Japanese Women or Korean Women for Marriage

[Yohan]

It's simple. Japan, South Korea and Taiwan too are countries in Asia which are not really suitable for a foreign (Western) man to look for a wife.

In all 3 countries local men married to a foreign (mostly Asian) wife outnumber local women married to a foreign man at least 2:1 or more, especially in rural areas.

In South Korea it goes even so far, that there are government programs concerning foreign women and their protection, as Koreans are not known to be soft-hearted people (Korean men and women can be very aggressive)

http://www.koreaherald.com/view.php?ud=20191122000436

South Korea will create a multi-language police hotline to better protect foreign wives from domestic violence, the gender ministry said Friday.

The government will also ban men with records of serious crimes from bringing in foreign brides and enhance education for marriage migrants and mix-race families to help them settle in this ethnically homogenous nation.

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The number of international marriages in Korea rose 8.5 percent to 23,773 in 2018 from a year earlier, according to government data released this month. Couples made up of a Korean man and a foreign woman accounted for 67 percent of the total.

-----

About myself, I am an European man living in Japan since over 40 years. Many Western men I can say, expect something totally different in Japan and are grossly misinformed or ignorant of the way of life here.

If you don't have any special reason to marry into Japan and have no knowledge about Japan and language expect troubles. If you cannot find a reasonable job with a good income, then better stay away from Japan, and same is also true with South Korea and Taiwan.

Japanese women are not really into living with their Western husband overseas and usually prefer to live in Japan and keep good relationship with parents and relatives and also want 1 or 2 children. This costs all money of course. Don't expect that a salary as an 'English teacher without any qualification' is enough for a financially stable Japanese household.

Most foreign men I know from Europe who live in Japan since decades have a good income working for foreign companies, foreign government related offices, airlines, international hotel management, international schools and such jobs. Such jobs are only available in the larger cities and housing is at least 4 times more expensive than anywhere else in Japan.

[Yohan]

Korean women and Japanese women are both shit.

This is not true. The problem is often about foreign men who insist to import Korean and Japanese women into their own countries, especially USA.

Foreign men are not only 'white men' or 'black men', but also Asian Americans, even Japanese-USA related people, who totally lost the connection to the native country of their parents. Such people often cannot speak Korean or Japanese correctly, they are native English speakers and every time something is not fitting them they say 'this or that is what Japan should learn from USA' or start with 'discrimination' complaints which really is confusing ordinary local Japanese people...

True, as a 'white man' from Europe or US, you are a foreigner in Japan - and I take it easy, this is a country where 96 percent of the population are nothing but Japanese and there is no way to mistaken me for a Japanese and not for a foreigner... LOL

You have to decide, where do you want to live - in Japan or in USA, the distance is too large, you cannot just be a little bit here and a little bit there.

The quality of such Japanese women who are into foreign men only is often also questionable, what shall I say to some guy whose first sentence is 'I met her in a bar...' and really thinks she loves him...

Well, anyway, Japan is not such a cheap place for living and most of these men are gone within a few years... Not over 2 or 3 years, as far as I can see.
Same in South Korea... not much difference of the situation.

[Yohan]

Btw, Forerunner,

Back to Korea and Japan, why would you want to marry someone from North Korea's messed up culture? You mght find one good candidate, but the culture has to be super weird up in North Korea. Take the rigidity of South Korean culture, and add to it being shut off from the outside world and living in a country where it is a religion to worship the ruler of the country.

When I was talking about meeting a N.Korean women its because I think they would be more humble and traditional in a sense from living in communist country just like the women in the FSR countries who had been under communist rule.

Back to Korea and Japan, why would you want to marry someone from North Korea's messed up culture? You mght find one good candidate, but the culture has to be super weird up in North Korea. Take the rigidity of South Korean culture, and add to it being shut off from the outside world and living in a country where it is a religion to worship the ruler of the country.

There is no way to enter North Korea and to marry a local woman living there.

There are however North Koreans living in China, often illegal, and the majority of them are women, but how to bring such a woman out of China?
To bring to where?
Anyway, even to try that you have to be very fluent in Chinese and Korean...and you need some good local connection and paying bribes etc...

Dantong 丹东 is known for its North Korean population...about 30000 North Koreans are living there legally, not sure how many illegals made it over the border.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dandong

[MrMan]

Btw, Forerunner,

Back to Korea and Japan, why would you want to marry someone from North Korea's messed up culture? You mght find one good candidate, but the culture has to be super weird up in North Korea. Take the rigidity of South Korean culture, and add to it being shut off from the outside world and living in a country where it is a religion to worship the ruler of the country.

