How they treat Russians in America

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ladislav
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How they treat Russians in America

Post by ladislav »

I got this from quora

"I immigrated here with my parents shortly after the fall of communism. I was old enough back then to remember food lines, social disturbances, bombings, and that whole mess, but too young to understand the implications. I am of Russian descent. My parents raised me on Russian values, culture, stories - since that was what they knew, but I grew up in America. Now I can tell you from my experience, US is anti-Russian enough. Its one thing to be hostile towards a political ideology, but in US, I find that there is hostility towards being Russian, and because we’re caucasian, we technically can’t play the race card, so its way more overt that in other cultures’ instances.

Here are some examples —

My experience as a kid:

Teachers and adult constantly made communist jokes about me and my parents
Kids constantly told me to “rush back to Russia”
Adults and kids berated me because of how my name sounded when my parents called out for me in the school yard. Sushi was my nickname at some point.
Teachers were ignoring me in class because I wasn’t 100% knowledgeable of english and of American culture. I didn’t grow up on Barnie, and Simpsons wasn’t allowed in my house.
My accent was constantly berated by adults and kids
My lack of knowledge of what some foods were, was made fun of constantly (Sorry, no such thing as sloppy joe’s in Moscow)

What did that create? - It isolated me and created distrust in me of the local community. I started hanging out with mostly Russian kids, speaking Russian and not wanting to learn English. I went from being a brilliant outspoken kid, to a disengaged kid who sat in the corner quietly by myself. My friends became other quiet immigrants who also were ostracized from the “American” community.

My experience as a Teen:

Teachers telling me they will send my kind back to Russia in a potato sack (thanks LaGuardia HS!!)
Teachers berating my culture and making fun of any opportunity they had of my Russian heritage
My name still remained a point of contention with many
hearing phrases like “back in my day, we wouldn’t have allowed your kind into our country” - a lovely phrase mentioned by one of my teachers.

There were more, but by this time, I had gotten used to many of these things and began to ignore them. I formed a close group of other Russian people in my H.S. with whom instead of assimilating, we amplified our culture. We brought blini, caviar and boiled eggs for breakfast with zero f***s given. We played Hi5 in the hallways, sang Russian pop songs, played Russian card games and ignored the general nastiness that came our way. The nastiness and the Anti-Russian sentiment though got a lot more negative in those years, and as it did, we became much more dismissive of it.

My experience in collage and as an adult:

I’ve had potential employers assume that I was illegal or unqualified because of my name, or that I could not speak English (another story on how I found out about those instances)
I’ve had colleagues and class mates constantly ask me about being a hot Russian spy - guys who tried picking me up with that line also became numerous.
I’ve had colleagues, class mates and random guys “hitting on me” ask me about being a Russian mail order bride.
Another assumption that get’s thrown my way is that I *must* have been an escort at some point
My account supervisor told me the following phrase about 2 weeks ago “I know that English isn’t your first language so I rather you go through several processes of approval before you write this document” (I was writing a press release, and could tell you that our editor was more than happy with my work on first round, so as you see, clearly there was no language barrier)
People ask me about Putin every opportunity they get, even though I haven’t lived there for 22 years — another favorite topic that gets brought up, especially by the older generation, is communism and how they personally feel about Russian politics (for which I really don’t care)
I frequently hear the following comment “Your English is so well! You don’t have an accent - you must have studied it in Russia?!”
And even though no one says it to my face in person, I still see the same childhood jokes about Russian accents, culture and “rushing back to Russia” pop-up across US comment sections and forums
Also, I must add how I am tired of seeing Russians portrayed as the bad evil juju guys in practically every thriller/ spy film.

So as you see, people are still pretty hostile ...

BTW, for reference point, this is the stuff that happens in NYC."
A brain is a terrible thing to wash!


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Contrarian Expatriate
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Re: How they treat Russians in America

Post by Contrarian Expatriate »

This is a shameful account of how some Russians are treated in the USA. It reminds me of a former YouTuber who used to make videos about his horrible life in the US. His life was idyllic in Russia before his parents decided to move the family to the USA. Then his world was turned upside down.

He finally returned to Russia and he was no longer depressed and felt right at home after not being back there since his pre-teen days.

However, I have encountered many Russians who absolutely love living in the USA. Most of them women, and many of them Jewish. They seem to based in middle to upper middle class communities and their "Russianness" is never a negative issue.

There is a long history of Russian emigres loving the USA even during the heights of the cold war. The list is long and extensive:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Russian_Americans

So I think it is a matter of the quality of the communities in which they live that makes or breaks their experience.
ladislav
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Re: How they treat Russians in America

Post by ladislav »

Yes, exactly. If they are reasonably rich and the kids go to private schools and they live in rich areas, then it's not an issue. Usually IT people and PhDs at unis and their kids are treated OK.

