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Why I Left America...

What's your story? Discussions your reasons for going abroad.

Moderators: jamesbond, fschmidt

Why I Left America...

Postby globetrotter » Sun Sep 26, 2010 5:34 pm

I am a former numbers guy, used to work construction finance / bean counting / operations / etc.

While doing research on our market in Los Angeles, I began to uncover some very disturbing information. The more I looked the worse the scams became. I looked around the SF Valley at house prices of $750k and realized that it was impossible that everyone earned $250k in household income, what with all the illegals sleeping 8 to an apartment over on Roscoe. I declined to buy, even after our VP of Biz Dev kept pushing me to enter the market.

That was in mid-2007.

Then I joined several financial fora, and the information just went from bad to worse.

The USA was going to have an economic collapse and I wanted to escape the blast radius. Yes, I saw this coming and liquidated the week before Obama won election. In Nov 2008 I sold it all, dissolved my IRA, 401(k), precious metals, auto, everything; left my job, traveled across the USA for a few weeks. One of my brothers, being very perceptive, asked me if I was taking a look at America one last time before it all went to shit. That was part of it, and I also like road trips. After the trip I sold my car and moved to Mexico, then to China.

From recent conversations back in the states, my job sector is virtually gone. Instead of earning $84k, I would be making $30k at best. Total devastation. I would have to work in a department one-half the size, do the work of the two people I let go, and be massively stressed out with lower pay laboring 65 hours a week.

Instead of working myself to death I chose to earn an ESL teaching cert and now I work 15 to 20 hours a week, 25 weeks a year. The rest of the time I play the guitar, learn languages and hit on the girls in town.

Whilst this can and will result in one leaving the USA career track forever if one does not creatively re-write one's resume/CV upon re-entry, I don't really mind and I am much happier here and now.

In short my reasons were mostly economic, and that I just could not tolerate so much of what 'America' was/is about anymore.

This change in perception often plagues cultural USA refuges as they get outside and take a look back from a new perspective. The more you stay away, the more difficult it becomes to go back and tolerate what the US has become.

Ladislav, Winston, Fred Reed, Myself and many others simply cannot go back.
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Postby momopi » Mon Sep 27, 2010 7:16 am

The RE market had already crashed in 2006, but in 2007 the prices still wasn't low enough to make positive cash-flow. IMO the best time was probably early summer in 2009. By winter 2009 all the local vultures have arrived with their multi-million dollar bank accounts to bid on everything in sight. In 2010 the vultures from abroad came and started buying the leftovers. I lost a bid last week to some guy from Sweden who made an all-cash offer, and next week my friend's dad from Canada is flying down and wants me to show him properties to buy.

Here in Irvine, where the Irvine company has a virtual monopoly on new construction, the pricing is completely whacked. They imposed restrictions on new construction to limit supply, so buyers gobble up whatever that comes on the market at any price. Yesterday I went to Woodbury with a friend to look at some houses, and in one tract I think they released 24 units for sale for the phase. That was in the morning, and we saw a horde of buyers with their checkbooks out. By noon only 1 unit was left and my friend forked over $30k+ deposit check to buy the last unit. Today we went back to have another look and they already stamped "sold out" on all their flyer's for this phase. The price was $1.1 million and I almost choked. I told him that it'd have been cheaper to rent the house than to buy it, but he doesn't care because he'd just ask his mom for the $ like he did with the house in Shanghai. >_> Gee, must be nice, and here I'm stuck with poorer parents that I have to send money to every month. ;p

Back in 2007, Larry wrote this entry:
http://www.irvinehousingblog.com/blog/c ... value-101/

The prediction was that the housing prices there must capitulate. Well, 3-4 years later, people are still buying million dollar homes in that development tract. I gave up. I'd only buy investment properties along the I-15 these days.
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Real Estate is still booming in Moscow!

