Are most Filipinas gold diggers or scammers?

[mentor]

Thanks for sharing this info hammanta.
I thought that the 'ending' was a 'happy' one, leading to one filipina girl, but after your clarification I understand that it was just over now.

As I think of it, find the right girl, takes time, efforts, money, and a lot of attention, but once you find the right girl then everything is ok.

[MarcosZeitola]

As I think of it, find the right girl, takes time, efforts, money, and a lot of attention, but once you find the right girl then everything is ok.

If she really is "the right girl", she will not cost you a lot of time, effort and money.

[PFWARD]

Best advice is don't do it. Weeding out the gold diggers/scammers is the easier part. Thinking just because the girl isn't interested in money and loves you like crazy puts you in the clear is a big mistake. Many have heard, floating around the net, the Philippines being called a narcissistic society. And it is. And the corruption isn't only the government, it goes throughout the society all the way down to the squatters. It's pathological. Lying, cheating, stealing is NOT seen as wrong and the blame is assigned to the victim, not the perpetrator. The tables are turned in the Phills. Young girls chase much older men, sounds good, hugh? But the tables are turned on what's right and wrong also, that includes the perpetrator being seen as the victim and the victim being seen as the guilty one. Family Values? The term does not have the same meaning in the Phills as it does in the West. Instead of parents feeling responsible for the welfare of the children they brought into the world, the children are raised to believe they are responsible for the welfare of the parents and reminded that they are owed for bringing the children into the world. It's deplorable. Parasitical. Some, and it is only some, of the middle class have escaped this mindset. But don't count on it just because they're middleclass. For many these traits are hidden until it is much too late.

First you must understand that there is a difference between being Narcissistic and Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD). NPD is a pathology that can not be cured, you can't teach a NPD the "right" way. The pathology prevents them from ever being able to learn right from wrong. They're delusional. Yes everyone lies. But there is a big difference between a normal persons lie and that of a NPD. They lie without conscience, they see nothing wrong with lying to hurt others. Nothing wrong with lying to gain at another expense or to evade responsibility for mistakes or wrong doing. Have you ever lied to hurt another person? For personal gain? To your boss or spouse? How did you feel? Was it ok? Did you reflect and realize that you needed to work on your behavior or actions as to not be in that position again? Did you feel bad about what you did? Well they don't, they do not correct the behavior as they see the lie to be the correct behavior and reaction. They do not even reflect on the behavior that led to the lie. It is mind boggling.

NPD in itself is a little misleading if you don't know what's really going on. NPD belongs to a cluster of PD's on a spectrum that includes Histrionics (HPD), Anti-social (Sociopaths and psychopaths) (APD). Males are more likely to have NPD and females HPD. But it is often more complicated than that. The cluster is called Cluster B.

Someone who is HPD, for instance, will often have traits that are also NPD or even APD. HPD may be their "core" behavior, but don't be surprised if you end up with narcissistic rage and discover that your sweetie acts like a psychopath behind closed doors once the hooks are in. Any of the PD's can be the "core" PD and incorporate some of the others from the cluster.

These are the abusers of the world. It is just that it is rampant in the Phils. (4%, lol, more like 4% are not a problem if you ever get close enough to them).

If you're still determined to jump in at least spend some serious time looking into Cluster B and their manipulative, abusive ways. At least when those little red flags go off in your head you'll have more support for them and hopefully listen and run. It's so crazy you'll think it is a mistake, no one would tell such a stupid lie, no one would do something like that on purpose, I (or they) must just misunderstand. It's not a mistake and the issues will snowball with never a resolution.

Google terms like:
FOG Cluster B abuse. (FOG stands for Fear, Obligation, Guilt, if you've ever been involved with a PD you'll know why).
NPD abuse.
HPD abuse.

Take heed of victims input on the subject, psychologist can only read about it and observe the behavior displayed in their office. The victims are the ones who have the first hand experience of just how crazy and upside down life is with them.

Making matters worse, the abuse can cause PTSD or C-PTSD in the abused, essentially making you both crazy. They can then point to your behavior in reaction to their behavior and you'll be well on your way to a downward spiral. Getting away from them and then seeking counseling for abuse will help you. It is a grave mistake to try to help them, you can't, if you try the FOG will just become thicker.

