Master wrote:

Whats the difference between the two? which one is better and which one is cheaper?

I think that the TEFL and CELTA programs are basically the same in content, but the CELTA is given by a British organization and is often preferred overseas and might convey a bit more status. I'm not sure, but I think that both courses are about the same price.

Master wrote:

what do you mean when you say extreme? do you mean dangerous? or poor or something?

I meant geographically very far to the east (almost in Asia) and this usually also implies that they are poorer and less-developed (although perhaps there are some exceptions which I'm not aware of).

I went to Romania once and I was totally creeped out. Nothing bad happened to me, but it felt very wild and I got the feeling that all the thieves were watching me. I breathed a sigh of relief once I crossed the border back into Hungary (Romania is not yet a part of the Schengen area, so you have to have your passport checked by the border guards, even though Romania is part of the EU).

Master wrote:

I thought the ukraine was a nice place.

It's a big country. There might be nice places, but other areas like Odessa are full of crime from what I gather. I've never been to Ukraine, so I can't definitively say anything about it.

Master wrote:

dano wrote:

Master wrote:

thanks. my first response finally.

yea but how is the social life really?

There lots of opportunities for dating in china if you can speak mandarin or cantonese, otherwise your limited to dating english speaking chinese women(middle class). Middle class chinese women in China are the same as middle class chinese women in the US.

The best teaching gig for meeting women is probably teaching at a university, it doesn't pay as well as a private school but theres thousands of young women to choose from. The english teachers usually get together several times a week and get drunk together too.

From what i heard the dating scene in china is awful. Dont men out due the women in terms of ratio?

My main objective right now is not money. I mean I can always find something better to do with my life after going abroad. My main objective is a good experience and some fun.

The gender inbalance only occurs in rural areas, theres no shortage of women in the cities. If you can speak chinese getting a girlfriend will be fairly easy. Chinese women from the poorer provinces will ask you if they can be your girlfriend if they like you.

Also, dating your students in China is not unethical. As an english teacher in China you are not in a position of authority over your students. In fact, if the students don't like you you can get fired. It creates a situation where the teacher kind of sucking up to the students to gain popularity. The most popular teachers are more like entertainers rather than teachers. Getting your students to laugh and have fun will help you more than anything else.

ladislav wrote:

Quote:

what do you mean when you say extreme? do you mean dangerous? or poor or something?

Extreme geographically, I guess.

Quote:

I thought the ukraine was a nice place.

Ukraine without the "the". But it is relaxed laws-wise.

http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Ukraine

yea i got the joke.

it is relaxed because the criminals get away with anything according to what jackal said.

To Jackal:


Well that doesnt sound very good. I dont want to go the place that i have to watch my back every second. I want to go to place that i can relax and feel at home not like i dont belong.

I dont mind places being poor or less-developed in fact I encourage mostly cause i feel more humanized. The thing is that what I dont want is for me to feel my life is at risk just for the purpose of trying to do something good or have fun.

So in that sense i would have to go to Britain to the CELTA? If I do go that route wouldnt be overwhelmingly expensive compared to the alternatives?




What would you think its the best place to teach from what you know and why?

dano wrote:

Master wrote:

dano wrote:

Master wrote:

thanks. my first response finally.

yea but how is the social life really?

There lots of opportunities for dating in china if you can speak mandarin or cantonese, otherwise your limited to dating english speaking chinese women(middle class). Middle class chinese women in China are the same as middle class chinese women in the US.

The best teaching gig for meeting women is probably teaching at a university, it doesn't pay as well as a private school but theres thousands of young women to choose from. The english teachers usually get together several times a week and get drunk together too.

From what i heard the dating scene in china is awful. Dont men out due the women in terms of ratio?

My main objective right now is not money. I mean I can always find something better to do with my life after going abroad. My main objective is a good experience and some fun.

The gender inbalance only occurs in rural areas, theres no shortage of women in the cities. If you can speak chinese getting a girlfriend will be fairly easy. Chinese women from the poorer provinces will ask you if they can be your girlfriend if they like you.

Also, dating your students in China is not unethical. As an english teacher in China you are not in a position of authority over your students. In fact, if the students don't like you you can get fired. It creates a situation where the teacher kind of sucking up to the students to gain popularity. The most popular teachers are more like entertainers rather than teachers. Getting your students to laugh and have fun will help you more than anything else.

Well from the statistics i think the ratio is quite scary. Well Im sure the chinese language is probably one of the hardest to speak. One of my teachers who was quite good explained how hard it was and it was quite scary.

That sounds good. I like when women ask a guy out that they like.

Well thats a problem, as much as i could want to become a clown I dont think it would be fun to be forced into one. Constantly being on the edge of somebody elses whim. Ive never heard of such a thing. Is there a reason why this is?

The most significant problems I encountered in China were. (in order of importance)

1. Language (being surrounded by beautiful women 24/7 and not being able to talk to them)
2. Culture Shock (the first few weeks in china blew my mind!)
3. Problems with my job (teaching)
4. Problems getting prescription medication (some brands are not available)
5. Food (about 5% of chinese food is good by western standards)
6. Finding clothes and shoes that fit
7. Climate is very hot, humid and overcast in the south, you'll sweat constantly

Chinese is one of the most difficult languages in the world to learn. Having a chinese girlfriend that can teach you everyday will help you the most.

dano wrote:

Chinese is one of the most difficult languages in the world to learn.

