As if it wasn't clear enough (from FilpinoCupid)

[dragonsmack68]

Just for fun I decided to log back into my old dating site. I did a search using the following criteria:

- Single
- up to 25 years old
- No children
- Bachelors degree or higher
- Davao City (area)

All I can say is...you are screwed..lol. I found exactly two women with that meet the above criteria and what I would considered fairly attractive. The cutest is an accountant though so maybe..... now Cebu on the other hand....

[Johnny1975]

I'm starting to get the feeling that there are a lot of filipinos that are snobs. And the fact that there are about 500,000,000,000,000 women there makes it easier to be ridiculously picky. But that doesn't mean that there aren't a lot of good ones. I don't care what anyone thinks, I would just go for what I like.

[publicduende]

I know it must be frustrating listening to someone who's never been there, and who hasn't seen what you've seen, or knows what you know, and hearing me being simplistic. I get it. I'm sure there are lots of things that I've said that probably make you think wow, this guy really doesn't know what it's like over here.

Not particularly. The fact you have never been here, or you have only been here for a total of a few weeks, doesn't mean you are not entitled to an opinion, and that your opinion is not the product of some serious thinking. I appreciate the way you and a handful of others, including gsjackson and droid, engage on countless threads are all about me and my problems. Not so usual to find people who care at all, especially online. The fact their opinions and points of view differ from yours can only be a good thing: best things come from dialectics, clash of perspectives.

However, I keep thinking about the fact that although you're having bad luck, plenty of others are doing well. And no, I don't think it's always because they have very low standards or are just tourists or whatever. The way you talk about how things are for you is not something that I hear often.

This is something I would like to know more about. Who are the others who are "doing well"? What is your definition of doing well? If by doing well you mean having access to a lot of p***y at short notice, or getting a lot of (often unsolicited/unwanted) female attention and interest, or living la vida loca with young hotties who love to party with you, these are all attainable goals. Attainable, so long one doesn't pay too much attention to the quality of the women, which is the single most important element when looking for a serious, long-term relationship.

Believe me, if you can. Whatever your definition of "doing well", finding a girl who ticks even just half of my boxes (young, pretty, well educated and reasonably ambitious, decent family, not so desperate to get a boyfriend, never married/no kids) is much, much harder than you can imagine.

Please review your online chat friends. If you are happy to disclose statistics, obviously without making any names, please tell me: how many of them are from metropolitan areas (Metro Manila, Metro Cebu, Davao, etc.) and how many of them from smaller cities and neck of the woods townships? I have only been on FC for a few short days ane received dozens of messages and "hearts" (expression of interest).

Despite making it very clear that I live in Davao, have a business in Davao, am serious about settling in Davao and "catch me, I'm in Davao", I have perhaps received 5 or 6 messages from women living here or around here. All of them were unattractive and in their late 30s to 40s. Where are the locals? I tell ya: they are too sophisticated for someone like me and you. They stick to their peers, who are certainly not scarce, despite the incredible number of gays and ladyboys I see around. The few who do have a fancy for foreign boys will be able to find much younger and better looking guys just by hitting a mall, going to a bar or the few decent clubs downtown.

So there's your solution: go date in smaller cities. A logistical nightmare, if you know how badly the Philippines are connected! Even to spend a day in uneventful Digos City, the closest decent-sized town outside Davao, one has to take a 2-to-3 hour ride, which times two, means you spend half of your day travelling. It might make sense if I already had a strong prospect, but I don't and doubt I ever will. Plus, as I realised with the girl from Dumaguete, girls found outside the cities are even less educated and more simpletons.

Yes they might be "gems" for those men who are convinced that they have to groom the girl like a father. I am not one of them. I am looking for somebody with a personality and a brain, not someone whom I need to teach the basics of English and the basics of life. Yes, of course I'll have to look for someone a bit more mature than 20 or 21...and that's where you see the ocean of single moms and seasoned spinster who take you 5 minutes to understand why they have so far remained loveless.

