Amanda Knox - Is she guilty or innocent of murder in Italy?

Discuss news and current events around the world.

Do you think Amanda Knox is innocent or guilty?

She is guilty as sin!
5
56%
She is innocent and wrongly accused.
1
11%
She didn't commit the murder but was probably involved at some level and isn't telling everything she knows.
2
22%
Undecided/Unsure
1
11%
 
Total votes: 9
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Re: Amanda Knox - Is she guilty or innocent of murder in Italy?

Post by Winston »

Update:

I added one more option to the poll:

"She didn't commit the murder but must have been involved at some level and isn't telling everything she knows."

Unfortunately that reset the poll results back to zero. I didn't know it would do that. So please cast your vote again. You may change your vote later if you change your mind based on the evidence or data.

For those of you unfamiliar with the case, here is a documentary from "Crimes of the Century" series that gives a good overview of all the details of the case.

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Re: Amanda Knox - Is she guilty or innocent of murder in Italy?

Post by Winston »

To Alex, who thinks Knox is probably innocent and falsely accused:

Btw Alex. U should read the imdb reviews for the Amanda Knox Netflix documentary. Most of them are very incriminating and do not agree with u that Knox is innocent. The reviewers sound like they know the case very well and have studied it for years. See below.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt5952332/re ... _=m_tt_urv
"So what's the verdict on Amanda Knox the documentary? Well it's a terrible, false and ultimately immoral exercise in innocence fraud and here are some facts that Knox's PR infomercial left out:

1 The Supreme Court's acquitting report states that Amanda Knox was present during Meredith's murder and may even have possibly washed the victim's blood from her hands afterwards but it STILL can't be proved that she did it. (which begs more questions, namely why didn't innocent Amanda call the cops for her friend and why wasn't she done for accessory at least?) The same Supreme Court do not make the same allowance for the black guy though, had he had have washed the victim's blood from his shoes for example. The court also states that there's "strong suspicion" that Sollecito was there.

2 The Supreme Court's acquitting report states that the burglary was staged.

3 The Supreme Court's acquitting report states that Meredith was murdered by three attackers and that Guede had two accomplices. (And you really don't have to be Stephen Hawking to figure out who these two accomplices were, when you view the evidence in its totality)

4 The Supreme Court's acquitting nonetheless finalizes Knox's calumny/ criminal slander conviction, which she got for falsely accusing her innocent employer of rape and murder, leaving him in prison for two weeks and never retracting her statement, despite false reports that she did, meaning that Knox's status is still that of a convicted criminal felon.

5 In finalizing Amanda Knox's calumny/criminal slander conviction, The Supreme Court's acquitting report states that Knox blamed her boss to protect Rudy Guede as she was afraid that Guede could "retaliate by incriminating" her, which of course begs some more very interesting and pertinent questions, such as how could Guede incriminate innocent Amanda to begin with?

6 The Supreme Court's acquitting report does NOT exonerate Knox, it acquits her due to "insufficient evidence",like Casey Anthony, OJ Simpson and that nice man Robert Durst.

RIP Meredith Kercher, who along with her stoic dignified family (who have been subjected to absolutely abhorrent abuse and attacks by Knox's supporters online) and Knox's employer Patrick Lumumba are the only victims here. May the truth shine in your case one day and the facts and truth come to light. Neither Amanda Knox or Raffaele Sollecito are fooling anyone familiar with Ms Kercher's case & facts are available at the murder of Meredith Kercher .com and in the Nencini and Massei reports."
So u see these are not random opinions. They are well informed.

Btw if the burglary was staged because the glass was on top of the ransacked clothes in filomenas room, then how do u explain that bro? If Guede broke into the house through the window then the glass should be below the ransacked clothes on the floor right? Not above it. You never explained that. Its a crucial piece of the puzzle.
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Re: Amanda Knox - Is she guilty or innocent of murder in Italy?

Post by Winston »

Assuming Amanda Knox is guilty and trying to cover up her involvement in the murder, some unanswered questions that have never been addressed are: (feel free to post your answers to them below if you can)

1. Why would Knox come home at 10am after the murder? If i were her I'd stay away from the crime scene and let the other two roommates discover Meredith's body first so i could distance myself from it and feign ignorance.

