Happier Abroad Forum Community

I was thinking about this for a while now and I ve come to the conclusion that all women do care who they with in terms of looks ,economy,social status in no particular order
We spend so much time bad mouthing AW an WW and glorifying women from the other countries. I could agree that women in western countries are more choosy
and only expect the best simply because they do not need need a man to survive and they are not as sexual creatures as us males, that gives them enormous advantage since they can afford
to sit back and wait for Mr right and in meantime screw guy or guys they desire while still maintaining single status

So what about women form 3rd world countries
I think they are somewhat similar to their western counterparts. Its commonly understood that when western man go to the diff country and he finds a gf it is almost certain that women
Will be poorer then he is. Is that a coincidence? No it is not, it just proves that women are same everywhere you go and Anglo man happen to be rich by their standards.
It is economy above all things and I wonder what would happen if you go to live in Thai or Phil and have only $200 a month to survive? I’m sure you would still be able to bang chicks in short term coz you would still be perceived as a rich guy but not sure if you want to marry woman and you tell her that you only got 200 bucks a month and work as a cashier in their supermarket.
Yes in Asia as a white you d still be able to bang some skinks here and there and some good women who want to experience white penis
How bat Russia and Ukraine, it’s even more brutal I’d say, being white doesn’t make you stand out coz they are all white and prrbly whiter than you, lol so the only thing that sets you apart is $$$

In another words without thick wallet you not going to get far in Russia and EE..long term no way.

Many times you hear foreign women complaining abt men in their own country, there is no good man etc etc, BUT I have strong suspicion abt these claims and to what extent they are true if they are true at all. Sure there are modest and nice EE women but I’m focusing now on the women that advertise themselves on dating sites and ones that specifically hunt for foreign man.
I find it hard to accept that these women are that desperate that they can’t find some man in their own town. Is it possible that these women are picky who they screw, date and want to be with?
Does average Russian man who does some shitty job looks attractive in their eyes or is he just another wanker who relies on porn to get his fix?

I’m convinced that with FW economy plays a huge chunk in da whole thing , How many of these women would be happy to go dutch and share all expanses equally and still be in love with you? You have much better chances finding a WW who would be happy with that proposition

no woman anywhere in the world ever found a millionaire ugly. nuff said.

Most of the time, what your saying is true, money and status is the main motivating factor for women wanting to meet men.

However, in Asia at least, when a woman is over 25 yrs old her dating days are basically over. Lots of single women over 25 yrs old that don't have a hope in hell of finding a boyfriend, some of them are wealthy, good looking, educated, speak english, are horny and have low expectations of men. Theres not lots of Asian women that are what I just described but I've met some online and they were very eager to tie the knot with me, one has been waiting for over 2 years for me to come meet her, marry her and screw her, not necessarily in that order.

You can meet your dream girl right now, their waiting for you 24 hrs a day!

http://www.dateinasia.com/

Banano wrote:I was thinking about this for a while now and I ve come to the conclusion that all women do care who they with in terms of looks ,economy,social status in no particular order
We spend so much time bad mouthing AW an WW and glorifying women from the other countries. I could agree that women in western countries are more choosy
and only expect the best simply because they do not need need a man to survive and they are not as sexual creatures as us males, that gives them enormous advantage since they can afford
to sit back and wait for Mr right and in meantime screw guy or guys they desire while still maintaining single status

So what about women form 3rd world countries
I think they are somewhat similar to their western counterparts. Its commonly understood that when western man go to the diff country and he finds a gf it is almost certain that women
Will be poorer then he is. Is that a coincidence? No it is not, it just proves that women are same everywhere you go and Anglo man happen to be rich by their standards.
It is economy above all things and I wonder what would happen if you go to live in Thai or Phil and have only $200 a month to survive? I’m sure you would still be able to bang chicks in short term coz you would still be perceived as a rich guy but not sure if you want to marry woman and you tell her that you only got 200 bucks a month and work as a cashier in their supermarket.
Yes in Asia as a white you d still be able to bang some skinks here and there and some good women who want to experience white penis
How bat Russia and Ukraine, it’s even more brutal I’d say, being white doesn’t make you stand out coz they are all white and prrbly whiter than you, lol so the only thing that sets you apart is $$$

In another words without thick wallet you not going to get far in Russia and EE..long term no way.

