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The Filipinas (Observations/Tips)

Discuss culture, living, traveling, relocating, dating or anything related to the Asian countries - China, The Philippines, Thailand, etc.

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Postby OutWest » Wed Nov 20, 2013 5:57 am

publicduende wrote:
OutWest wrote:Western "dating" runs into old world reality. Of course there is a way to win in this situation
if you find a keeper and want to win her over. It is nothing that can be done on a vacation though.
I would have told he that I was thankful that she was keeping herself away from modern dating or American style dating, and that you thought that traditional Filipino courtship was much better.
I would get to know a few of her friends...especially one that seems sympathetic. Develop
her as a confidant. A traditional good girl in the Philippines does not want her reputation ruined
by becoming the vacation GF of foreigner. Tell the friend that your intentions are honorable
and that you intend courtship for marriage and wish to respect Filipino traditions.

You confidant will of course relay this of course, and if you are getting the green light(it may take time) you will know. Learn some tradition and show that you are willing to abide by those things.

Show that your intentions are honorable. Of course, for most Westerners, showing honorable intentions would be a basic contradiction in their character.

Take your time, get feedback on how this is going over with her dad (and mom) as as grandma
and grandpa. Join a local booster club of some sort and donate some time to a local charity.
If she is at all interested, you are giving her cover and justification for showing that interest.
She may begin confiding with her aunt or other family confidant that she has interest in you.

>>>>At some point, the fact that you are "different" will filter into their reality.

Be very respectful of her family. That is super important. At some point you want
to have that conversation with her father. You are marriage minded and that would be your sole
intention with courtship.

And did I say, be respectful of her family?

Invite her brother out for dinner and a few drinks. Make a friend.

If she has grandparents, show them care and every kindness.

This could go on and on, but if by this point you are getting green lights...
things would be about to get interesting. Of course, very very few Western men will ever do
anything like this. But for those who dare....


Outwest


Spot on, OW. Unfortunately, many of the things you mention - time, perseverance, conviction, attention to the local culture and customs - don't resonate too well with the "need it easy, cheap and yesterday" attitude of the younger generations of Americans. If, as you admit, even adult and middle-aged men can easily be deluded that a hot, traditional and well-educated Pinay will fall into their laps only by virtue of a handful of online chats (with a few minutes of pixelated webcam) and a couple of weeks spent over there, just imagine what expectations the younger 'uns may be nurturing.

As well as impatience, another problem I see is the fact that the American work ethics will only allow decent money and no free time, or plenty of free time and limited/welfare money. I don't know how many good-hearted young men have enough savings to leave their corporate jobs, travel to the Philippines and spend the weeks, if not months, needed to establish themselves among the locals, meet the right kind of young women, get intimate with them and their entourage and, finally, woo one. As far as I know, a mid-career American man has around 10 or 15 days of paid leave per year. How many of them would want to commit 75% or 100% of their holiday pool on the hope to find the perfect young gf?

The only category I see succeeding that way is the rare young expat on a good package and European (25/30 days per year) holidays, perhaps stationed in a first-world socio-economic platform "commutable" to the other SEA destinations. When I was in Singapore in 2009 I saw quite a few of those late-20-to-mid-30 lucky dogs doing very well both in town or on frequent trips to neighbouring Malaysia, Indonesia, Thailand or the Philippines.

Your suggestion, to focus on "the one" and invest enough time and effort, is a good one. The thing I have noticed is, traditional girls from upper middle class backgrounds - the Ateneo, De La Salle or Santo Tomas graduates - will have have massive pressure from their social peers and family not to stray from the pre-determined path of settling with a young man of similar or superior heritage. I really wouldn't see many of those top-notch young women dissing most of their social circle and choosing a 40-something or divorced foreigner. Of course I have heard stories fo those girls who leave their families and venture into dating adults, Filipinos or foreign, and drop out of school and/or get pregnant and/or disowned by their families. Those don't sound good gf material to start with, though...

As you could probably testify, things do change moving away from the upper middle class of Metro Manila, Cebu or Davao to the middle class of a smaller town or a rural area, and from middle to lower middle class. I once bumped into a very old (> 60) man from Romania (who could speak perfect Italian) who had settled in Davao and married the daughter of a local Samal politician, the ex-mayor of one of the small villages on the island if I remember well. Surely a nice young, traditional girl from a well-known family, yet not so-well educated (she could hardly speak any English) and - at least to my eyes - not quite the stunner.