When I was talking about meeting a N.Korean women its because I think they would be more humble and traditional in a sense from living in communist country just like the women in the FSR countries who had been under communist rule.

Back to Korea and Japan, why would you want to marry someone from North Korea's messed up culture? You mght find one good candidate, but the culture has to be super weird up in North Korea. Take the rigidity of South Korean culture, and add to it being shut off from the outside world and living in a country where it is a religion to worship the ruler of the country.

There is no way to enter North Korea and to marry a local woman living there.

There are however North Koreans living in China, often illegal, and the majority of them are women, but how to bring such a woman out of China?
To bring to where?
Anyway, even to try that you have to be very fluent in Chinese and Korean...and you need some good local connection and paying bribes etc...

Dantong 丹东 is known for its North Korean population...about 30000 North Koreans are living there legally, not sure how many illegals made it over the border.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dandong

If a man met a North Korean and liked her, I can see why he might want to date her. But I don't see any reason to single out North Korean women as a target and try to find them in a city in China. Communism strips cultures of social refinement. North Korean women tend to have sub-optimal short hair dos. I've seen some pictures of pretty women from North Korea, but they aren't that much different from their more accessible southern neighbors, except it is less likely their looks have been modified at the doctor's office.

[hypermak]

I agree with what Yohan has been saying. However, how about the prospect of living in Japan with a lovely Filipina gs/wife?

[Yohan]

I agree with what Yohan has been saying. However, how about the prospect of living in Japan with a lovely Filipina gs/wife?

This is a good question, and in countries like Japan, South Korea and also in HongKong, Singapore, you find many contract workers - men and women - from poorer countries in Asia. Many are married already, just working and sending money home for their children and other family members - but not all of them of course. If you approach contract worker groups, you will find somebody for sure....somebody will show up and will introduce you to somebody...

The question is however how to arrange your stay in Japan? More likely you will prefer to go home to your own country, expect visa problems for her sometimes and this can take long time and cost money - or if you are not retired and have to work, to move over to such countries like Philippines, Myanmar etc. and earn money there is not easy either.

There is no easy way to go for an international/interracial marriage... somehow more difficult, more challenging than with a local girl from your own country.

[Yohan]

If a man met a North Korean and liked her, I can see why he might want to date her. But I don't see any reason to single out North Korean women as a target and try to find them in a city in China. Communism strips cultures of social refinement. North Korean women tend to have sub-optimal short hair dos. I've seen some pictures of pretty women from North Korea, but they aren't that much different from their more accessible southern neighbors, except it is less likely their looks have been modified at the doctor's office.

To meet her where? How? Not possible in isolated restricted North Korea as a foreigner. Women from North Korea who are living somewhere in China, but some of them also in South Korea and Japan, are not known to be peaceful people. Same as North Korean men growing up in a military state under harsh training they are known to be very aggressive, many people from North Korea who made it over to Western countries badly adjust to Western values.

About looks, it is impossible to see any difference between North Koreans, South Koreans, Japanese and also Mongol people.

In Japan the number of younger North Korean people who are living in Japan permanently is strongly declining year by year, as they often opt for Japanese citizenship, get a Japanese name and move away, just disappear in the Japanese crowd of people.

About Koreans in Japan you have to talk to them in Japanese and the only difference you notice as a fluent Japanese speaker is some kind of 'hard accent'.
-----

About cosmetic surgery, many Japanese and Korean women are not really beautiful and have their 'beauty problems', and in richer Asian countries much money is spent for dental work, dermatology, etc. Asian people often are prone to acne and have often very bad teeth. Just two examples.

[hypermak]

I agree with what Yohan has been saying. However, how about the prospect of living in Japan with a lovely Filipina gs/wife?

This is a good question, and in countries like Japan, South Korea and also in HongKong, Singapore, you find many contract workers - men and women - from poorer countries in Asia. Many are married already, just working and sending money home for their children and other family members - but not all of them of course. If you approach contract worker groups, you will find somebody for sure....somebody will show up and will introduce you to somebody...

The question is however how to arrange your stay in Japan? More likely you will prefer to go home to your own country, expect visa problems for her sometimes and this can take long time and cost money - or if you are not retired and have to work, to move over to such countries like Philippines, Myanmar etc. and earn money there is not easy either.

There is no easy way to go for an international/interracial marriage... somehow more difficult, more challenging than with a local girl from your own country.

I understand you are living in Japan, so I really appreciate any insights of yours. See, I did't ask the question willy-nilly. I am a chef by trade and for us Japan is some sort of "ultimate horizon". I am sure you know Girolamo Panzetta aka "Jiro-san" or even Salvatore Cuomo and his father.