Many times you hear foreign women complaining abt men in their own country, there is no good man etc etc, BUT I have strong suspicion abt these claims and to what extent they are true if they are true at all. Sure there are modest and nice EE women but I’m focusing now on the women that advertise themselves on dating sites and ones that specifically hunt for foreign man.
I find it hard to accept that these women are that desperate that they can’t find some man in their own town. Is it possible that these women are picky who they screw, date and want to be with?
Does average Russian man who does some shitty job looks attractive in their eyes or is he just another wanker who relies on porn to get his fix?

I’m convinced that with FW economy plays a huge chunk in da whole thing , How many of these women would be happy to go dutch and share all expanses equally and still be in love with you? You have much better chances finding a WW who would be happy with that proposition

Good topic, and it really gets to the heart of the matter of what women are all about.

Like you said, it really doesn't matter where a girl is from because the core of all women are the same being that the majority of women are looking to date and marry a man who has more money and status then themselves. And guess what? If they can't find that man, who is, "on their level," they rather remain single like Oprah W.

And also as you have already stated, I too have seen that these same women WILL spread their legs open for a morally bankrupt male. Bad boy, player, unemployed bums who smoke weed all day, tough guys or whatever you want to call them, women have an addiction for these guys that is similar to chocolate where as you know you shouldn't eat it, but you do anyway because it's just too good to resist. These same women then place all the blame on these guys when the shit finally hits the fan and walk away from all accountability. As a matter of fact, in a high end area of California I knew of a Asian woman who was banging a black dude on the side (he was a former drug dealer) up until her wedding day. In other words she was engaged to be married (I never saw the groom) and still banging this black dude on the side.


Anyhow, I was lurking at another form and here is the proof that women are the same all around:



"Second, while girls are in it for the money, I genuinely believe they enjoy interacting with tourists. I don't mean to make a racist comment, but many young Filipino men are seen by the ladies as being uneducated, chauvinistic, lazy, drunk and having no future. So when she interacts with you, she sees someone of a much higher quality -- someone sophisticated, treats her with respect and having money and future. You would notice that, on Fields, if a Filipino man tries to talk to a girl, she usually ignores him. But if a tourist talks to a girl, she usually responds.

Some of these girls are harboring hopes you'd married them and rescuing them from their squalor. However, I find they usually target older lonely white men for that."

XXX.philippines-addicts.com



Lastly, once you know that women hardly ever date or marry down, for the life of me, I don't understand why guys still sign up to date and marry poor women. WHY?!! f**k that bitch! Screw her and LEAVE!

I just don't get women? Men let women in the work force (which subsequently took away jobs from men) and these ungrateful bitches return the favor by keeping all the money they earned to themselves, and deciding that any male who does not make as much as them is simply not good enough as a consort?!

Are you serious? Is this what men deserve after centuries of providing shelter for them and protecting women from wild beast and foreign invaders?

NorthAmericanguy wrote: I too have seen that these same women WILL spread their legs open for a morally bankrupt male. Bad boy, player, unemployed bums who smoke weed all day, tough guys or whatever you want to call them, women have an addiction for these guys that is similar to chocolate where as you know you shouldn't eat it, but you do anyway because it's just too good to resist. These same women then place all the blame on these guys when the shit finally hits the fan and walk away from all accountability.

See Whitney Houston to Bobby Brown, case in point.

You have to treat women like grown children
its easier obviously for them to have someone pay for them
i would love to have somone pay for me - why not
thats right - im a man and its my job to pay for the p***y according
to social programming of a f***ed up socity
once you realise the game - like north american guy above
you see its that its men who are used and abused
all males should boycott the military and stop being providers, protectors
my new motto- no respect received - no respect given
- end of story - no apologies
you want equal - now you got it

Did you really say Women aren't sexual creatures that men are? I beg to differ. There too many negatives to a woman being open about her sexuality in most circles. Look at stuff around you, men (often White Men) call women "sluts" just for looking a certain way and not knowing anything about them. This forces them to be covert with their sexuality unless they are paid for it.