2. Why would Knox call her other roommate Filomena and report a burglary? That forces her to return home and ends her time to clean up the evidence. If she wanted to delay the discovery of the body that would be the opposite of what she'd do. She would not tell Filomena anything so she could have more time to clean up the evidence.

3. Why would she tell the postal police that arrived to go into the cottage and look around? If she wanted to delay the discovery of the body she would just pretend nothing was wrong and just take the two lost phones and say "Well I guess Meredith isnt home yet. I'll take her lost phones and give them to her when I see her. Thanks. Have a nice day." And wait for them to leave. Then I'd go back in and continue the clean up.

4. If the murder happened at 10pm like the investigators estimate, that would give plenty of time for Knox and Sollecito to clean up the crime scene before morning. So then why did they leave the blood spots in the bathroom sink and the bloody footprint on the bathmat? Why didnt they use bleach to clean it off and get rid of the bathmat? If I were covering up a murder id get rid of the bathmat if the bloody footprint couldnt be cleaned off because is Sollecito's footprint is on it then it incriminates us. So I'd definitely get rid of it by taking it out to the public trash bin outside. And id bleach off the blood stains in the bathroom sink too. I'd make sure the cottage was squeaky clean before morning. Knox and Sollecito are intelligent so why wouldn't they have done that? Even if Knox isnt good at logic, Sollecito as a computer science major should have been good at logic. So he would have cleaned up all traces of them before morning during all those hours after 10pm that night.Or maybe I am overestimating their intelligence?

5. Finally, since Rudy Guede is already out of jail now and served his sentence, why doesn't he spill the beans on Knox and reveal all that really happened? Since he's free now, he has nothing to lose right? Why is he still covering for her? Why doesn't he just come out with the whole truth? Surely he must know what happened since his DNA was all over Kercher's body and the crime scene. What's to stop him? No one has addressed this either.

Why has no one brought up these points or tried to explain them?
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Re: Amanda Knox - Is she guilty or innocent of murder in Italy?

Post by Winston »

This body language analysis of Amanda Knox is very incriminating, especially the part where Diane Sawyer asks Knox if she was there that night, and she says "No" with a big head NOD afterward. The narrator said this indicates that Knox's words and brain were in conflict. That's very spot on. I'm sure CE and jamesbond would agree. Also before that when asked if she killed Kercher, she says "No" with a smile in the corner of her mouth. Very odd.



From the comments below:

"also what you might have missed is that when she was asked did she kill her friend, she gave a slight smile on the corner of her lips before saying no, bit of a give away dont you think"

"The thing that alarms me most is at no stage of this event does knox show any form of trauma! She talks about throats being slit and says it with no sign of sadness or any frowning! She actually laughs when saying these things! All the rest is just twisted lies and no sense will ever come from them!! She keeps saying she was freaked out but does not show any physical signs at all!! Kissing her boyfriend then looking with a stare is not trauma! Very sad for victims family!!"

Another video analysis of her body language which is also very incriminating and telling.



In part 2, you can see Rudy Guede's interview, and in contrast, his body language is more congruent and less deceptive.



The list of evidence against Knox is very long and exhaustive. See here:

http://themurderofmeredithkercher.com/Evidence_List
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Post by Winston »

eurobrat wrote:
October 3rd, 2011, 4:42 pm
I read that earlier today

I think she did it as I do think Casey Anthony is also guilty. Young women get away with so much in this world it's unreal.

If she didn't kill her roommate than who did and why was her DNA all over the british girls body?
Knox's DNA was not all over the victim's body. Rudy Guede's DNA was all over her body and the crime scene room. However, Knox's DNA was on the blade of the knife found in her boyfriend's flat, and some of it was mixed with the victim's blood in a few drops in the bathroom, which is ambiguous and hard to explain.

See this full evidence list for more details.

http://themurderofmeredithkercher.com/Evidence_List
http://themurderofmeredithkercher.com/The_Evidence
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Re: Amanda Knox - Is she innocent or guilty?

