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Greetings fellahs, this is Sexter. I've been in the pickup industry for a long time. I've pretty much used almost every dating guru's advice and went out and field tested it.(see if it worked). As for me, i come from a normal background. Kinda dorky growing up but not super nerdy. I had friends and had a few girlfriends. When i was in college, I wasn't seeing that much women so I turned into the pickup industry. I've tested a lot of pickup methods out there. I will review every method I used...

Before you read my reviews... Here are the statistics

1. I've approached roughly 5000 girls(sets)
2. The approached i've done was mostly non-asian girls(I wasn't interested in asian girls, i was mostly interested in white women, sometimes persian or latina women)
3. the girls i've approached were mostly either average looking/ HOT/or Thin. I rarely approached fatties or uglies
4. I'm Filipino American, 5'7 average looking.(25 yrs old now)

method #1 Mystery Method


When I got in the game, I used Mystery Method for a long time. Basically you approach a girl using an indirect line(who lies more men or women?), then you lower a girl's value by "negging her", after you neg her, you qualify her, then build rapport with her. They also have techniques like "false time constraints" and "body rocking". I've applied all of the material mystery preached and 95% of the time I got rejected.

WHY? because I came off incongruent and robotic. The women were already bitchy/rude to begin with. After using mystery's method, they became more BITCHIER. The only times the women were ever interested in the techniques mystery taught are the women who already saw me as a guy with "value". The women who were already attracted to me are usually the ones it worked on. Even when the women were already attracted to me, those "negs" and "DHV stories" made me come off incongruent, thus I still got rejected anyway.

THe major problem about mystery method is the level of practice you have to give out. You literally have to practice hundreds of times for the method to work, otherwise it will come off incongruent. After talking to a thousand women using this technique. I absolutely didn't get any results. The problem with this method is that it forces you to somebody your not. It makes you over think, and it will make you WEIRD.

I'm sure when Mystery used his method, it worked for him b/c he came from an entertainer background(magician). He's also 6 foot 5 and very good looking caucasian guy. 5 foot 7 average looking asian guy who came from a dorky background didn't work out for me.

pickup method #2 Real Social Dynamics

Basically this method teaches "natural game". It teaches a lot of inner game jargon such as

1. Not caring what people think of you
2. having confidence they call "state"
3. Social conditioning is bullshit
4. Looks and money doesn't matter, as long as your a lovable fun guy, she will still sleep with you
5. self entertain yourself

I've studied "The Blueprint decoded" by Owen Cook, and he really had some great concepts. Basically what RSD is, is they teach you a lot of inner game stuff(stuff you think in your head) to fix your non-verbal communication with women. THat way, you come off congruent and confident, hence you will get women.

I've tried this technique many times and had minimal success. There were nights where I would be "in-state" and every girl loved me. However, there were nights where I was "out of state" and every girl hated me. Regardless of all the nights i've went out, I barely got any results. Even if you are really confident around a women, if the woman was never interested in the first place, she will most likely not sleep with you. Sure, she will laugh at your jokes and even give you her number, but she probably will flake out on you(b/c she was never really attracted to you).

RSD has a lot of pretty useful concepts, but it only worked with certain men. I know a couple of tall good looking white guys who utilized "real social dynamics" and got a lot of good results. However, when I use it, it hardly ever worked. Women who gave out their numbers to me were Flakey. I know a really good looking indian guy who relied on "natural game", he would only talk to a woman for 2 minutes, and he will rarely have any flaky numbers. However, when I talk to a woman using natural game, whenever I get her number, 9x out of 10 the number is flaky(regardless of how good my phone game is).

When a woman is really attracted to you, she won't flake out or ignore your phone calls. Every guy who's ever successful with RSD are usually guys who are good looking or guys who have a lot of status. Don't believe me?

If you look at all the "naturals" w/ hot white girlfirends living in Southern California, most of them are good looking white guys. Or average looking white guys with a really good personality or high status. I rarely see an average looking asian guy date a good looking white girl in socal. Whenever i see one, they probably met through their social circle, not through cold approach.

Method #3 David DeAngelo, Cocky Funny

This was actually the 2nd method i used. Basically, what they teach you is to be "cocky funny" to women. That way, you will come off as a "challenge" to the woman.