Part of the reason women want men is because they get tired of rubbing one out and using dildos. Those things do not replace human contact and for several reasons both men and women thrive on that.

The problem mainly in America is the culture we live in, not so much the people in it. We are no different than the majority of Europeans for example, however our culture uses different social issues to divide people into groups and there is little sense of community and no sense of solidarity among Americans. In the modern sense there are moments in history where we were united but this was squandered by the leading elite because they profit more over inequality and class divides.

This creates strange outcomes. How come Interracial Marriage is more acceptable in Britain, that in the US? Someday soon I'll find the answer to that question but again this relates to the class divide and continued social inequality in America I am sure of it.

In countries like Russia it is basically true the choice of good men are limited and this is for several reasons. In the prime age group there are roughly 4 Million more women available than Men in Russia. Add to the fact that most men opt for hard labor employment because it doesn't require a degree. These men get involved in typical male activities at that age (drinking, drugs, banging random women). Men know they have a numbers advantage and use it against women. This is largely the same outcome in South America.

Part of being a man is not being ashamed of who/what you are and don't let them shame you. It is working for me, it will work for you, try it sometime.

onezero4u wrote:no woman anywhere in the world ever found a millionaire ugly. nuff said.

How true!

I agree with djfourmoney completely.

In addition, going to Russia or Eastern Europe. You see, there is a huge problem with decent men available over there. Most guys aren't players or bad boys, but just simply are skin-heads, soccer fans - which are mostly the same group with skin-heads, there are LOTS of heroin addicts that die on the streets every day. When I was growing up, I lived in high rise apartment building as everyone does in the city over there. I literally stepped over bodies of dudes laying on the dirty floor with a heroine needle stuck in their arms, legs and sometime near the penis (as time goes by most veins degrade, so they use veins near penis that are still working). Just watching that shit will drive most Americans insane! Yet in Russia or Ukraine people see that crap everyday.

Another one is true thugs and criminals. Yes, Russia/Ukraine are not far behind the U.S. in incarceration rates! Mafia, gangs, drug dealers are very common once you start living there. No, they are not wanksters like in the U.S. - wanna be ghetto retards. Those Russian/FSU thugs are for real. They kill people, they racketeer markets and restaurants - basically they walk into a business and ask for monthly payments - otherwise they threaten business owner to burn his business to the ground and/or kill him and his family. Once a business owner starts paying one of those gangs every month, that gang is called simply "a Roof" or "krisha", like a roof of a building they cover over that business. When another gang is trying to take over this business, they deal with each other, often this results in killings and real street wars between gangs to gain control of city businesses. Often local police is a part of it and local politicians as well, sometimes police is that "roof" asking for monthly payments Needless to say, having a family with these guys is a suicide, but there are girls attracted to these true "bad boys" as everywhere else. Yet very few girls like those guys, I would say like 5% in the most case scenario.

Now there are also alcoholics! Many of them. Lots of them. Guys over there mostly don't give a crap about anything in their life - just like in the U.S. there are guys that enjoy a slice of pizza, bottle of beer and soccer on their TV, they don't want to work or do anything with their life! Unlike U.S. where these guys are glorified as "players" that were able to "use a woman" to their advantage, in Russia/FSU lazy men like that are considered BIG losers. Yet there are millions of men like that, just because these men aren't alcoholics or aren't drug addicts - many girls are happy to work, cook and raise kids just because THERE ARE NO BETTER MEN TO FIND! Another reason girls settle with these lazy dudes is because family in Russia/FSU is considered happy only when father and mother are living together. Single mothers are looked down in the society. Also because there are SO many beautiful young women available, single mothers in Russia/FSU are pretty much DONE for the rest of their life, they have almost ZERO chance of finding any decent guy in their life just because they already have a child.

Since there is a strong sense of "manhood" and "brotherhood" in Russia or Ukraine, many guys prefer to have a beer with their male friend and "talk their soul out" in the local bar or cafe after work. In Russia/FSU there is a "soul" that is important, Americans would never understand what I mean unless they have lived in Russia/FSU. So many men just don't care about women, they just want to hang out with some guys and get a drink/get drunk.