I have at least 4 colleagues who are working in Japan (Tokyo and Yokohama) as exec chefs. They keep telling me how great it is to work in Japan, possibly the only country in the world where the culinary arts are taken very seriously and non-celeb-status chefs don't have to feel like glorified waiters whenever a conversation comes up. The supply side (ingredients, equipment, logistics) are first-class, the salaries are very good and as soon as you make a name for yourself, you will have multiple investors lining up to open a restaurant or franchise with you.

The only, and I repeat the only negative they reported was - case in point - the dating game. At least 2 of these friends are single, young and good looking and never had trouble finding occasional hookups. However all of them lament the fact that women are materialistic, cold and uninterested in sex. The better looking, classier and educated they seem, the more their see sex as a "bothersome" activity, like the Victorians!

So maybe, just maybe, as soon as I am happy to give up the sex rota and ready to settle, I should find a good Filipina and apply for a job in Japan. Of course the Visa process for her might not be easy unless we are married, but I have to count on the general efficiency of the Japanese immigration process. I have to hope that, if my job is in a large food or hotel franchise, the company might be able to sponsor a fiancee Visa, or similar.

I really don't know how this might play out, but I want to hold it as a very possible option.

[chanta76]

15 or 20 years ago. South korea and japan was ok place to hook up and maybe find a wife. But with the women movement and western expats tends to spoil the country..word gets around that foreigners are just playboys.

You still can find a wife buts it's not super easy at the same time the local asian guys up thier game. The local asians will sometimes dress better act better or even earn better than some expat. The higher quality local women have choices.

[Yohan]

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=29569&start=75

Everdred made a long report about Japan, surely worth to read it, also some comments in the thread written by me.

I can only recommend you about Japan to start first with YOU and disregard anything related to women.

As you have already experience with a job a chef, the company in Japan, for example in your case a restaurant in an international hotel or so, has to apply for your visa and not you.
Japanese immigration will issue then, if approved, a so-called eligibility certificate, and presented to a Japanese embassy overseas by you, you will get a visa which is OK for work at that company. You will also be able to use the Japanese Health insurance, which is very important too.

I can only say, first of all regulate everything about yourself after arrival in Japan and this will take a while - a few months at least - don't care about women.

To bring a foreign woman with you - if married - is not a problem, but if not legally married don't expect any positive response for long-stay.

Short visits however as a tourist are easy, you can invite relative and friends if you offer full guarantee for airticket, travel insurance, accommodation etc. There are forms for that. If you invite somebody make sure that this foreign woman will never overstay and leave Japan before the visa expires.
ASEAN citizens are often visafree to enter Japan, but only for a short time (Filipino still need visa even for short-stay).

An official list in English can be found here:
https://www.mofa.go.jp/j_info/visit/vis ... ovisa.html
https://www.mofa.go.jp/j_info/visit/visa/index.html
-----

Ordinary Japanese women in general are not materialistic, often very modest, not into wasting money - they expect from a future husband to have a regular job and a minimum income of more than USD 2000,- - USD 2500,-. However these women are not into 'occasional hookups' and expect language problems if you are a foreigner and unable to speak at least some basic Japanese. - Japanese are not good with foreign languages and are not very communicative anyway - many prefer introduction and help from friends, women are often acting only in groups. Believe me, there are many Japanese women who are not 'rich'. Same with Japanese men, some are jobless, only playing pachinko and drinking alcohol, and often full with debits....

What you mention, these are girls who are into nightlife in the major cities, but of course what counts for them 'for dating' is only the money. Daughters from really rich families, who are studying 'something' and spend the evening up to late night in nightclubs or in golf resort hotels etc...

Anyway here in Japan, as a foreign Western man, you need patience - this is true also in other Asian countries like South Korea or Malaysia. Positive response of your actions from local people are slow - much slower as you are accustomed it to be in Western countries.

It is said, that Japanese people are discriminating, but I cannot confirm that - they are more 'to stay away' - not for you but also not against you - considering you more as 'invisible'. Japanese often will tell you they feel the same if they have to move to another part of Japan where they meet new people and know nobody next to them.

Japan should however be seen not only from a negative side - it is still if you ask me by far the best country in Asia for working as a foreigner, it is really a safe place day and night wherever you go - it is a society where this annoying 'give me a tip' does not exist - where prices are regulated - where people are polite and cities are clean, good public transport within the cities, a place with good health care, etc.

However Japan is surely not a place where girls are running after you...

[Yohan]

15 or 20 years ago. South korea and japan was ok place to hook up and maybe find a wife. But with the women movement and western expats tends to spoil the country..word gets around that foreigners are just playboys.
You still can find a wife buts it's not super easy at the same time the local asian guys up thier game. The local asians will sometimes dress better act better or even earn better than some expat. The higher quality local women have choices.

