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Closed Cliquish Cultures vs. Open Social

What's your story? Discussions your reasons for going abroad.

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Closed Cliquish Cultures vs. Open Social

Postby Winston » Sat Jul 17, 2010 12:32 pm

Closed cliquish business cultures vs. Open passionate social cultures

America is essentially a business culture in nearly all aspects of life. As such, social interaction is confined within closed cliques, usually established early on in life in one's high school and college years. Otherwise, communication with strangers is usually for business related purposes only (e.g. customer service, business transactions, sales, etc.)

Therefore, if you don't have an established clique of friends, or you are new to the area, you are basically F***ed socially for who knows how long (unless of course you are super attractive, involved in the entertainment industry or allied with the rich and successful).

The social nature of such countries is very conservative (despite the media image of America being a wild, free, open, extroverted culture). People live in structured routines, whether it's social or professional, and life is more of a business than a passion. Everything is highly compartmentalized into a proper time and place.

But passion is what opens people up truly to connecting with others, including strangers. Business does not, and instead treats communication as purely for business related purposes. American culture is the latter of course.

In addition, such socially closed workaholic countries are segregated, driven by fear and paranoia by their media and social consensus. People are conditioned to fear every stranger as a potential psycho or killer, despite the reality of how safe their environment really is, and fed daily news stories that reinforce that myth. It's a form of social mind control to keep the population weak, subservient and working and consuming.

And of course, since most people are natural followers, rather than freethinkers or leaders, they will conform to that, for they assume that authority and consensus = truth, rather than the actual truth itself.

In fact, the corporate elite have a vested interest in limiting your social relationships, family life, and creativity or passions, for if you have too many friends, good social relationships and/or spend too much time cultivating your passions and creative pursuits, then you will have less time for industrious work and productivity, which America sees as the purpose of your life. You see, your life is a business resource to America, a commodity, measured in terms of productivity, not passion. Thus communication and relationships between strangers are generally confined to business related purposes.

America's goal is for you to remain a "happy slave", productive and efficient. To do that, it must maintain the illusion of freedom in your mind. But it definitely does NOT want to encourage you to pursue things like passion, creativity or deep human bonds and relationships. No way. Such things are counterproductive to its goal of keeping you a "happy slave" whose life is "all business". That's why America teaches a system where such things are highly compartmentalized, limited or suppressed. To America, the economy is number one, NOT your soul!

So what can you do about that? Well you can expose it and bring awareness to it, like I'm doing here. And you can tell yourself everyday "I am a human being! Not a business resource!" But the most important thing is for you to place yourself among groups, movements or cultures that are conducive to life of freedom, passion and rich human connections and relationships. There are alternative, counter culture and hippie-type movements in the US for instance, that support a life free of "the system" where you can meet like minded others.

Or you can go to overseas cultures where passion and camaraderie are still regarded as the focus of life, rather than cold hearted business and closed cliquishness. (I will provide some examples below) There are many cultures abroad that are far more open, relaxed and inclusive, where people are not segregated by "ice barriers" or paranoia. I've experienced many of them and can vouch that they are a world of difference. But the US media doesn't want you to know about them of course, so you will not hear about this on mainstream channels. For many, this has been a happy fulfilling and permanent solution to the misery, stress and loneliness of America.

But you'd better hurry though, cause America is in a rush to try to turn the "cultures of passion" out there into cold business-like cultures like itself! So you'd better pray that it fails in its attempt to "globalize" the world into a carbon copy of itself.

Here are examples of cultures where passion, creativity, expression and human camaraderie are the focus of life and enjoyed to the fullest, where people are more socially open and less cliquish:

- Latin America, Mexico, Russia, Italy, Spain, France, Greece, Holland, Mexico, Southeast Asia, The Philippines, Thailand, Indonesia, etc.

Now here are examples of cultures where people are less socially open and more cliquish, where business is the aim of life and workaholic lifestyles are idolized, where passion, creativity and social lives are suppressed or restrained:

- America, Canada, Japan, Taiwan, Hong Kong, Korea, Finland, Norway, etc.

Of course, other cultures lie somewhere between both these categories.

But keep in mind that people fit in differently in each culture, and have different experiences that will vary. There is no "one culture fits all".

The important thing is that you choose a culture or atmosphere where your INNER matches your OUTER environment. In other words, if you are shy, conservative, socially closed or cliquish, as well as a workaholic, you would vibe best in cultures that reflect such qualities (e.g. Japan, Taiwan). But if you are open, passionate, sociable, relaxed and carefree, you'd fit best in cultures dominated by such traits (e.g. Latin America, parts of Europe). Otherwise, a mismatch between your inner self and outer environment is not a good thing. It will weaken you in the long run and not allow your natural self to come out or bring out the best in you.

