Pros and Cons of Living and Dating in the Philippines

[FreeYourMind]

Btw, it has been pretty cold here in the PH ever since I returned, amazingly. I've never seen it this cool before in the past 3 years. Must be due to either some weird pole shifts in the Earth or to that Global Warming scam. lol

When you say "cold," compared to what? I'm visiting the Philippines next month for the first time and one thing that interests me is dealing with the tropical humidity as I am a big fan of low humidity levels and currently live in a very dry climate.

[Winston]

Btw, it has been pretty cold here in the PH ever since I returned, amazingly. I've never seen it this cool before in the past 3 years. Must be due to either some weird pole shifts in the Earth or to that Global Warming scam. lol

When you say "cold," compared to what? I'm visiting the Philippines next month for the first time and one thing that interests me is dealing with the tropical humidity as I am a big fan of low humidity levels and currently live in a very dry climate.

I mean cold by Philippines standards, enough so that you don't have to use aircon and can just use a fan. I prefer dry climates too.

[Rock]

Well keep in mind that this is true mostly in Angeles, where the greedy flock to. Outside of Angeles in the small towns, provinces, and even in Cebu, there are many nice sweet poor girls who will NOT take advantage of you or act greedy/shameless. I've met some of them too. If you come to the PH, I can show you some of them. There are many poor girls who do not do that, and some are not even interested in foreigners too. So not all poor girls are like that.

There are friendly middle class girls that aren't that good looking and more open. You can meet middle class girls but it has to be by breaking into their cliques, working at their company, going to school with them, etc., which are the conservative normal routes.

I get along well in the PH as long as I am nice and kind to everyone, because they will treat me the same way, and thus there is a harmonious vibe here that is not present in the rest of Asia. That's an important thing. Don't forget that.

Once you tune into their frequency, as Ladislav and I have, you will do fine with them. You just gotta learn to "ride their wave".

It seems like different people have somewhat different perceptions about the PI. On this site, my sources have been Mr. S, Terrance, you, and Ladislav. Lad is overall the most positive and seems to genuinely love the place. Mr. S makes it sound like a step down from Thailand in terms of infrastructure and nightlife with girls who go downhill very fast after 25 or who have attitudes similar to American girls. Terrence seems to prefer Seoul and Shanghai for longer term and even found them both to be cheaper than Cebu overall for a reasonable quality of life. You often often refer to vibes you believe are not pleasant in NE Asia but very positive in PI. That may be the case. But keep in mind, that vibes are a product of both sides - you and members of the host population. Many gringos I met in Brazil raved about the friendliness and vibes there. But for me personally, I couldn't fully tune-in. The warm, friendly, and physical Brazilian style often rubbed me the wrong way because I felt it generally lacked sincerity or even opened me up to risk. I actually felt a lot more comfortable in Tokyo around more introverted and socially awkward types.

I really need to spend an extended period in PI - Makati, Cebu, and Angels - before I can make extended comparison from my own point of view with other Asian countries.

[Mr S]

Btw, it has been pretty cold here in the PH ever since I returned, amazingly. I've never seen it this cool before in the past 3 years. Must be due to either some weird pole shifts in the Earth or to that Global Warming scam. lol

When you say "cold," compared to what? I'm visiting the Philippines next month for the first time and one thing that interests me is dealing with the tropical humidity as I am a big fan of low humidity levels and currently live in a very dry climate.

It usually starts getting hot again around March while April/May seem to be the hottest months of the year in PI. This year seems to be cooler than usual so it may not be as warm as previous years this March.

It will most likely be well over 30 C and hot and humid when you show up if its in the later half of March...

[Mr S]

Well keep in mind that this is true mostly in Angeles, where the greedy flock to. Outside of Angeles in the small towns, provinces, and even in Cebu, there are many nice sweet poor girls who will NOT take advantage of you or act greedy/shameless. I've met some of them too. If you come to the PH, I can show you some of them. There are many poor girls who do not do that, and some are not even interested in foreigners too. So not all poor girls are like that.