Then there are men that left for work in Western countries. This is the case in Moldova, Latvia and Lithuania, not sure about Estonia - probably the same thing. Ukraine had lost many men as well, since there are thousands of illegal immigrants in the U.S. that came from Ukraine and overstayed their visa. I met MANY. These guys just work 3-4 jobs, I know a guy who works 12 hour nights 6 nights per week for 12 years already. He has no life, but he can't do anything about it since he STILL does not know English and cannot find any other job.

Everything I had listed here already limits the number of men by 50% easily in Russia/FSU!

Then we have married men, men that are geeky engineer type that never go out, men that are die hard Counter Strike and Starcraft players, there are asocial men that simply stay home.

And NOW we have MONEY. Yes, I absolutely agree about the money part. I was recently communicating with a girl from Kazakhstan. I was thinking - wow, she is probably very humble and down-to-Earth. Well, no. She asked me if "I expect my wife to ever work in her life"? Since some friend of hers married a rich Australian dude who is 36 and she is 20 and he is buying her everything, brand new convertible, everything she tells him he does like a magician! It could be a bunch of BS and this girl could be a naive idiot, but that just shows how many gold-diggers are out there!

Another thought on money: Yes and no. There are MANY Russian/FSU women that WANT just a simple decent guy because the culture DOES NOT glorify "thug posers" and "wanksters" as they do in the U.S. Yes, there are some movies about gangsters on Russian/FSU TV channels. Yes, there is a popular culture of "thug life", but nevertheless it is NOT as wide-spread as in the U.S. For example, in Russia/FSU "bad boy" is often considered rude and immoral. There is also a difference between a "true thug" and a "bad boy behavior", since "bad boys" are the thugs in most cases over there.

In conclusion: there are many women over there that want a guy with money. I consider it very normal, since they want to create a family and see a guy as a provider. It is a very traditional view and that's what we want, right? A traditional woman! So the biggest challenge is to differentiate a gold-digger from a decent girl who is trying to find a decent provider for a family. If a girl is trying to find a guy that will allow her to "never work in her lifetime" that should be ringing a bell for you right away! You found a gold-digger most likely. However, most women had never been in the U.S., so they may think every American man is a sporty blue-eyed millionaire as they show in Hollywood movies, so why would she even have to work if he is so rich and wants her to care about children and his house? Therefore, it's your job to explain WTF is happening in America in real life and that life here is VERY expensive.

Whew! I hope I cleared the topic a little bit. This stuff is really hard to explain. Maybe Ladislav and Think Different can add some more here.


P.S.: I have a hilarious video where local SWAT team was on a rush to capture a black Porsche Cayenne. Guys in that black Porsche killed a police guard that was carrying lots of cash from one of the banks in Moscow. Well, the police f***ed up Just watch.

How easy is for foreign man to find upper class Russian woman that is interested in him?

Point is that women tend to marry up and thse women that have money would rather date local guy and are not easy catch.
Means once woman got the money her need for man decreases....regardless of geografic location


That explains why Japanese and Korean women are not as easy and friendly as Thai or Philipinas, once they have money they look for someone with more money and would rather be alone then date down while men ALWAYS date/marry down

It isnt fair, market value of dick should be the same as the value of p***y

have2fly wrote:I agree with djfourmoney completely.

In addition, going to Russia or Eastern Europe. You see, there is a huge problem with decent men available over there. Most guys aren't players or bad boys, but just simply are skin-heads, soccer fans - which are mostly the same group with skin-heads, there are LOTS of heroin addicts that die on the streets every day. When I was growing up, I lived in high rise apartment building as everyone does in the city over there. I literally stepped over bodies of dudes laying on the dirty floor with a heroine needle stuck in their arms, legs and sometime near the penis (as time goes by most veins degrade, so they use veins near penis that are still working). Just watching that shit will drive most Americans insane! Yet in Russia or Ukraine people see that crap everyday.