Post by Winston »

Contrarian Expatriate wrote:
June 12th, 2017, 7:16 am
Winston wrote: But she claims that the police interrogated her and abused her and hit her for 50 hours. So she broke down and was forced to tell them what they wanted to hear.
Nope. It does not add up. If she were hit for 50 hours, where are the photos of the bruises and injuries? Also, how does she figure the police want her to falsely accuse another man? She did that of her own accord and the police wasted time and energy arresting the poor man who was later exonerated and released. It does not add up.
I read a good book recently on Kindle that dissects the case with a fine tooth comb by a genius in true crime named Nick Van Der Leek. His book is called "Deceit: The Murder of Meredith Kercher". He lists a lot of background details about the case that most people don't know, including insight into Knox's character and behavior, and Sollecito's too, all of which are quite disturbing and incriminating. Overall, he listed 28 incongruent behaviors by Knox after the murder, which points to her guilt. Individually each odd incongruent behavior can be explained away, but taken altogether, all 28 indicate a strong picture of guilt. This is what Knox supporters don't understand, that yes her odd behavior quirks can be explained away one by one, but taken together collectively and added up, they paint a strong pattern of guilt.

There's also a section in the book on false confessions. It says that usually false confessions under torture only work on low IQ and low educated people, not middle class girls like Knox. Also, there's never been a documented case where a false confession led to the accusation of someone innocent. Usually, they only lead to a false confession incriminating oneself. So the false confession argument doesn't hold water, even if she was indeed interrogated for many hours or tortured.
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Re: Amanda Knox - Is she guilty or innocent of murder in Italy?

Post by Winston »

Something I wrote to Alex, who believes Knox is innocent:

Btw bro. I been reading a book recently on kindle called "Deceit: The Murder of Meredit Kercher" by Nick Van Der Leek. It is quite amazing. I could not put it down for hours. The author is a genius in crime solving. He goes through the case with a fine tooth comb and dissects it meticulously.

https://www.amazon.com/DECEIT-Meredith- ... 00Y9CS69C/

Ill bet u 100 dollars that if u were to read it you would change your mind about the knox case. Because he brings up many details about the case that most people dont know. Details about the background of the case and the context and amanda knoxs past history that u didn't know about. It gives amanda knox a real motive for the murder that makes sense when u understand the environment and context of the few weeks before the murder and what led her to choose Perugia, Italy, etc. It makes a lot of sense. Youd be impressed if u read it bro guaranteed. And you would probably change your mind too and agree that its very plausible for knox to be guilty.

The author does not say Knox is guilty or innocent but he shows all the deceit and red flags that everyone misses and that add up cumulatively to a lot. For example did u know that Knox had an arrest in Seattle for throwing rocks at police cars during a riot. Another time she staged a burglary as a prank too.

Also on the train in September she slept with a cocaine dealer she met on the train in italy. Probably in exchange for free cocaine. So she was a cocaine addict too. And its well known that cocaine can make u feel violent and invincible even if u are normally not a violent person. Once u are addicted u lose your morals.

Patrick Lumumba said knox had no soul. she was dead inside. Thats how cocaine addicts are.

Sollecito also had a history with drugs and cocaine. Not just marijuana.

Most likely knox went to perugia for the drug party life with no rules. Thats what attracted her to that place. Perugia is the drug capital of italy.

So all this definitely raises the plausibility that Amanda Knox is guilty. For sure. You agree?

So u see knox is not as innocent as her parents claim. Also cocaine addicts need money because cocaine is expensive. So knox could have stolen merediths 250 pounds and that could have started a fight which escalated to murder. Guede also needed money because the rent was due November 1 and he had no money and no drug sales. So both guede and knox had desperate need for money. Its a fact that merediths 250 pounds cash was stolen. So someone took it. This could have led to a fight which escalated and got more and more violent.

The police did not test Knox or Sollecito for drugs. They forgot to. Because Knox was not a suspect until 5 days later. But there's circumstantial evidence for cocaine use. The books goes into many details and testimonies.

Also if u research false confessions, you will see that false confessions only come from those with low IQ and are uneducated. And even when false confessions happen they usually implicate themselves. No one implicates an innocent person. Thats never been documented to happen.

Remember the reason Knox implicated Lumumba was because Sollecito admitted that Knox was not with him. He said she was out from 9pm to 1am. So she lost her alibi. In addiction sollecito lost his alibi too. It was a major mistake. Both lost their alibi at the same time. Why would Sollecito change his story and claim Knox was not with him?