I have then met families in Davao who were wealthy enough to pay holiday trips to Las Vegas and Japanese hot springs several times a year, and whose kids had their summer camps in South Korea, Singapore or Canada. Assuming those girls will grow up not only smart and good looking, but with solid principles, they will most probably learn that they have a legacy which needs be preserved, a career that's incompatible with marrying too young and wealth which needs be kept within the family or pooled to that of an even wealthier family. And while all the markers of high status - physical height, fair skin and Chinese or Caucasian looks aren't abundant - there seems to be enough eligible boy and girls among those local elites.

If memory doesn't fail me, you are married to a young and attractive girl who is an Engineering graduate and daughter to an influential family in the town you chose to settle in. All box squarely ticked, basically! I would say she (and your happiness) are a testament to how wisely you played all of your cards as well as, obviously, the great deal of time and dedication you poured into your Pinoy adventure. Now tell me: everything else on your side being equal, would you have managed, indeed would you have wanted, to win the heart of an upper middle class girl from Makati, or central nCebu?


As to your question...hmmmm, well, perhaps I could have courted and won some upper middle
class girl from Makati, or Central Cebu, but that was never my objective. At one time I had opportunity
with a girl from such a family- a girl whose family name is on quite a few street signs, but I began to
suspect that she was just Social- as in the way Filipinos use the term.

>>>>I would far rather have a poor girl with a rich heart than the other way around!!!

Yes, I knew when I first met my bride to be, that she was not poor- the setting, clothing and body language gave her away. What impressed me most about her family is how humble and kind they are
to all of those around, and how well they treated their ya-ya. My wife's father is at this time in Tacloban
helping with relief efforts. He is just that kind of man.

The attitudes of most of those "elites" in Makati and elsewhere are not what I aspire to be
part of. Much of the ruling class in the Philippines is total pond scum. So yes, I may have played my
cards well in this case, I was also lucky and persistent. I have a family history in the Philippines that
has been off and on since 1945.

You are right. The average young American is not well suited to doing well here in terms of meeting and courting a desirable girl. Typically he would not have the faintest clue as to what that even means.
A few have sense about it and I have seen some do well...and usually they somehow have the time to spend. The quick pick bride is a great risk...for both sides.

As to a 40's or older man such as myself being able to swoop in and score an upper middle class girl- that is almost all baloney. In fact, and the odds of any foreigner pulling that off is pretty remote
unless he has long term connections and can take his time. Most of these families are pretty cliquish
as Mguy has observed. I think such aspirations- setting out to score such a society girl, are a waste of time.
Maybe my ramblings have answered your questions....


Outwest
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Postby davewe » Wed Nov 20, 2013 6:46 pm

OutWest wrote:[
As to your question...hmmmm, well, perhaps I could have courted and won some upper middle
class girl from Makati, or Central Cebu, but that was never my objective. At one time I had opportunity
with a girl from such a family- a girl whose family name is on quite a few street signs, but I began to
suspect that she was just Social- as in the way Filipinos use the term.

>>>>I would far rather have a poor girl with a rich heart than the other way around!!!

I think such aspirations- setting out to score such a society girl, are a waste of time.
Outwest


I agree with Outwest. I always shake my head at guys who insist they must (or have) gotten middle class or elite Filipinas.

For one thing it's tough enough to define what middle class is in the West, let alone a 3rd world country. Is it how much money you have, how much money you grew up with (IOW how much your parents have), what your education is, where you live(d), what kind of job you have? The list goes on. I grew up in a suburban area that would have been defined as middle-upper middle class. But I dropped out of college and spent my 20s in a series of shit jobs. Was I still middle class?

In the Philippines (and many countries like it) a guy can make the equivalent of $1000/month and be considered middle class. He's middle class because he can feed his family, owns a modest house, maybe has a car or motorcycle. In the Philippines he's in the top 20%, and any daughter he might have knows she's higher up the social ladder than most. But in the West they're poor. I definitely dated such girls in PI. But were they any better or different than poorer girls? Not in my view. So in the end, I didn't care about a girl's social or economic class; I did however care about her education and general ability to learn and adjust.

As to the elites - well such talk always seems nonsensical. How many of us are elite in our culture? Any Rockefellers or Kennedys here? How many of us are married to such people? And hell, why would you want to be?

OTOH, I have referred before to my friend who is about to marry his Pinay gf. Her father is definitely not the $1000/month type guy. He clearly is very successful, though his daughter still says he is a simple businessman. But I still don't believe that much matters. My friend isn't marrying her because she is not poor. And she's good friends with my wife whose family is poor. Any economic differences between the girls is trumped by the fact they both are Visayan.
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Postby mguy » Sat Nov 23, 2013 11:50 pm

Going through an ugly break up with HB7.