One more about your definition of success: I were to judge from the foreigners I know here who are with Filipinas, they are with far less than remarkable girls. The few young stud types I know know they can have it good and bed a different girl every night, if they are sober enough to remember!, and avoid commitment at all costs. The adult foreigners who have a Filipina gf are with uneducated, plain and poor looking girls. The few times I see them in their company, the girls seem more preoccupied with typing on her brand new phone than talking to their partners.

I have no idea if these men are happy and contented, but surely - knowing a few of them and their cultural levels - I must conclude they must have compromised quite a lot when looking for a girl. Or maybe hooked up with the first girl who was introduced to them by neighbours, acquaintances. All in all, I would personally think twice when calling them "success stories".

Also, I think about the fact that I've chatted to loads of filipinas on dating sites, and a reasonable number of them have been fairly articulate. When I say teach them english I don't mean from scratch, I just mean a few corrections here and there, if necessary.

I have no experience over there, so I can only speculate or go from my limited experience on dating sites, plus everything I've heard and read for the last few years. For the most part it's positive. Again, there has to be one or two significant reasons why you in particular are having bad luck.

The expat experience thing is one of the things that fooled me, too, LOL

I was in Davao a mere 4 years ago. Not more than a few weeks, but I clearly remember the city being more provincial than now and girls far more approachable. It might be the Duterte effect that instilled pride in Davaoenos and Davaoenas - and rightly so! - but this round of Davao life is presenting itself a lot more challenging. The humble girls are just as plain and un-interesting than before and the few pretty girls are more "maldita" (snobbish) than ever. I put that down to even more visual social media like Snapchat and Instagram, that took away even more of the textual/descriptive aspect in favour of pure selfie narcissism. But, as you know, this is a worldwide phenomenon. I can assure you it's well felt here and especially here.

Moral of the story...emerging societies like the Philippines are in tumultuous change and what is true or partly true on one foreign tourist or expat account in 2015 might no longer apply in 2017. I can definitely see that that window of opportunity for adult foreigners looking for a Filipina young gem is closing fast. Davao is already kaputt, Cebu has been for a long while. Metro Manila is more of a go, but simply because it's an awfully sprawling megalopolis where all walks of life can be found.

What I can, sadly, conclude is that unless I embark on a long journey through the Mindanao (or the Visayan) province, which is impossible given my work constraints, expressly looking for a pretty but semi-literate girl to extract from her family context and bring with me to Davao, I will always get diddy squat. That is perhaps my only way out of this.

You've spent a lot of time and energy explaining why it's not working out for you. There's always a reason, always an explanation, and I'm not saying that you're making it up. But if it turns out that there's one simple thing that you're not doing, or one thing that you're not compromising on which perhaps you could, or just one thing that you might change, wouldn't it be a better use of your energy to try to figure out what it is?

It's simple at the end of the day. Either that country / region / city absolutely objectively does not have what you're looking for, or it does but you're not seeing it. If it doesn't, leave.

The simple thing I am not doing is: I am not heading out for the province, the smaller towns, especially the university towns (like Koronadal, Iligan or Zamboanga) looking to "recruit" a girlfriend. That is the *only* thing that would work.

I can't leave now without killing the business, that's the problem. I have 15 staff and several projects, it would be incredibly selfish of me to leave everything just to give myself a (dubious) chance to find love in the deep province.

[publicduende]

"I am under constant scrutiny from a lot of people. I cannot just "not care". "
...might be part of your problem. Who knows, subconsciously (this is just a suggestion), it could be that you feel like you have to pick someone based on how it makes you look to the local community / your circle of friends, acquaintances and associates. I'm just saying it's a possibility.

It's not even that subconscious, it's very evident I don't live in a desert island and I have to be at least aware that, if I were to bring my barely-speaking young girl from the province to, say, a formal event in Manila packed with businessmen, politicians and socialites, I will have to meet with their judgment. Filipinos, like most Asians, are extremely judgmental people. It's not their judgment I am scared about, though, it's the repercussion of their judgment on business dealings and relationships.

Maybe I haven't said this on the forum but on the one occasion I brought C. the young Ateneo de Manila smartie I met, I lost the respect of the girlfriends of my two friends in Manila, my lawyer and his best friend, both of whom I have business dealings with. Reason? C. is young (23) and looks even younger. They apparently didn't like me not dating "one of my stock".