Btw the book said recently Sollecito said he formally retracts Knox's alibi and now claims that she was not with him that night. He now says knox was out between 9pm and 1am. So currently Knox has no more alibi from Sollecito.

There are also many clues. For example it was freezing cold and knox did not wear a jacket like everyone else. Only a cocaine addict would feel warm. Plus she was giddy and not tired. The book gives many examples. Furthermore, a load of laundry with merediths clothes was in the washer. Her italian roommates attested that they were merediths clothes. That means someone tried to wash the blood from her clothes. Right? A burglar would not have had time to wash her clothes.

Another important thing.

If a girl bleeds to death from her neck from a knife wound, there should be a large pool of blood on the floor. Like when u take two large coke bottles and pour them onto the floor. The spill would cover the floor. Much more than in the photos of merediths room which showed only some blood, not a big pool. Everyone misses that fact. It means that someone spent a lot of time to clean up all the blood from the floor which should have been large and spread out. Who would have the time or towels and rags to clean up a large spill of blood and get rid of the towels and rags? It indicates a clean up of the evidence right? Where is all the missing blood? Thats another crucial piece that we all missed.

One more interesting thing about the knox case. Amanda's lamp from her room was in Meredith's room where she was lying dead. So Meredith's room had two lamps, hers and Amanda's. Thats a bit strange and indicates that two lamps were used to light the floor during the clean up of the blood or cover up effort after the murder. Thats what it implies. It's suggestive.

Anyway, the author, Nick Van Der Leek, also has a long series on YouTube where he dissects the Amanda Knox case, which goes on for over 12 hours. Its interesting and extremely meticulous. Hes a genius in crime solving. Just like u are with hardware. Lol. He analyzes every little detail with a fine tooth comb. You should listen to it sometime. It has many hours of analysis. Let me send u the link.

Heres the playlist from true crime rocket science. It has 9 videos and 12 hours of analysis of the Knox case. The detail will impress you for sure. And perhaps change your mind too.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... LQjTrNxndu

Here's the first part.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUGeP10aBb0

After u hear his deep analyses of hundreds of details and points and questions i guarantee you will change your mind at least 20 or 30 percent. The true crime rocket science guy is a genius. Not many people are genius when it comes to crime solving. He is one of them. You will be impressed.
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Re: Amanda Knox - Is she guilty or innocent of murder in Italy?

Post by gsjackson »

These high profile criminal cases are often good examples of the general rule of thumb: Whatever the corporate media are in agreement on is presumptively the opposite of the truth. O.J. Simpson didn't kill anybody, Amanda Knox almost certainly did. The media have that completely backwards.
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Re: Amanda Knox - Is she guilty or innocent of murder in Italy?

Post by Winston »

gsjackson wrote:
November 5th, 2020, 2:32 pm
These high profile criminal cases are often good examples of the general rule of thumb: Whatever the corporate media are in agreement on is presumptively the opposite of the truth. O.J. Simpson didn't kill anybody, Amanda Knox almost certainly did. The media have that completely backwards.
Why do you think OJ was innocent? His DNA was all over the crime scene right?

Why would the media wanna defend Knox? What's in it for them?

What do you guys think of this Amazon Books interview with Amanda Knox? Does she look innocent and sincere?

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Re: Amanda Knox - Is she guilty or innocent of murder in Italy?

Post by Winston »

5 Incriminating things about Amanda Knox from the comments section on YouTube that can't truly be explained away.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mINz3tqu0G8

1) The confession.

Knox confessed that she was in the house on the night of the murder and that she heard Miss Kercher scream, identifying a Congolese bar owner, Patrick Lumumba, as the assailant. She told the court during the trial that the confession was made under duress but then repeated the entire account in a five page memorandum the next morning.

2) The false accusation.

The prosecution said the fact that Knox falsely accused Lumumba of being the killer was a sign of her own guilt and an attempt to throw them off her trail. He was arrested in a dawn raid by armed police and spent two weeks in jail. It was only by chance that a Swiss businessman read about the case and came forward to say he had been talking to Lumumba in his bar on the night of the murder — offering him a rock-solid alibi. Lumumba says Knox nearly ruined his life and is suing her for defamation.

3) The alibi.