There were red flags going all over the place when I got back. So I kinda let the relationship slide. I still kept her my #1 chick as I felt an affinity for her as she was the one who showed me what was possible. She was my #1 chick and had dibs on my time.

Like any other breakup -- it stings. I would have kept it but really my heart wasn't there anymore. The love evaporated after I got into my ventures and her with her office work. Real world. Turns out we had a lot of differences. I still like the things I like about her but have found out how she also has other spiders from a complex of coming from the province and trying to make it in Manila. I just didn't want to deal with it so it ended.

The Next Chapter is more chicks. lol. Nahhh.

Now I am quite in tune with who is who in Manila. Even my beauty standard is shifting. I am also getting paranoid of knocking someone up. I kinda want a romantic life but I can't become too needy or without clear direction. I am not that 100% secure now and it is showing. I get numbers by the truck load but the need to do my own thing overrides the game aspect of the girls.

I'm truly satiated. Tired even. A part of me says take advantage of my youth and game, another part says to just chill out and do something else. I have been toying a lot with the go pro. I will post some footages of me toying around. Well I gtg.. time to teach koreans some English.
"So never refuse an invitation, never resist the unfamiliar, never fail to be polite and never outstay the welcome. Just keep your mind open and suck in the experience. And if it hurts, you know what? It's probably worth it."

Like to read?Third World Hero
Like to see?3WorldHero -- Did he really just do that?

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Postby mguy » Sat Nov 23, 2013 11:52 pm

In terms of differences of break-up procedures between Filipinas and Foreigners: there really is none.

Females will be females. Just let it slide and dettach yourself.

Also, like I said, for guys you will be staying for a week looking for a wife.. I hope for your success but it takes more than a vacation to get to know a person.
"So never refuse an invitation, never resist the unfamiliar, never fail to be polite and never outstay the welcome. Just keep your mind open and suck in the experience. And if it hurts, you know what? It's probably worth it."

Like to read?Third World Hero
Like to see?3WorldHero -- Did he really just do that?

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Postby mguy » Sat Nov 23, 2013 11:58 pm

In my humble opinion on the issue regarding middle class and elite girls.

I think the money aspect is not that important. There is an element of culture that defines the classes. I think it is a value set difference between the classes. Again, this is just an opinion.
"So never refuse an invitation, never resist the unfamiliar, never fail to be polite and never outstay the welcome. Just keep your mind open and suck in the experience. And if it hurts, you know what? It's probably worth it."

Like to read?Third World Hero
Like to see?3WorldHero -- Did he really just do that?

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Postby publicduende » Sun Nov 24, 2013 12:08 am

mguy wrote:In my humble opinion on the issue regarding middle class and elite girls.

I think the money aspect is not that important. There is an element of culture that defines the classes. I think it is a value set difference between the classes. Again, this is just an opinion.


Yes, there is an element of culture, like everywhere in the world. But culture, education and the "status upgrade" that comes with it isn't cheap in the Philippines. Sure, there will always be wizkids who grow in destitute families and win those coveted scholarships to go to Philippines Science and then on to UP Diliman. Yet, from what I saw, the smartest kids always came from middle and upper middle class families, which were coincidentally those who could afford their offsprings top quality education from kindergarden onwards, which in the Phils means the Jesuits or the odd international school/college. This is the main way elite families ensure their status and power are seamlessly propagated forward.
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Postby mguy » Sun Nov 24, 2013 12:10 am

Guys, so you know... the call centering here is booming. 20K for anyone who speaks English. That's $500/month. They are getting so desperate they are handing out fliers and you get the job on the spot. Ill ask about visa what not but you guys really have to poke me.
"So never refuse an invitation, never resist the unfamiliar, never fail to be polite and never outstay the welcome. Just keep your mind open and suck in the experience. And if it hurts, you know what? It's probably worth it."

Like to read?Third World Hero
Like to see?3WorldHero -- Did he really just do that?

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Postby mguy » Sun Nov 24, 2013 5:54 am

say you want this chick. it helps if you have really great connections. but you also have to be successful in PI society. your bankroll must be high and you must be something. she's also cebuana. extra allure.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qn1ntKF7sYE [/youtube]

"So never refuse an invitation, never resist the unfamiliar, never fail to be polite and never outstay the welcome. Just keep your mind open and suck in the experience. And if it hurts, you know what? It's probably worth it."