Now, you could say these are a bunch of snobbish people and I should withdraw in my paradise island and live a simple but fulfilling life. I wish it was that simple. By choice, I have to mingle with these kinds of people. Who, by the way, are not evil per se: they're just traditional and judgmental.

[publicduende]

I'm starting to get the feeling that there are a lot of filipinos that are snobs. And the fact that there are about 500,000,000,000,000 women there makes it easier to be ridiculously picky. But that doesn't mean that there aren't a lot of good ones. I don't care what anyone thinks, I would just go for what I like.

Just like Italians, Filipinos like to scr*w their fellow countrymen a lot. This is what makes FIlipinos friendly to anyone, at least on the surface, but deeply suspicious of anyone who doesn't come from the same circles (e.g. same university, same community, same clubs). They are very, very tribal in their choice of social relationships.

Believe me, for all the million girls here in the Philippines, the "good ones" are pretty scarce. Maybe 2% of the total. And how many of that 2% is free and happy to date an adult foreigner...an even smaller amount. Most of those would accept a foreigner are to be found in the province. So I need to get going...soon.

[publicduende]

Just for fun I decided to log back into my old dating site. I did a search using the following criteria:

- Single
- up to 25 years old
- No children
- Bachelors degree or higher
- Davao City (area)

All I can say is...you are screwed..lol. I found exactly two women with that meet the above criteria and what I would considered fairly attractive. The cutest is an accountant though so maybe..... now Cebu on the other hand....

Cebu is full of extremely proud people who need to have a bloody good reason to like a foreigner, especially if mature. The province around Cebu, well, that's a different story. The only two women I ever chatted with from Cebu City were essentially single moms and of the "scammy" type. If I have to date a girl in a large city, I would choose places like Makati or Quezon City many times over.

[hammanta]

Just for fun I decided to log back into my old dating site. I did a search using the following criteria:

- Single
- up to 25 years old
- No children
- Bachelors degree or higher
- Davao City (area)

All I can say is...you are screwed..lol. I found exactly two women with that meet the above criteria and what I would considered fairly attractive. The cutest is an accountant though so maybe..... now Cebu on the other hand....

The quality chicks spend about a week on a dating site then say to hell with it after getting spammed ridiculously by dick pics, nude cam requests, and nursing home geriatrics, etc. I banged a hot girl from Davao working in Cebu City from DIA. While laying in bed I asked her how many messages she had got before me. She opened the Website and showed me something like 150 messages just in the last week she had gotten. Some of those messages were just plain weird, others far to straight forward, and even more just pathetic (marriage requests, continued "why don't you talk to me" requests, sad stories, etc). And I thought I was a player on there. She never opened 90% of them. Needless to say we had some good laughs reading them.

With that said, I'd concentrate on New Arrivals as they are usually the less tainted. Quality girls who usually get on dating sites do so in times of turmoil, mainly when they get cheated on by a local (filipinos are notorious for this) or dumped by a local or, like the case of my ex, try it out because their schedule is too busy to spend time sifting through guys in person. Jumping on these girls is the key and you gotta stand out. Gotta separate yourself from those Dick pick senders.

All in all, dating sites are going down hill big time. Last year I had better luck on Tinder (it's where met my current girl) and downloaded Badoo recently just to see what's up and got a lot of interest in the few days I was on there. Those sites may be a better bet as it generally separates out desperately poor girls (you need a smart phone), is simple to sign on to, and isn't a blatant site strictly for foreigners. You gotta actually be in the area you are swiping.

[publicduende]

The quality chicks spend about a week on a dating site then say to hell with it after getting spammed ridiculously by dick pics, nude cam requests, and nursing home geriatrics, etc. I banged a hot girl from Davao working in Cebu City from DIA. While laying in bed I asked her how many messages she had got before me. She opened the Website and showed me something like 150 messages just in the last week she had gotten. Some of those messages were just plain weird, others far to straight forward, and even more just pathetic (marriage requests, continued "why don't you talk to me" requests, sad stories, etc). And I thought I was a player on there. She never opened 90% of them. Needless to say we had some good laughs reading them.