There are friendly middle class girls that aren't that good looking and more open. You can meet middle class girls but it has to be by breaking into their cliques, working at their company, going to school with them, etc., which are the conservative normal routes.

I get along well in the PH as long as I am nice and kind to everyone, because they will treat me the same way, and thus there is a harmonious vibe here that is not present in the rest of Asia. That's an important thing. Don't forget that.

Once you tune into their frequency, as Ladislav and I have, you will do fine with them. You just gotta learn to "ride their wave".

It seems like different people have somewhat different perceptions about the PI. On this site, my sources have been Mr. S, Terrance, you, and Ladislav. Lad is overall the most positive and seems to genuinely love the place. Mr. S makes it sound like a step down from Thailand in terms of infrastructure and nightlife with girls who go downhill very fast after 25 or who have attitudes similar to American girls. Terrence seems to prefer Seoul and Shanghai for longer term and even found them both to be cheaper than Cebu overall for a reasonable quality of life. You often often refer to vibes you believe are not pleasant in NE Asia but very positive in PI. That may be the case. But keep in mind, that vibes are a product of both sides - you and members of the host population. Many gringos I met in Brazil raved about the friendliness and vibes there. But for me personally, I couldn't fully tune-in. The warm, friendly, and physical Brazilian style often rubbed me the wrong way because I felt it generally lacked sincerity or even opened me up to risk. I actually felt a lot more comfortable in Tokyo around more introverted and socially awkward types.

I really need to spend an extended period in PI - Makati, Cebu, and Angels - before I can make extended comparison from my own point of view with other Asian countries.

Yes. its a step down from Thailand in Infrastructure and nightlife. But the gist of the women here in PI is what I notice about the culture in general. Filipinos are generally followers so the ones that don't hang around Westerners that are educated and critical thinkers and take care of their health will take on the filipino attributes of poor exercise and eating habits and not care what they look like as they age cause they will be married and there is no divorce in Philippines so they don't give a shit. The educated ones from middle class and above families that went to decent private schools and universities tend to act like American women and can be high maintenance because they expect to be courted and all that shit. Plus their parents will get involved and might be a pain in the ass to deal with too. But the poorer girls which you call peasant girls will be tolerable to hang out with and won't be too difficult but they will probably be very ignorant about things, speak poor English and may or may not have ambition to better themselves. so its a mixed bag. If you find a poor one with a decent personality and is willing to have you teach her how you want her to be around you and all that then thats good, but you will have to look hard and date a lot of them before you meet a decent one. Also you may have to loosen your standards a bit since to find the ultimate package you would probably have to actually live in the Philippines for a number of years and be very picky while meeting and having many experiences with different types of women here.

That's what I've done. If I didn't f**k up the first year having a kid with a chick I shouldn't have been with in the first place, I probably would have found a decent local girl I could tolerate and be with long term. Now I'm just waiting it out and hoping for the best a few years down the road. Oh well live and learn, at least I'm not married!

[globetrotter]

"Unfortunately, this is the only group that will deal with us. You'll almost never find a foreigner accepted by middle or high class families here".

In the Philippines you can find something not present in other Asian countries- poor educated people ( kind of like me). These are girls who are nurses and teachers and all that. They are not lower class at all. Many girls that I have dated had college degrees. So, yes, I would put them with "middle class" there. I guess you could get into even higher classes if you yourself were a high class person. As a CEO or something. Or if you hung out the right circles.

There are one's social values, education and behavior and one's economic class. These two are different and distinct.

America was, until 2007, a nation with an Upper Middle Class/Upper Class Income and Lower Middle Class values.

Now many who have those Lower Class values have the income to match. Also you now have educated poor people in the USA as downward mobility, as FerFal detailed in his Architecture class in late 2001, has affected people with Upper Middle Class values who sink in to the Lower Middle/ Lower Class.

