PUA says "looks are not important to women"

[ssjparris]

Okay...Okay...so we all know according to the last two pages...girls do like looks here in the good ol' USA.

you muscle yourself up for them to be interested in you. which is funny by the way.

American women are so funny and so messed up in the head that you have to do all of this work JUST to get their attention.

All that blood and sweat just to get a woman's attention. this is just ridicioulous (did i spell that right ? ).

I am still here in the states and can not find a date, this ofcourse is not my fault. I am skinny and dress casually ( or horrible for american women's taste ).
Now here is the thing.

american women look at me in public very often. where ever i go I get looked at.

I am considered the nerd type too by others but that ofcourse is not how i percieve myself. these women give me the boyfriend excuse
and want me away from them.

i look skinny, dress casually, and perceived as a nerd (but an attractive one ) yet when foreign women come and visit southern california in the usa.

they approach me and flirt with me. foreign women do NOT care about looks, they were fine by how i was dressed so there is nothing wrong with me

I do not need to build muscle to get attention from foreign women. i am extremely attractive handsome man it is just totally different with foreign
women.

UK girls are awesome they like good wholesome nice guys. They too do not care about looks as BellaRuth has proven, sure they like the thug look too
but without the bad side.

i was just sent a facebook chat request from a girl in australia ( they like black guys; barely any over there ) she flirted with me before then and told
me " mmmmm...black !! " haha.

american women...they want the thug look and the bad side to go with it. what the F*** is wrong with american women.

Again all this work and this game playing just to get an american womans attention. There ALL BAD GIRLS here. the guys that are doing all of
this work know this sooner or later. they are just too damn difficult when your actually with an american woman.

besides, PUA stuff is just a big scam that does not work. it is not natural. not normal.

David Deangelo ( Eben Pagan real name ) is making over $1,000,000 per month off of poor guys trying to get a date with BAD girls.

why play all these games when it is super easy to get a hot sexy foreign woman from east. europe, mexico, phillipenes, Japanese (hubba hubba )
and on top of that foreign women are super easy going nice girls that you will never have problems with ( once you find one that you are compatible
with.

GOD its great being me.

[keius]

Imagine a woman looking for a guy who's a perfect 100.
Looks will tip that number to 30. Money will tip it again to 70.
The last 30 depends on your personality, charisma, and social skills.

Now imagine that you are one ugly ass dude. Thats -50. Dirt poor?
-100 now? So, your charisma and personality are now supposed to compensate for the fact that you are repulsive in her eyes? If you can manage +200 to
charisma, then yeah, your good to go for the ladies but how many people can do that? (like others mentioned, it helps to hedge your bets by working out, and lying/deceiving
about your finances by looking like money. Good for something simple like just getting laid)

Extreme example maybe, but being tall, handsome, and wealthy sure bloody helps and gives you an extreme advantage. It opens up your pool of perspective partners by alot. Otherwise your stuck with the dregs of womanhood.

...unless you repatriate to some dirt poor country where your number one commodity (your money or nationality) is actually worth something

My conclusion, this Tyler is full of BS. Most of these guru's are full of BS.
One thing is true though. If you are confident without being egotistical, this also helps and can tip the number just a bit closer to 100. *Most* people who aren't too attractive are typically not very confident or socially adept with the opposite sex.

[Colt2571]

keius,

don't take this the wrong way but you're incorrect

women don't care about looks or money, they mean NOTHING to getting laid.

obvious example: cavemen didn't have mirrors or money, yet they were f***ing left and right

if money and looks were so important to getting laid, then why are there so many good looking and/or rich guys who can't get any p***y? there a tons of these guys and they can't seem to get laid...it's because attraction has from women has nothing to do with looks or money.

there are maybe 2% of women who care about those things and MUST have an attractive rich guy...there are exceptions to every rule.

but the rule is, women are attracted to CONFIDENCE...and you cannot buy confidence and you cannot be born looking confident. confidence is a state of mind that oozes from every pore. and you can the the ugliest dude in the room...if you're charismatic, you're going home with the hottest chick, while the good looking rich guy is buying girls drinks and going home alone. or girls are going to simply want to date him for his money, but not f**k him, because he's just an ATM machine.

don't get it twisted...social conditioning (looks, money) and attraction are two completely different things.

[The_Adventurer]

@Colt2571: One thing I have noticed is that the gradual build up of wealth and looks leads to to greater and greater confidence in a lot of men. So it may not be that that the women care directly about the guy's looks or money, they may be attracted to what the looks and money did for him and his confidence.

The Philippines is a perfect example of how little money matters. How many, who have been there, know any girl who is dating a "wealthy" foreigner that she rarely, if ever, sleeps with, but also has a dirt poor filipino boyfriend sitting at home?