Another one is true thugs and criminals. Yes, Russia/Ukraine are not far behind the U.S. in incarceration rates! Mafia, gangs, drug dealers are very common once you start living there. No, they are not wanksters like in the U.S. - wanna be ghetto retards. Those Russian/FSU thugs are for real. They kill people, they racketeer markets and restaurants - basically they walk into a business and ask for monthly payments - otherwise they threaten business owner to burn his business to the ground and/or kill him and his family. Once a business owner starts paying one of those gangs every month, that gang is called simply "a Roof" or "krisha", like a roof of a building they cover over that business. When another gang is trying to take over this business, they deal with each other, often this results in killings and real street wars between gangs to gain control of city businesses. Often local police is a part of it and local politicians as well, sometimes police is that "roof" asking for monthly payments Needless to say, having a family with these guys is a suicide, but there are girls attracted to these true "bad boys" as everywhere else. Yet very few girls like those guys, I would say like 5% in the most case scenario.

Now there are also alcoholics! Many of them. Lots of them. Guys over there mostly don't give a crap about anything in their life - just like in the U.S. there are guys that enjoy a slice of pizza, bottle of beer and soccer on their TV, they don't want to work or do anything with their life! Unlike U.S. where these guys are glorified as "players" that were able to "use a woman" to their advantage, in Russia/FSU lazy men like that are considered BIG losers. Yet there are millions of men like that, just because these men aren't alcoholics or aren't drug addicts - many girls are happy to work, cook and raise kids just because THERE ARE NO BETTER MEN TO FIND! Another reason girls settle with these lazy dudes is because family in Russia/FSU is considered happy only when father and mother are living together. Single mothers are looked down in the society. Also because there are SO many beautiful young women available, single mothers in Russia/FSU are pretty much DONE for the rest of their life, they have almost ZERO chance of finding any decent guy in their life just because they already have a child.

Since there is a strong sense of "manhood" and "brotherhood" in Russia or Ukraine, many guys prefer to have a beer with their male friend and "talk their soul out" in the local bar or cafe after work. In Russia/FSU there is a "soul" that is important, Americans would never understand what I mean unless they have lived in Russia/FSU. So many men just don't care about women, they just want to hang out with some guys and get a drink/get drunk.

Then there are men that left for work in Western countries. This is the case in Moldova, Latvia and Lithuania, not sure about Estonia - probably the same thing. Ukraine had lost many men as well, since there are thousands of illegal immigrants in the U.S. that came from Ukraine and overstayed their visa. I met MANY. These guys just work 3-4 jobs, I know a guy who works 12 hour nights 6 nights per week for 12 years already. He has no life, but he can't do anything about it since he STILL does not know English and cannot find any other job.

Everything I had listed here already limits the number of men by 50% easily in Russia/FSU!

Then we have married men, men that are geeky engineer type that never go out, men that are die hard Counter Strike and Starcraft players, there are asocial men that simply stay home.

And NOW we have MONEY. Yes, I absolutely agree about the money part. I was recently communicating with a girl from Kazakhstan. I was thinking - wow, she is probably very humble and down-to-Earth. Well, no. She asked me if "I expect my wife to ever work in her life"? Since some friend of hers married a rich Australian dude who is 36 and she is 20 and he is buying her everything, brand new convertible, everything she tells him he does like a magician! It could be a bunch of BS and this girl could be a naive idiot, but that just shows how many gold-diggers are out there!

Another thought on money: Yes and no. There are MANY Russian/FSU women that WANT just a simple decent guy because the culture DOES NOT glorify "thug posers" and "wanksters" as they do in the U.S. Yes, there are some movies about gangsters on Russian/FSU TV channels. Yes, there is a popular culture of "thug life", but nevertheless it is NOT as wide-spread as in the U.S. For example, in Russia/FSU "bad boy" is often considered rude and immoral. There is also a difference between a "true thug" and a "bad boy behavior", since "bad boys" are the thugs in most cases over there.

In conclusion: there are many women over there that want a guy with money. I consider it very normal, since they want to create a family and see a guy as a provider. It is a very traditional view and that's what we want, right? A traditional woman! So the biggest challenge is to differentiate a gold-digger from a decent girl who is trying to find a decent provider for a family. If a girl is trying to find a guy that will allow her to "never work in her lifetime" that should be ringing a bell for you right away! You found a gold-digger most likely. However, most women had never been in the U.S., so they may think every American man is a sporty blue-eyed millionaire as they show in Hollywood movies, so why would she even have to work if he is so rich and wants her to care about children and his house? Therefore, it's your job to explain WTF is happening in America in real life and that life here is VERY expensive.