The not much mingling between real middle class Filipinos and foreigners is also due to the fact that many foreigners are not rich themselves and they themselves do not want to be courting girls in offices- which takes a year or two or proving yourself. They want to be have a lady now and do all kinds of things to her now. They want to drink beer and carouse and have fun with 3-4 ladies at the same time. Now. Not court one to be able to marry her after 2 years.

Some Filipinas were asking online why foreigners always go with ladies of ill repute and do not court ladies the proper Filipino way. Do I need to explain? Few if any guys who go to RP go there to try and integrate and do thing the local way.

You could be dead tomorrow. That's why.

'Someday' does not exist. Tomorrow is a Fiction.

Two Years is Two Years wasted.[/quote]

[Winston]

Some more complaints about Angeles City:

- 99 percent of the bar girls are butt ugly, trashy or ghetto looking. It takes a lot of time and luck to find one decent looking bar girl. Also, their skin is not smooth, and their feet often look dirty and dusty with short stubby toes which look barbaric and unfeminine. They are not clever or refined like Chinese, Japanese or Korean girls. Thus they don't fit the tastes of refined Asian Americans. Occasionally I find an exception though, but the exception is like 1 in 100.

Note: What's weird and kind of gross is that Filipinas often wear sandals that expose their feet, which is often the LEAST attractive part of their body. That is a horrible tactical blunder, since one ought to conceal the least attractive part of their body or at least try to improve on it. But they freely expose it, even though it downgrades their appearance. Their feet often look dirty and dusty... eeewww... as if they've been walking barefoot on dirt and mud, which looks uncivilized and unfeminine and is a sexual turnoff to me. (Yes, as you might have guessed, I have a feet fetish, which is why I focus on this and am turned off by it) Yet they freely flaunt it without shame or embarrassment. Furthermore, some also have hairy legs and refuse to shave them, claiming that it is more "natural" to let the hair grow on their legs if you ask them about it. (Fortunately though, my Filipina girlfriend has long skinny toes and decent looking feet)

- The bar environment is not good to be in on a regular basis. They can be a lot of fun at first and in the short-term. But the vibes in them feel pushy and greedy and they constantly incite you to be a big spender, as if your cash were unlimited everyday. It not a peaceful place with honest sincere vibes. If you are in them for too long, you begin to feel like scum and feel a loss of dignity.

- The sex here is like a routine and feels mechanical. It lacks passion and tension, and of course, it's hard to find a Filipina that you have a mental attraction with too, since they are so simple and unrefined/unsophisticated. So the spark is missing. I have met a few bar girls in the past who made love with a lot of passion, which I'll never forget, but that was back in 2007. I can't seem to find such types anymore. Every year, the bar girls want more money and are willing to spend less time with you. Hardly any of them do "long time" anymore. Even if they say they will do, they still try to bail within 2 hours. It's so dishonest and a big let down, especially when you get all excited about one of them.

- Trikes are overly priced in Angeles, not only for foreigners, but for Filipinos as well, who complain about it too. And there are too many trikes in Angeles that annoy you by constantly calling out to you, "Trike, Trike, Trike" and "Hey boss..."

- Most products and foods here fall into two extremes: 1) cheap and shitty quality, or 2) decent quality but imported and over-priced. It's hard to find a middle ground between those two extremes. Plus, only in the third world can you be inside a nice clean shopping center, only to walk out the front door and be immediately hounded by beggars in rags...

- The air and smog is horrible and poisonous. There is no class and standards here. When you are here too long, you feel like you are compromising your health and standards, and hanging around people who drag you down, not up, making you lose pride. It's hard to find decent people, since such types are more conservative and less open.

- The lower classes and bar girls often lack any form of pride, honor or dignity. They seem to have no ability to feel shame, which is evident from their behaviors and actions. When you are around people like that for too long, you suddenly realize that you are compromising your own pride, dignity and status by associating with such types, which feels like a disgrace.