Again, it doesn't work for everyone. Not many men are witty, and being cocky funny requires a lot of wit. Sure, you might be witty with some cocky funny lines, but if you f**k up, she will just look at you like your a weirdo or an ass hole. THe best times cocky funny worked was when I was using it in a very subtle way where I used it as a "witty" remark. Not as a tool to get the girl.

Cocky funny only made the girl laugh, it never made the girl "f**k me" or "interested in me".

Whenever cocky funny didn't work, DeAngelo will blame it on your "inner wuss". TOTAL HORSESHIT b/c I was never really a wuss to begin with.

Method #4 Love Systems(by savoy)

Very similar to mystery method but way more broad. They preach a lot of social circle game and gives you a lot of techniques.

I've tried social circle game and it's somewhat rewarding. The problem with social circle game is that you are limited to the women you meet in that social circle. The women you meet in the social circle tend to go for the "alpha male" of the social circle. The guy who has "value" and respect of the peer group. That's b/c you are in a social circle, doesn't automatically mean you will get laid. THe person who gets laid in the social circle are usually the guys who are the "most alpha, best looking, or the guy everyone respects".

Social circle game isn't really social circle game, it's more like "status game".

The person who has the most status in the social circle has the easiest time getting laid. That explains why the "DJ" or the "bouncer/head club promoter" etc get the most p***y is b/c they have status.


SUMMARY


I've tried other pickup methods out there and i keep on running into the same patterns....

1. you approach a girl(most of the time, they are rude and bitchy especially the hotter ones,)
2. you make girl laugh(cocky funny from david d/Negs from mystery/Confidence from RSD)
3. you build rapport
4. you get her number

9/10 the number is flaky. She won't return or pickup your call. That or she befriends you and not take you seriously as a man.

of all the times i've ever had success with a girl, it's the times where she already thought "i was cute" "I was her type". Or when I was in her "social circle" and saw me as a guy who's high value.

I've approached over 5000 girls and I have yet to have a girlfriend. Sure, i've made out with quite a few chicks using the "pickup" techniques and got a few lays, but nothing really consistent such as a long term girlfriend. Making out is overrated too, it doesn't get your dick wet. Making out with a girl at a club is totally different from f***ing her.

Pickup in America is f***ing BRUTAL. If a girl isn't really interested in you, no matter how good your game was. THE PHONE NUMBER SHE GAVE YOU WILL MOST LIKELY BE FLAKY. The best way to get laid in America (especially to the women who were never interested in you in the first place) is to f**k her that same night you met her(when she's tipsy or when she's laughing at ures jokes). Chances of her going on a date w/ you(especially to men she was never interested in) is slim to none.

BTW, I went on many dates w/ cute white girls in the past(all cold aproach). Of all the times I went on a date with a cute white girl, most of the dates... she never took me seriously. Just treated me as a friend. Of all the times I got lucky w/ a cute white girl, usually she's the most open minded white girl who's used to dating men in different races.

Dating in America is f***ing brutal(especially if you are non-white or non-black). Women have high standards and only go for men with the most status in their clique, most status in general, or a guy who's good looking w/ average game.
An average looking asian guy w/ good game just doesn't cut it anymore....

THe pickup industry in America is mostly a scam; however, that doesn't mean they don't teach good concepts. Many pickup methods teach good concepts, but to only guys who are compatible with it. Or to girls who see you as someone they are already interested in. There are some good concepts in PICKUP, but that doesn't mean you will get laid b/c of it. It really sums down to the guy with the most status or the guy with the best looks(tall good looking white guy).

So true. Those methods only work if the girl ALREADY likes you.

Instead of all that work, why don't you just go overseas?

One thing I must disagree on Winston is the Social Circle "clique" your talking about.

It is 10x easier to date women in your social circle than to actually cold approach them.

You necessarily don't have to be good looking, but a confident guy with status. if you are in a social circle with plenty of single women in it, assuming you have status and confidence, you really have a good chance with those women. Being in the same tribe as a woman, and having status in that totem pole will definitely help you out in that tribe.