Like to read?Third World Hero
Like to see?3WorldHero -- Did he really just do that?

mguy
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Postby publicduende » Sun Nov 24, 2013 4:06 pm

mguy wrote:Guys, so you know... the call centering here is booming. 20K for anyone who speaks English. That's $500/month. They are getting so desperate they are handing out fliers and you get the job on the spot. Ill ask about visa what not but you guys really have to poke me.


20K is almost as much as a registered nurse makes after 5 years of college and another 3 years as a trainee. Jaysus...
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Postby In2dadark » Sun Nov 24, 2013 4:30 pm

[quote="Halwick"] So I drew a picture of my "wealth" in relation to the cost of things in the U.S. compared to Filipino's salary relative to the cost of things in the Philippines. It became apparent to her that I wasn't THAT rich after all.

Thereafter, she refused my calls, texts, etc. in other words, she dumped me.

You might be a little too good at that.. Please refrain ...? :D
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Postby ryanx » Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:32 pm

mguy wrote:say you want this chick. it helps if you have really great connections. but you also have to be successful in PI society. your bankroll must be high and you must be something. she's also cebuana. extra allure.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qn1ntKF7sYE [/youtube]



Did anybody else see her nipples? :twisted:
Last edited by ryanx on Mon Nov 25, 2013 11:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby publicduende » Mon Nov 25, 2013 1:06 am

mguy wrote:say you want this chick. it helps if you have really great connections. but you also have to be successful in PI society. your bankroll must be high and you must be something. she's also cebuana. extra allure.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qn1ntKF7sYE [/youtube]



Wow, what a beauty. Ellen Adarna. Chinese and Spanish descent. It helps being an actor and a millionaire. And a young one. And come from a prominent Filipino family.
Or if you're a young and up and coming Senator like this:

Image (Chiz Escudero)

you could have a girl like this:

Image
Image
Image

(Heart Evangelista)
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Postby OutWest » Mon Nov 25, 2013 5:21 am

publicduende wrote:
mguy wrote:say you want this chick. it helps if you have really great connections. but you also have to be successful in PI society. your bankroll must be high and you must be something. she's also cebuana. extra allure.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qn1ntKF7sYE [/youtube]



Wow, what a beauty. Ellen Adarna. Chinese and Spanish descent. It helps being an actor and a millionaire. And a young one. And come from a prominent Filipino family.
Or if you're a young and up and coming Senator like this:

Image (Chiz Escudero)

you could have a girl like this:

Image
Image
Image

(Heart Evangelista)


Reality is...there are far more girls like that than there are senators...good thing too...
It allowed a basically irreverent rascal like me to cash in...

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Postby mguy » Mon Nov 25, 2013 7:29 am

I know someone who got in that pants of ms. evangelista. And yes, he fits all the requirements.

I fail some of those. But I think I can get someone like this girl who is fil-am bold star. They tell me to get into showbiz, but I don't know if they'r fckin with me or not: I am not a handsome motherfcker but do ok in videos. haha!

Anyway here is joyce. I am also falling in love for fil-am chick who I talk about in blog. They are scandalous beasts that come in tight packages.


Image

Image

Image[/img]
"So never refuse an invitation, never resist the unfamiliar, never fail to be polite and never outstay the welcome. Just keep your mind open and suck in the experience. And if it hurts, you know what? It's probably worth it."

Like to read?Third World Hero
Like to see?3WorldHero -- Did he really just do that?

mguy
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Postby mguy » Mon Nov 25, 2013 7:31 am

publicduende wrote:
mguy wrote:Guys, so you know... the call centering here is booming. 20K for anyone who speaks English. That's $500/month. They are getting so desperate they are handing out fliers and you get the job on the spot. Ill ask about visa what not but you guys really have to poke me.


20K is almost as much as a registered nurse makes after 5 years of college and another 3 years as a trainee. Jaysus...


Nurse here nowadays goes straight to Japan to help their aging population. Fresh grad from hospital makes a pretty penny. It's getting pretty streamlined. And it's only going to increase. Nursing schools costs too much for some though.
"So never refuse an invitation, never resist the unfamiliar, never fail to be polite and never outstay the welcome. Just keep your mind open and suck in the experience. And if it hurts, you know what? It's probably worth it."

Like to read?Third World Hero
Like to see?3WorldHero -- Did he really just do that?

mguy
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Posts: 749
Joined: Sat Nov 24, 2012 6:09 pm

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