Approaching Taiwan girls - Response to Winston

[swincor]

I also act refined in the way I talk and carry myself. That's why job interviewers are usually impressed with me. I do not talk with the ghetto voice that taxi drivers or truck drivers in Taiwan talk with, nor do I have their wrinkly brown skin and ghetto voice. Hell no.

Doing a job interview is different from trying to get with a chick, Winston. Do you really have to be told this?

[swincor]

I do not look like an uncle type or taxi driver type. That was a lame shallow opinion that is typical Asian shallowness.

Many women say that I am cute with soulful eyes. That's true. I have a different look on my face than most. But only some appreciate it.

[Winston]

Big deal. She was just being nice to you. What did you expect her to say, that you look like a taxi driver?

Boy, you are unbelievably gullilble and naive, Winston. No wonder you got taken to the cleaners in Russia. And the Philippines.

Newsflash, Winston: people generally aren't going to say the honest truth straight to your face, especially if they're asked to comment on your physical looks. It's amazing that you would latch on so desperately to the word of some model who happens to be polite enough to flatter you with empty compliments. She must have said the same thing to dozens of other horndogs who've asked her the same question about their looks.

And anyway, who cares what you looked like back then? What does your looks back then have to do with the fact that you look like a taxi driver now?

LOL I knew you were going to say that. You are so predictable. So when a girl says I'm unattractive, she's being honest, and when she says I'm attractive, she's just being polite? lol Do I smell confirmation bias here?

You obviously don't read people well. If Trista was just being polite, she would have said "Nice pic" or something polite. I've talked to thousands of girls online and I know from experience what they say when they are just being polite. They do not use exclamation marks like Trista did. They do not say "I find you very attractive!" with an exclamation mark. That's not being polite. Being polite is saying "Nice pic" or "Cool" or something like that.

Sorry, but again, as a model Trista's opinion of my looks trumps yours.

Yeah I'm more overweight now. But the point is, the natural symmetry and features of my face are not unattractive. They are decent looking.

As to my hair guys, I've tried every kind of style and it just doesn't hold. My hair is too coarse. All I can do is cut it really short like a buzz cut. No other style will hold, even with lots of gel and mousse. The hair just sticks outward like a punk rocker or porcupine needles. What can I do about that?

[Repatriate]

Yeah I'm more overweight now. But the point is, the natural symmetry and features of my face are not unattractive. They are decent looking.

This sort of thing is for other people to judge. It's ok to recognize your flaws and work to improve them. It's even ok to admit you're kind of ugly as long as you don't internalize that into other aspects of your personality. What's not ok is self delusion and thinking that it's everyone else who has the problem.

Really Winston, it's not everyone else that doesn't recognize the magnificence of Winston. It's you. Women that you meet aren't going to be impressed with your rationalization about your "natural symmetry" they're going to think "hey he looks kinda like that Taxi driver that gave me a ride over here to this night club" and then giggle and walk away. Worse yet if you go with someone even mildly more attractive the girls are just going to flock to him naturally because you're the grenade. Get it?

I'm being harsh for your benefit.

As to my hair guys, I've tried every kind of style and it just doesn't hold. My hair is too coarse. All I can do is cut it really short like a buzz cut. No other style will hold, even with lots of gel and mousse. The hair just sticks outward like a punk rocker or porcupine needles. What can I do about that?

Go to a professional hair stylist and ask her what she can do with your hair to make it as attractive as possible. Go to a high end place that specializes in this sort of thing and get suggestions.

Also ditch the f***ing charlie brown polos, highwater pants, and ugly trail hiking shoes.

Sorry, but again, as a model Trista's opinion of my looks trumps yours.

Did she have sex with you? If not her opinion doesn't matter. You're her friend and she sounds like a very nice person but don't delude yourself into thinking comments like "you're cute" means "I'm really attracted to you and want to sleep with you later" There's a huge difference there. She might think you're cute like a pug or a pawn shop teddy bear but she won't let you anywhere near the boudoir. Plus she's not going to rip into your looks because nice friends generally don't do that unless they know you well enough to have frank critical discussions.

[Winston]

This sort of thing is for other people to judge. It's ok to recognize your flaws and work to improve them. It's even ok to admit you're kind of ugly as long as you don't internalize that into other aspects of your personality. What's not ok is self delusion and thinking that it's everyone else who has the problem.

Really Winston, it's not everyone else that doesn't recognize the magnificence of Winston. It's you. Women that you meet aren't going to be impressed with your rationalization about your "natural symmetry" they're going to think "hey he looks kinda like that Taxi driver that gave me a ride over here to this night club" and then giggle and walk away. Worse yet if you go with someone even mildly more attractive the girls are just going to flock to him naturally because you're the grenade. Get it?