However, when it comes to pure cold approach game. No matter how many techniques you have, or how much confidence you have. It really sums down to whether or not the woman was already attracted to you to begin with. This is fact. Most dating gurus will probably blame it on your lack of "comfort game" or lack of "qualifying" or lack of "attraction game". It really sums down to chemistry. If the woman doesn't see you as her type, then she probably won't date you. Sure, she might laugh at your jokes and think your a cool guy, but that doesn't mean she will date you.

Sexter wrote:One thing I must disagree on Winston is the Social Circle "clique" your talking about.

It is 10x easier to date women in your social circle than to actually cold approach them.

You necessarily don't have to be good looking, but a confident guy with status. if you are in a social circle with plenty of single women in it, assuming you have status and confidence, you really have a good chance with those women. Being in the same tribe as a woman, and having status in that totem pole will definitely help you out in that tribe.

However, when it comes to pure cold approach game. No matter how many techniques you have, or how much confidence you have. It really sums down to whether or not the woman was already attracted to you to begin with. This is fact. Most dating gurus will probably blame it on your lack of "comfort game" or lack of "qualifying" or lack of "attraction game". It really sums down to chemistry. If the woman doesn't see you as her type, then she probably won't date you. Sure, she might laugh at your jokes and think your a cool guy, but that doesn't mean she will date you.

I don't see where our disagreement is.

Yeah but it's really hard to break into cliques that have lots of single women in them. That's the problem.

Plus, like you said, if you are non-white or non-black, most American women reject you anyway, for race alone.

Just cause you're in a clique, doesn't mean the girls in those cliques will be attracted to you. If they're not, you're screwed.

That was my point. So where is the disagreement here?

How do the rules with cold approaches apply differently within cliques? The rule is the same. If she's not attracted to you, then you're not dating material to her. And you get no action.

You also have to vibe with them too, not just look good. To do that, you gotta fit into the culture and know how to act fake to fit in with their flow. You know what I mean? You gotta "catch their wave" so to speak. Young women are not open and natural. They got a frequency and tempo of their own, and if you're not on that frequency, the conversation will be awkward. Know what I mean?

It's not open and natural where you can just be yourself. You gotta adjust to a certain tempo.

And if you're on a frequency that's far too different from them, like me, then you can't adjust even if you wanted to.

The whole thing is so damn unnatural and awkward.

It's also jinxed for some guys, cause even if I meet a soulmate in America who likes me and has a lot in common with me, something will STILL go wrong and f**k it up, or she will suddenly do a 180 for no reason and drop her feelings!

So even when I find someone compatible, I still lose! What could be more f***ed up than that?!

sexter you pretty much summed up my same research. it is a scam and everything you've described come outs green on my end. The only true successful pick up without a doubt is money. Like Borat asked the dealer in the movie. how many girls can i pick with this monstrocity of a car(hummer) ooh thousands said the sells man and im sure he wasnt lying either. the more expensive the girl the more girls he could pick and i do it. Its really scary. The honest most down to earth girl would probably sell all her morals if the right cashy guy came around.

that is the most successful pick up. Say something like, want to come to my private boat? party? limo? all quick ways to get any girls attention. everything else its just a joke. women are not that smart and dont give a shit what you have to say and theyve probably been told the same exact shit by many million guys. you know its a selling business where tons of guys buy it so its bound to be used by different guys and thus, become repetitive. dont believe all that, get a nice paying gig and all your dating problems will disappear.

Sexter wrote:One thing I must disagree on Winston is the Social Circle "clique" your talking about.

It is 10x easier to date women in your social circle than to actually cold approach them.

You necessarily don't have to be good looking, but a confident guy with status. if you are in a social circle with plenty of single women in it, assuming you have status and confidence, you really have a good chance with those women. Being in the same tribe as a woman, and having status in that totem pole will definitely help you out in that tribe.

However, when it comes to pure cold approach game. No matter how many techniques you have, or how much confidence you have. It really sums down to whether or not the woman was already attracted to you to begin with. This is fact. Most dating gurus will probably blame it on your lack of "comfort game" or lack of "qualifying" or lack of "attraction game". It really sums down to chemistry. If the woman doesn't see you as her type, then she probably won't date you. Sure, she might laugh at your jokes and think your a cool guy, but that doesn't mean she will date you.

Wow Sexter, 5,000 approaches. Now I'm sure you got a lot of valuable experience and interesting stories to share. Please stay on this forum and write a lot more.