Whew! I hope I cleared the topic a little bit. This stuff is really hard to explain. Maybe Ladislav and Think Different can add some more here.


P.S.: I have a hilarious video where local SWAT team was on a rush to capture a black Porsche Cayenne. Guys in that black Porsche killed a police guard that was carrying lots of cash from one of the banks in Moscow. Well, the police f***ed up Just watch.

Tell the truth Comrade!

I know Western Men find this sh*t hard to believe but its TRUE, its everywhere, read Pravda for CK!

Russia has a serious mafia, they are involved in trafficking Slavic women all over Europe, Oil Rich Middle East countries, Canada and even America. That's just the tip of the ice berg, they have car thief rings in Los Angeles and a whole bunch of other shit I know about. There aren't as many Russians here as in say Chicago, but plenty to find Russian girls going to your local high school and out at local hot spots. There are a couple of Russian preferred nights at some clubs around Southern California where they play some of that trashy trance you hear on the GTA 4 soundtrack.

Anyway, any man bitching he can't find a woman is wallowing in his all self-pity. If your a fat-bastard, LOOSE WEIGHT! Some women MAY accept that, but most won't, even Russian Women. You don't have to be an Adonis as they are not looking for physical protectors (or perfect men, pretty boys) of the family but financial protectors because while you may have never seen poverty up close, many Russian Women have....

The same goes for Ukrainian women, they despise Russians and don't like to be compared to them. But only those born before the the fall of the USSR would even know what life was like when you were forced to learn Russian language and Russian history.

Yes there are scam artist but honestly they are only after easy prey and this is important, listen -

This is why AFA and other agencies are not nearly as picky about who they take on their tours. They will "try" and help you understand the culture and the women in it, but not really. They just hand you Bud's book, which does help but only after you have a paid membership and have reserved a tour seat. Mark gives you his book, he's "New School" the information is to be shared equally among us all and its good I recommend it. Mark is very selective about the people on his tours. He wants them to be successful. AFA wants that too, but after getting to Ukraine (they don't go to Russia anymore), you're pretty much on your own. Sure they will help you find women but again no course on how you should talk to women, learn how to listen to what they are saying or understanding their culture and how it REALLY works.

Above all, you better be a MAN when you go after Slavic women. You run the house, you pay for dates, dinners and movies. Don't expect them to pay to help pay until you are in a committed relationship. They will be insulted and think your a CHEAP SOB if you ask them to help with dinner expenses. You should do that to Western Woman only, after all in many cases they have reached equality, that is NOT the case in Russia as many highly respected occupations here and not treated the same way there (or paid like it).

Russian/Slavic women in general understand their position in life, even if they want to be rich and successful. In the end they still want a husband that loves them, is supportive and faithful. They also want a beautiful family with healthy and beautiful children. Frankly while most of them want a Caucasian man by default, many are open to all types of men as long as they are happy. There are some Slavic women looking specifically for Black Men, I know a few of them and they make no bones about it.

Russia is a great place to go wife shopping especially since many of the major agencies don't even bother to go there anymore yet still run Russian women's profiles.

The Russian Economy has improved but they still have a very wide equality gap and corruption is apart of everyday life. Many don't like it and if given a choice they would leave but how many countries can Russians freely travel too? Not many, this is because of US Hegemony of course via NATO, but some manage to get out and live in various Western countries with varying results.

Yeah Fly the problem is largely the same in all ex-USSR/CIS countries. Men shortage for various reasons, not because there aren't enough men, but so many men engage in selfish and dangerous acts (Ghost Riddin The Whip for example) and generally love hanging out with other men (drinking beer, watching football and generally being MEN). The problem is many Slavic women are ready to get married and have children in their early 20's, sometimes as young as 18. Many Slavic men are not, there is no hurry for them as they know when the time comes to get serious they can find a girl.

But you have to understand Marriage Agencies are nothing new in Russia or Ukraine, the agencies that AFA is involved with have been around longer than AFA... They just worked with local women or men looking for mates. It was new to them that there would be interest in the US and Europe for these same women and sometimes men.

