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Taiwan Observations - Taboo, Deep and Truthful

Discuss culture, living, traveling, relocating, dating or anything related to the Asian countries - China, The Philippines, Thailand, etc.

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ladislav
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Post by ladislav » June 1st, 2010, 10:02 pm

If you ask anyone in Asia to describe an American, a smile will come up: an American? Expressive, warm, creative, warm-hearted, passionate. Open, sincere. Open-hearted. Hospitable. Intelligent and super RICH!!! Valiant, caring about others. Good provider. Helpful and super duper friendly.

That's an American!

Tom Cruise?

Bruce Willis?

Rambo?

Tony Danza?
A brain is a terrible thing to wash!

Rock
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Post by Rock » June 2nd, 2010, 6:40 am

Winston wrote:
Rock wrote: Loneliness in a country is not necessarily correlated with how "open, expressive, outgoing, and friendly" it is. I find people in many parts of the US to be all of those things. Yet they also seem very fake and plastic and that sort of behavior certainly does not make me feel less lonely. The thing that helps me most is that I have zero expectations.

I remember a few months ago chatting with a taxi driver who had returned to Taiwan a couple of years ago after having spent nearly twenty years staying in Orange County where his children still lived. He told me he felt lonely in the States because everyone was so private and socially restricted. But in Taiwan, he could call friends at almost anytime last minute, day or night, and get together or food, tea, or beers.
How are typical Americans "open, expressive, outgoing, and friendly"? Do you mean they way they jeer in bars? The way they go "Yahoooooo. Eeeeeehaw!" when they win? The way they yell in sports games? The way they go "Alright. YA!"? Or when they yell "PARTY ON!"?

To me that's loud pumping, not open and friendly.

Or the way two strangers walking their dog pass each other and smile and say hi and just pass by?

Or the way Americans are friendly and expressive in movies?

I can't see how I could be lonely in an "open, expressive, outgoing, and friendly" country. How do you define those terms?

So what is a typical American these days, someone from Peoria? The States is not South Korea, its a very diverse place. You will probably get very different experiences in Manhattan vs. Ft. Meyers vs. Detroit vs. Tuscaloosa vs. Freemont vs. ... (you get my point) and depending on what demographics and circles you expose yourself to.

I spend a fair amount of time with my friend in the Santa Monica / LA area (notorious for being superficial) and people are generally all these things (open, expressive, outgoing, and friendly) to us. I mean they like to hang with us, joke around, and talk. Its not that hard to expand circles from existing contacts either. Perhaps it is a function of his outgoing and easygoing personality and his love of American sports that attracts this. When I'm alone, I don't have the type of personality to easily meet strangers there the way he does. I think when you naturally love a place the way he loves SoCal, it helps a lot. He is in his 40s with an average income and from Sweden but emigrated to the States at around 20. He visits his parents' home every year or two and tells me that people from his city (Malmo) are super cold compared to LA. However, he told me that once you get to know them which takes some time, they are much more sincere and solid as friends. He even told me a few years ago that in the States, he has way too many friends but that no ladies are interested in him. He ended up meeting a northeastern China girl online, marrying her, and bringing her to the States.

Sometimes I go to Norfolk/Virginia Beach area where my sister now lives. She is a very outgoing type, has a ton of friends, and has no problem meeting new people. She's also lived in San Diego, rural Illinois, Corpus Christi, and Monterrey and says Virginia is much friendlier and more pleasant than any of those other places. People do seem very open and friendly when I am there but I do realize that prevalent political views are different from mine so I avoid sensitive topics.

I visited Sarasota last year and was surprised at how generally friendly, warm, and unhurried people were towards me. This includes young people too. People in malls, restaurants, the beaches, etc. Perhaps it was a function of the weak economy but it certainly was refreshing.
Last edited by Rock on June 2nd, 2010, 9:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

globetrotter
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Post by globetrotter » June 2nd, 2010, 8:14 am

Chinese don't do what is best for themselves at the expense of others, they just only act in their interests and don't care about anyone else. Drive in China for one month and you will see.

Think about this for a second:

Why would a society develop MULTIPLE ideologies that placed restraints upon behaviour if people were not acting out the worst violations of the new code?

IOW Chinese are prone to doing the OPPOSITE of what is taught in Confucianism. Kong-zi needed to teach people because their inherent nature was beastly. Unlike Christianity which has managed to internailse many ideals into people's day to day behaviour, many Chinese still need this code enforced from without to within.