Sollecito could not back up Knox’s alibi on the night of the murder.
She claimed she spent the evening with him, smoking marijuana, watching the French film Amelie and making love. But Sollecito told police he could not remember if Knox was with him that evening or not.

Even assuming his memory was hazy because of the drugs, it seemed odd that a young man who had just embarked on a new relationship could not recall whether he had spent the night with his girlfriend or not.

4) Computer and telephone records.

Sollecito claimed he used his computer to download and watch cartoons and Amelie. But computer experts told the court that there was no activity on his laptop between 9.10pm on Nov 1, and 5.32am the next morning — the time frame in which the murder took place.
Knox and Sollecito turned off their mobile phones on the night of the murder, from around 8.40pm, and turned them back on at around 6am, inviting further suspicion.

5) The staged break-in.

A bedroom belonging to one of Miss Kercher’s Italian flatmates was ransacked on the night of the murder, with a window smashed with a rock. But police said the break-in was staged – broken glass from the window was found on top of clothes scattered on the floor, suggesting the window was broken after the contents of the room were messed up. Prosecutors accused Knox and her boyfriend of staging the break-in to make the killing look like a burglary that had turned into rape and murder.
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Re: Amanda Knox - Is she guilty or innocent of murder in Italy?

Post by Winston »

Alex,
These two podcasts with Roberta Glass and Isabelle McFadden are entertaining. They rant about why they think Amanda Knox is guilty and has the bad behavior of a sociopath. They make some interesting points.





Btw here is what Italian supreme court said. See below:

"Harry Rag
@Tom Graham Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito were acquitted under paragraph 2 of article 530, which is an insufficient evidence acquittal. Had they been acquitted under paragraph one of article 530, then that would have been a definitive acquittal or exoneration.

The Italian Supreme Court ascertained there were multiple attackers and it's a proven fact Amanda Knox was at the cottage when Meredith was killed. It also stated Sollecito was probably there when Meredith was killed. It's not difficult to work out who Rudy Guede's accomplices were."

So u see it was insufficient evidence acquittal not exoneration. Here is the Supreme Court report that you can read yourself.

English version
http://themurderofmeredithkercher.com/E ... ion_Report

Italian version
http://themurderofmeredithkercher.com/S ... otivations

Pinned comment under the true crime podcast about what the Italian Supreme Court said:

"Harry Rag
Amanda Knox repeatedly makes the false claim she was exonerated by the Italian Supreme Court when in reality she was acquitted due to insufficient evidence. Unfortunately, her claim is accepted as fact by journalists who have never bothered to read a single page of any of the official court reports and court transcripts.

She also brushes inconvenient facts under the carpet. The Italian Supreme Court ascertained (1) there were multiple attackers (2) it's a proven fact Amanda Knox was at the cottage when Meredith was killed (3) she washed Meredith's blood off in the bathroom (4) she lied repeatedly to the police and (5) the break-in at the cottage was staged and it wasn't staged by Rudy Guede.

The Supreme Court also places Raffaele Sollecito at the cottage at the time of the murder. It's not hard to work out who Guede's accomplices were."

Keep in mind that a key point and what Knox defenders don't get is that yes, individually each piece of the jigsaw puzzle can be explained away in Knox's favor with alternate explanations. However, when taken CUMULATIVELY and added up, when you see the big picture, it all point to a STRONG indication of her guilt. The prosecution made this key point, so do many true crime podcasts (such as this one), and so did the prosecutor in the Lifetime made for TV movie about the Amanda Knox case.

Something else to consider:

"@Francisco There have been a number of high-profile cases where seemingly normal girls have committed horrific and senseless murders with little or no motive e.g. Laurie Ann Swank, Leslie Van Houten and Patricia Krenwinkel, Amy Bishop, Karla Homolka, Juliet Hulme and Pauline Parker, Kelly Ellard, Anna Maria Botticelli and Mariena Sica, Erika de Nardo, Jasmine Richardson, Rachel Shoaf and Shelia Eddy.

It's worth highlighting the points that Vieri Fabiani, the Kerchers' lawyer, made about motive:

"When we speak of a crime – we often say we need a motive. But whoever opened the door to Rudy Guede, what does it change? There were a series of contrasts between Meredith Kercher and Amanda Knox. The motive, or the lack thereof, is absolutely irrelevant. Because the voluntary homicide is proven. There was a progression of violence. Alcohol. Drugs. Fatigue. Stress. There could be 1000 problems that evolve into a punishment of the victim, because that is what we see in the escalation of violence that killed Meredith Kercher."

