No wonder why Elliot Rodger lost it - He was in narcissismvil

[Tezcatlipoca]

Well, it seems like the entire world is doucheville.

[S_Parc]

I had every excuse to 'snap', but I didn't, just as you didn't. What separates you and me from the Rodgers of the world? Conscience, vigilance, perspective, life experiences? Probably a combination of these and other factors.

I wrote about it in Tsar's infamous loneliness thread. It's about the various stages of becoming a man, the gateways at ages 13, 17, 24, & 29+.

viewtopic.php?t=23351&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=45

At 13, childhood comes to an end. The world of phantasmagorical things, like believing that the Star Wars universe is actually happening outside of cinema or perhaps, a prophecy of some distant future/parallel universe, starts to unwind. What's real is real and what's in the mind's eye is imagination (or prophetic if one's third eye is open, but that's another story for another day). What was clear to me was that I needed to start to deal with situations and not run into some dream-like vision-quest state that they weren't happening.

17 is the start of one's early adulthood. I'd left home that year, never to return. Clearly, I had to carve my own path and couldn't stand my father or sister. I also vehemently broke out of being shy and started talking to just about everyone out there.

Then, 24 is the first reflection pool period of that early adulthood. I'd made a career change/shift that year and in terms of my inner/outer relationships with others, I'd gone cold turkey on American women and started going abroad to date FWs. It was a dramatic shift from prior times.

And then, that 29+ era is classically known as the Saturn Return, if you read that astrology gobbledygook. But what it signifies is whether or not one's on the right path and whether or not one needs serious modification. That's somewhat when I'd realized that I didn't fit into the whole Catholic large family thing of Rio; my illusions about that were beginning to unwind. I was generally an outgoing introvert (which isn't a contradiction) and started to learn things like Qigong, Meditation, and so forth, looking for happiness from within w/o outside validation. This is where Public and I have departed ways.

Today, I can be completely alone and happy or with a group of people and feel the same way, provided that they're not a bunch of a-holes. And likewise, with Mel, I now have a new family with whom I can get to know and form relationships.

So basically, Rodgers got stuck at the 1st gateway (think about it, 'Titanic', a chick fantasy flick, was his favorite movie. For most guys, it would be 'Raiders of the Lost Ark' or 'Terminator') and thus, he never made it to the 2nd gateway.

Afterwards, slipping deeper into fantasy and concocting this dream-like realm of external persecution, he'd given up on life and went out with a bang. So I think it's how we process those gates is how we determine, whether or not we make it.

[ntm1972]

I had every excuse to 'snap', but I didn't, just as you didn't. What separates you and me from the Rodgers of the world? Conscience, vigilance, perspective, life experiences? Probably a combination of these and other factors.

I wrote about it in Tsar's infamous loneliness thread. It's about the various stages of becoming a man, the gateways at ages 13, 17, 24, & 29+.

viewtopic.php?t=23351&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=45

At 13, childhood comes to an end. The world of phantasmagorical things, like believing that the Star Wars universe is actually happening outside of cinema or perhaps, a prophecy of some distant future/parallel universe, starts to unwind. What's real is real and what's in the mind's eye is imagination (or prophetic if one's third eye is open, but that's another story for another day). What was clear to me was that I needed to start to deal with situations and not run into some dream-like vision-quest state that they weren't happening.

17 is the start of one's early adulthood. I'd left home that year, never to return. Clearly, I had to carve my own path and couldn't stand my father or sister. I also vehemently broke out of being shy and started talking to just about everyone out there.

Then, 24 is the first reflection pool period of that early adulthood. I'd made a career change/shift that year and in terms of my inner/outer relationships with others, I'd gone cold turkey on American women and started going abroad to date FWs. It was a dramatic shift from prior times.

And then, that 29+ era is classically known as the Saturn Return, if you read that astrology gobbledygook. But what it signifies is whether or not one's on the right path and whether or not one needs serious modification. That's somewhat when I'd realized that I didn't fit into the whole Catholic large family thing of Rio; my illusions about that were beginning to unwind. I was generally an outgoing introvert (which isn't a contradiction) and started to learn things like Qigong, Meditation, and so forth, looking for happiness from within w/o outside validation. This is where Public and I have departed ways.