I used to talk to a girl that worked for her mother's agency. They didn't work for the big agencies in America or Europe however just locals. She has a bi-racial child as she had a fling with a Black US Servicemen in Vietnam I believe. Not the greatest looking blond haired Russian I have ever seen, but if I wanted her, she would come.

As I said you can feel sorry for yourself and complain or you can change your life, its up to you. There is nothing better than the love of a good woman and that is a problem in the US, so many women have forgotten how to love somebody or even be in a productive relationship. That's because most Western women regard men as an accessory, not a needed asset like many Slavic women see you.

What you say is basically true. However, looks are another big factor, but not in the long run. But the fact that even in a poor country like the Philippines, there is no loneliness epidemic among men, even poor men, says a lot.

This is why AFA and other agencies are not nearly as picky about who they take on their tours. They will "try" and help you understand the culture and the women in it, but not really. They just hand you Bud's book, which does help but only after you have a paid membership and have reserved a tour seat. Mark gives you his book, he's "New School" the information is to be shared equally among us all and its good I recommend it. Mark is very selective about the people on his tours. He wants them to be successful. AFA wants that too, but after getting to Ukraine (they don't go to Russia anymore), you're pretty much on your own. Sure they will help you find women but again no course on how you should talk to women, learn how to listen to what they are saying or understanding their culture and how it REALLY works.

But AFA doesn't have to be selective for who they take to their tours, because obviously, any guy who can afford 3 or 4 thousand dollars for a romance tour is not going to be poor right? Only successful people (financially that is) can afford such things. So doesn't the cost weed out the less financially stable?

Banano wrote:How easy is for foreign man to find upper class Russian woman that is interested in him?

Point is that women tend to marry up and thse women that have money would rather date local guy and are not easy catch.
Means once woman got the money her need for man decreases....regardless of geografic location


That explains why Japanese and Korean women are not as easy and friendly as Thai or Philipinas, once they have money they look for someone with more money and would rather be alone then date down while men ALWAYS date/marry down

It isnt fair, market value of dick should be the same as the value of p***y

How many times does it have to be said? If you're marrying a Russian Woman or Ukrainian Woman chances are she is marrying up. Doctors, Lawyers and Engineers are high paying jobs in the US/Europe, not so much in Russia and Ukraine. They earn what would be termed "Middle Class' wages. Enough to afford their own flat and possibly a car.

Plus those educations are not acceptable in Western Countries, they'll have to go for retraining or addition education. I know a few women that were doctors in Russia but when they immigrated to the US it took too long to become a US certified doctor so they opted for Registered Nurse which pays roughly the same as being a doctor in Russia at least woman doctor.

Most women between 18-22 or so are in school, so they have no money. Marrying ANYBODY is usually an improvement. Also living in Western Europe or US despite its crumbling infrastructure is a massive improvement. Yes the subway goes everywhere in both countries (Ukraine and Russia) but its needs updating, I know I rode on it, the cars are from the 1970's at least.

Why you worried about hooking up with middle class women? Most women are unable to get the jobs they were educated for. Unlike US women who go to school to get liberal art degrees, some Russian/Ukrainian women get some sort of Tech based degree but end up working in a retail shop because they were unable to get a job related to their education where they live.

There is no need to chase around high maintenance Russian women, while they look great, with a little help with clothes and some makeup a less fussy Russian women will look just as good, especially if she has the standard Slavic/Model features of high cheek bones and slim figure.

Are you looking for a woman to help with the expense of immigration? This is possible, not impossible not unlikely. Middle Class Russian women are just as interested in Western men as poorer women are, what makes you think they aren't? They just have the means to travel a bit more, likely own a car but still have the same problems with men. Only these are usually White collar men, who have an even larger choice of available women, don't need to rush into marriage, relationships, anything.

Again they understand they have an advantage and they use it. Just as American and some Western European use their advantage over you. Which is they have bypassed you up to this point and you're hanging out with us on this web site -

The problem I see over and over with American Men chasing Russian/Ukrainian women is, you're chasing them, there is no mutual attraction and no interest. Stop chasing them! You treat them like American women, NO, treat them like Russian women. American women too often want to be one of the guys and watch football with you. Russian women want to the sexy vixen that jumps into your lap during a game with nothing on but a long jersey of your favorite team. Russian women understand and knows dirty, unkempt children and home are a direct reflection on her. Knowing that your happy is just as important. This is a concept hard to understand post-feminism and everything but this is very much the case.