Professor David Wilson pointed out that "murder may often primarily be an ill-thought-through response to a highly-charged emotional situation"."
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Re: Amanda Knox - Is she guilty or innocent of murder in Italy?

Post by Winston »

Wow check this out. I thought the Amanda Knox interrogation at the police station was not recorded, everyone says, but there is one recording of her interrogation with Mignini online. See below. If this exists why did everyone say it didn't? It's in Italian with subtitles. This interrogation didn't seem brutal as she claimed. What do you think @Contrarian Expatriate?



More interrogation audio files here: http://themurderofmeredithkercher.com/F ... ion_audios

Audio of Knox questioned during police interrogation about why she accused Lumumba. WTF is she saying Contrarian Expatriate? She sounds like she's babbling and being evasive.



Audio of interrogators asking Knox how she knew details about the murder that only the murderer would know.

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Re: Amanda Knox - Is she guilty or innocent of murder in Italy?

Post by Contrarian Expatriate »

Winston wrote:
November 13th, 2020, 9:27 pm
What do you think @Contrarian Expatriate?
My opinion of the case remains the same. I already detailed why I believe she committed that crime. The nail in the coffin is that she did not merely suggest another person was the killer, but she stated it as a matter of fact and embellished the story with lies about how she heard screams (about which she did nothing). Then she doubles down on the lie by stating that she thought it was true without any rationale for it.

Innocent people merely insist on their innocence and they sometimes try to mention anything exculpatory like alibis. Speaking of alibis, if Lumumba did not have a solid one, he might still be in prison today.

One thing about young, attractive females who are suspects of crimes, people (men especially) are seldom able to remain objective in evaluating the case against them. The attractiveness, the damselization, and the natural empathy clouds the judgement of lay people. That is why I always recommended a seasoned female investigator as the lead in these cases.

In a case where there are no witnesses or inculpatory physical evidence, the police and prosecution have a huge burden of proof to overcome. Although I believe AK's behavior after the crime point to her as the culprit, the local police bungled any hope of pinning physical evidence on her because they allowed physical contamination of the crime scene. This is what saved her in the end, the lack of uncontaminated physical evidence against her.

But there are many cases like this. Jodi Arias was one a similar psychopath who could not get by the mountain of physical evidence against her. Casey Anthony unfortunately did overcome the mountain against her by playing dumb and naive.
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Winston
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Re: Amanda Knox - Is she guilty or innocent of murder in Italy?

Post by Winston »

Right CE. Plus if you listen to those interrogation tapes above, she is very dodgy and evasive in answering critical questions. An innocent person doesn't talk like that.

Btw CE, this will make your blood boil. Apparently, Knox is trying to scam people for money. She's asking donations for a wedding party on her blog, when in reality she got married last year already. I don't get something though. If she got 4 million dollars for her book, why does she need to scam money from people? Because it all went to pay her parents back for legal fees? Also, if she just bought a nice house for $718,000, why does she act like she needs money? Also the European Human RIghts Court ordered Italy to pay Knox $20,000 in damages. lol. See below. It will make your blood boil. It doesn't seem she has any ethics. Someone suggested that her new husband knows she's a murderer and probably "digs it". Why would a guy dig that? Strange. Doesn't he know that it means his life could be in danger?

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Re: Amanda Knox - Is she guilty or innocent of murder in Italy?

Post by Contrarian Expatriate »

Winston wrote:
November 14th, 2020, 7:31 pm
Btw CE, this will make your blood boil.
Not really. I have no emotional investment in her nor her case.
Winston wrote: Apparently, Knox is trying to scam people for money. She's asking donations for a wedding party on her blog, when in reality she got married last year already.
I am not surprised at all. These are typical things that sociopaths do.
Winston wrote: Someone suggested that her new husband knows she's a murderer and probably "digs it". Why would a guy dig that? Strange. Doesn't he know that it means his life could be in danger?
It's called hybristophilia and it is rare in men as the vast majority of hybristophiliacs are female.
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