I've defended PU techniques in several earlier posts. But I don't doubt anything you say above. Your results from real experience approaching 1,000s of girls speak loud and credibly.

Let me put-out for discussion a few thoughts on PU. Then I hope you will respond telling us what you agree, disagree, or are not sure about based on your valuable experience.

1. PU gets you out on the field and in front of girls. Without it, many guys, myself included, never approached or even went out much. Your experience suggests that a guy has to be at least somewhat the targets type to get anywhere. OK. So now your challenge is to find these gals. If you happen to be the right type for 1 out of 500 random girls, you should, on average, have a fair chance on 1 out of 500 approaches. So if you manage 2,000 approaches in a year, you might find 4 girls who find you interesting and attractive in some way who you can work on. However, if you don't approach anyone, are those 4 girls gonna approach you? Its like selling life insurance. If you knock on enough doors with a very ordinary sales pitch, eventually, someone will probably buy a policy from you. But if you don't knock on any doors, are prospects going to call you? PU helps you realize your full potential by getting you out there selling yourself.

2. PU is not magic. At best it gives you a handicap. If you are 6'' or more shorter than your target, below average looking, obese, socially stupid, are going for girls your daughter's or grand-daughters age, or have other blatant issues which depress your batting average to virtually zero, PU skills will prolly not have much impact on your dating life. You will just approach 1,000s of girls and get shot-down 1,000s of times.

3. PU gives you ways to talk to and engage gals long enough for them to figure out whether or not they might be attracted to you if they are not wowed by you at first sight. This is important. An average guy might generate the following thoughts from girls who see him for the first time: NO WAY: most, MAYBE: a few, LIKELY IF CONDITIONS ARE RIGHT: 1%, YES: 0.1%. Suppose these made up percentages are right. Then most of the time, you will get shot-down. The YES girls may just fall into your lap after you say hi and introduce yourself. But for the MAYBE and even LIKELY girls, you need some material to give them time to warm-up and get used to you.

4. Some PU philosophies will encourage you to develop yourself into a more interesting and attractive person over time. If a guy gives up and lets himself go in every way, he's done. If on the other hand, he gets in shape, dresses and grooms well, makes lots of friends, learns some interesting skills such as dance, martial arts, or cooking, this may improve his chances.

Just a few thoughts that came to my mind. What do you think?

PUA is the biggest con game in history. If it seems to work, it's only because you're playing the numbers. Ask a billion chicks out and somebody's BOUND to say yes sooner or later.

The only value I see in it is to help more introverted people overcome their shyness. You're not going to get anywhere if you don't at least get out from hiding under your bed and go talk to people (you know, like I do every weekend). It's a fear men have to get over. Just accept that you're going to be rejected, over and over and over and over again until you basically don't give a flying f**k anymore. If she rejects you f**k her she's not the one, and if she doesn't yay you get a date at least.

The problem is the law of diminishing returns. The more effort you put into meeting girls the less the ROI is. That's just how it is in America. You're sacrificing time, money, energy... for a whore? f**k that shit.

1. PU gets you out on the field and in front of girls. Without it, many guys, myself included, never approached or even went out much. Your experience suggests that a guy has to be at least somewhat the targets type to get anywhere. OK. So now your challenge is to find these gals. If you happen to be the right type for 1 out of 500 random girls, you should, on average, have a fair chance on 1 out of 500 approaches. So if you manage 2,000 approaches in a year, you might find 4 girls who find you interesting and attractive in some way who you can work on. However, if you don't approach anyone, are those 4 girls gonna approach you? Its like selling life insurance. If you knock on enough doors with a very ordinary sales pitch, eventually, someone will probably buy a policy from you. But if you don't knock on any doors, are prospects going to call you? PU helps you realize your full potential by getting you out there selling yourself.

Of course there's always a chance that if you knock on enough doors, a woman will be attracted to you. i had my fair share of experiences where I woman is totally attracted to me, thus I ran minimal game and just "be myself." However, most of the time(especially the hotter women) she will either be polite and won't take you seriously, or be rude to you and ignore you. The 3 or 4 hours I've spent "sarging" these girls, to only end up getting flaky numbers is every distressing. (and yes, if you know PU, majority of the numbers you will ever get are flaky).