The concept of saving face is central to this - it doesn't matter WHAT YOU DO, it matters WHEN YOU ARE CAUGHT. You don't bring shame upon your family by taking an action, lying or breaking the law -- you bring shame upon them by being caught out and exposed. Only then do the heads hung in shame appear; until then the act as they wish with no compunction at all.

This is unlike New Yorkers, who in business toss a tonne of shit your way to test you to see if you can handle it, or the Hucksters of L.A. who will try to scam you at every turn - The Chinese will simply behave without bound like an expanding sphere of gas until you tell them that a certain thing is rude. THEN they back off because being rude is far, far worse than being immoral or unethical or illegal.

This is obvious on the international scene wrt the USA. China will do what it wants until the USA does not allow it to do so. Americans don't get it, all the way up to the State Dept., and the Chinese will continue on their path until someone stops allowing them to do what they are doing. They will act in their own interests without bound until they encounter a wall or implacable counterparty.

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Post by Winston » July 20th, 2010, 7:03 pm

After observing the behavior and body language of Taiwanese girls some more, I came up with these new observations and analysis:

- Taiwanese have a repressed look on their face, and an introverted, cold, strict, stuck up expression. They appear very closed in personality and social attitude, and act overly serious and inhibited. If you look in their eyes, you see a miserable repressed inner state of anxiety. This is apparent all over Taiwan. If you are antisocial, closed, cold and stuck up yourself, you may not notice it (since you are the same as them and will see nothing abnormal about it). But if you are outgoing, open, direct, relaxed and extroverted, you will notice it for sure for it will strongly contrast the way you are.

- Being in Taiwan feels like a sci fi horror movie. I feel like a normal human in a society of people who have been genetically and artificially altered into zombies by some evil computer or rulers. Definitely a Twilight Zone experience. That's because Taiwanese do not act natural, but are cold, repressed and inhibited to an abnormal degree. This is not just about being snobby or stuck up. It's about EXTREME suppression and repression, either by upbringing or the general "Memes" of their culture and hive mentality.

- Taiwanese are completely driven by fear and guilt. It's in their vibes and face to the nth degree, and will rub off on you if you are around them long. They are conditioned to be weak and insecure. Inside they are empty and miserable. These are the traits that drive them to be conformists and workaholics. Living in fear, weakness and having no identity, they badly need something to conform to and a structure in their lives for security and safety.

This is why so many of them are workaholics and often work 7 days a week. It's not just because they like to make money. That is just their excuse, for even wealthy retired Taiwanese are still workaholics. It's because working all the time gives their fearful empty selves some structure to conform to, which brings them a sense of safety and security. That's what makes them such willing slaves, and those who run the country love it. That's what drives Taiwanese to seek fixed structures and routines, as well as bondage and servitude. Their minds are not free at all, and neither are their lives. They don't want to be free. Freedom brings insecurity and loss of identity to the Taiwanese. Eric Fromm's "Escape from Freedom" treatise describes the Taiwanese psyche very well.

- On the surface, Taiwanese appear very shy, especially young women. But that shyness is just a symptom, not the root cause of people being difficult to meet in Taiwan. For instance, there are many shy sweet innocent girls in the Philippines too. But they are also relaxed and open, and enthusiastic about meeting new people. And they are NOT hard to meet at all. That is an important difference. You see, at the root, the Taiwanese psyche is fundamentally FEARFUL, CLOSED and NARROW. It's in their nature and difficult for them to overcome, unless they live abroad. That's why they are so socially closed, and can't meet people unless they are introduced by mutual friends, or through connecting activities and routines like school and work. Thus they are socially conservative and somewhat "nerdy".

And that's why Taiwanese girls in particular, are like deer and spook easily. They are the most frightened creatures on Earth, and have a fearful closed body language which is easily observable. They have no social skills, no confidence, and are the exact opposite of open and direct. They cannot deal with anything outside of their realm of familiarity and routine. These words may sound unkind or judgmental, but that is the obvious truth.
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CIA
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Post by CIA » March 23rd, 2011, 10:20 am