Today, I can be completely alone and happy or with a group of people and feel the same way, provided that they're not a bunch of a-holes. And likewise, with Mel, I now have a new family with whom I can get to know and form relationships.

So basically, Rodgers got stuck at the 1st gateway (think about it, 'Titanic', a chick fantasy flick, was his favorite movie. For most guys, it would be 'Raiders of the Lost Ark' or 'Terminator') and thus, he never made it to the 2nd gateway.

Afterwards, slipping deeper into fantasy and concocting this dream-like realm of external persecution, he'd given up on life and went out with a bang. So I think it's how we process those gates is how we determine, whether or not we make it.

Yes, I'd already read your 'gateway' entry, and identified with it, particularly the parts relating to the second and final gateways. It's worth noting that successful passage through the final gateway can take much longer than the others, yet also result in the most profound benefits.

I'm reminded of Blake's "doors of perception", an idea explored by Huxley in a book entitled such. Rodger's doors of perception were terribly filthy. Had he had in his possession, much less made use of the tools (factors) to which I referred in order to cleanse his doors, no lives would have been lost, and he would be on his way to being a success story in the only arena that counts, life itself.

[MarcosZeitola]

Elliot Rodger wanted sex. He wanted companionship. He wanted a hot girl. She had to blonde and have near model looks. It was for him, mainly, a status thing.

He failed. He failed because he did nothing. And he blamed the world.

[S_Parc]

Elliot Rodger wanted sex. He wanted companionship. He wanted a hot girl. She had to blonde and have near model looks. It was for him, mainly, a status thing.

He failed. He failed because he did nothing. And he blamed the world.

He didn't have me, as a multimillionaire uncle. Give me the lump sum of money, a time machine, and I'll get back to 2009, and fix this kid at the age of 17.

[ntm1972]

Elliot Rodger wanted sex. He wanted companionship. He wanted a hot girl. She had to blonde and have near model looks. It was for him, mainly, a status thing.

He failed. He failed because he did nothing. And he blamed the world.

He didn't have me, as a multimillionaire uncle. Give me the lump sum of money, a time machine, and I'll get back to 2009, and fix this kid at the age of 17.

Not good enough.

This kid's personality was set in stone by the age of 17. College just reinforced the worldview he'd cultivated, with a lot of that development occurring in junior high and high school. You, or any other would-be savior, would have had to intervene much earlier in his life, and would have had to mentor him for a protracted period of time.

Bathing in p***y juice wouldn't have been enough, just as it's not enough for any man. This guy had far deeper problems.

[S_Parc]

He didn't have me, as a multimillionaire uncle. Give me the lump sum of money, a time machine, and I'll get back to 2009, and fix this kid at the age of 17.

Not good enough.

This kid's personality was set in stone by the age of 17. College just reinforced the worldview he'd cultivated, with a lot of that development occurring in junior high and high school. You, or any other would-be savior, would have had to intervene much earlier in his life, and would have had to mentor him for a protracted period of time.

I'm looking at it, as a Holden Caulfield persona of 'Catcher In The Rye', a boy caught between that 13 to 17 gateway, unable to resolve his inner idealism with the not so accommodating world around him.

Bathing in p***y juice wouldn't have been enough, just as it's not enough for any man. This guy had far deeper problems.

Not sure, because if Mel wasn't a near soulmate, I'd be perfectly fine simply doing h@es and could probably manage quite well w/o a GF.

As for Rodgers, my program for him would be a lot different than simply tossing women at him, like practicing free throws on a basketball court.

I'd remove him from the campus life, as he's clearly a misfit there. He'd be doing the Penn State online bachelors, and I'd have a few places to rotate during the year like Costa Rica, Thailand, etc. At most, the only time he'd show up in the US, would probably be to pick up his graduation diploma in Pennsylvania when it's all over.