I'm being harsh for your benefit.

So your hypothesis is that I'm ugly and that I should admit it? Why? Most people do not think I'm ugly. Not even frank people. Why do you make it a religion to diss my looks and why do you want me to say that I'm ugly? I am not. I've gotten lots of compliments before. Just cause you think I'm ugly, the whole world has to? Explain your logic here.

[Winston]

Hi all,
Rock and I went clubbing for a few days in Taichung last weekend. While there, we approached a lot of different girls. The reactions varied. Some of them fit the introverted types that I described, while others were more open, and some were in the middle too. So some of them validated what I said and others fit what he said. We had fun and met a lot of people while clubbing. I even met a drunk Mongolian girl who spoke Russian. She was shocked that I spoke Russian and hung out with us afterward.

I can say though, that the people in Taichung do seem a lot more open than in Chiayi and the smaller southern towns of Taiwan. There definitely was a difference.

Overall though, I'd say that the girls were more approachable to Rock, since he is white, tall and speaks fluent Mandarin. What's funny is that he has to speak Mandarin to make them feel comfortable talking to him, while I have to try to speak English to make myself look different from the rest of the Asian guys. But the race thing definitely makes a difference. Even Rock noticed that the girls seemed more standoffish to me.

Near the train station where we hung out though, the girls were mostly too young, like around 18. The college girls I guess, were at the colleges there.

On our 2nd night there, Rock made some calls from the girls we met at the clubs and arranged a double date for us. We had fun and the girls were amused that Rock and I were an unusual pair. He explained that he was an egg (white on the outside, yellow on the inside) while I was like a banana (white on the inside, yellow on the outside).

Rock's date was very flirty and a lot of fun to be around. She kept flirting with both of us and liked to tease us and ask challenging provocative questions. I have never seen a Taiwanese girl so open before. When she said that I was "so cute" it reminded me of last year when I went out in Taichung with Momopi and his Taiwanese female friend, who also said that I was "so cute". (I guess some TW girls think I'm cute, but not sexually attractive enough to sleep with?)

After we sang and drank at a karaoke bar for a few hours, Rock's date tried to get mine to go home with me. Rock told her about my "dry spell" in Taiwan so she tried to help out. But my date refused, and later admitted to her friend (Rock's date) that she does do a fair share of one night stands but usually with tall white guys.

So I guess that with open Taiwanese girls, tall white guys are the in thing. Another reason why it sucks to be Asian if you're a male. Also, Momopi has always said that Taiwanese women look for the best combination of the big 3H - Height, Handsome and High Income. What a shallow world.

Anyway, we met a lot of sweet nice girls, and I will post some photos of our outings here as soon as I find time to upload them to Picasaweb.

Rock is typing up his version of the trip and will probably post it soon.

Winston

[Repatriate]

So your hypothesis is that I'm ugly and that I should admit it? Why? Most people do not think I'm ugly. Not even frank people. Why do you make it a religion to diss my looks and why do you want me to say that I'm ugly? I am not. I've gotten lots of compliments before. Just cause you think I'm ugly, the whole world has to? Explain your logic here.

No I look at the results and what's obvious with my own eyes from the dozens of pics online you've posted. You go out for a night on the town and you get clowned by girls who only tag along because it's a double date with a better looking guy. Then you start blaming race, the environment, politics, the sky, basically everything and anything except your own attributes. Most people on this very forum have even pointed out the obvious.

[Winston]

So your hypothesis is that I'm ugly and that I should admit it? Why? Most people do not think I'm ugly. Not even frank people. Why do you make it a religion to diss my looks and why do you want me to say that I'm ugly? I am not. I've gotten lots of compliments before. Just cause you think I'm ugly, the whole world has to? Explain your logic here.

No I look at the results and what's obvious with my own eyes from the dozens of pics online you've posted. You go out for a night on the town and you get clowned by girls who only tag along because it's a double date with a better looking guy. Then you start blaming race, the environment, politics, the sky, basically everything and anything except your own attributes. Most people on this very forum have even pointed out the obvious.

Well it's true. Rock's date said that she only does one night stands with taller white guys. That's not something I can control.

Why do you have such a nasty victim blaming mentality? Do girls like that about you? Most girls are much more positive than that. Gee I bet that gives you a winning personality.

Why don't you show your pic to all of us? At least I have the guts to show myself. All you can do is blame. Not a very attractive trait.

Btw, Trista and many other girls say that I'm a very good talker with girls. I don't see how you are a good talker Repatriate. You just point fingers. Not a fun guy to be around. At least I act positive around women.

[Repatriate]

Well it's true. Rock's date said that she only does one night stands with taller white guys. That's not something I can control.

Why do you have such a nasty victim blaming mentality? Do girls like that about you? Most girls are much more positive than that. Gee I bet that gives you a winning personality.