glob, you pretty much described an american. they just only act in their interests and don't care about anyone else=american. how else do you manage to be the richest country in the world? theres plenty of proof out there to show that americans get rich by sabatoging the industries of other countries. just watch this video http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 9556832271
ironically, it is hosted on google, a cia front.
i can answer your question about Why would a society develop MULTIPLE ideologies that placed restraints upon behaviour if people were not acting out the worst violations of the new code?
but this answer is in regards to american law. you see, america actually has the highest prison population in the world. you are 6 times more likely to end up in prison in the u.s. than you are in China. so why does the u.s. set up these strict rules while people are savagely violating the law? simple. profits. america has a huge prison industry that allows for many multinational corporations to get rich, alongside prison contractors and so forth. for more information on american prisons, see this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IWxpQ87C4t4. ironically again, hosted on youtube, a google subsidiary.
http://www.csmonitor.com/2003/0818/p02s01-usju.html
how exactly has christianity internalise many ideals into peoples day to day behaviour? you mean like u.s. troops slaughtering millions of iraqis, vietnamese, koreans, pakistanis, and afgans? is this the kind of christian behaviour you speak of? heres a little video the u.s military doesnt want you to see. it contains some of these christian behaviours you speak of http://tv.globalresearch.ca/2010/10/vid ... nt-you-see

China does what it wants to eh? you got things turned upside down. the u.s. does what it wants to on the international scene, including overthrowing democracies, while claiming to promote it. in fact, one of the first things they tell u.s. soldiers is to forget about the geneva convention and shoot everyone within 50 metres. let's just take a look at some of the recent events that have happened. egypt- govt overthrown by the u.s., tunisia- overthrown by u.s., libya- u.s. launched aggression (unprovoked), yemen. http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/CIAtimeline.html if throwing colour revolutions whenever you want isnt doing whatever you want, then i dont know what is. the u.s. has turned the world into a mockery, where it bribes other countries into behaving the way it wants in the united nations.

glob, i am sure you will disagree with most of my statements as you probably travel the globe as an economic hitman, so this response is for everyone except you.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTbdnNgqfs8
globetrotter wrote:Chinese don't do what is best for themselves at the expense of others, they just only act in their interests and don't care about anyone else. Drive in China for one month and you will see.

Think about this for a second:

Why would a society develop MULTIPLE ideologies that placed restraints upon behaviour if people were not acting out the worst violations of the new code?

IOW Chinese are prone to doing the OPPOSITE of what is taught in Confucianism. Kong-zi needed to teach people because their inherent nature was beastly. Unlike Christianity which has managed to internailse many ideals into people's day to day behaviour, many Chinese still need this code enforced from without to within.

The concept of saving face is central to this - it doesn't matter WHAT YOU DO, it matters WHEN YOU ARE CAUGHT. You don't bring shame upon your family by taking an action, lying or breaking the law -- you bring shame upon them by being caught out and exposed. Only then do the heads hung in shame appear; until then the act as they wish with no compunction at all.

This is unlike New Yorkers, who in business toss a tonne of shit your way to test you to see if you can handle it, or the Hucksters of L.A. who will try to scam you at every turn - The Chinese will simply behave without bound like an expanding sphere of gas until you tell them that a certain thing is rude. THEN they back off because being rude is far, far worse than being immoral or unethical or illegal.

This is obvious on the international scene wrt the USA. China will do what it wants until the USA does not allow it to do so. Americans don't get it, all the way up to the State Dept., and the Chinese will continue on their path until someone stops allowing them to do what they are doing. They will act in their own interests without bound until they encounter a wall or implacable counterparty.

momopi
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Post by momopi » March 23rd, 2011, 2:46 pm

If you want to see how Taiwanese businessmen relax and indulge in hedonism, take a short flight from TW to Xiamen and visit a few places like 一代佳人, 新一代佳人, 東方名殿, etc. The largest cabarets have ~3,000 girls on rotation (bigger than the ones in Taichung). Be warned that some are owned by Taiwanese gangsters from the Celestial Way Federation, so stay out of trouble and know where your $$ is going.

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CIA
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Post by CIA » March 24th, 2011, 6:50 pm

glob, you pretty much described an american. they just only act in their interests and don't care about anyone else=american. how else do you manage to be the richest country in the world? theres plenty of proof out there to show that americans get rich by sabatoging the industries of other countries. just watch this video http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 9556832271
ironically, it is hosted on google, a cia front.
i can answer your question about Why would a society develop MULTIPLE ideologies that placed restraints upon behaviour if people were not acting out the worst violations of the new code?
but this answer is in regards to american law. you see, america actually has the highest prison population in the world. you are 6 times more likely to end up in prison in the u.s. than you are in China. so why does the u.s. set up these strict rules while people are savagely violating the law? simple. profits. america has a huge prison industry that allows for many multinational corporations to get rich, alongside prison contractors and so forth. for more information on american prisons, see this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IWxpQ87C4t4. ironically again, hosted on youtube, a google subsidiary.
http://www.csmonitor.com/2003/0818/p02s01-usju.html
how exactly has christianity internalised many ideals into peoples day to day behaviour? you mean like u.s. troops slaughtering millions of iraqis, vietnamese, koreans, pakistanis, and afgans? is this the kind of christian behaviour you speak of? heres a little video the u.s military doesnt want you to see. it contains some of these christian behaviours you speak of http://tv.globalresearch.ca/2010/10/vid ... nt-you-see