With any non Anglo Saxon, one is supposed to know one's place/limitations in the USA and where one is welcome and where one is not. No Russians are in the US gov't. None in the corporate world. It's basically IT mostly. And virtually no American woman will date or marry a Russian man. Extremely rare!

And the same can be said about black people who are well off. Very few ( not 0, though) problems but they, too, are supposed to "know their place". Once they start branching into other areas, such as say, banking and investments, or the corporate world, then this is when problems begin.

If they are low middle class to poor, then they have to deal with low class Americans. Low middle class to poor Americans can be beastly and most Americans belong to that class of people. If one is wrong type of person, they give him/her hell.

Jewish people are not Russians by Russian law or culture and in Russia. Just like they were not Germans. They are called Hebrews in Russia. It's Americans who call them Russians. Compared to how Jews are treated in Russia, Jews are treated better in the USA. But to an American , a Jew is just a religion ( nowadays). While in Russia and Germany it is a race/ethnicity/nationality. So, to an American, a Jew from Russia is a Russian.

Otoh, what the women told you about living in the USA and what is actually happening are two different things. One is supposed to say that one loves America at all times. If one does not say that, one is told to get out and go back to where he came from. Angrily so.
A brain is a terrible thing to wash!
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Contrarian Expatriate
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Re: How they treat Russians in America

Post by Contrarian Expatriate »

ladislav wrote:
September 13th, 2020, 7:20 pm
Otoh, what the women told you about living in the USA and what is actually happening are two different things. One is supposed to say that one loves America at all times. If one does not say that, one is told to get out and go back to where he came from. Angrily so.
I think you make some great points. These are accounts are of women who I have met in Ukraine, Georgia, Armenia, and elsewhere abroad. They all have studied or lived in the USA previously. Only one or two were actually Russian now that I think about it.

But their affinity for America comes from the fact that as young, attractive, white, females, their status rises to the top of the social hierarchy the moment they set foot on American soil. This newfound pinnacle-status intoxicates them in a way they have never experienced in their home countries.

Russian men I encountered have been a mixed bag. Most of them are indeed successful in IT (or in Russian language instruction) as you mentioned, but they feel somewhat socially marginalized at the same time. They just don't feel 100% fully invested in the social fabric of America largely because they are mere men IMO.
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Re: How they treat Russians in America

Post by Tsar »

Contrarian Expatriate wrote:
September 13th, 2020, 7:10 pm
This is a shameful account of how some Russians are treated in the USA. It reminds me of a former YouTuber who used to make videos about his horrible life in the US. His life was idyllic in Russia before his parents decided to move the family to the USA. Then his world was turned upside down.

He finally returned to Russia and he was no longer depressed and felt right at home after not being back there since his pre-teen days.

However, I have encountered many Russians who absolutely love living in the USA. Most of them women, and many of them Jewish. They seem to based in middle to upper middle class communities and their "Russianness" is never a negative issue.

There is a long history of Russian emigres loving the USA even during the heights of the cold war. The list is long and extensive:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Russian_Americans

So I think it is a matter of the quality of the communities in which they live that makes or breaks their experience.
A real Russian cannot ever be a Jew. Jews are only ever Jews.
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Re: How they treat Russians in America

Post by ladislav »

Contrarian Expatriate wrote:
September 13th, 2020, 8:22 pm
ladislav wrote:
September 13th, 2020, 7:20 pm
Otoh, what the women told you about living in the USA and what is actually happening are two different things. One is supposed to say that one loves America at all times. If one does not say that, one is told to get out and go back to where he came from. Angrily so.
I think you make some great points. These are accounts are of women who I have met in Ukraine, Georgia, Armenia, and elsewhere abroad. They all have studied or lived in the USA previously. Only one or two were actually Russian now that I think about it.

But their affinity for America comes from the fact that as young, attractive, white, females, their status rises to the top of the social hierarchy the moment they set foot on American soil. This newfound pinnacle-status intoxicates them in a way they have never experienced in their home countries.

Russian men I encountered have been a mixed bag. Most of them are indeed successful in IT (or in Russian language instruction) as you mentioned, but they feel somewhat socially marginalized at the same time. They just don't feel 100% fully invested in the social fabric of America largely because they are mere men IMO.
Oh, those women were guests, with good jobs and possibly money. They were not immigrants. The Russian men get shit for being white men and for being foreigners and for coming from Russia. I guess they just concentrate on making money as many people do. Oriental people are the same.Just concentrate on studying, getting degrees and making money. Also, remember your place.
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Re: How they treat Russians in America

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Tsar wrote:
September 13th, 2020, 8:54 pm
A real Russian cannot ever be a Jew. Jews are only ever Jews.
That makes absolutely no sense. What is a "real Russian" anyway? The White, Slavic Russians we think of in Russia are originally from Ukraine (Kievan Rus) anyhow. Aboriginal Russians include Chechens, Udege, Evenks, Ulchs, Evens, Nana and several other groups.