Postby polya » Mon Sep 27, 2010 10:37 am

Surprisingly, Moscow Real Estate is still in the stratosphere in Oct 2010. Other countries I live in the real Estate is just lower than peak prices (New Zealand & Australia). I tell everyone who will listen to sell - that you've been taken for a ride by agents & banks over the last 7 years, but everyone things the prices will go up soon!! Totally not going to happen, as they are just 3-4 years behind the USA.
Good on you for following your passions and not working yourself to death!!
"Woman is a violent and uncontrolled animal... If you allow them to achieve complete equality with men, do you think they will be easier to live with? Not at all. Once they have achieved equality, they will be your masters." Cato the Elder
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Postby jounderw » Thu Nov 04, 2010 12:06 pm

The reasons I went abroad were the Exposure to new people, foods, cultures, and languages-- to broaden your awareness and experience, the better you are able to handle the uncertainty of life.
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Re: Why I Left America...

Postby djfourmoney » Sat Nov 20, 2010 11:08 pm

globetrotter wrote:I am a former numbers guy, used to work construction finance / bean counting / operations / etc.

While doing research on our market in Los Angeles, I began to uncover some very disturbing information. The more I looked the worse the scams became. I looked around the SF Valley at house prices of $750k and realized that it was impossible that everyone earned $250k in household income, what with all the illegals sleeping 8 to an apartment over on Roscoe. I declined to buy, even after our VP of Biz Dev kept pushing me to enter the market.

That was in mid-2007.

Then I joined several financial fora, and the information just went from bad to worse.

The USA was going to have an economic collapse and I wanted to escape the blast radius. Yes, I saw this coming and liquidated the week before Obama won election. In Nov 2008 I sold it all, dissolved my IRA, 401(k), precious metals, auto, everything; left my job, traveled across the USA for a few weeks. One of my brothers, being very perceptive, asked me if I was taking a look at America one last time before it all went to shit. That was part of it, and I also like road trips. After the trip I sold my car and moved to Mexico, then to China.

From recent conversations back in the states, my job sector is virtually gone. Instead of earning $84k, I would be making $30k at best. Total devastation. I would have to work in a department one-half the size, do the work of the two people I let go, and be massively stressed out with lower pay laboring 65 hours a week.

Instead of working myself to death I chose to earn an ESL teaching cert and now I work 15 to 20 hours a week, 25 weeks a year. The rest of the time I play the guitar, learn languages and hit on the girls in town.

Whilst this can and will result in one leaving the USA career track forever if one does not creatively re-write one's resume/CV upon re-entry, I don't really mind and I am much happier here and now.

In short my reasons were mostly economic, and that I just could not tolerate so much of what 'America' was/is about anymore.

This change in perception often plagues cultural USA refuges as they get outside and take a look back from a new perspective. The more you stay away, the more difficult it becomes to go back and tolerate what the US has become.

Ladislav, Winston, Fred Reed, Myself and many others simply cannot go back.


As a fellow SF Valley resident I also saw the writing on the wall. While AW would call me looser for staying at home, why would I jump into a overpriced real estate market? f**k people that can't see the numbers in the Matrix. There are regular stories of 3rd World America in the alternative press, about the only time you saw this in 2007 or 2008 was the occasional "tent cities" that were springing up all around formerly hot real estate markets like Inland Empire and Sacramento River Valley.

We're in the beginning of a corrosive immigration debate with Blacks generally feeling they have no dog in this fight because the Corporate Structure rather coddle immigrants from Mexico and Central America and not Blacks. There's also a general feeling of animosity between the two races. This could get really interesting and not in a positive way.

Besides the massive transfer of jobs and wealth over the past decade or more, the culture itself is breaking down.

I applaud you taking complete control of your life. There are 3.5 Million Americans that don't live here...
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Postby ladislav » Sun Nov 21, 2010 1:46 am

I applaud you taking complete control of your life. There are 3.5 Million Americans that don't live here.
..

The number is much bigger actually. I think it is close to 6 million which is some 2% of the population.

I left primarily because of three reasons: few good jobs , few good women and the people in the US do not treat each other well. There is a lot of anger, suing, mistrust and just 'leave me alone and do not bother me' attitude.