Do not talk to men who have failed in this venture, unless they admit their failure like Tony Bochene - http://europeandreamconnections.com/ton ... ating-one/ who admitted to Mark that his 2nd marriage to a Russian lady that had clear mental problems related to her childhood and was a heavy drinker (aren't all Russians??? j/k). These are things he did not pick up on because he didn't spend enough time with this lady before they got married. He had spend time time with her while juggling other women while on his own dime in St. Pete.

I find that most "Train Wrecks" are just as much the man's fault as the woman's and its easy to blame a so-called less sophisticated Slavic woman. Many of these men make the same mistakes with Western Women which is why they are single. Some are completely overlooked in America or Western Europe and the hint of attention shown to them by a Russian Shark looking for prey is enough to make them loose complete control of all rational thought. This includes constant emailing of women and showing up to Ukraine with a ring and your bride no where to be found. (Seen on the ABC Nightline program).

Anyway, you can make excuses Banano, it won't help and frankly if you're not man enough to find a Russian woman that won't play you like a cheap guitar from Esteban, maybe you should focus on women that are easier to get like Asians.

As I said in another post, there is a reason(s) why Asian women are not near the top of the food chain.

How easy is for foreign man to find upper class Russian woman that is interested in him?

You will be surprised, but MANY! I personally added a girl in Facebook that lives in my city here in the U.S. Adding people on Facebook isn't "creepy" or "stalky" for foreigners, as you may know. So anyway, I chatted with her, then asked for a phone number. Then we went out for a "coffee", which in reality turned into a dinner since I was hungry. She told me her story: she moved with her family from St. Petersburg just a few months ago, her family is not "very rich" by upper Russian standards, but nevertheless they bought a 3-bedroom apartment in a VERY upscale gated neighborhood with a water view. She bought a brand new Mercedes C300 2009. Her plan is to go to University in the U.S. and possibly stay here to live and have a family, since Russian government changes laws all the time and economy is very unstable, corruption is another thing.

Next day I took her out to the night club. Yes, she drives a better car than I do, but she preferred ME to drive because driving somewhere to go out is a MANLY thing to do. Get it? Woman sees herself as a follower, man is leader, that's how it should be. Even this rich Russian girl is like that. So I go to the club, I was trying to buy her drinks, but she refused and bought them herself. In about an hour I was making out with her After I drove her home, she insisted I park the car and she jumped on me, we made out for another 20-30 minutes at least.

I could have easily f***ed her, but she is a bit heavy for me, although she is decent looking, but I am just not attracted to her, even though she is extremely neat, clean and smells like fresh flowers.

Rich men in Russia can have any girl they want! All you have to do is drive a BMW X5 to any bus stop and offer some girl "a ride", then ask for a phone number. Remember the video I posted about "pickup in Ukraine" in Rants section? Giving rides in Russia/FSU is very common, since most people walk and many people can't afford a car.

If you are trying to find a rich Russian/FSU girl, it CAN be done. I just did that here in America without even going anywhere. I was a sweet, smart, educated and experienced guy with her, I acted serious and barely cracked any jokes. Well, she LOVED that behavior. I know how to do it, I've done it too many times.

Keep in mind that if you are working at local Burger King, you are 50 years old and have a huge belly, are you really thinking some rich girl from ANY country want to marry you? When you are middle class, have a half-way decent job and education and you can also offer smartness and CLASS to a woman, you ARE very able to find a rich educated girl in Russia/FSU. But moving up there for a year or two is ABSOLUTELY required, since meeting someone upper class will require you to find people from that "circle", you will have to find places where those people hang out and also date the woman you have chosen to find out who she really is and what she really wants from her life with you.

I actually ask FSU women that simple question: "What do you want/expect from your life?" Americans are scared of such "personal" questions, but Russian/FSU girls (mature ones of course) see that you care about her inner side by wondering about her life plans etc.