David DeAngelo undermines masculinity

[Winston]

Good day to all,

I read one of David's books(for free) a few years ago. The problem with these techniques is that they are only effective on ladies who you would NOT marry. There is no need to use pick up lines to get the attention of a good woman.

Women in America have the upper hand in the bars and clubs. They are the gate keepers. Most attractive women there already know what they will say to a guy that they have no interest in. When I was younger, I would be in the clubs almost every weekend with a little success. Once I got older, I realized that these party girls all led to dead ends for me.

I have traveled to many parts of the world where there is no need to use "game" to talk to an attractive lady.

DD's methods, to me, are a waste of time.

I think they also only work on women who find you in a certain type range too. If you are not in her type range, no PUA shit will matter. Also, if she hates guys, she will be repulsed by it. The question is, do they work on girls you want to sleep with?

How can you be something you are not, unless you are a sociopath?

What is David DeAngelo's real name? Does anyone have a picture of his face?

[fightforlove]

David D, Mystery, all of these PUAs put women up on a pedestal to stir up fear in the hearts of naive young men and get them to buy their books, CDs, etc. David D in particular uses a lot of pedestaling of women in order to brainwash potential customers into thinking that women truly are these superior, impenitrable godesses that can only be won over if you buy this PUA book and learn all the right tactics!!

It really pisses me off cause there's a lot of naive, socially-inept guys out there who already suffer from low self-esteem and are prone to oneitis, p***y pedestaling, etc. This inferiority-to-women complex is the linch-pin in the PUA marketing strategy. DeAngelo has made a lot of $$$ by playing off of those unhealthy fears and his material really only ingrains those fears even deeper into the minds of many a young man.

[Andrewww]

@Winston, pick-up artists are indeed sociopaths. You do have to change your personality (to some degree) if you want to become a douchebag.

But why pay for the material when you can find it on torrent sites ?

I was into this PUA crap a couple years ago. I never spent a cent on it but I read a half dozen books, watched a crapload of videos and I can resume my conclusions to this:

-10% is actually useful, if anything PUA pushes you to go out more, get out of your confort zone, hit a gym.
-90% is mumbo jumbo you have to sort through on your own.
-The women you attract by acting like a douchebag/PUA type are only immature sluts. Now immature sluts for a sexually frustrated guy is a lot better than no sluts but no interesting women will fall for bullshit. Very few interesting women spend their nights in clubs and bars anyway. PUA is a lot like whore mongering, it only serves to satisfy one need. You can't have a long-term relationship with a woman that falls for a smooth talker, no matter how attractive she may be.
-Success will be determined by 2 things: location and the number of approaches. Many guys don't go out much, don't approach at all but they start doing that once they get into PUA. Suddenly they realize that women notice them and associate that effect with PUA when in fact it's simply because they approach more women.
Location matters the most I would say. The closer you live to the nightlife scene, the more you'll go out and women will be much more receptive to come home with you.
-PUA is not natural and useless if you can afford an escort. If you look at the bottom line, going out 4 times a week by spending at least $50 on drinks, late night junk food and other stuff you don't usually spend money on (not to mention the loss in productivity the next day) you get a bill of at least $200 weekly and no guarantee of getting laid. For that kind of cash you can get one hour of bliss with a beautiful escort and spend the rest of the week enjoying your hobbies.

[Jester]

@Winston, pick-up artists are indeed sociopaths. You do have to change your personality (to some degree) if you want to become a douchebag.

But why pay for the material when you can find it on torrent sites ?

I was into this PUA crap a couple years ago. I never spent a cent on it but I read a half dozen books, watched a crapload of videos and I can resume my conclusions to this:

-10% is actually useful, if anything PUA pushes you to go out more, get out of your confort zone, hit a gym.
-90% is mumbo jumbo you have to sort through on your own.
-The women you attract by acting like a douchebag/PUA type are only immature sluts. Now immature sluts for a sexually frustrated guy is a lot better than no sluts but no interesting women will fall for bullshit. Very few interesting women spend their nights in clubs and bars anyway. PUA is a lot like whore mongering, it only serves to satisfy one need. You can't have a long-term relationship with a woman that falls for a smooth talker, no matter how attractive she may be.
-Success will be determined by 2 things: location and the number of approaches. Many guys don't go out much, don't approach at all but they start doing that once they get into PUA. Suddenly they realize that women notice them and associate that effect with PUA when in fact it's simply because they approach more women.
Location matters the most I would say. The closer you live to the nightlife scene, the more you'll go out and women will be much more receptive to come home with you.
-PUA is not natural and useless if you can afford an escort. If you look at the bottom line, going out 4 times a week by spending at least $50 on drinks, late night junk food and other stuff you don't usually spend money on (not to mention the loss in productivity the next day) you get a bill of at least $200 weekly and no guarantee of getting laid. For that kind of cash you can get one hour of bliss with a beautiful escort and spend the rest of the week enjoying your hobbies.

I don't care for p***y-sharing (escorts), but I 100% agree with your main points.

Location. Approaches. And -- Fearlessness.

And this should work with good girls, too. Not a PUA sarcastic negging approach, but something creative, amusing, fearless.

[ramonthomas]

Hi Winston



David DeAngelo's real name is Eben Pagan. This was written about in great detail on Wikipedia until the editors removed it. In his business development program "Get Altitude" he explains his Double Your Dating business model in great detail. You may want to read about him getting married to an Indian woman here.

Disclaimer = I purchased two ebooks, one audio and DVD program from him in 2005/6. It made a big difference in my life and as I met more experience guys I learned from them more and more.

RJ THOMAS

I think they also only work on women who find you in a certain type range too. If you are not in her type range, no PUA shit will matter. Also, if she hates guys, she will be repulsed by it. The question is, do they work on girls you want to sleep with?

How can you be something you are not, unless you are a sociopath?

What is David DeAngelo's real name? Does anyone have a picture of his face?

[Winston]

That's what he looks like? He doesn't look attractive at all. Why doesn't he use all the money he makes to get plastic surgery on his nose?

Is he Middle Eastern? He doesn't look Caucasian.

His new Indian woman isn't that good looking either.

I doubt if his claims are accurate. He probably exaggerates a lot. I don't see how his PUA methods can work. Western women are programmed to reject pick ups like a rehearsed routine they've memorized and done thousands of times.

His claim that you can "create attraction" is also wrong and doesn't make sense. Anyone with experience with women knows that you can't create attraction that's not there. Attraction doesn't work that way.