[Colt2571]

"@Colt2571: One thing I have noticed is that the gradual build up of wealth and looks leads to to greater and greater confidence in a lot of men."

not really because it's not genuine confidence

looks and money are transient, meaning they don't mean much because they can easily be altered. you can have your face pounded and there goes your looks...you can easily lose all your money, so there goes your confidence.

so it is not real confidence you're talking about, it's socially programmed confidence, which is not real.

women are attracted to TRUE CONFIDENCE, which money cannot buy and looks have no effect on.

i will say it once again...how often have you seen an ugly and/or average looking guy who wasn't wealthy pick up or constantly hang with a hot chick? it happens ALOT. they obviously don't have alot of money or good looks, yet they consistently get results with women.

ever see the movie Office Space? remember how the guy got accidentally hypnotized and just became SUPER CONFIDENT and didn't care either way? THAT is what women are attracted to and that's why Jennifer Aniston became his girlfriend? he was an average looking guy who lived in a moderate apartment complex...the dude was obviously not wealthy or that good looking, yet he scored like crazy.

looks and money DO NOT, HAVE NEVER, AND WILL NEVER MATTER when it comes to scoring hot chicks.

[Repatriate]

looks and money DO NOT, HAVE NEVER, AND WILL NEVER MATTER when it comes to scoring hot chicks.

I wouldn't say it doesn't matter at all. It certainly can sway things in your favor if you have the appearance of stability and freedom as well. If you're in a dead heat with some guy with the same attributes then I can almost guarantee the dude with the most money will get the girl 9 times out of 10.

[ultraviolet]

This is a great thread,
I noticed a number of people have mentioned Confidence and Mindset.
This is something I agree with.

What I'd like to add is that I think Confidence and Mindset is a symptom,
Not the thing itself.
I think that the thing itself is this:

Masculinity.

Think about it, the masculine is strong,
It's confident,
It leads,
It's a force of nature that's undeniable.

Physiologically, what creates masculinity?
Testosterone.

This is something Pook talked about in his Book of Pook,
That when a girl says she wants a guy that's:
Strong, confident, can lead, etc...
Those are all masculine traits,
And those masculine traits come from testosterone.

As said, I've been working out,
This raises testosterone.

I have also been losing fat.
Fat lowers testosterone
So when a guy loses fat,
He has more testosterone.

I have improved my diet,
Making sure I get enough
Essential fatty acids and good oils
(ie. olive oil, coconut oil, fish oils from fish, etc...)
This helps build testosterone.

And literally I feel it,
The day after working out,
When I'm sore,
I start walking like how football players walk,
That kind of stagger,
People call it "jock walk".
When I walk like that, girls notice,
I'm not doing it as "game",
I'm doing it because my muscles are hurting,
And the effect is tangible.

I suppose one could try to "fake" it,
But I wonder if it would work t all.

When I work out my chest and arms,
My body language naturally improves,
It looks "alpha", exactly as those PUA books describe.
When I was studying PUA and trying to force myself
Into "alpha" postures, it felt uncomfortable.
Whereas in working out, that's just how my body naturally fell.
That's the effect of testosterone.
It literally is the essence of masculinity,
Which is what the feminine attracted to.

Of course this is just one theory.
In my own personal experience, this theory holds up.
Would be curious to know others' experience.

[keius]

Ultraviolet,

From personal experience, i'll say this: I was a skinny guy most of my life until after college.
I started pumping weights. It helped ALOT. The long term relationships still sucked due to many different factors,
but getting dates and relationships became much easier.

When your cut, women look at you. They give you more consideration. It does affect attraction. Many of the
girls admitted that they were attracted to hot bods. My wife told me that enough as well. I've gained a couple inches on
my waistline since i met my wife and she isn't too thrilled with it. She says she doesn't care that much (although she does care obviously)
except that she says i'm not allowed to get fat.

Being cut doesn't help if you act like an ahole but it provides an opportunity for a guy to make his move.
If you don't 'look' attractive by their standards, many girls won't even give you a chance to make your move.

EDIT: and yeah, i felt more energetic, confident, or more 'alpha' as you put it when i was buffed up.