[The_Adventurer]

I honestly don't understand this fascination with very educated, independent women with good jobs etc. In my mind, their thinking is often too much like that of a man. If one is traditional, I would think they desire I stay at home wife and mother. I realise many here have little desire to learn languages (I happen to love it) but many of these "uneducated" girls speak just fine in their own language and can hold good conversations.

Education isn't the end all... In fact, most times it's indoctrination into a mode of thinking that it anti-traditional and against the good of society. While it might be great for the modern world and big city lifestyle, marriage and children have no place in either really. Everyone works, no one quits and it's every person for themselves.

I've had two long term relationships with "educated" working women. They think like a man. They expect you to match to their schedule. When they get off work or get free time, they expect you to drop what you're doing and spend time with them, even if you're in the middle of YOUR work or something equally important.

Eventually, something like this happens: In order to get better pay or a higher position, she has to go to city A, or worse country A. For YOUR job, in order to advance, you have to go to city B, or country B. Now you are left with two choices. Either someone must compromise their happiness for the other, or you SPLIT and go your separate ways. Just like that. It's over.

[PFWARD]

I honestly don't understand this fascination with very educated, independent women with good jobs etc. In my mind, their thinking is often too much like that of a man. If one is traditional, I would think they desire I stay at home wife and mother. I realise many here have little desire to learn languages (I happen to love it) but many of these "uneducated" girls speak just fine in their own language and can hold good conversations.

Education isn't the end all... In fact, most times it's indoctrination into a mode of thinking that it anti-traditional and against the good of society. While it might be great for the modern world and big city lifestyle, marriage and children have no place in either really. Everyone works, no one quits and it's every person for themselves.

I've had two long term relationships with "educated" working women. They think like a man. They expect you to match to their schedule. When they get off work or get free time, they expect you to drop what you're doing and spend time with them, even if you're in the middle of YOUR work or something equally important.

Eventually, something like this happens: In order to get better pay or a higher position, she has to go to city A, or worse country A. For YOUR job, in order to advance, you have to go to city B, or country B. Now you are left with two choices. Either someone must compromise their happiness for the other, or you SPLIT and go your separate ways. Just like that. It's over.

For one, ideally, education instills and cultivates critical thinking. It is an indicator (but not guarantee) of a desire to improve oneself through their own effort. It builds confidence. Believe me your children will not be happy with a mother who's an idiot. Your wife won't be a stay at home mother forever anyways, what is she supposed to do with the rest of her life, tmismis, shop and watch soaps? A mind is a beautiful thing to waste. "independent women", well uneducated woman can be very independent when it comes to doing what they want no matter the consequence (especially when one way or the other you are the one who will bear the consequences). They can only be dependent, very dependent on their needs and wants and then declare their independents for everything else. The goal of a functional family is interdependence, not dependence, there is a big difference. Still, education is no guarantee that you're not headed for the abyss.

"indoctrination into a mode of thinking that it anti-traditional and against the good of society.", sounds more like you're talking about indoctrination into feminism on campus. Those who fall into that way of thinking will still end up being an issue. You stand a lot better chance of an educated woman understanding things than an ignorant woman being able to understand. It's not a guarantee, there are definitely exceptions on both sides, especially when PD's are involved.

" great for the modern world and big city lifestyle, marriage and children have no place in either", are you planning on us getting bombed into the stone age? Our children are the advancement of the modern world, being able to function in it is very important for them and their success in life. You may be really talking about traditional values vs what may be seen as "modern" values. The issue is values, not education. Raise them with your values, live them by example, be flexible and reflective enough to notice your own errors and self correct. Your children will trust your advice much more readily, and be better able to judge when they should modify their values.

"they expect you to drop what you're doing and spend time with them", I've faced the same shit with uneducated non working woman.