With that said, I'd concentrate on New Arrivals as they are usually the less tainted. Quality girls who usually get on dating sites do so in times of turmoil, mainly when they get cheated on by a local (filipinos are notorious for this) or dumped by a local or, like the case of my ex, try it out because their schedule is too busy to spend time sifting through guys in person. Jumping on these girls is the key and you gotta stand out. Gotta separate yourself from those Dick pick senders.

I agree on all the line. Some sites like DIA have a "new" label so it's easy to spot those who just signed up. Some of the better chats had (including the Dumaguete girl) was with girls who literally signed up 48 hours before. Nonetheless, it's a game that takes time and peace of mind, neither of which I have plenty of. I am sitting here typing away because it's a holiday long wekeend (Kadayawan) and my team was off, so had time to get quite a lot done yesterday.

All in all, dating sites are going down hill big time. Last year I had better luck on Tinder (it's where met my current girl) and downloaded Badoo recently just to see what's up and got a lot of interest in the few days I was on there. Those sites may be a better bet as it generally separates out desperately poor girls (you need a smart phone), is simple to sign on to, and isn't a blatant site strictly for foreigners. You gotta actually be in the area you are swiping.

I met a few interesting people on Tinder. The average cultural level is much higher, they tend to be all professional women or women with someone to say/do in life. Only caveat: they are all in their late 20s to 30s, most separated looking for some diversion. The other quirkiness is: Tinder doesn't work on Globe SIMs. Strange but true, it only works on a handful of cells. Most of the time I had to use it on a wi-fi connection, which kind of defies the point of "dating on the go".

Badoo...never tried.

All in all I agree with you: if a girl has dating options, she wouldn't even be interested in joining a dating site. Nor dating a foreigner, I would add.

[hammanta]

I met a few interesting people on Tinder. The average cultural level is much higher, they tend to be all professional women or women with someone to say/do in life. Only caveat: they are all in their late 20s to 30s, most separated looking for some diversion. The other quirkiness is: Tinder doesn't work on Globe SIMs. Strange but true, it only works on a handful of cells. Most of the time I had to use it on a wi-fi connection, which kind of defies the point of "dating on the go".

Badoo...never tried.

All in all I agree with you: if a girl has dating options, she wouldn't even be interested in joining a dating site. Nor dating a foreigner, I would add.

Hmmm didn't notice that, though my phone carrier charges me crazy amount for data overseas so I just use WIFI most of the time anyways. I'd check out Badoo, couldn't hurt. I think it's more popular in Asia. There's also Bumble where the women are supposed to send the first message but as one can imagine it's pretty shitty.

I do think there are a small sub section of women that fall into the category where they are too good for normal guys but not good enough for the top notch dudes that get on dating sites. For instance an ex of mine had degree was one of the top in her graduating class. Became a mobile marketer for company in Singapore. She made 3k USD average per month living in a Province town and often times made more; owned a mango farm and Sari Sari store. She wasn't top notch in looks but still cute. Her income level and education level in a province town out surpassed majority of men. And she wasn't good enough to get the top notch guys in looks and success. So she decided to go online. I know a few girls like that that did have options but the options weren't up to their desired standards. But again they are few and far between.

[Johnny1975]

I give up. You paint a very bleak picture. If everything you're saying is accurate, then f**k the Philippines. But one of my golden rules of life is : get a second opinion. Or in this case, I'd need to see evidence that more people agree with you than disagree. No matter how convinced you are, I cannot believe that it's how you describe unless I can see that yours is the majority view, and so far, that is not the case. I'll take everything you've said on board, but let's not forget, this is your experience, your reality, your circumstances, and your personal preferences.

By the way, did you know that Rome has the largest number of filipinos in Europe?

[publicduende]

I give up. You paint a very bleak picture. If everything you're saying is accurate, then f**k the Philippines. But one of my golden rules of life is : get a second opinion. Or in this case, I'd need to see evidence that more people agree with you than disagree. No matter how convinced you are, I cannot believe that it's how you describe unless I can see that yours is the majority view, and so far, that is not the case. I'll take everything you've said on board, but let's not forget, this is your experience, your reality, your circumstances, and your personal preferences.