See Also:
Comparison Chart between America and most countries in terms of Dating, Social Life and Self-Esteem:
http://www.happierabroad.com/comparison.htm

More cultural comparisons at:
http://expatriateobservations.blogspot.com
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsDbEwmCMz0
Last edited by Winston on Wed Jul 21, 2010 4:12 pm, edited 7 times in total.
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"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
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Re: Closed cliquish business cultures vs. Open passionate so

Postby jamesbond » Sat Jul 17, 2010 1:32 pm

Winston wrote:America is essentially a business culture in nearly all aspects of life. As such, social interaction is confined within closed cliques, usually established early on in life in one's high school and college years. Otherwise, communication with strangers is usually for business related purposes only (e.g. customer service, business transactions, sales, etc.)

Therefore, if you don't have an established clique of friends, or you are new to the area, you are basically F***ed socially for who knows how long (unless of course you are super attractive, involved in the entertainment industry or allied with the rich and successful). The social nature of such countries is very conservative (despite the media image of America being a wild, free, open, extroverted culture). People live in structured routines, whether it's social or professional, and life is more of a business than a passion.

Christ on a bicycle! You hit the nail on the head! In the US you need to develop your click of friends early in life (like in grade school, high school and college) because once your out of school, you are shit-out-of-luck as far making friends goes! lol :lol:

I feel sorry for foreigners who move to the US and don't know anybody. They will find out REAL QUICKLY how anti-social Americans are! In America, you make your friends early in life, because that will be the best opportunity you will ever have to make friends!
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Re: Closed cliquish business cultures vs. Open passionate so

Postby Winston » Sat Jul 17, 2010 2:11 pm

jamesbond wrote:Christ on a bicycle! You hit the nail on the head! In the US you need to develop your click of friends early in life (like in grade school, high school and college) because once your out of school, you are shit-out-of-luck as far making friends goes! lol :lol:

I feel sorry for foreigners who move to the US and don't know anybody. They will find out REAL QUICKLY how anti-social Americans are! In America, you make your friends early in life, because that will be the best opportunity you will ever have to make friends!


Well they do. Check out all these lonely depressed Indian immigrants in America. It's so bad that Little India did a story about them, which you can read here:

http://www.littleindia.com/august2004/U ... merica.htm
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

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"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
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Re: Closed cliquish business cultures vs. Open passionate so

Postby rome86 » Sat Jul 17, 2010 5:48 pm

jamesbond wrote:
Winston wrote:America is essentially a business culture in nearly all aspects of life. As such, social interaction is confined within closed cliques, usually established early on in life in one's high school and college years. Otherwise, communication with strangers is usually for business related purposes only (e.g. customer service, business transactions, sales, etc.)

Therefore, if you don't have an established clique of friends, or you are new to the area, you are basically F***ed socially for who knows how long (unless of course you are super attractive, involved in the entertainment industry or allied with the rich and successful). The social nature of such countries is very conservative (despite the media image of America being a wild, free, open, extroverted culture). People live in structured routines, whether it's social or professional, and life is more of a business than a passion.

Christ on a bicycle! You hit the nail on the head! In the US you need to develop your click of friends early in life (like in grade school, high school and college) because once your out of school, you are shit-out-of-luck as far making friends goes! lol :lol:

I feel sorry for foreigners who move to the US and don't know anybody. They will find out REAL QUICKLY how anti-social Americans are! In America, you make your friends early in life, because that will be the best opportunity you will ever have to make friends!



You said it man.. I am a foreigner here ... and I feel isolated, empty I try to compensate by doing a lot of sports, working, studying to keep me busy or else I'll lose my mind... clubs, bars I've tried them unfriendly, cliquish, insecure, competitive, loud people over there.
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Re: Closed cliquish business cultures vs. Open passionate so

Postby Winston » Sun Jul 18, 2010 9:56 am

rome86 wrote:You said it man.. I am a foreigner here ... and I feel isolated, empty I try to compensate by doing a lot of sports, working, studying to keep me busy or else I'll lose my mind... clubs, bars I've tried them unfriendly, cliquish, insecure, competitive, loud people over there.


So true. You describe exactly my life there as well. And you describe the exact vibe of the bar/club scene in America. I wonder how others tolerate it there.

Jamesbond, what did you think of my advice here?

The important thing is that you choose a culture or atmosphere where your INNER matches your OUTER environment. In other words, if you are shy, conservative, socially closed or cliquish, as well as a workaholic, you would vibe best in cultures that reflect such qualities (e.g. Japan, Taiwan). But if you are open, passionate, sociable, relaxed and carefree, you'd fit best in cultures dominated by such traits (e.g. Latin America, parts of Europe). Otherwise, a mismatch between your inner self and outer environment is not a good thing. It will weaken you in the long run and not allow your natural self to come out or bring out the best in you.
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

Don't forget my HA Grand Ebook and Dating Sites!

