[Winston]

ABCs in Taiwan can do well. But it behooves them to look and act like one the sterotypes - fashionable, preppy, high educational and career achievement, from wealthy family business, etc. Freethinking, sloppy, non-conformist hippie types go against all this.

I see. But what I don't understand is, the attractive traits you described above would apply for local Taiwanese men as well, right? I mean, how does being an ABC add any extra points to that? Do you see what I'm getting at? I don't see how just being an ABC in itself adds any attraction points to that.

China is divided between 'haves' and 'have nots'. Its a lot more polarized economically than Taiwan. ABCs and Chinese from places like Taiwan, Hong Kong, Singapore, the US, etc. are generally considered as coming from the 'haves' category. That confers automatic status on you in China. This dynamic is much weaker in Taiwan. So someone like yourself may be considered a catch with many of the PRC women, especially if they are from families who don't have real estate or significant wealth. So at the first level, its not surprising that you are getting good responses in China. But fair warning. When it comes to deeper relationships, understand that Chinese are less westernized (in the good sense) than Taiwanese. And the women there tend to be tougher on bfs and husbands. There are more cold-hearted golddiggers you will have to weed-out but they are pretty obvious.

Anyway, I hope you get my points here.

I see. So basically I'm seen as more valuable and higher socio-economic status in China. So it's because the girls are more poor and desperate right? And they aren't as picky about looks, as long as you look decent right? What about them being less shy and more open? Is that a factor too? They do seem more relaxed in their behavior for some reason. Why is that? PRC women also seem more appreciative and less spoiled too.

Thanks for the insights.

One more question. If overseas Chinese have more value and status in PRC, then how come there aren't stories about local men from Taiwan having a better dating/sex life in China and talking about it publicly? How come I never hear about that on the news, or anywhere else?

[Winston]

Hey billy,
I think you'll love these stories about me being scammed in Russia. They should give you some big kicks. These are the kind of stories that Rock misses. lol

Winston's all night sex feud in Vyborg
http://www.happierabroad.com/Sex_Feud_Vyborg.htm

Winston the victim of the Negotiator Scam
http://www.happierabroad.com/The_Negotiator_Scam.htm

[Repatriate]

I see. But what I don't understand is, the attractive traits you described above would apply for local Taiwanese men as well, right? I mean, how does being an ABC add any extra points to that? Do you see what I'm getting at? I don't see how just being an ABC in itself adds any attraction points to that.

It adds a lot in my opinion. My ABC friends in Taiwan all said that the girls were just more attracted to them because they had a more western outlook in the relationship and in their interaction with women. A lot of TW guys are shy, reserved, or have a narrow view of the world. Women like adventure too and someone interesting with a well lived and traveled background.

These guys also had good social skills amongst TW people too though and weren't bad looking.

One more question. If overseas Chinese have more value and status in PRC, then how come there aren't stories about local men from Taiwan having a better dating/sex life in China and talking about it publicly? How come I never hear about that on the news, or anywhere else?

I don't know about Taiwan but have you heard of the sammyboy forum Winston? It's mostly a whoremonger forum but it's very popular with Singaporeans who live and date in the P.R.C. too. A singaporean friend of mine told me about it and I still read it from time to time. P.R.C. women also possess a large percentage of brides in Taiwan and Singapore. They even had to add in some restrictions because it was getting too crazy.

[Winston]

I see. But what I don't understand is, the attractive traits you described above would apply for local Taiwanese men as well, right? I mean, how does being an ABC add any extra points to that? Do you see what I'm getting at? I don't see how just being an ABC in itself adds any attraction points to that.

It adds a lot in my opinion. My ABC friends in Taiwan all said that the girls were just more attracted to them because they had a more western outlook in the relationship and in their interaction with women. A lot of TW guys are shy, reserved, or have a narrow view of the world. Women like adventure too and someone interesting with a well lived and traveled background.

But usually Taiwanese women with a western outlook want WHITE guys, not Asian. That's the problem. Here's an experiment for you to try. Set up a profile on DateinAsia, then email the Taiwanese women there and tell them you are an ABC. See if that gets any special points or interest from them. You will see that it doesn't. They will just be polite and maybe admire that you are well traveled. But that won't make them want to meet you. Taiwanese women have complimented me before for being well traveled. But that compliment did NOT result in any personal attraction.

On the other hand, when I used a photo of a hot white guy, I got a hot Taiwanese girl from Tealit who was 5'9'' to go crazy for me and she invited me over to Tainan to meet her after a few days of chatting. I posted the whole conversation with her last year in this forum, if you remember. As soon as I confessed that I was Asian and did this as part of an experiment, she immediately dropped me.

[Repatriate]

But usually Taiwanese women with a western outlook want WHITE guys, not Asian. That's the problem. Here's an experiment for you to try. Set up a profile on DateinAsia, then email the Taiwanese women there and tell them you are an ABC. See if that gets any special points or interest from them.