I'd make sure that he learned to either play guitar or keyboards, do his homeworks on a scheduled manner, b*ink to his (or my) favorite songs, and develop an exercise program.

In a few years of a structured program, like described above, he'd start to mellow and may actually realize that all he really needs is money and so he'd probably end up becoming another 'Wolf of Wall St', and so while he may be just another rip off artist in the end, at least he won't kill anyone.

[Cornfed]

He failed. He failed because he did nothing. And he blamed the world.

Did nothing? He was a literate, articulate guy in good shape, presumably getting OK grades etc. How is that doing nothing?

[ntm1972]

He didn't have me, as a multimillionaire uncle. Give me the lump sum of money, a time machine, and I'll get back to 2009, and fix this kid at the age of 17.

Not good enough.

This kid's personality was set in stone by the age of 17. College just reinforced the worldview he'd cultivated, with a lot of that development occurring in junior high and high school. You, or any other would-be savior, would have had to intervene much earlier in his life, and would have had to mentor him for a protracted period of time.

I'm looking at it, as a Holden Caulfield persona of 'Catcher In The Rye', a boy caught between that 13 to 17 gateway, unable to resolve his inner idealism with the not so accommodating world around him.

Bathing in p***y juice wouldn't have been enough, just as it's not enough for any man. This guy had far deeper problems.

Not sure, because if Mel wasn't a near soulmate, I'd be perfectly fine simply doing h@es and could probably manage quite well w/o a GF.

As for Rodgers, my program for him would be a lot different than simply tossing women at him, like practicing free throws on a basketball court.

I'd remove him from the campus life, as he's clearly a misfit there. He'd be doing the Penn State online bachelors, and I'd have a few places to rotate during the year like Costa Rica, Thailand, etc. At most, the only time he'd show up in the US, would probably be to pick up his graduation diploma in Pennsylvania when it's all over.

I'd make sure that he learned to either play guitar or keyboards, do his homeworks on a scheduled manner, b*ink to his (or my) favorite songs, and develop an exercise program.

In a few years of a structured program, like described above, he'd start to mellow and may actually realize that all he really needs is money and so he'd probably end up becoming another 'Wolf of Wall St', and so while he may be just another rip off artist in the end, at least he won't kill anyone.

Fair enough. In high school, I performed in piano recitals and started on the basketball team; in college, I was in a few theater productions, and played on a softball team. Point is, I got out there - as I'm sure you did - and didn't let my lack of a sex life become a ruinous obsession.

Not sure, because if Mel wasn't a near soulmate, I'd be perfectly fine simply doing h@es and could probably manage quite well w/o a GF.

I hear you. Between slammin' hos and swinging, I do just fine in my GF-free stretches, which get longer (my choice) as I grow older.

In a few years of a structured program, like described above, he'd start to mellow and may actually realize that all he really needs is money and so he'd probably end up becoming another 'Wolf of Wall St', and so while he may be just another rip off artist in the end, at least he won't kill anyone.

At least not right away. Some white-collar types are quite proficient at killing their targets slowly, depending on their chosen field of endeavor.

[S_Parc]

In a few years of a structured program, like described above, he'd start to mellow and may actually realize that all he really needs is money and so he'd probably end up becoming another 'Wolf of Wall St', and so while he may be just another rip off artist in the end, at least he won't kill anyone.

At least not right away. Some white-collar types are quite proficient at killing their targets slowly, depending on their chosen field of endeavor.

The thing is that he'll probably be another sleazy salesman type, as his morals were probably screwed up, before the age of 13. And thus, he'll know how to weasel ppl into buying penny stocks but at the same time, he won't necessarily need to go into a life of killing others, out of a sense of depravity, as he did at UCSB. He'll make money and do coke and h@es, nothing too out of the ordinary for a broker

[droid]

The funny thing is, there is more class and realness in the people from this video than I see in the people from either the American party video or Italian party videos:
http://youtu.be/6fVE8kSM43I

That video illustrates the typical sausage fest in America. It's actually more representative of what actually goes on than the OP video.