Colt2571, don't get this the wrong way either but i'd have to disagree with you as well
The problem i have is you saying that money and looks mean NOTHING.
You are right about confidence to a certain extent.
I like to call it charisma, mostly because you can be confident and an ahole
and that combination isn't good for getting laid (unless the girls looking for that lol)
To me, it's different things and i like to define it as different attributes.
Women look for alot of different things in men. Ask them how important it is to have money and looks.
For many, it may not be number 1 on their list but it is important; always in the top 5 things they are looking for.
If your just looking to get laid with any ol' ugly, well then, i admit a little sweet talking is
probably all you need.
What i'm saying is that looks and money goes a long way in tipping the scales your way. If your a charismatic
guy, then yeah, that goes a long way in tipping the scales as well.
Why are there so many good looking guys or rich guys who can't get any p***y? Look at the ratio compared
to 'regular' looking guys. Comparatively, there aren't that many that can't get p***y. You can attribute that
to them having bad personalities, having extremely high standards, or any other number of reasons.

Also, 2% of women that MUST have those qualities in men? possibly.
My opinion: how about 100% of women that PREFER that men have those qualities?

Also, what women find attractive is based on social conditioning/culture to a large extent. They are very inter-related. There is a reason
tastes in women and men have changed over time. There is a reason that Chinese and Japanese (in the far past) used to think
white men looked ugly/hairy/apish/etc and no longer do so. There is a reason why certain tribes in Africa find nose-rings and various other
mutilations to be extremely attractive. Money may well be completely different from attraction but looks is an attribute too tightly
interwoven with attraction to be correspondingly independent.
Different societies have different standards. Much of this is related to social conditioning. The existence of this site is evidence to that fact.
And yeah, maybe we are debating apples and oranges. I think we might be looking at things from slightly different viewpoints.

Here's a big what if:
Winston is currently in Taiwan having problems with dating girls.
Do you believe he'd have a "better" chance (without changing his personality/confidence/charisma/whatever) if he were to
a - Get cut with a sexy bod.
b - dress better, more stylish
c- get money, drive a sexaaaay car, and be able to flash it.
d - all of the above.

[djfourmoney]

I agree with Colt, Confidence wins in the short term. In the long term money matters slightly more which is why so many woman abandon "Bad Boys" for often times "boring" to them men that are stable, mentally and financially.

This happens in every culture.

The problem in America is that everybody watches things and TV and wants "that" lifestyle. That's why those fancy wedding shows are popular, Wives of insert location are popular. These aren't shows around poor people, they are shows around upper middle class or rich people.

This is where women overseas come into play. Coming from some countries, they are plenty happy with a modest but nice home, a nice but not expensive car and enough money to be able to travel back home or go on vacations on a regular basis, nothing more.

Short Term, AW aren't bad, but not good either. Too many games too much junk to deal with.

Long Term, AW are too few and far between. You wanna spend 5-10 years finding that "special" American girl who's been done dirty by some guy so you can pick up the pieces?

F that, go elsewhere and if you're smart, play your cards right you could be married with your first child on the way inside of 2 years. If that's what you want.

[Colt2571]

for some reason this isn't letting me quote, so i have to do it manually:

QUOTE: "I wouldn't say it doesn't matter at all. It certainly can sway things in your favor if you have the appearance of stability and freedom as well. If you're in a dead heat with some guy with the same attributes then I can almost guarantee the dude with the most money will get the girl 9 times out of 10."

listen to me very carefully...if you have money AND TRUE CONFIDENCE, the girl isn't sexually attracted to you because you have money, it is meaningless...she is going to f**k you because you are confident, the money is simply a bonus, but it does not get her p***y wet.

you're trying to say a guy with game AND money will score a hot chick and using money as the reason, it doesn't work like that...the money has nothing to do with it because a woman doesn't f**k your money.

i'm talking about sex, not relationship. you will often see a rich man with a hot chick, but she is only with him for money, and she is probably not even boning him...if she is, she sure as f**k isn't enjoying it, as she isn't turned on by money.

i'm talking about sexually attracting hot chicks, which is what gets you laid. money attracts gold diggers, not girls who wanna f**k.

[Colt2571]

keius,

social conditioning does not affect sexual attraction...men have always been attracted to a woman's body...tits, ass, long hair, body shape, whatever...social conditioning has not changed that, EVER. so today she wears lipstick, dresses, high heels and perfume...men are still only attracted to their tits, ass, long hair and body shape...nothing has changed. social conditioning has just added more bullshit to get through.

it's the same for women, the base attraction for women is confidence...it always has been and social conditioning does not change that. so today men wear mohawks, watches, have tattoos, and rings...women are still attracted to confidence...social conditioning has just added more bullshit to get through.

the only thing social conditioning does is put barriers between men and women, that's why you see chicks playing all these bullshit head games, because they're looking for security for the long term and are just repeating what their mother's told them about not being "easy" and their p***y being worth a billion dollars or some other horse shit.

but attraction is NOT a choice, it is primal, like the fear of a shark....it simply is what it is and social conditioning does not change primal behavior.