Relocation for career is a tricky thing, every situation has different dynamics. Relocating so she can get an accounting job and you'd have to give up your IT managerial job is foolish. Relocating so she can take an executive position in a fortune 500 company and you having to give up your $20 an hour widget manufacturing job is a totally different consideration. You both need to remove your emotional feelings about it and apply common sense. It is more about what is better for the future of all involved, not about what is best for me, me, me for your own emotional reasons. These kind of things should be realized BEFORE you start pushing out children. If your taking a Pinay, even an educated Pinay to the West, relocation based on the Pinay's career advancement that makes sense for all involved would be a rare case. Her being an albatross around your neck is what you should be worried about.

Pinays being better wives and homemakers is a myth. They are often even more selfish and self centered than woman in the West, it is just hidden until they think they have a lock, if they are able to control themselves at all. Their parenting skills often SUCK. You can definitely get them MUCH younger here, and it might (just a might) be cheaper to play a sugar daddy if that's what you want. If you're the type that wants and can effectively put a woman under your thumb you may (just may) be able to get away with it. A stronger abuser can keep a weaker abuser "inline". But who in their right mind wants to bring up children in that way.

Tread lightly here in the land of human IED's.

[mentor]

After reading the above posts, and some 'red flags' I saw in some of my conversations with filipinas,
I wonder if chinese girls are finally better.
I think it is told that are more 'cold' or with more 'logic' and less 'warm heart', but build a relationship with no lies, is very important.
Of course, anything depends on each person, but if a girl lives in society that telling lies is absolutely normal, then this is a problem...

[pete98146]

I honestly don't understand this fascination with very educated, independent women with good jobs etc. In my mind, their thinking is often too much like that of a man. If one is traditional, I would think they desire I stay at home wife and mother. I realise many here have little desire to learn languages (I happen to love it) but many of these "uneducated" girls speak just fine in their own language and can hold good conversations.

Education isn't the end all... In fact, most times it's indoctrination into a mode of thinking that it anti-traditional and against the good of society. While it might be great for the modern world and big city lifestyle, marriage and children have no place in either really. Everyone works, no one quits and it's every person for themselves.

I've had two long term relationships with "educated" working women. They think like a man. They expect you to match to their schedule. When they get off work or get free time, they expect you to drop what you're doing and spend time with them, even if you're in the middle of YOUR work or something equally important.

Eventually, something like this happens: In order to get better pay or a higher position, she has to go to city A, or worse country A. For YOUR job, in order to advance, you have to go to city B, or country B. Now you are left with two choices. Either someone must compromise their happiness for the other, or you SPLIT and go your separate ways. Just like that. It's over.

Well I too would stay clear of the VERY educated women. Before I met my wife, I had an online fling with a young lady from Singapore. She had her masters degree and was a marketing manager for IBM. She came from a very well to do family. Her life's mission was to meet and marry a nice white guy <-- her words directly. In fact, she came to visit me in Seattle for a week and while here she gave me the ultimatum as our relationship had reached the do or die point. I opted not to pursue her because I saw too many red flags ie the materialism, her being a daddy's girl and used to getting anything she asked for etc.
So I agree with you on this point.

What I settled for instead was a Filipina with her 4 year degree in education. She is not VERY educated. And let's face it, a college education is probably the equivalent of high school in the west. However, completing a 4 year degree shows me some traits that peak my interest ie the willingness to commit, dedication, the willingness to overcome hurdles. Also, I can almost guarantee that she'll be more mature and a she'll somebody that I enjoy engaging in a conversation with. I've posted many many times that you want your woman to be an asset and not a liability to your family. She doesn't have to be a rocket scientist, just a nice smart girl with a good head on her shoulders.

Hope this helps clarify my viewpoint.

[hammanta]

I honestly don't understand this fascination with very educated, independent women with good jobs etc. In my mind, their thinking is often too much like that of a man. If one is traditional, I would think they desire I stay at home wife and mother. I realise many here have little desire to learn languages (I happen to love it) but many of these "uneducated" girls speak just fine in their own language and can hold good conversations.

Education isn't the end all... In fact, most times it's indoctrination into a mode of thinking that it anti-traditional and against the good of society. While it might be great for the modern world and big city lifestyle, marriage and children have no place in either really. Everyone works, no one quits and it's every person for themselves.

