Re: Does God Exist? Is there any proof or evidence?
Posted: December 13th, 2020, 4:24 am
More on Anthony Flew's conversion to Theism.
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I don't hear anything about a proof of an afterlife.
He left behind his fellow unbelievers and thinks they will still listen to him?... Flew was known as a strong advocate of atheism, arguing that one should presuppose atheism until empirical evidence of a God surfaces. He also criticised the idea of life after death, the free will defence to the problem of evil, and the meaningfulness of the concept of God.
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However, in 2004 he changed his position, and stated that he now believed in the existence of an Intelligent Creator of the universe, shocking colleagues and fellow atheists. In order to further clarify his personal concept of God, Flew openly made an allegiance to Deism, more specifically a belief in the Aristotelian God, and dismissed on many occasions a hypothetical conversion to Christianity, Islam or any other religion. He stated that in keeping his lifelong commitment to go where the evidence leads, he now believed in the existence of a God
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He supported the idea of an Aristotelian God with "the characteristics of power and also intelligence", stating that the evidence for it was stronger than ever before. He rejected the idea of an afterlife, of God as the source of good (he explicitly states that God has created "a lot of" evil), and of the resurrection of Jesus as a historical fact, although he has allowed a short chapter arguing in favor of Joshua's/Jesus' resurrection to be added into his latest book.
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Flew was particularly hostile to Islam, and said it is "best described in a Marxian way as the uniting and justifying ideology of Arab imperialism.
I have been denounced by my fellow unbelievers for stupidity, betrayal, senility and everything you can think of and none of them have read a word that I have ever written....
What if you were provided with proof that people's houses were cleaner when they used the product, in the same way that it can be shown that people's lives were demonstrably better over time when they worshipped a moral god?MarcosZeitola wrote: ↑December 14th, 2020, 12:25 amYou would be justified, and quite factual, in saying that until the salesman shows up and demonstrates an actual product that works as claimed, you are withholding belief.
Well there we can get into a philosophical argument about the nature of truth. You are taking the Platonic position that there is an objective truth that is out there and your beliefs are true to the extent that they correspond with it. Is that really all that useful? Maybe we could take the position that something is true to the extent that we act as if it is true, things work out in a favour, and if you think about it we do this all the time.MarcosZeitola wrote: ↑December 14th, 2020, 1:04 amThen it would prove that the belief itself is a good and useful thing, but evidence of the product or deity itself existing would still be missing. Which is pretty much how I see it... by all means go to Church and uphold your religious morality but there is no need to delude yourself into actually believing any of it is real-real. It's like watching a movie which inspires you. Is it real? No. Is it useful? Yes.Cornfed wrote: ↑December 14th, 2020, 12:38 amWhat if you were provided with proof that people's houses were cleaner when they used the product, in the same way that it can be shown that people's lives were demonstrably better over time when they worshipped a moral god?MarcosZeitola wrote: ↑December 14th, 2020, 12:25 amYou would be justified, and quite factual, in saying that until the salesman shows up and demonstrates an actual product that works as claimed, you are withholding belief.
God doesn't exist but the Bible does. And it's the Bible from which all the good stuff originates.
Would u tell a child that never met his father that his father didnt exist and he was created by random chemicals mixing by accident? Just because u dont see God doesnt mean others dont and doesn't mean that everything was created at random and that life came from non-life. See these videos about why atheist Anthony Flew was forced to change his mind by following the evidence where it leads.MarcosZeitola wrote: ↑December 14th, 2020, 1:04 amThen it would prove that the belief itself is a good and useful thing, but evidence of the product or deity itself existing would still be missing. Which is pretty much how I see it... by all means go to Church and uphold your religious morality but there is no need to delude yourself into actually believing any of it is real-real. It's like watching a movie which inspires you. Is it real? No. Is it useful? Yes.Cornfed wrote: ↑December 14th, 2020, 12:38 amWhat if you were provided with proof that people's houses were cleaner when they used the product, in the same way that it can be shown that people's lives were demonstrably better over time when they worshipped a moral god?MarcosZeitola wrote: ↑December 14th, 2020, 12:25 amYou would be justified, and quite factual, in saying that until the salesman shows up and demonstrates an actual product that works as claimed, you are withholding belief.
God doesn't exist but the Bible does. And it's the Bible from which all the good stuff originates.