By the way, did you know that Rome has the largest number of filipinos in Europe?

Johnny, if it was just the product of my negativity, of a bad day or a bad month, do you think a man like me, a veteran of an extremely disciplined profession (software engineering) would spend hours and hours penning dark and depressing threads like these and keep complaining like a whining child?

My frustration, my burning comes from seeing that this the reality of dating in this country. This is the dating pool a man like me, despite my qualities and all the hard work to let those qualities shine through, can access. There is nothing beyond it.

Past a certain age (around 40, I believe) and a certain stage of physical appearance, you get the same women whether you are handsome or ugly, whether you're broke or wealthy, whether you spend your days drinking beer or you work your a** off 14 hours a day to give a few good IT kids a better future in their home city. And the reason is not that those girls have a better heart or can see past appearances and "read a man's heart". That's the myth a few dating sites still want to perpetuate. It's much simpler: those girls have no other options, or the other options are so undesirable that a foreigner is preferred, or they need somebody who can sort their family finances out quick and they don't mind giving themselves away to a foreigner, to any foreigner.

Nobody will ever tell you this straight to your face. Not the girl, not her (extended) family and friends. Filipinos are good at screwing one another up but display a remarkable team play when it's an outsider (in this case a foreigner) who needs to be screwed. The tribal game, basically. It took me two long and painful years to understand why every single attempt was a failure, why I couldn't approach any woman not of some stratospheric quality, but, say, 50% of what my ex-wife has been to me. Why I have seen the girls I have been with having me one day and a guy 20 years older or 10 years younger the week after. Whatever goes.

In other words, the barrier for the mediocre girls is set so low that anyone could get them. The barrier for the quality girls who are desirable and world-class is set so high that we just won't get them. They're snapped up by the locals and, even if they were single and available, the chances of convincing them to be with us would be lottery-winning thin. And in between, where one would expect a large gray area full of nuances and opportunities, there seems to be not much worth picking.

There is more: this is a society essentially stuck in a time-warp, in a caricature of the 80's-style American Dream...money, success, notoriety, and beauty. Possibly obtained by alleged magical shortcuts requiring minimal talent, minimal hard work and even minimal time. Only, the Philippines are nowhere near the powerhouse that US were at that time and Filipinos are nowhere near as educated, creative, independent and hard working as the Americans were, at that time in history at least.

Yes, one or three girls can fool you on a chat window - they are all hard working, proud, beautiful inside and out. They all help their families and give all the money to them. They are all open to listening to you, they reiterate a few soothing words from their limited vocabulary and, after telling you what an amazing man you are, promise you unconditional love. Thing is: if they were even half as good as they portray themselves online, they would have been picked up by a Filipino man and married up. Or they would be snobbish as hell and (metaphorically or not-so-metaphorically-speaking) selling themselves to the Filipino highest bidder. Reality check: they're not as good and they know it. They need a foreigner to complete their lives, get out of poverty and, who can blame them, get their stab at being respected and happy.

As long as you have people with p***y-goggles who would accept any woman who is younger, more slender and more submissive than the valkyrie they had as ex-wife back home, the myth will continue to perpetuate itself and more men will come here for a semi-literate souvenir girl from the province who will make most locals giggle. If that's what a man here wants, then sure, it's one big success story: endless happiness and fun await in the Philippines!

Or maybe you're stuck, like me, in this silly obsession that a 43 years old man who is well-educated, from a good family, still willing to challenge himself and be productive, hard working and open to making more sacrifices than what he's already making, deserves a better girl than what anyone could get in 3 chats and 48 hours of residency. If that's your mojo, then brace yourself for disappointment.

[Johnny1975]

Hold on, what's your idea of a quality girl? If it involves status / wealth or being world class (whatever that means), then that's irrelevant to my definition. My definition is based on personal qualities and how she was raised.

Does a girl really have to have a degree? Is it really necessary? If she's intelligent and hard working at whatever job she does, then what's the problem? And what if her english is at a level where you have to explain a word or a term here and there from time to time (I don't mean "the" or "yes")? Is that really a dealbreaker? So what if she doesn't know what superfluous means? Just tell her. I'm not even sure what it means.