I've had two long term relationships with "educated" working women. They think like a man. They expect you to match to their schedule. When they get off work or get free time, they expect you to drop what you're doing and spend time with them, even if you're in the middle of YOUR work or something equally important.

Eventually, something like this happens: In order to get better pay or a higher position, she has to go to city A, or worse country A. For YOUR job, in order to advance, you have to go to city B, or country B. Now you are left with two choices. Either someone must compromise their happiness for the other, or you SPLIT and go your separate ways. Just like that. It's over.

For one, ideally, education instills and cultivates critical thinking. It is an indicator (but not guarantee) of a desire to improve oneself through their own effort. It builds confidence. Believe me your children will not be happy with a mother who's an idiot. Your wife won't be a stay at home mother forever anyways, what is she supposed to do with the rest of her life, tmismis, shop and watch soaps? A mind is a beautiful thing to waste. "independent women", well uneducated woman can be very independent when it comes to doing what they want no matter the consequence (especially when one way or the other you are the one who will bear the consequences). They can only be dependent, very dependent on their needs and wants and then declare their independents for everything else. The goal of a functional family is interdependence, not dependence, there is a big difference. Still, education is no guarantee that you're not headed for the abyss.

"indoctrination into a mode of thinking that it anti-traditional and against the good of society.", sounds more like you're talking about indoctrination into feminism on campus. Those who fall into that way of thinking will still end up being an issue. You stand a lot better chance of an educated woman understanding things than an ignorant woman being able to understand. It's not a guarantee, there are definitely exceptions on both sides, especially when PD's are involved.

" great for the modern world and big city lifestyle, marriage and children have no place in either", are you planning on us getting bombed into the stone age? Our children are the advancement of the modern world, being able to function in it is very important for them and their success in life. You may be really talking about traditional values vs what may be seen as "modern" values. The issue is values, not education. Raise them with your values, live them by example, be flexible and reflective enough to notice your own errors and self correct. Your children will trust your advice much more readily, and be better able to judge when they should modify their values.

"they expect you to drop what you're doing and spend time with them", I've faced the same shit with uneducated non working woman.

Relocation for career is a tricky thing, every situation has different dynamics. Relocating so she can get an accounting job and you'd have to give up your IT managerial job is foolish. Relocating so she can take an executive position in a fortune 500 company and you having to give up your $20 an hour widget manufacturing job is a totally different consideration. You both need to remove your emotional feelings about it and apply common sense. It is more about what is better for the future of all involved, not about what is best for me, me, me for your own emotional reasons. These kind of things should be realized BEFORE you start pushing out children. If your taking a Pinay, even an educated Pinay to the West, relocation based on the Pinay's career advancement that makes sense for all involved would be a rare case. Her being an albatross around your neck is what you should be worried about.

Pinays being better wives and homemakers is a myth. They are often even more selfish and self centered than woman in the West, it is just hidden until they think they have a lock, if they are able to control themselves at all. Their parenting skills often SUCK. You can definitely get them MUCH younger here, and it might (just a might) be cheaper to play a sugar daddy if that's what you want. If you're the type that wants and can effectively put a woman under your thumb you may (just may) be able to get away with it. A stronger abuser can keep a weaker abuser "inline". But who in their right mind wants to bring up children in that way.

Tread lightly here in the land of human IED's.

Solid post! Agree with a large portion of what you wrote. I still believe pinays are a better catch than a lot of the world's women though there will always be negative qualities.

[The_Adventurer]

A great and detailed response PFWARD. Thank you. I do have a few points...

For one, ideally, education instills and cultivates critical thinking.

From what I have seen, modern education does the exact opposite. It seems to create content, if not happy, worker drones. People who will go to work (for someone else), do their job, shop and question nothing. Being over 40, most of the stuff talked about on this board didn't exist in my day. Aside from mass media, education was a means of bringing it all about.

I don't believe that a lack of education, particularly higher education, creates an idiot. Many of the heads of some of the greatest companies in history were "uneducated" after all. We all have heard terms like "sidewalk university" and "street smarts" etc. It is never as black and white as go to university or be ignorant.

Of course, it matters what one studies as well. I am guessing that even those who want an educated woman aren't planning to marry an astronaut or doctor, someone who may spend months in space or outrageous hours in a hospital.