Why don't you show your pic to all of us? At least I have the guts to show myself. All you can do is blame. Not a very attractive trait.

Btw, Trista and many other girls say that I'm a very good talker with girls. I don't see how you are a good talker Repatriate. You just point fingers. Not a fun guy to be around. At least I act positive around women.

Post up your best pic on that hot or not site for asian people that Rock or whoever linked to awhile back. At least get a broad superficial consensus on the internet.

You are incapable of any kind of self improvement or development Winston because you're delusional. A few girls giving you passive compliments doesn't mean jack shit.

I've said this already. I don't post pics or personal bio information on the internet.

[Winston]

Well it's true. Rock's date said that she only does one night stands with taller white guys. That's not something I can control.

Why do you have such a nasty victim blaming mentality? Do girls like that about you? Most girls are much more positive than that. Gee I bet that gives you a winning personality.

Why don't you show your pic to all of us? At least I have the guts to show myself. All you can do is blame. Not a very attractive trait.

Btw, Trista and many other girls say that I'm a very good talker with girls. I don't see how you are a good talker Repatriate. You just point fingers. Not a fun guy to be around. At least I act positive around women.

Post up your best pic on that hot or not site for asian people that Rock or whoever linked to awhile back. At least get a broad superficial consensus on the internet.

You are incapable of any kind of self improvement or development Winston because you're delusional. A few girls giving you passive compliments doesn't mean jack shit.

I've said this already. I don't post pics or personal bio information on the internet.

I've posted my pics on hot or not before. My ratings hovered around 7. Occasionally they went to 8. But sites like that are for shallow people anyway.

I am open to self improvement. Show me in pics what kind of clothes I should wear and what kind of haircut I should have. Give specific examples.

Most people do not like overly critical personalities like yours. Most people prefer relaxed easygoing guys like me. You don't come across as someone very pleasant yourself, so why do you pick on me? Is it your way of putting someone below you on the pecking order, like bullies do?

[Winston]

Question to Ladislav:

When me and Rock were in Taichung, I met up with a Filipina I met on Tagged. When we met her though, she was kind of standoffish and not very engaging, with either of us. She brought along two friends since I told her I was bringing Rock. We all talked at McDonald's, since there was nowhere else to go in that drag little town of theirs (outside of Taichung). Rock and I were engaging and talked about a lot of things about our lives, this forum, my site, etc. I tried to look innocent, but Rock enjoyed spilling the beans and making us look like playboys for some reason. I guess he preferred total honesty and spilling the beans over tact. lol

The girls' body language was kind of standoffish though. They were not flirty and engaging in their talk and body language as the Filipinas in the Philippines are. Rock told me that in Hong Kong, the Filipinas he met working there did not seem very "easy" either. So he concluded that overseas Filipino workers aren't that easy.

Why is that? Is there a reason for that? Is it cause they are making money and so become less eager to date? Since they are treated like low class objects in Chinese countries, it can't be that these Filipinas have a lot of dating opportunities in Taiwan and have therefore become spoiled.

So what is the reason that they seem different than in the Philippines? Any idea?

(Btw Repatriate, before you jump on the critical gun again, remember that these girls were standoffish and platonic to Rock too, not just to me.)

[Winston]

One more thing Repatriate.

In the Taichung clubs we went to, most of the other Asian guys were in cliques of regular friends. There were a few foreigners too. So it's not like I was anything below average or not able to do anything that everyone else was doing. Most guys there were not trying to pick up on chicks. They were just hanging out with their group of friends or dancing. So it wasn't like the girls wanted everyone else except me. So stop exaggerating. I may not measure up to standards, but it's not like everyone else can pick up hotties except me. It was not a point and click environment like the Angeles City P4P bars.

[Winston]

Repatriate,

Question: As the people said in the Lonely Planet thread (which got removed since approaching girls is a taboo subject there), in East Asia women don't usually talk to strangers unless introduced through a third party. That is part of the culture and tradition there. Chatting up women feels "out on a limb" and not part of the natural flow of things. Remember what they said below?

In many Asian cultures, the only way to meet women in a socially acceptable fashion is to be introduced by a third party.

Make friends with expat women who might be acquainted with local women or make friends with local men who might know local women.

You can point it out all you want. If the local culture is that a young woman is thought to have loose morals if she interacts with someone to whom she has not been formally introduced, then she is not about to respond to your advances.

No one is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to stay in Taiwan.

Ruth

It's not just Taiwan you know - it's the norm in much of Asia. From what I know, the following places (the entire Indian subcontinent), Malaysia, Singapore, Brunei, Indonesia, Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia, Myanmar, Korea, Taiwan, HK, China - try saying "Hi" loudly to any female stranger and you will get a blank response at most. Asians (and not just the girls) don't have a culture of answering back to greetings the way foreigners have. And at best, in Thailand and Japan you might get an embarassed smile with the girls quickly drawing back.