In addition, there are many Russians who are Cossacks, Ingush, Lezgin, Dagastani, Tartar, Ossetian, Alans, Avars, Circassians, and many others I have not come to know. And I am not even referring to people from other former Soviet republics. These are Russian peoples! So your narrow concept of what constitutes a real Russian is grossly inaccurate. Go there and visit and you'll see.

ALL of them are Russians and many have been there before the Slavic Russians came over from what is now Ukraine.

As for Jews, they exist all up and down Russian society and they have for several hundred years. Some acknowledge their Jewishness, and some do not. Jews are inextricably linked to Russian history and society at this point.

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Re: How they treat Russians in America

Post by Tsar »

Contrarian Expatriate wrote:
September 13th, 2020, 9:18 pm
As for Jews, they exist all up and down Russian society and they have for several hundred years. Some acknowledge their Jewishness, and some do not. Jews are inextricably linked to Russian history and society at this point.
How could they exist up and down Russian society when before the Bolshevik Jewish Revolution they were kept in pogroms and hated by most Russians just like they were hated by almost everyone else in Europe? They must have really hated being kept at the bottom because their Marxist revolution was also part of White Genocide and to dismantle European and Christian society.
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Re: How they treat Russians in America

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Tsar wrote:
September 13th, 2020, 9:25 pm
Contrarian Expatriate wrote:
September 13th, 2020, 9:18 pm
As for Jews, they exist all up and down Russian society and they have for several hundred years. Some acknowledge their Jewishness, and some do not. Jews are inextricably linked to Russian history and society at this point.
How could they exist up and down Russian society when before the Bolshevik Jewish Revolution they were kept in pogroms and hated by most Russians just like they were hated by almost everyone else in Europe? They must have really hated being kept at the bottom because their Marxist revolution was also part of White Genocide and to dismantle European and Christian society.
There are Jews who were part of the Tsarist governments, Jews who where revolutionaries, and Jews who were part of Soviet leadership so your oversimplified view of Jews is about as ridiculous as your notion that only Russians of Slavic origin are true Russians.

Also, no one is kept in a pogram. A pogram is an event, not a place. Perhaps you meant they were slaughtered in pograms in some of the villages and towns. In that case you would have been correct.

Finally, a Russian Jew is not simply a Russian Jew. There were Mountain Jews, Ashkenazi Jews, Sephardi Jews, Crimean Karaites, Krymchaks, Bukharan Jews, and Georgian Jews and they are not all the same. Some were religious, some were secular, some were peasants, and some were intellectuals. So they were not all treated the same and many rose to great prominence both before and after the Bolshevik revolution.
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Re: How they treat Russians in America

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ladislav wrote:
September 13th, 2020, 7:20 pm
And the same can be said about black people who are well off. Very few ( not 0, though) problems but they, too, are supposed to "know their place". Once they start branching into other areas, such as say, banking and investments, or the corporate world, then this is when problems begin.
Not really. Middle class and affluent blacks have made great gains in almost all sectors of the labor force, both high and low.

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Re: How they treat Russians in America

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Contrarian Expatriate wrote:
September 14th, 2020, 12:57 am
ladislav wrote:
September 13th, 2020, 7:20 pm
And the same can be said about black people who are well off. Very few ( not 0, though) problems but they, too, are supposed to "know their place". Once they start branching into other areas, such as say, banking and investments, or the corporate world, then this is when problems begin.
Not really. Middle class and affluent blacks have made great gains in almost all sectors of the labor force, both high and low.
Imagine all the human suffering that has been inflicted by the government forcing blacks down people's throats. It is a complete horror show.
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Re: How they treat Russians in America

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That makes absolutely no sense. What is a "real Russian" anyway? The White, Slavic Russians we think of in Russia are originally from Ukraine (Kievan Rus) anyhow. Aboriginal Russians include Chechens, Udege, Evenks, Ulchs, Evens, Nana and several other groups.
In addition, there are many Russians who are Cossacks, Ingush, Lezgin, Dagastani, Tartar, Ossetian, Alans, Avars, Circassians, and many others I have not come to know. And I am not even referring to people from other former Soviet republics. These are Russian peoples! So your narrow concept of what constitutes a real Russian is grossly inaccurate. Go there and visit and you'll see.
ALL of them are Russians and many have been there before the Slavic Russians came over from what is now Ukraine.
To understand it, one needs to leave the English language behind and think in Russian. There is a word "Russkiy", and this denotes those people whom you call "White Slavic Russian" ( this term is not translatable into Russian).
They are people like Putin or Kurnikova or Medvedev. Origin Slavic blood with a great deal of Finnish admixture. They recognize each other by names and faces.Yes, some of their ancestors came from Ukraine, but it was 1000 years ago. Their names are not Ukrainian, and their faces look different, also.
Chechens, Udege, Evenks, Ulchs, Evens, Nana and several other groups.
In addition, there are many Russians who are Cossacks, Ingush, Lezgin, Dagastani, Tartar, Ossetian, Alans, Avars, Circassians,
In Russia, these are called "Natzmen", ethnic minorities. Kind of like Pakistanis and Jamaicans in England. No Englishman would seriously call those people " English".
In Russia, people never call them "Russkie". They're just called by those names you have posted above.