" great for the modern world and big city lifestyle, marriage and children have no place in either", are you planning on us getting bombed into the stone age? Our children are the advancement of the modern world, being able to function in it is very important for them and their success in life.

The most "modern", developed and advanced countries have frighteningly low birth rates, whereas in slum environments people are having 4 or 5 kids. I'm not saying this is the fault of education, but the role of education in this cannot be denied. More educated people live alone, in big cities and do their jobs. This is also why in advanced Asian countries, rural areas are often empty and men there are importing foreign brides from poor countries.

Relocation for career is a tricky thing, every situation has different dynamics. Relocating so she can get an accounting job and you'd have to give up your IT managerial job is foolish. Relocating so she can take an executive position in a fortune 500 company and you having to give up your $20 an hour widget manufacturing job is a totally different consideration. You both need to remove your emotional feelings about it and apply common sense. It is more about what is better for the future of all involved, not about what is best for me, me, me for your own emotional reasons.

I can't speak to how it may be in Phils, but in China, and a couple of cases I know in Korea, what is considered best for all is the largest number on the bottom of the balance sheet. If he works here and she works there, and the result is more overall income for the "family", they do that.

They are often even more selfish and self centered than woman in the West, it is just hidden until they think they have a lock...

This might just be the case anywhere with young, post 90's women.

[PFWARD]

"frighteningly low birth rates", the real problem is the frighteningly high birth rates of the uneducated. Philippines has a population of 100m and is smaller than Arizona. We have an over population problem, not an under population problem. Having children you can't feed and educate properly is stupid. "in slum environments people are having 4 or 5 kids", that's an argument FOR education not against it.

Sorry, for relocation I was thinking the real world in the West. For the Phil's anything that gets you to the West trumps all unless you're part of the oligarchs.

[mentor]

The filipina girl I am talking this period (seems a good one, but...what now?), tells me all the time that she has not load in her phone....
so she sends me just an email of 1 line of text, each day, that's all.
I want to understand the situation, but I cannot tell this like a contact.
If she really wanted a communication with me, doesn't she has to find a way, to at least be able to communicate?
If she cannot send a simple email with text, what will happen if I told her to go to a net cafe, to make a video call in skype?
I saw somewhere else the phrase 'if a girl wants, she finds the way'...
I want to understand poverty, but not at this extent. I am not gonna pay her, any girl, to contact with me.

Any clues? What do you think about?

[PFWARD]

1 line of text email? LOL, they're such shit heads....

[The_Adventurer]

Poor girls run out of load all the time. They'll have 5 peso load and pass 2 to their friend. That's just the way it is. Would it kill you to pass a dollar load (forty something peso) to her?

[Jester]

I honestly don't understand this fascination with very educated, independent women with good jobs etc. In my mind, their thinking is often too much like that of a man. If one is traditional, I would think they desire I stay at home wife and mother. I realise many here have little desire to learn languages (I happen to love it) but many of these "uneducated" girls speak just fine in their own language and can hold good conversations.

Education isn't the end all... In fact, most times it's indoctrination into a mode of thinking that it anti-traditional and against the good of society. While it might be great for the modern world and big city lifestyle, marriage and children have no place in either really. Everyone works, no one quits and it's every person for themselves.

Gold.

[Jester]

"frighteningly low birth rates", the real problem is the frighteningly high birth rates of the uneducated. Philippines has a population of 100m and is smaller than Arizona. We have an over population problem, not an under population problem. Having children you can't feed and educate properly is stupid. "in slum environments people are having 4 or 5 kids", that's an argument FOR education not against it.

Sorry, for relocation I was thinking the real world in the West. For the Phil's anything that gets you to the West trumps all unless you're part of the oligarchs.

I guess you are from the Phils, you know slum-dwellers better than I do. Perhaps they should f**k less, study and work more. I don't know.

But for the typical reader of HA, to start aiming at 4 to 5 kids would be a GOOD thing.

Because for us, the problem is not lack of education. The problem is lack of action.

And the more babies we make, the better the world will be.

So don't expect us to deplore the mythical "overpopulation".