Sure, you might make her laugh and give you her number, that doesn't mean she will return your call and go on a date with you. She probably felt good at the time you met her, but when she finally goes home and rationalizes everything, most likely she has a preference that you don't fit in.

How do i know this is true? I've sarged with this good looking indian guy before, i've winged with him for 4 months. Majority of the girls who ever cold approached were "middle eastern or indian girls." b/c he's so good looking, all he had to do was talk to her in a few minutes and majority of the time, she won't flake out on him.

However, whenever I talk to a persian girl or white girl, and I happen to get her number. Most of the time, she's not interested or the number is flaky.. She might laugh at the "cocky funny" line I said to her but that doesn't mean she wanted to date me.

Pickup is very subjective on the person. If you happen to be a 6 foot 2 good looking white or black guy (who isn't fat), just fix a few non-verbals such as "confidence and eye contact" and approach enough girls.

When Mystery claims his method works, it probably only worked for him. he's a 6 foot 5 good looking white guy with a background in Magic, of course it's gonna work for him. He has a trait in which most good lookign white woman usually go for (height and looks). However, having mystery teach me something that worked for him probably won't work for ME.

2. PU is not magic. At best it gives you a handicap. If you are 6'' or more shorter than your target, below average looking, obese, socially stupid, are going for girls your daughter's or grand-daughters age, or have other blatant issues which depress your batting average to virtually zero, PU skills will prolly not have much impact on your dating life. You will just approach 1,000s of girls and get shot-down 1,000s of times.

There were girls who'm i've approached were taller than me(especially white girls at night clubs wearing high heels). If My game is on that night, she will actually talk to me for a few minutes. However, 9x out of 10 her friend will grab her away to cockblock me. Even if I had a wingman to accupy the obstacles, if you give off a confident and chill vibe, that doesn't necessarily mean they will sleep with you. SHe will probably give you 5 or 10 minutes to talk to her and maybe give you her flaky number, but it doesn' tmean she will sleep with you or see you as "dating material". She will probably view you as a cool guy who she she's as a friend, nothing more.

3. PU gives you ways to talk to and engage gals long enough for them to figure out whether or not they might be attracted to you if they are not wowed by you at first sight. This is important. An average guy might generate the following thoughts from girls who see him for the first time: NO WAY: most, MAYBE: a few, LIKELY IF CONDITIONS ARE RIGHT: 1%, YES: 0.1%. Suppose these made up percentages are right. Then most of the time, you will get shot-down. The YES girls may just fall into your lap after you say hi and introduce yourself. But for the MAYBE and even LIKELY girls, you need some material to give them time to warm-up and get used to you.

Girls in america are sometimes polite and won't shoot you down blunty... They will bring up the "boyfriend" line or will politely say "well, it was nice talking to you, but I have to go." (even though she never had a boyfriend or she never really needed to go).

It really sums down to the chemistry. If she sees chemistry between the two of you, then she will stay and won't bring up the boyfriend(regardless if she has one).

Most of the girls that reject me either just "walked away" or got cockblocked by her "friend" or said "it was nice talking to you" or said "i have a boyfriend". Usually what it really means is "she's not your type"

4. Some PU philosophies will encourage you to develop yourself into a more interesting and attractive person over time. If a guy gives up and lets himself go in every way, he's done. If on the other hand, he gets in shape, dresses and grooms well, makes lots of friends, learns some interesting skills such as dance, martial arts, or cooking, this may improve his chances.

Improving yourself such as confidence and getting in-shape doesn't correlate to getting more women. If you happen to improve yourself, don't do it for the sole purpose of getting more girls, do it for the sole purpose of bettering yourself.

Most guys who learn Pickup are average looking guys with really good jobs w/ a bunch of friends and hobbies. That doesn't mean they were getting laid.(otherwise they wouldn't be in pickup in the first place). I went to a bunch of Lair Meetings in Southern California, and almost every person i've winged with had a decent job and very educated w/ a bunch of hobbies and are pretty normal. All they want is to date a desirable or average looking woman(in which they struggle in).

For example. I have a ton of hobbies(surfing, cooking, traveling) and work in a good job(finance) and a pretty confident sociable guy. And I still struggle to get a cute white girl.