There's a couple things about this Winston that you're missing. English language personals on sites like DIA are naturally catering towards westerners. It's already filtering out preferences just by language alone. So when you're posting on an english site catering towards a certain audience it's no wonder that you're only getting certain responses. Btw, I have had a profile on both msn personals and forumosa friends in the past I did get responsesfrom TW women even when I was living in Bangkok heh. I didn't even initiate with several of those women. It's not as hard as you're claiming it to be.

I think this is really an individual thing for you Winston as we've discussed many times before. Rock is right when he says racial factors matter a lot less than individual factors.

On the other hand, when I used a photo of a hot white guy, I got a hot Taiwanese girl from Tealit who was 5'9'' to go crazy for me and she invited me over to Tainan to meet her after a few days of chatting. I posted the whole conversation with her last year in this forum, if you remember. As soon as I confessed that I was Asian and did this as part of an experiment, she immediately dropped me.

Do you really want to test the racial factor? Post up male model pics of an asian guy, a black guy, an arab, and a white guy. I guarantee if they are all good looking you will get responses on all of them. No sane asian woman or most any other woman is going to turn someone that looks like Rain down. Even guys we think are sort of faggy like Edison Chen pull obscene numbers and types of women. The guy ploughed most of the Hong Kong starlets. As I said before they have that look. It's not race it's individual looks.

[Rock]

Do you really want to test the racial factor? Post up male model pics of an asian guy, a black guy, an arab, and a white guy. I guarantee if they are all good looking you will get responses on all of them. No sane asian woman or most any other woman is going to turn someone that looks like Rain down. Even guys we think are sort of faggy like Edison Chen pull obscene numbers and types of women. The guy ploughed most of the Hong Kong starlets. As I said before they have that look. It's not race it's individual looks.

Why not extend the experiment to include regular guys which is what most men are?

Go to a rateme site such as Hot or Not, pull-off a few photos of guys from various races who rate around 6 (which may be slightly below average already due to ratings inflation). Use photos which look around 35 and use that age on the profiles. Make everything similar - height, weight, education, etc. Then, post the profiles on some English and Chinese sites popular in Taiwan. First wait a week or two and see what kind of responses each gets from being totally passive. Then, you can have each one contact some girls and see how they react. It would be interesting to see how results come-out.

[targetguy]

i wish winston the best of luck with his pursuits in china. I hope he likes it there are fits in there. I have never been there but from the view i have met from there in the la airport many speak english well and runn successfull businesses there. He may find a lot of business opportunitys there as well as happiness in a wife. good luck

[Repatriate]

Why not extend the experiment to include regular guys which is what most men are?

Go to a rateme site such as Hot or Not, pull-off a few photos of guys from various races who rate around 6 (which may be slightly below average already due to ratings inflation). Use photos which look around 35 and use that age on the profiles. Make everything similar - height, weight, education, etc. Then, post the profiles on some English and Chinese sites popular in Taiwan. First wait a week or two and see what kind of responses each gets from being totally passive. Then, you can have each one contact some girls and see how they react. It would be interesting to see how results come-out.

That would be an interesting experiment. At least 2 of each race with varying looks for each race that is considered above average looking and clean cut.

My prediction is that any english language site will have a slight bias for the typical white male in his 30's simply because of the inherent social filter and audience it caters to. I doubt the disparity will be as great as in Winston's situation though. The problem is he's comparing himself with some male model's pic he pulled then he starts blaming race for his problems. Playing the race card is such a cop out in this comparison. I can see Winston's point if he mentioned the difficulty in dating in the U.S. because it's factually proven in statistics that there is tremendous bias against certain minorities in the dating game there. I don't believe this is true in Asia though, especially where you have a home team advantage.So in my opinion that narrows it down to the obvious factors such as individual attractiveness and personality.

If race is such a problem why is it all my ABC friends had no issues finding girlfriends or dates in TW? Even in Thailand the Thai-Americans I know all date incredibly attractive and quality compared with your average expat.

[Winston]

I don't know, but it is a fact that TW girls are cold and cliquish. And even when you meet them, they are flaky and slippery, not reliable at all. Lots of guys are complaining about this, not just me.

I'd bet a lot of money that Repatriate can't approach any TW girls either, at least not cold.

All the ABC guys I know concur and admit that Taiwanese girls aren't open to strangers. Your ABC friends are probably part of cliques. That's why they meet girls. If you aren't part of cliques, you can't just casually meet girls in TW. Everyone knows that. It's a fact. No one is denying that. I am not wrong about this. No one says I am either.

If TW was a dating paradise, then Rock would never have to go to Bangkok. He could just hit on sexy model types in Taipei and have all his needs fulfilled. Come back to reality dude. Also, remember Shawn's story in the other thread.

Repatriate, you seem to have a strong cognitive dissonance. I have a ton of stories and quotes from others that back my points. But you filter them out with cognitive dissonance.