"It takes far less effort to find and move to the society that has what you want than it does to try to reconstruct an existing society to match your standards." - Harry Browne, How I Found Freedom in an Unfree World
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Re: Closed cliquish business cultures vs. Open passionate so

Postby momopi » Mon Jul 19, 2010 1:13 am

Winston wrote:Closed cliquish business cultures vs. Open passionate social cultures
America is essentially a business culture in nearly all aspects of life. As such, social interaction is confined within closed cliques, usually established early on in life in one's high school and college years. Otherwise, communication with strangers is usually for business related purposes only (e.g. customer service, business transactions, sales, etc.)
Therefore, if you don't have an established clique of friends, or you are new to the area, you are basically F***ed socially for who knows how long (unless of course you are super attractive, involved in the entertainment industry or allied with the rich and successful).


Try yelp.com for local group activiites to meet new friends.
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anti-social

Postby starkeep » Sat Jul 24, 2010 11:06 pm

8) I have to agree with the anti-social behavior here inthe usa. I have many people my own nationality who act more rude then someone from a foreign country. I may be a victim of electronic harrassment but that is no excuse. I have read where someone fell at wallmart on a sale day and the other people kept right on walking over that person until they eventually died. This is a example of what is going on here noone really cares what happens to anyone unless they are direct family.
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Re: anti-social

Postby Winston » Sat Jul 24, 2010 11:32 pm

starkeep wrote:8) I have to agree with the anti-social behavior here inthe usa. I have many people my own nationality who act more rude then someone from a foreign country. I may be a victim of electronic harrassment but that is no excuse. I have read where someone fell at wallmart on a sale day and the other people kept right on walking over that person until they eventually died. This is a example of what is going on here noone really cares what happens to anyone unless they are direct family.


That is very unusual. When people fall, someone usually helps them or calls for help. People in America will help with little things like that, but not invite you to a barbecue or go to coffee with you, unless they are old and lonely of course.
Check out the latest posts in our blog The Happier Abroaders.

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Postby gsjackson » Sun Jul 25, 2010 12:12 am

Norway? Repressed? They lead the world in admission to having had sex in public places by a comfortable margin -- some 69 percent of the population, I believe. This is the country where two young environmental activists came up on stage at a rock concert to "f**k for the forests," in order to draw attention to their issues. A summer sojourn in Oslo has been among my cherished goals for a while now.

To the point about how all relations in the U.S. have become essentially economic, certainly Marx's prediction of the commodification of personality has been fully realized here. I used to think of myself as a person, now I know that I am only a mark. If someone is approaching me to speak in the U.S. I know that he/she wants either my money or my soul for Jesus. So I just get out my wallet when I see people approaching, and give everybody a dollar. The fundamental problem here is pathological narcissism, as a number of writers predicted back in the '70s. People in America basically don't like each other, because they know that other Americans are interested in them only to the extent that they can benefit by getting money or brownie points in heaven out of the interaction. People don't really want to know you as an individual. Again, it was not always that way here.
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Postby jamesbond » Mon Jul 26, 2010 1:12 am

gsjackson wrote:To the point about how all relations in the U.S. have become essentially economic, certainly Marx's prediction of the commodification of personality has been fully realized here. I used to think of myself as a person, now I know that I am only a mark. If someone is approaching me to speak in the U.S. I know that he/she wants either my money or my soul for Jesus. So I just get out my wallet when I see people approaching, and give everybody a dollar. The fundamental problem here is pathological narcissism, as a number of writers predicted back in the '70s. People in America basically don't like each other, because they know that other Americans are interested in them only to the extent that they can benefit by getting money or brownie points in heaven out of the interaction. People don't really want to know you as an individual. Again, it was not always that way here.

In America, we are a nation of strangers! A lot of people in the US don't know who their neighbors are and of course people don't talk to strangers. Women in the US are scared shitless of men! They think every man they meet is a potential murder, rapist or robber.

No wonder why there are so many workaholics in the US, people have nothing else to do with their lives other than work! In America it's life, liberty and the pursuit of a paycheck! :D
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Its a sick society...

Postby polya » Wed Jul 28, 2010 4:51 am

The problem is people have turned bad. Look at how people treat each other - how dating has become "a game" - what about finding love, or spending your lives together?? Look at the lies people believe how "there's someone for everyone..." Its all lies and I don't think the USA can be turned around easily. People are just too self centered - strangely they've lost their standard of living, lost their future and all they have is the ability to dump on other people. Its a shame the USA chose to decline like Rome or Greece.
"Woman is a violent and uncontrolled animal... If you allow them to achieve complete equality with men, do you think they will be easier to live with? Not at all. Once they have achieved equality, they will be your masters." Cato the Elder
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AGREE!