[Winston]

The Pros and Cons of Living and Dating in the Philippines (my perspective)

Here is my list of pros and cons on living and dating in the Philippines. Hope you find it informative. I gotta warn you though, there is no fake political correctness in this list like there is on the Travel Channel and those fake positive hippies who only want to hear cliches. This is telling it like it is, no holds barred, with insight and truthfulness. These are not absolutes, nor do they apply to everyone in every situation. But they are true to such a large degree as to become discernible patterns.

Pros:

- It is a dating paradise for men, especially foreign men. It is easy to get dates or sex anytime you want. No deprivation in this area for men. With most local guys being poor and a large percentage of them being gay or transsexuals, the supply of dateable men is very low. Hence there are always single girls who are looking everywhere you go, a huge surplus of them, never a shortage.

<Balance snipped for brevity's sake>

Winston,

The Philippines seem to offer more con that pro. Apart from it being a 'dating paradise' for men who aren't getting any love in their home countries, why the hell would anyone want to go there? Regular and random power brown-outs would be a big concern for me, since I have a sleep disorder that requires use of a respirator every night, so I would need some form of back-up power. I also find I don't tolerate high heat and humidity well, either. Plus, I don't always suffer fools gladly and would have trouble adapting to a milieu in which stupidity is the norm rather than the exception.

I realize that a woman couldn't provide me with all the intellectual sustenance I would want, but I would do best with someone who is reasonably intelligent. My ex-wife turned out to be a bird-brain, so...

But the irony here is that financially, the Philippines would be ideal for someone as broke-ass as I am, and I'm not a good-looking guy, so I'd probably find myself in heaven getting all kinds of attention from women.

You are right and very observant. As to the pros and cons, well it depends on how you count them. If you count them by adding up the list of pros and list of cons, then yeah the cons seem to outnumber the pros. But the pros I listed are highly significant and BIG ITEM areas that are important for many guys, so they carry more weight and value than the list of many minor annoyances. So you gotta consider the weight too, not just the nominal number.

But of course, being in Angeles City, which is a bad representation of the Philippines, I'm going to be more jaded since I'm around more greedy people. And I have less tolerance than other guys too.

When you live here, you may develop a love/hate relationship with it.

[Winston]

"Unfortunately, this is the only group that will deal with us. You'll almost never find a foreigner accepted by middle or high class families here".

In the Philippines you can find something not present in other Asian countries- poor educated people ( kind of like me). These are girls who are nurses and teachers and all that. They are not lower class at all. Many girls that I have dated had college degrees. So, yes, I would put them with "middle class" there. I guess you could get into even higher classes if you yourself were a high class person. As a CEO or something. Or if you hung out the right circles.
The not much mingling between real middle class Filipinos and foreigners is also due to the fact that many foreigners are not rich themselves and they themselves do not want to be courting girls in offices- which takes a year or two or proving yourself. They want to be have a lady now and do all kinds of things to her now. They want to drink beer and carouse and have fun with 3-4 ladies at the same time. Now. Not court one to be able to marry her after 2 years.
Some Filipinas were asking online why foreigners always go with ladies of ill repute and do not court ladies the proper Filipino way. Do I need to explain? Few if any guys who go to RP go there to try and integrate and do thing the local way.
When you have 5 poor 19 year olds who want you now and you have one middle class 20 year old who is playing hard to get and who wants you after 2 years of courting, if you were an average Joe, what would you choose?

True Ladislav, but when it comes too easy to you, you value it less and the whole thing feels cheapened. What you strive for feels far more valuable later on. Easy sex lacks the spark and energy and passion that relationships have when they slowly build up.

It's a tradeoff.

Regarding middle class Filipinos, I was wondering something.

Whenever I am in cafes and restaurants, I see plenty of Filipinos paying for their drinks and meals. And when they are in groups, each person usually shares the cost, even if it's one guy and six girls in the group.

So how come 99 percent of Filipinos around me claim to be totally broke and need me to pay for them? Are these the same Filipinos that I see paying for things in cafes?

What if, the Filipinos I see paying in cafes were with me? Would they still be paying, or would they lie to me and tell me that they are broke? That's what I'm wondering about.