[djfourmoney]

for some reason this isn't letting me quote, so i have to do it manually:

QUOTE: "I wouldn't say it doesn't matter at all. It certainly can sway things in your favor if you have the appearance of stability and freedom as well. If you're in a dead heat with some guy with the same attributes then I can almost guarantee the dude with the most money will get the girl 9 times out of 10."

listen to me very carefully...if you have money AND TRUE CONFIDENCE, the girl isn't sexually attracted to you because you have money, it is meaningless...she is going to f**k you because you are confident, the money is simply a bonus, but it does not get her p***y wet.

you're trying to say a guy with game AND money will score a hot chick and using money as the reason, it doesn't work like that...the money has nothing to do with it because a woman doesn't f**k your money.

i'm talking about sex, not relationship. you will often see a rich man with a hot chick, but she is only with him for money, and she is probably not even boning him...if she is, she sure as f**k isn't enjoying it, as she isn't turned on by money.

i'm talking about sexually attracting hot chicks, which is what gets you laid. money attracts gold diggers, not girls who wanna f**k.

Many mean just don't understand that. Yeah some women around dudes with money are hot, but you can get women just as hot elsewhere. I defy anybody go to Western or Eastern Europe, pull a serious dime that would break necks in Los Angeles, Miami or New York City. When the valet brings your late model car around and they see a hot woman jump in it with you, they aren't wondering how much money you got but rather what you did to get her to be with you.

Is that a function of money or confidence?

[Colt2571]

i think guys in here are mistaking attraction with gold digging.

they are not the same.

if you want a gold digging whore, go for it, but the sex will never be very good, it will be just enough for her to stay in your wallet if she's f***ing you at all. but if you want hot sex, genuinely hot sex from a woman who's ATTRACTED to you physically, then money and looks has ZERO to do with it. it has less than zero to do with it...as attraction is not a choice and is primal, like instinct...women respond to confidence, not worthless paper bills (money has no real value).

[keius]

What i'm saying is that social conditioning affects the standards by which people can be considered attractive.
Here's an example:

Agree or not, different generations of men view women differently using different standards.
Look at magazines/pictures in the US since it's come of age.
Standards of beauty have changed.
Look at the supermodels of the 80's and later.
The young crowd find these current super skinny models to be attractive. It's by no means 100% but
i think we can agree that it's the general consensus.
Personally, i think they are unattractive and somewhat 'nasty'. I'm a product of my
generation (the 80's) and this conditioning will typically last throughout a person's
lifetime. I find that most guy's my age, from the same background/culture share the
same standards of beauty/attraction that i do.
Social conditioning has a basis on my own preferences when it comes to attraction...from
physical attributes all the way to the way they dress. (ex. platform heels - huge turnoff)

My wife has a best (or former) friend still living in China. By my standards, she's a
2 out of 10 (ugly even). BUT she gets hit on and pursued by old guys relentlessly. They find her
to be very attractive. These old guys have waaaaay different standards. Never seen a young guy pursue her though

There are places on this globe where men find 'chunkier' women attractive and
skinny women repulsive and unhealthy.

There are places like Japan where the current young generation is crazed for super skinny
androgynous young men.

The relationship exists, although you could argue that it isn't directly related. Like i said before, possibly 'apples and oranges'.

I agree totally with you on one thing though, social conditioning does put up barriers of absolute BS over relationships. The social
conditioning can be very different between different generations and in different cultures/areas/countries.

keius,

social conditioning does not affect sexual attraction...men have always been attracted to a woman's body...tits, ass, long hair, body shape, whatever...social conditioning has not changed that, EVER. so today she wears lipstick, dresses, high heels and perfume...men are still only attracted to their tits, ass, long hair and body shape...nothing has changed. social conditioning has just added more bullshit to get through.

it's the same for women, the base attraction for women is confidence...it always has been and social conditioning does not change that. so today men wear mohawks, watches, have tattoos, and rings...women are still attracted to confidence...social conditioning has just added more bullshit to get through.

the only thing social conditioning does is put barriers between men and women, that's why you see chicks playing all these bullshit head games, because they're looking for security for the long term and are just repeating what their mother's told them about not being "easy" and their p***y being worth a billion dollars or some other horse shit.

but attraction is NOT a choice, it is primal, like the fear of a shark....it simply is what it is and social conditioning does not change primal behavior.

[E_Irizarry]

Good-ass thread, guys.

I think that Keius is right about how JP is. Japan has changed alot. Even in the Philippines, women like the boyish type and half the time, their b.f. is 10-20 lbs. lighter than they. Crazy eh? Whereas in AmeriKKKa, women have to have a dude near their age and be superskinny while they are buffy farm animals.