China does what it wants to eh? you got things turned upside down. the u.s. does what it wants to on the international scene, including overthrowing democracies, while claiming to promote it. in fact, one of the first things they tell u.s. soldiers is to forget about the geneva convention and shoot everyone within 50 metres. let's just take a look at some of the recent events that have happened. egypt- govt overthrown by the u.s., tunisia- overthrown by u.s., libya- u.s. launched aggression (unprovoked), yemen. http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/CIAtimeline.html if throwing colour revolutions whenever you want isnt doing whatever you want, then i dont know what is. the u.s. has turned the world into a mockery, where it bribes other countries into behaving the way it wants in the united nations.

glob, i am sure you will disagree with most of my statements as you probably travel the globe as an economic hitman, so this response is for everyone except you.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTbdnNgqfs8

it's funny how america and its rogue allies always complain about dictators like sadam, only to over throw him and murder even more people than he did. never mind the fact that america put him in power in the first place. put it this way, the u.s. and its rogue allies, britain and australia included, murdered more people within a 5 year time frame than sadam did in 25yrs. same thing goes for america complaining about terrorism while being the number one terrorist. some of the stuff coming out of the state dept is just ludicrous. they complain about China's military build up, while spending 10 times more than China. and while creating about 70% of the wars. the u.s. claims to promote democracy while overthrowing some of the best democracies in the world, simply because they stood in the way of corporate profits.
globetrotter wrote:Chinese don't do what is best for themselves at the expense of others, they just only act in their interests and don't care about anyone else. Drive in China for one month and you will see.

Think about this for a second:

Why would a society develop MULTIPLE ideologies that placed restraints upon behaviour if people were not acting out the worst violations of the new code?

IOW Chinese are prone to doing the OPPOSITE of what is taught in Confucianism. Kong-zi needed to teach people because their inherent nature was beastly. Unlike Christianity which has managed to internailse many ideals into people's day to day behaviour, many Chinese still need this code enforced from without to within.

The concept of saving face is central to this - it doesn't matter WHAT YOU DO, it matters WHEN YOU ARE CAUGHT. You don't bring shame upon your family by taking an action, lying or breaking the law -- you bring shame upon them by being caught out and exposed. Only then do the heads hung in shame appear; until then the act as they wish with no compunction at all.

This is unlike New Yorkers, who in business toss a tonne of shit your way to test you to see if you can handle it, or the Hucksters of L.A. who will try to scam you at every turn - The Chinese will simply behave without bound like an expanding sphere of gas until you tell them that a certain thing is rude. THEN they back off because being rude is far, far worse than being immoral or unethical or illegal.

This is obvious on the international scene wrt the USA. China will do what it wants until the USA does not allow it to do so. Americans don't get it, all the way up to the State Dept., and the Chinese will continue on their path until someone stops allowing them to do what they are doing. They will act in their own interests without bound until they encounter a wall or implacable counterparty.

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Post by Winston » June 20th, 2012, 6:19 pm

Taiwanese are cliquish and group oriented

Taiwanese are very cliquish and only hang in groups. They are insecure as individuals. The individual has no value and no identity. Groups are everything in Taiwan's social atmosphere. No one dares go out alone unless they are on their way to school or work. You will never see anyone going alone to a restaurant, cafe, pub, theater, etc. You will be seen as a loser if you go out alone in Taiwan. It's easier to meet people if you're in a group than alone - it's all about cliques.
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Post by Winston » June 20th, 2012, 6:22 pm

momopi wrote:If you want to see how Taiwanese businessmen relax and indulge in hedonism, take a short flight from TW to Xiamen and visit a few places like 一代佳人, 新一代佳人, 東方名殿, etc. The largest cabarets have ~3,000 girls on rotation (bigger than the ones in Taichung). Be warned that some are owned by Taiwanese gangsters from the Celestial Way Federation, so stay out of trouble and know where your $$ is going.
What can you do at those places? Your pics just show a bunch of girls on a stage. Is that it? Just a show? What can you do there that's hedonistic and not "conservative"?