As for intelligence, it's pointless to expect to be able to have a highly intellectual conversation with a woman from any part of the world, nor is it important. As long as you can talk to her about most things and she at least can follow what you're talking about (I'm talking about intelligence, not language skills), that should be good enough. I mean, if you start a conversation about politics, history, philosophy or whatever, if she can grasp enough to be able to engage, that's all you need. And it doesn't even matter if her thoughts are not original. Women are for pleasant conversation (among other things), not intellectual tennis. It's just not that important.

But you know, maybe you're right. It could well be that the Philippines is jam packed with giggly little girls who don't know anything about anything and who love to fidget with their phones all day and have no interest in anything beyond the everyday, and who are all clones of each other. But as I keep saying, don't underestimate the effect of your mindset. If I'm looking for something in a room, I have a picture in my mind of what it looks like, and if I come across the object but it doesn't match the picture, I'll overlook it. I've done it so many times.

Are you really saying that even if you compromise as far as is possible, that you still won't find someone suitable? Why don't you try compromising to a level that you currently would think is too much? I'm saying go beyond what you think is acceptable. Just as an exercise. Wipe the slate clean. Do something, anything, to challenge your mindset. And if your mindset stays the same, then you move on and forget about filipinas.

By the way why don't you give some examples of what you're looking for (photos, videos).

[publicduende]

In a pretty tentative English, that's another friend of mine (married, in her early 40s like me) telling me how things are, honestly.

A woman who's single, pretty, with a degree and no kids will not really be into foreigners because they can find a good job and have a good life even without a foreigner.

How many of you are still excited at the prospect of having a girl who is with you because you are the only way to live a better life? I am personally not so keen. P***y is important, but dignity is even more important. Of course p***y can be an excellent reason to drop one's dignity for a while...but then it comes back.

[droid]

^I'm gonna come off as mysoginistic or something and please don't take offense but why are you discussing your romantic woes with a hag that thinks so highly of herself duende? Sometimes that's ok to vent off but really It will conduct nowhere, of course she won't tell you you deseve better, as that would bring her own value down. Won't introduce you to anything but similar hags etc.
Some months ago this aquantice of mine from central europe, asked when I was going to finally go there, "I have several single mommies, interested in you"

[publicduende]

^I'm gonna come off as mysoginistic or something and please don't take offense but why are you discussing your romantic woes with a hag that thinks so highly of herself duende? Sometimes that's ok to vent off but really It will conduct nowhere, of course she won't tell you you deseve better, as that would bring her own value down. Won't introduce you to anything but similar hags etc.
Some months ago this aquantice of mine from central europe, asked when I was going to finally go there, "I have several single mommies, interested in you"

Thanks for taking my defense, dear Droid. It so happens that she is a dear friend, from the Rotary club, she is not a hag and I expressly asked her to be honest. She actually did say I deserve the girl I want, but she also admitted it's not easy...

The thing is, Filipinas if anything have grace. They are always reluctant to say hurtful things to someone, especially to a man and especially if they have no reason to hurt (e.g. they're not upset or maybe tampo). I had to convince her to tell me the truth. This is the truth. Now, please, don't tell me that I put these words into her mouth, or something It's how things are over here in Filipinland. I am not eating my hat over it anymore, this last bout of replies on this disgraced miserable thread has worked miracles to finally allow me let off any remaining steam.

I just have to accept it as a fact of life and shape my life around it. It is not very likely that I won't make it past the end of the year. I have a meeting just tomorrow with a foreigner who lives in Samal, a very senior developer who has founded 4 successful software companies between Manila, Cebu, and Davao. I will ask him to co-run my company for a few months, with a view to give it or sell it to him and my other Filipino partner.

Absolutely no point remaining in a country that is not prepared nor happy to accept my qualities and will never see past the age barrier.

Yeah Droid, they're all "single mommies" (hopefully not "single mummies" ) anywhere. In most countries the value of a single mom in the "dating market" is a tiny fraction of what a single unmarried girl with would have. I have never been to Eastern Europe for dating (but once, and it wasn't a pleasant experience) but I can imagine the cookie crumbles the same way as here in the Philippines.