Cossacks are not an ethnic group but a social class, although they like to be seen as an ethnic group, but they would probably be more akin to Texans trying to be a separate ethnic group.

In the Soviet times, the people whom you call White Slavic Russians (they don't call themselves like that) had their nationality marked in all their IDs as "Russkie", but the rest would have those other names marked in all their IDs.

After the 90's, the new gov't invented a new term:"Rossianin'. Meaning "a citizen of Russia". It had never existed before. "Russkie" is no longer used formally, but everybody uses it informally. There is no way these Chukchi or Dagestanis will be called Russkie by anybody.

Enter English language which makes no difference translating Russkie and Rossiyane. Both are Russian in English. To you, an English speaker they are the same. But not to a Russian speaker. No way someone with a Mongolian face is a Russkiy.
As for Jews, they exist all up and down Russian society and they have for several hundred years. Some acknowledge their Jewishness, and some do not. Jews are inextricably linked to Russian history and society at this point.
The Russians have a term inorodtsy EE NO ROD TSIH "xeno-races". Those people with Mongolian and Turkic faces are inorodtsy They are Ne-Russkie

Jews were not allowed to live in Russia proper by law in the old times. They lived in Luthuania, Poland, Ukraine, etc. Only after 1917 did they move into Russia. So, it is only 103 years now. Jews are not seen as an indigenous population of the country and are not liked. They are called Hebrews which is what they are. They are treated similarly to how overseas Chinese are treated in Indonesia. Foreigners. Not of this place.
They are a lot better integrated now, but back in the past, even if they converted to Christianity, they were still called Baptized Hebrews, a foreign tribe from the Middle East. No assimilation was possible. And they did contribute a lot but they were still "Ne-Russkie" inorodtsy.

So, while to you, they are all Russians, to them, they are not.
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Re: How they treat Russians in America

Post by ladislav »

[/quote]
How could they exist up and down Russian society when before the Bolshevik Jewish Revolution they were kept in pogroms and hated by most Russians just like they were hated by almost everyone else in Europe? They must have really hated being kept at the bottom because their Marxist revolution was also part of White Genocide and to dismantle European and Christian society.
[/quote]

Some do, but many have left. White Genocide is a British colonial term and is not used in Russia. Jews wanted equality and no, they did not hate the whites because no such ethnic group in Russia.
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Re: How they treat Russians in America

Post by Cornfed »

ladislav wrote:
September 16th, 2020, 2:45 am
How could they exist up and down Russian society when before the Bolshevik Jewish Revolution they were kept in pogroms and hated by most Russians just like they were hated by almost everyone else in Europe? They must have really hated being kept at the bottom because their Marxist revolution was also part of White Genocide and to dismantle European and Christian society.
Some do, but many have left. White Genocide is a British colonial term and is not used in Russia. Jews wanted equality and no, they did not hate the whites because no such ethnic group in Russia.
[/quote]

The Jews hated white Christians, as evidenced by them murdering millions of them.
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Re: How they treat Russians in America

Post by ladislav »

Cornfed wrote:
September 16th, 2020, 2:51 am
ladislav wrote:
September 16th, 2020, 2:45 am
How could they exist up and down Russian society when before the Bolshevik Jewish Revolution they were kept in pogroms and hated by most Russians just like they were hated by almost everyone else in Europe? They must have really hated being kept at the bottom because their Marxist revolution was also part of White Genocide and to dismantle European and Christian society.
Some do, but many have left. White Genocide is a British colonial term and is not used in Russia. Jews wanted equality and no, they did not hate the whites because no such ethnic group in Russia.

The Jews hated white Christians, as evidenced by them murdering millions of them.
Where did they kill white Christians in millions? You mean in the USSR? It was a class genocide, not Jew vs Christian or vs. white. Killing counterrevolutionaries. Killing those who believed in private property, rich peasants. Then, when Stalin came to power, he started killing all his enemies and Jews were targeted as well.
Where else did they murder millions of them? Can you please enumerate these executions and where is the evidence that they were targeting white Christians?
Last edited by ladislav on September 28th, 2020, 4:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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