Postby have2fly » Sun Aug 01, 2010 10:04 pm

totally agree!!! I am a Ukrainian who moved to the USA and could not figure out WTF is wrong with me. It took a loooong time to actually understand that people around me are completely morally degraded, retarded, limited, not educated, have never been to other states or NEVER in their life been to OTHER country (we don't count trips to Cancun to get wasted). People are completely lonely, they smile - but you know that it's almost 99% FAKE. People CANNOT stand in public - they hide themselves into cell phones, iPods or just clicking whatever in their hand. No one makes eye contact for more than 3 seconds! If you just look at someone for a long time - they look at you as a rapist! What kind of retarded society is that??? Completely screwed up, Freedom does NOT exist in America! At least not at this point!

I can go on and on about family, relationship, food, meetings etc. Even European cities are planned differently - in France there are many HUGE squares in any city center (downtown) where they have literally HUNDREDS of cafe's right out on the streets, people walk and stroll down the streets during weekends, socialize, talk, hang out, sit in the parks, meet and greet etc. There are virtually NO FAT PEOPLE in France!!! And food here is GREAT, tasted natural, organic and home-made. No, not home-made from box of Mac'n'Cheese from Wal-Mart (complete chemical poison). Food in France is natural in every way possible. I know because I grew up in Europe eating everything fresh from the market and thank God, there was no McDonald's in our city until I was 16. But funny - McDonald's in Europe tastes MUCH better than in the USA. Same goes for Coca Cola, chips and other food. Yesterday I tried French Fries in French restaurant for the first time - IT TASTED BETTER THAN ANY U.S. made chocolate!

Everything is retarded in USA in terms of enjoying life! Food, people, families, social interaction, work long hours (in France there is 35 hour work week and 5 week of vacation for everyone! Eat that!). People have a life here. Socialized medicine is amazing by the way. I don't want to repeat Michael Moore, he is 95% correct in his Sicko movie about situation and life in the USA - you live in debt all your life, while education is almost always FREE in Europe (or very cheap).

We have to organize a movement, publish brochures, open people's eyes, tell them that they live in the matrix! Winston, you are doing a great thing by helping other people understand the truth behind their miserable lives. At this point I see no benefit of living in the USA and especially living or creating a family, even with a foreign girl. Just teaching English will be enough to make a living in most countries abroad and if you have a degree, you will eventually find a better job. Many U.S. companies operate abroad, you could work for them as a regional manager or representative etc. Go Abroad, GET A LIFE.
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Re: AGREE!

Postby ladislav » Mon Aug 02, 2010 1:27 am

Your description of the US is definitely not how the world sees the US and not how the US sees itself. The world sees America and Americans as these free, loose people who are friendly and open. Women are sexy and will sleep with any guy they like. Freedom rules! The US sees itself as this very liberated and free society whereas Europe is this stuffy place filled with stuck up and stand offish people. Whereas America is this wide open space where you can roam free and be yourself.

Russia, for example has been on the receiving end of the American demonization with the people there constantly being accused of being dour, stone faced ogres .

Here is a clip on how Russian kids perform a song:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eabj2ZZT ... re=related

WTF is going on? Why are things reversed?

If America is so stuffy, where did all these Hollywood images of the footloose US and the self image come from? How are people aware of what they 'should' be? Asians for example do not see themselves as friendly and many dream of going to the US where people are liberated and where one can finally break through conventions and restrictions.
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Re: AGREE!

Postby momopi » Mon Aug 02, 2010 5:50 pm

Could it be that Hollywood conspired to make Americans better looking and richer than they really are to the rest of the world, so men like you and me can travel abroad and receive a warm greeting from the locals?

I wonder, if the local women actually knew the truth, and compared a line-up of American joe's with a line of French and Italian guys, would we lose 9 out of 10 times?
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Postby Asp » Mon Aug 02, 2010 8:43 pm

gsjackson wrote:Norway? Repressed? They lead the world in admission to having had sex in public places by a comfortable margin -- some 69 percent of the population, I believe. This is the country where two young environmental activists came up on stage at a rock concert to "f**k for the forests," in order to draw attention to their issues. A summer sojourn in Oslo has been among my cherished goals for a while now.


It's this type of country which, while clearly not being repressed about sexual expression and sexual liberation, can be repressed for men in the dating scene because of the high level of feminism. The common factor being the political correctness found in such societies.
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