This is Asian culture - not the West. Not the entire world works the same. The only time you may get a response back may be from an Asian that has spent a considerable amount of time in a Western country or someone that works in the service industry.

Anyway, my question is: How do you know that my problem isn't that I just lack connections? I mean if I had more connections in TW, the results might be different right? Rock and I only met a small sample of women, and supposedly, there are many kind friendly girls in TW right? Not all of them are going to be as shallow and judgmental about little things as you are right?

So how do we know there isn't an untapped market of friendly girls in TW that I haven't met simply cause I haven't had the connections, rather than due to some deficiency in me?

Even Rock said that he noticed that people in China seemed more relaxed and open than in Taiwan. You can ask him about that.

So there are many factors here. It isn't all about how I look. I do act like a decent person.

Rock is tall and decent looking, yeah, but his skill is that his Mandarin is fluent, which surprises many girls, and he asks many open ended questions like Larry King and Jay Leno do, to keep the ball rolling. I can do that too but it takes me longer since I'm more used to written communication.

One more thing: I don't only go on double dates when I'm with a white guy. Last year, I went on one with Momopi as well, with a girl I knew (not introduced by Momopi) whom I met on my own online. (She lives in Australia now or else I'd be hanging out with her)

Stop being so overly judgmental Repatriate. You sound more shallow and fickle than most women I know. I think most Westerners prefer to hang around easy going laid back type of guys.

Honestly, I think you must be an insecure guy yourself Repatriate. Secure confident happy Asian men do not need to so vehemently put down the looks of another Asian bro, especially as viciously as you do.

[Repatriate]

Anyway, my question is: How do you know that my problem isn't that I just lack connections? I mean if I had more connections in TW, the results might be different right? Rock and I only met a small sample of women, and supposedly, there are many kind friendly girls in TW right? Not all of them are going to be as shallow and judgmental about little things as you are right?

From the very beginning of the discussion about your lack of a social life in Taiwan I mentioned social networking. That's what establishing connections are. I feel like i'm repeating myself here but if you look back I already said this. I'm sure if you went out every night and socialized in the right places you would find some women to overlook your flaws same as anywhere else. My whole philosophy in regards to this is not trying to find people that "accept" your flaws but becoming a better person.

Let me ask you something Winston, would you date a fat asian girl with the face of a noodle stall lady who dressed badly and liked to talk about aliens, how special she is, and ufos? I sure as hell wouldn't and you probably wouldn't either. That's the female version of how you look.

So how do we know there isn't an untapped market of friendly girls in TW that I haven't met simply cause I haven't had the connections, rather than due to some deficiency in me?

There are but they don't want someone who clearly doesn't give a crap. This "be yourself" stuff women always dole out to people is 100% bogus. There's nothing wrong with being comfortable with yourself but social presentation and grace means a lot. You keep asking why Rock was escalating sexual tension with those girls..uh that's because they probably in fact liked it even though they tried to play it off as being "good girls" with feigned uncomfortableness. Rock sounds like he knows how some women think at least.

Honestly, I think you must be an insecure guy yourself Repatriate. Secure confident happy Asian men do not need to so vehemently put down the looks of another Asian bro, especially as viciously as you do.

Winston you have this habit of flipping around any kind of discussion and making it an attack. Have you considered that some people out there actually want to see you reevaluate yourself and do better?

[Winston]

Repatriate, you are exaggerating again. I do not talk about aliens except with people who are interested in those things. You can ask Rock. Not once did I talk about aliens with any women. You are FALSELY stereotyping me as some geek. I can talk about anything, depending on who I am with. You have a FALSE image of what I am like.

I do not dress badly. I wear slacks and nice polo shirts usually. Middle class people dress like that. It's decent.

I am not that fat. Still height weight proportionate. Rock has gone for women double my weight. He likes big curvy women who weigh more than me even.

I didn't say that Rock was escalating sexual tension. I said he was divulging private things about me and him and our online life and this site that I would never talk about on my own. I usually go with the flow and talk about whatever they talk about, or comment on whatever we are doing.

I do not look like a noodle stall person at all. Again you err. Many who shake my hand think I'm rich cause my hands are softer than many women's hands even, so they think I must be royalty who has never had to do dirty work with his hands. Ask Rock. He's shaken my hands. He can tell you that my hands are probably the softest and smoothest for a guy he's ever met. They are just naturally that way. I do not use any lotion.

Taxi drivers and the low class people that you illogically compare, Repatriate, do not have soft hands nor do they act refined like I do. Perhaps you refer to yourself, not me.