Plus in my field- which is foreign languages and study of cultures, the only path I can have is maybe get a Ph D and become a professor at some university. The salary will not be big and it will be boring. There are no millions of Americans who are dying to study a foreign language. I could teach ESL in the US but the market is very small and good jobs go to women, minorities and gays. I am not considered a minority in the US so it is not as easy. Plus teaching is not a respected profession/field.

The female situation is well known to all.

I watched many immigrants like myself who got into highly paid technical fields, law or medicine and prospered, but my heart simply does not lie in those areas.
I also like painting but the market is very tough. I guess I could survive if I tried very hard and long and maybe even prospere but without a good woman by your side, you need to be willing to sacrifice many lonely years to do that.

Many guys in the US think I am gay because I am into art and poetry and foreign languages and this upsets me no end. Shocking really!

So, I never really ran away but I did what US companies do- multinationalising and being active in multiple countries each one providing me with what it has in abundance. You can't get blood from a turnip, so why grumble that a turnip does not give you the blood you want? You go to the blood bank.
Why blame the Sahara for having too few oases for us to drink water. It is a desert. Nice and warm and great views and the camels are great but there is not enough water. Why sit by a dried up oasis and talk sh!t about how brackish the water is, how little of it is left and how all these bedouins and animals are fighting over it. Let's do what other smart people do- go the Nile. But some people say-" no, it is my oasis, I was born near it, I will die near it".

You solve most problems by 'combining'.

America with its infrastructure, organization and credit, a great passport that lets you go into all these countries without a visa, great companies overseas that appreciate you for being a US citizen and having a degree from the US and pay you all this tax free money, give you a house and long vacations, etc.
And then you have countries where girls are hanging everywhere like ripe fruit and waiting for someone like you to pick them. Unlimited supplies of them.

Combine all these factors, quilt your world and you have a perfect life.

I am in the US now, and the internet connection is good and the services are great, and every time I apply for a credit card, I get it. Amazing!
Then I will use credit cards honestly and strategically to buy what I need and pay them off when the time comes with some foreign money. It has worked well for the most part.
A brain is a terrible thing to wash!
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Postby globetrotter » Sun Nov 21, 2010 12:49 pm

ladislav wrote:I also like painting but the market is very tough. I guess I could survive if I tried very hard and long and maybe even prospere but without a good woman by your side, you need to be willing to sacrifice many lonely years to do that.

Many guys in the US think I am gay because I am into art and poetry and foreign languages and this upsets me no end. Shocking really!


I have thought about this for a long time, and come to this conclusion:

In 1700, 1800, 1900, the USA was where you went 'to start over'. If you were willing to take a 3 month boat journey to a total wilderness, one in which you would likely starve to death the first winter, you clearly were not fitting in or not doing well back home.

America is populated by people who said:

"Europe, Russia, Mexico? Ya know, those places really are not all that great..." To a European especially this offends. There is no way they can conceive of Europe not being the ONLY PLACE in the world anyone would rather be.

The women who came in 1800 were butt ugly.

Think a second - it is 1750 and you are a hot chick in Europe. You don't need to move to the USA unless you are a lesbian. You have guys courting you all the time. Life is good. You have the choice among many men for a wealthy and good husband. Why move across the planet?

On the same way for men, if you were gay, into 'theater', 'creative', liked 'languages', 'art', etc., then you moved to the USA to leave your past behind.

This is why there are so many gays in the USA. The all moved here from elsewhere.

This makes male bonding in the post-feminist world all but impossible. If you are friendly to a man and happy to see him, then you must be gay. Right?

Tragic, sad, f***ed up and yet another reason why the USA is not a good place for straight men.

OTOH, if you are a woman, move to the USA. Your life will be almost perfect.
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Postby djfourmoney » Sun Nov 21, 2010 3:03 pm

Again I agree Globe, John@AFA talked about the history of Mail Order Brides - http://www.loveme.com/media/shows/live- ... o_007.html

I agree about the "Butt Ugly" status of most of the women. If you were good looking why would you want to go out to the American West with a bunch of dirty gold prospectors? Now that's not to say the adventurous types didn't make the trip, many of them did.

Now the Gay part took some thinking outside the box, but it logically make sense that is if you believe being Gay is something your born with, not something your taught.