What can you do at the Golden Jaguar in Taichung? Google has no info about what you can do inside there.
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Post by Blue Murder » June 20th, 2012, 6:29 pm

. . . I'm not even going to comment.

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Post by Fenix » June 20th, 2012, 8:09 pm

Albert Einstein was right about his insanity quote. It relates so much to Winston...

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Post by Blue Murder » June 20th, 2012, 9:27 pm

Phoenix, you're a pretty legit dude. Did I mentioned your badarsery factor is increased for looking like Tupac?
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Post by momopi » June 20th, 2012, 9:29 pm

Winston wrote: What can you do at those places? Your pics just show a bunch of girls on a stage. Is that it? Just a show? What can you do there that's hedonistic and not "conservative"?
What can you do at the Golden Jaguar in Taichung? Google has no info about what you can do inside there.
You're searching in the wrong language. Ask a local guy friend in TW or one of your male cousins to search online for you in Chinese & explain it to you.

Be aware of the difference between "princess" = hostess vs. shao-jie = hooker. My info may be outdated so you should check with someone who is more "current".

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Post by Fenix » June 20th, 2012, 11:03 pm

Blue Murder wrote:Phoenix, you're a pretty legit dude. Did I mentioned your badarsery factor is increased for looking like Tupac?
Thanks Blue! Blue is my favorite color :)

Winston already knows the deal. He knows how I feel about his delusion. Him and I had our battles. I was banned for 3, I mean 5 days for saying my grandmother punches faster than him. You know how funny this is? He bans me for dumb shit, but he lets PAN, BAW, and other trolls and scammers on this site go on a rampage.

Winston will never learn. He will continue to fail everywhere he goes because...

Wherever you go...there you are! He has the best success in the Philippines and this is because he had sex with prostitutes. He had more girlfriends in the US than anywhere else in the world. He left USA because it was hard to get a date, but he wants Taiwanese women so much because of the "challenge." He should have stayed in the US if he wanted girls that were challenging, right? Winston is a piece of work...

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Post by Winston » August 13th, 2012, 10:38 am

- In a way, Taiwanese are inverted compared to Westerners, in that they are closed and repressed on the exterior but are kind, good-natured, polite, and considerate deep down inside, whereas Westerners are more open, communicative, expressive, and articulate on the exterior but essentially "selfish a-holes" deep down inside. (pardon the language)

- Unlike youngsters in Europe and Russia, young people in Taiwan are totally NOT into deep meaningful intellectual conversations at all. Far from it. So if you are an intellectual or introvert who likes deep meaningful discussions, you will find Taiwanese youth to be disappointing in this area. At best, you may find open-minded people willing to listen in on deep meaningful conversations, but you won't find them contributing to such dialogues. No way. The most intellectual people I've met in Taiwan were Buddhist monks and elderly folks who have introspected on life and realized all the BS they were fed by their slave-driven society and culture. Young people in Taiwan are on a very superficial wavelength - they are not into history, philosophy, existential matters, or making insightful observations about people and things around them. Thus, if you are an intellectual, you may feel out of place in Taiwan, and would probably fit in better in Europe, where young intellectuals are far more common.

- Sadly, in Taiwan the more attractive the girls are, the more cold and unfriendly they are, and the less attractive they are, the more easy going and friendly they are, which SUCKS and is one of the major drawbacks of Taiwan, though it's taboo to mention it. Now don't get me wrong. There are a lot of friendly people in Taiwan who smile and are cheerful and helpful and polite. But it seems that almost any good looking young tall skinny girl there will be totally self-absorbed with no social skills - which sucks if you are a guy. In short, the better looking a girl in Taiwan is, the LESS friendly she is, while the worse looking she is, the more friendly she is - which sucks if you are a guy who likes hot girls. But for some reason it is politically incorrect to complain about this, as if you aren't supposed to. lol

It's too bad that Taiwan can't be like Russia, where hot girls are just as friendly, open and approachable, as average looking girls are, and have good social skills too - in total contrast to Taiwan, where the hottest girls are the most stuck up and have the most uptight walls around them. This is very true, but very taboo to mention for some reason. I don't know why. It's like it's obvious, but you aren't supposed to talk about it. Weird.
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