So improving yourself just to get girls doesn't correlate to anything. if you were to ever improve yourself, don't do it as an expense to get more girls, do it b/c you genuinely want to improve yourself.

Master and linc4love

Pickup isn't completely a scam. Some pickup methods really do teach good concepts.

However, those concepts usually doesn't mean a girl will sleep w/ you or "date you". It's still very subjective on what kind of girls you approach and what type of guy you are.

Fact of the matter is, Pickup is a losers sport.

Sure, it might make you approach more women and give you confidence, but it's still a losers sport b/c you will probably get rejected More than you actually succeed(and if you are a below average looking guy, expect to get blown out 80 to 90% of the time). And if you happen to succeed, the number will tend to be flaky.

Pickup is a losers sport ESPECIALLY IN AMERICA...

WHY? because girls are so paranoid in America, thinking most men are "players" and most men are "creepers" or have "high preferences in which you don't fit in"

So what happens when women in america are paranoid who think most men are "players" "creepers"?

1. you will get a ridiculously high Flake rate on phone numbers
2. you will get cockblocked a million times
3. she will be rude to you or ignore you if you approach her
4. she will give you "shit tests" or "congruence" tests to f**k up your game

Pickup is a losers sport. It is up to you to find out which Guru is a scam and which guru teaches good concepts.(and even if they teach good concepts, it doesn't mean you will get rock star success as they claim)

I'm not a PICKUP HATER, BUT I MUST BE REALISTIC. MOST MEN WHO EVER LEARN PICKUP DROP OUT WITHIN THE FIRST 2 OR 3 MONTHS. FACT!

Sexter wrote:Sure, it might make you approach more women and give you confidence, but it's still a losers sport b/c you will probably get rejected More than you actually succeed(and if you Pickup is a losers sport ESPECIALLY IN AMERICA...

WHY? because girls are so paranoid in America, thinking most men are "players" and most men are "creepers" or have "high preferences in which you don't fit in"

It does seem as if women in America are scared shitless of men! I don't know why this is but they certainly DO NOT want men to approach them at bookstores or grocery stores or in shopping malls. Your only supposed to approach women at bars, clubs and parties in the USA. The other way to meet women is through your friends.

It does seem as if women in America are scared shitless of men! I don't know why this is but they certainly DO NOT want men to approach them at bookstores or grocery stores or in shopping malls. Your only supposed to approach women at bars, clubs and parties in the USA. The other way to meet women is through your friends.

If you think about it, when a woman meets a man through friends, the guy is already prescreened by the friend already. Thus, making the man non-creepy and viable.

The bar scene is different. It's socially accepted to meet women at bars/clubs b/c it's a social gathering. Same with an organization you join. Meeting women in the club is also a safe place to meet men b/c there are a lot of bouncers around and ALCOHOL.

Whereas, meeting women at grocery stores or the streets is harder b/c hollywood brainwashed women. Growing up in america, people are taught to not talk to strangers. That is why there is always an assumption that a stranger might be a "creeper" or "serial killer".

When women are closed off to you. It's really nothing personal. America just brainwashed people that talking to strangers is a bad thing.

It's a sad fact about america but it's true. Social conditioning of hollywood and the notion that "talking to strangers is a bad thing" explains a lot of reasons why it's hard picking up women in America

They teach interesting stuff that they themselves didnt really come up with. Thats the only reason its not totally a scam. its a scam because they paint it as if your going to be getting girls out of your ears and it doesnt really work out that way. Its also a scam because they take a good portion of your money for little result. For the type of money some of these guys put into this stuff id want to be getting A class girls by gazzilions and thats not totally the case. They might teach you something but for what your after is not totally true and of course they know this.

you guys forget one thing....If you are a criminal women line up to open their legs for you.

bump

after re-reading this post, i'm still true to my word. 9 months later and I still didn't change my mind

thanks winston for this informative site. I've recently went to st. petersburg for a month(tourist visa) wow! cold approach there was so easy and women were polite. IT wasn't hard getting dates

totally different atmosphere from american woman. THAT "10" american women who is probably impossible to get, is very possible to get in russia.

I find that the russian women have less egos and less feminized. They actually like men

JamesBond and Sexter nailed it!