About being a woman, moving to America and having success I don't know, it largely depends on what your looking for as a woman.
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Postby gsjackson » Sun Nov 21, 2010 5:17 pm

globetrotter wrote:This is why there are so many gays in the USA. The all moved here from elsewhere.


But apparently they swung both ways enough to pass along their gene pool? Tenuous thesis, built on the equally tenuous supposition that homosexuality is some sort of biological inheritance.

But the general idea that most American immigrants were misfits where they came from makes some sense. They often were people like the Puritans who were frustrated by the ambiguity of secularizing Europe and wanted a home where the doctrine could be pure. Or they were hell-raising teenagers looking for money and adventure, like the early Virginia settlers. Or penal colonies, like in Georgia.
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Postby TRADER1972 » Tue Mar 08, 2011 7:24 am

globetrotter wrote:
ladislav wrote:I also like painting but the market is very tough. I guess I could survive if I tried very hard and long and maybe even prospere but without a good woman by your side, you need to be willing to sacrifice many lonely years to do that.

Many guys in the US think I am gay because I am into art and poetry and foreign languages and this upsets me no end. Shocking really!


I have thought about this for a long time, and come to this conclusion:

OTOH, if you are a woman, move to the USA. Your life will be almost perfect.



There is one thing that is NOT perfect for women here. If they work they will likely find one of two things.

Women are shitty bosses.
Female coworkers are often backstabbers, jealous, etc.

But for alpha bitches who want to be in charge, what could be better than living in the US?

I once did an informal survey of customers around 2000. I asked about 100 people did they prefer to work for a man or woman.
Not a single one preferred a female boss and females were more strongly against having a female boss then men were.

Fascinating!
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Postby Phatiz » Mon Nov 21, 2011 6:02 am

It's a strange thing: americans leave their country because of the crisis, and people from all over the world apply for green card and use any other ways to get there. I guess because of the crisis, too. The crisis is global, and even if it has started in USA, it doesn't mean that in US the situation is the worst. There will be always millions of people striving to immigrate there)
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Postby zboy1 » Mon Nov 21, 2011 6:32 am

Phatiz wrote:It's a strange thing: americans leave their country because of the crisis, and people from all over the world apply for green card and use any other ways to get there. I guess because of the crisis, too. The crisis is global, and even if it has started in USA, it doesn't mean that in US the situation is the worst. There will be always millions of people striving to immigrate there)


Yes, but many of those immigrants come from dirt-poor Third-World countries and rarely from advanced countries like Japan or Germany. And many of the people who do come here are brainwashed by American propaganda from American movies, T.V., and other forms of media. The myth that America is the "greatest country in the world" the U.S. likes to propagate does have an appeal to some people, but in many cases, the one's who do come to the U.S. often wind up regretting their choices or find out that the myth is a bunch of bullcrap. Read up on some of Ladislav's posts on the immigrant experiences in the U.S., and you will find out that for many immigrants, it is not a happy ending once they do come to the country.
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Postby Repatriate » Mon Nov 21, 2011 6:51 am

Phatiz wrote:It's a strange thing: americans leave their country because of the crisis, and people from all over the world apply for green card and use any other ways to get there. I guess because of the crisis, too. The crisis is global, and even if it has started in USA, it doesn't mean that in US the situation is the worst. There will be always millions of people striving to immigrate there)

America is a good place if you're coming from a poor lower developing world country with few prospects for social mobility. You can still work your way up to middle class fairly easily. The problem these days is that the people who have been middle class for generations have seen their standard of living eroding in the U.S. But in relative terms the material standard of living in the U.S. is very high for someone coming from a shit hole environment.

If the U.S. economy further erodes the middle class then we're going to see a major crisis forming. A lot of America's prosperity is derived from a large and prosperous middle class. If that goes then the U.S. will be another tiered society with a small percentage of wealth controlling an underclass. That's a sure-fire way to turn America's progress back.
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Postby odbo » Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:02 pm

He was also a close-minded jackass who liked to spent his time defending and rationalizing the criminal actions of banksters and politicians, and looked down on those who questioned the official reasons given for the deterioration of western civilization and its economies.
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