See, videos like the one Steve posted make it seem like these locations are 'happening' and that 'there's plenty of sluts for everyone'. When you actually hit the field, it's more like slipknot's scene.

For the average horny man, the frustration then arises from the fact that the dirty sluts are not being available to HIM, as some kind of torturous cognitive dissonance. But a level-headed man is conscious that it's mainly due to the ratios, which suck, as I've stated before.

[droid]

Eurobat, I have to respectfully wholeheartedly disagree with you on this comparison. To me its obvious.
For example, here is a u tube video of parting Italian youth. These just so happened to be the first few videos on U tube when I searched U tube under Italian partying, so Im not cherry picking.
1) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7il38QNNRzQ
2) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5anba-aKxE
3) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpsSkZ91WrE
Can you not clearly see the difference??? In general, the American youth (especially the women) are extremely narcissitic and crude and act trashy and totally lack any class. (not every person of course, just in general), The foul language is almost constant and rampant in most American youth partying, especially the women. There is a difference between partying in a normal healthy fun way (like these Italian videos, of which make me a bit jealous for not being able to be there) vs the douche bagness, egotistical narcisstic mannerisms of the AMerican youth partiers (obviously reflecting a culture in decline) not to mention the constant foul language in AMerican videos. I can clearly see the difference. And the majority of Latin and European young partiers don't have this trashy rap music. Usually other cultures party to classier positive happy go lucky party music like in video #2 above. Man, how can anyone not see these general differences.

Not really that much different. The trashy ways are spreading through the globe; all those pretentious douches sticking their tongues out don't seem a lot more wholesome. If you go to south-america you can find plenty of tramp-stamped bitches trying to be American, truly idiotic.
I guess what could be argued more is about the actual ratios at which these 'cultural traits' have spread out.

I never really understood the whole 'partying' thing. I understand going out and socializing, acting a bit crazy once in a while, which I did in my time. But making this a whole lifestyle is retarded.
What's frustrating is that more and more this bullshit environment is the only way to get to meet women; you can't just go to a library and talk to a chick about a common intellectual interest or something. You're expected to tat'up and speak Stupidese at a 'party' to get anywhere.

[eurobrat]

Not really that much different. The trashy ways are spreading through the globe; all those pretentious douches sticking their tongues out don't seem a lot more wholesome. If you go to south-america you can find plenty of tramp-stamped bitches trying to be American, truly idiotic. I guess what could be argued more is about the actual ratios at which these 'cultural traits' have spread out.

Thank you for that.

[MarcosZeitola]

He failed. He failed because he did nothing. And he blamed the world.

Did nothing? He was a literate, articulate guy in good shape, presumably getting OK grades etc. How is that doing nothing?

He did not approach women. Yet he expected them to throw themselves at his feet because he was a narcissistic asshole who believed himself to be the handsomest and most perfect man in the whole entire world. Because of this he never approached a woman... in his own deluded little mind, he didn't think he HAD to. Driving a big car and wearing brand clothes was, in his own shallow mind, all that he had to do.

He wanted to get rich by winning the lottery. This failed. He then tried to write "the greatest ever movie script", but quickly gave up. He spent hundreds of dollars on winning lotteries, drove to different states, but of course it was all a waste of time. He was a desperate loser and his plans to get rich were absolutely preposterous.

Elliot Rodger wanted things, but he did work for them. He never tried. He expected everything to naturally work out because he was such a swell guy, and the world simply doesn't work like that. He was the living, breathing definition of sour grapes; unable to feel happy for someone else, bitter and angry at the world. So he decided to punish the world for not giving him what he wanted. Like an overgrown toddler with deadly assault weapons, throwing a lethal tantrum. Because mentally he was exactly that... an overgrown toddler throwing tantrums.

[Cornfed]

He expected everything to naturally work out because he was such a swell guy, and the world simply doesn't work like that.

Well wasn't Elliot right to blame the world then? Do we not want men to be rewarded for being swell guys, as opposed to being dirtbags, constantly harassing females, or whatever you think he should have been doing? Would it not be in our interests if society functioned as Elliot thought it should, rather than as it actually does?