It is true that most Filipinos families do not hang around with foreigners. I don't know why. Aren't they curious about international culture? They buy international products and eat international food, so what do they have against international people? Also, don't they love American films and know a lot about American pop culture? If so, why wouldn't they want to have some American friends? Strange.

In my observation, when me and Dianne go to nice restaurants, I always see middle class Filipinos there with other Filipinos, or I see a foreigner or two with a group of poor low class Filipinos (that they are paying for), but never middle class Filipinos with foreigners for some reason. Some Filipinos deny this when I bring it up, but that's what I see almost every time I go out to a restaurant.

Why are middle class people often cliquish, stuck up and exclusive? Why can't they be open and sociable like me and Rock are? I am middle class too, but I'm not closed and cliquish. And Rock comes from a middle class family too, but he is very open and engaging with strangers. How come other middle class folks can't be like us? They seem so petty and small minded. Sheesh.

[Mr S]

Every time I take a bus in the Philippines no one wants to sit next to me unless it's the last seat available and no other option. It used to happen to my other foreigner co-workers as well so it's just not me. I still don't understand that.

[Winston]

So why is the Philippines so filthy and dirty? Is it the fault of the general population? Or the fault of the city planners and bad infrastructure? What are the causes?

How come some countries are so clean and others aren't? Is it due to the government or to the people themselves?

[The_Adventurer]

So why is the Philippines so filthy and dirty? Is it the fault of the general population? Or the fault of the city planners and bad infrastructure? What are the causes?

How come some countries are so clean and others aren't? Is it due to the government or to the people themselves?

I think it is infrastructure. What I notice in China is that there always people in blue uniforms with a wheel barrow constantly cleaning up the streets. People still throw cigarette butts and trash around (though thankfully they don't pee in the street) but the streets and sidewalks are constantly being cleaned, so the city always looks good. Also I notice they have trash cans and ashtrays almost every few steps. I could never find a trash can, even inside buildings in the Phils.

As for middle class Filipinos, it depends on the circles you run in. Me and my American friend are heavily into computers and me into Macs. Any Filipino who owns a Mac, probably has money, so if you run in those circles, you will hang out with higher class Filipinos. Also I am an animator and FX artist. People who do that work make pretty good money in Phils. If you hang with those people, you will hang out with higher class people who can pay for their own food and drinks in a cafe.

[Winston]

By middle class, I just mean living in a house and having a car parked in a garage or outside, like the families you see in the movies have, and like a normal family in America. Most American girls are middle class in that they have all that too. I came from the CA suburbs where everyone lives that way - in a house with a car in the garage. So that's what I mean by middle class. Basically, the way a normal family in America lives.

Girls like that in the Philippines are hard to find and do not usually chat up strangers in public.

[Twobrains]

Good points, Billy. Some parents are even more hypergamous than their daughters - it's their genes at stake as well, after all.

[Winston]

Look I am more or less in your situation. Just think abot this one.
Say we would have beautiful daughters and we would be hard working
disciplined middle class. Would we like to give our daugters to guys like
we are that is undisciplined to work in the cubicle, no serious jobs,
not believe in marriage watching porn all the time ....

I don´t think so. We would like to have a responsible guy who can
provide for our daughters.

That´s why these families aren´t interested to have contact to you and me.
And I think maybe it´s better also for us. We´re playing a different game.

True. But that doesn't get to the gist of my question about why they don't talk to strangers? I mean I can go to a rich area in Makati, and go to the mall there, but the middle class girls will not be open to me. Not because they think I'm a sex tourist. How would they know? We are not in a red light district. There, I just look like a shopper with money who can afford to buy things there, just like them, probably middle class in their view. So why wouldn't they talk to me there in a public setting? Obviously, in this situation, being a sex tourist wouldn't be a factor since they wouldn't know who I was or where I was from, just that I was another middle class shopper there with a foreign accent. So why wouldn't they want to meet me at that point?

What if I wore designer clothing, or whatever Brad Pitt and Tom Cruise wear when they go out? Would that make a difference in making middle class women more open? lol