Dano

Believe it or not, oral Mandarin Chinese is not that difficult for an American. I've approached several foreign languages and dialects from a foreign perspective (American) - Chinese (Mandarin, Taiwanese, Cantonese, Sichuanese/Chengdu), Thai, Spanish, and Portuguese and found Mandarin to be the easiest to pick-up in many ways.

Here is why:

- Mandarin has very little grammar compared to Latin based, Germanic, and other Asian languages. You indicate past/present/future by adding a bit of context (yesterday, now, tomorrow) or a simple suffix instead of modifying the verb. Pronouns are much simpler. And sentence word order is very simple for us us.

- Most of the sounds used in standard Taiwan or Beijing Mandarin have exact or at least rough equivalents in standard American English. This is not as true for the most popular Chinese dialects such as Cantonese or Taiwanese.

- Mandarin uses tones on each syllable (one of the biggest challenges for a westerner) but there are just 4 of them plus an infrequently used neutral one. This compares to 5 to 9 for many other Chinese dialects and some other Asian languages (Thai, Vietnamese, Khmer, etc.) Plus, the Mandarin tones are probably the easiest and most straightforward of all the Asian tonal languages/dialects.

With 2-4 hours of intensive verbal work per day, 5 days per week, in a Chinese living environment, I believe a typical American young person should be able to pick-up a very decent working command of Mandarin in just a few months.

A non-English speaking Chinese girlfriend would speed the process.

Master wrote:

ladislav wrote:

Ukraine without the "the". But it is relaxed laws-wise.

it is relaxed because the criminals get away with anything according to what jackal said.

Master, now you're overgeneralizing. Like I said, I've never been to Ukraine. I just know from news stories that Odessa has a lot of crime, but there are hundreds of other cities in Ukraine. Ladislav grew up there and has traveled back there many times. You should listen to his opinion about Ukraine. Maybe you should ask him about personal safety in different regions of Ukraine. He's the expert on that country.

I just said that a few cities in Romania creeped me out. But yes, generally poorer countries have more crime.

Master wrote:

Well Im sure the chinese language is probably one of the hardest to speak. One of my teachers who was quite good explained how hard it was and it was quite scary.

For an American who has only studied a bit of French or Spanish, yes, Chinese might seem a bit scary at first, but it's not the hardest language in the world, by far. Rock's post above is right on. I took a semester of Mandarin Chinese using the simplified communist characters (Taiwan still uses the more complicated traditional ones) in college. I got an "A" in the course and would have continued learning it, but I didn't have time because I was taking lots of other difficult courses.

I would classify the Mandarin Chinese language like this:
Grammar - easy
Pronunciation - medium
Writing - hard

Chinese grammar is very simple. You don't conjugate verbs. You just change the personal pronouns. It doesn't have any of the ass-rapingly-complex grammar that languages like Hungarian have.

Also, there are no shortage of books and websites in English about learning Chinese. So don't be scared away by the language. If you end up liking the country and you're willing to put in the time to memorize characters, you can do it.

Here's the only Chinese character I remember:
http://chineseculture.about.com/library/character/bl_zi00009.htm

Master wrote:

Well that doesnt sound very good. I dont want to go the place that i have to watch my back every second. I want to go to place that i can relax and feel at home not like i dont belong.

That's understandable, but you have less options for places to go because you don't have a bachelor's degree. The first thing you should do is to make a list of all the countries which will hire foreign English teachers who don't have BAs. Then you can narrow it down from that.

Master wrote:

So in that sense i would have to go to Britain to the CELTA? If I do go that route wouldnt be overwhelmingly expensive compared to the alternatives?

No, you can get a CELTA outside of Britain. But usually, only major cities will have CELTA or TEFL programs. There are both TEFL and CELTA programs in Prague, for example. Just do a search on google and do a bit of research.

Master wrote:

What would you think its the best place to teach from what you know and why?

I don't know. This depends on your qualifications, the ease of getting a visa, the quality of life, the quality of the students, the amount you're paid, etc. It depends what's most important to you, and I've only taught English in Hungary, so I don't have first-hand experience of teaching in other countries.

The rumor I heard is that you make the most money teaching English in South Korea, but they work you to death there and life is very boring there.

You've already expressed some interest in China. That might be very good for you, indeed. DiscoProJoe who used to post here went there to teach English. Maybe you could ask him some questions if he ever decides to come back.

Hmm...all this talk is making me hungry. I'm going out for a lángos.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%A1ngos

I am currently deciding which CELTA Program to take.


Here is a link which gives you the CELTA program by country where you can take it.

http://cambridgeesol-centres.org/centres/teaching/index.do

They seem to have a big center at CELTA Thailand. Does anyone recommend this?

Master wrote:

ladislav wrote:

Quote:

what do you mean when you say extreme? do you mean dangerous? or poor or something?

Extreme geographically, I guess.

Quote:

I thought the ukraine was a nice place.

Ukraine without the "the". But it is relaxed laws-wise.

http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Ukraine

yea i got the joke.

it is relaxed because the criminals get away with anything according to what jackal said.

The daily life in Ukraine is quiet and private. Criminality exists but I think it is even safer than the US. Just don't wonder into working-class neighborhoods at night alone.
Odessa used to be dangerous because Jewish gangsters ran it- ala Dutch Shultz. No more. It is a dreamy, Paris-like city. Nothing much ever goes on.


_________________
Sometimes at night, I cannot sleep
While thinking of my fail'd romances.
Why is my word so hard to keep
In view of changing circumstances?