15 or 20 years ago? I would say maybe 30 to 35 years ago....at that time Japan was still a poor country.
When I arrived USD 1,- for yen 365,- and now it is about USD 1,- for yen 107,-.....
Now Japan is not a cheap place at all, especially for housing and higher education.

Feminism is not really such a big issue in Japan as it is in Western countries. The legal situation in Japan is not against men. You cannot have it all, there are everywhere some advantages and disadvantages.

I think, better to live in Japan than in South Korea or Taiwan. Japan is the larger country and offers some rural area too, and Japanese people are calm compared to Koreans. Politically also more stable than Taiwan or South Korea facing China and North Korea as their neighbors.
Not so much religious influence - Christianity - from abroad from Western countries. Not like in South Korea, Philippines or Vietnam.
Japanese stay with their tradition as a Buddhist/Shinto nation.

After living in Japan more than 40 years, I have to say, I frequently have the desire to get out and away for a while. Japan can become boring, monotonous sometimes, even depressive. I have a second home in Thailand, that's a nice place too but only if you bring your own money with you.

[MrMan]

If a man met a North Korean and liked her, I can see why he might want to date her. But I don't see any reason to single out North Korean women as a target and try to find them in a city in China. Communism strips cultures of social refinement. North Korean women tend to have sub-optimal short hair dos. I've seen some pictures of pretty women from North Korea, but they aren't that much different from their more accessible southern neighbors, except it is less likely their looks have been modified at the doctor's office.

To meet her where? How? Not possible in isolated restricted North Korea as a foreigner.

I was thinking of you met an N. Korean expat, in China, for example. I don't see any reason to single them out since their country is so weird and seems to brainwash the populace with weird dogma.

About looks, it is impossible to see any difference between North Koreans, South Koreans, Japanese and also Mongol people.

Really? Koreans have a limited number of facial types. I think I can sort of tell, withe maybe 40% accuracy, maybe better, a Japanese from a Korean if those are the only two variables. But I've seen Mongols who look Korean to me. Have you discussed this with the Japanese, whether they can identify Koreans by looking at them?

[flowerthief00]

So maybe, just maybe, as soon as I am happy to give up the sex rota and ready to settle, I should find a good Filipina and apply for a job in Japan.

No offense but I found this amusing. I mean, Japanese people are the most attractive/fashionable and intelligent people in Asia. Maybe you could call the former allegation subjective, but certainly not the latter; Japan is ranked among the 5 smartest nations both in Asia AND in the entire world. Philippines is at the low end within Asia.

Wouldn't bringing a Filipina to Japan be kind of like traveling to the Admont Abbey Library in Austria (considered by many to be the most beautiful library in the world), pulling up a chair, putting on your reading glasses, and taking out of your backpack the Gangsta Rap Coloring Book?

Like, I'm not arguing that Japanese are not cold and materialistic and frustrating to try to date.... But for me it would be torture to be living with a Filipina while there are beautiful and intelligent women walking around me every day everywhere I go (whether I could have them or not).

[hypermak]

So maybe, just maybe, as soon as I am happy to give up the sex rota and ready to settle, I should find a good Filipina and apply for a job in Japan.

No offense but I found this amusing. I mean, Japanese people are the most attractive/fashionable and intelligent people in Asia. Maybe you could call the former allegation subjective, but certainly not the latter; Japan is ranked among the 5 smartest nations both in Asia AND in the entire world. Philippines is at the low end within Asia.

Wouldn't bringing a Filipina to Japan be kind of like traveling to the Admont Abbey Library in Austria (considered by many to be the most beautiful library in the world), pulling up a chair, putting on your reading glasses, and taking out of your backpack the Gangsta Rap Coloring Book?

Like, I'm not arguing that Japanese are not cold and materialistic and frustrating to try to date.... But for me it would be torture to be living with a Filipina while there are beautiful and intelligent women walking around me every day everywhere I go (whether I could have them or not).

Different strokes, obviously. I haven't actually seen many attractive Japanese. Of course magazine and ads are replete with Japanese fair skinned, smooth skinned, long legged goddesses. But if you walk down a busy street or a subway station in central Tokyo or Osaka (as I have done several times), you would be hard pressed to count 10 attractive or even cute women in half an hour of diving into that ocean of people.

Japanese women are masters of make up and spend a fortune on clothes and accessories. They do look classy and sophisticated, yes. I myself would prefer a more affectionate and down-to-earth Filipina type to a superficially glamorous but genuinely cold and materialistic (and probably frigid) Japanese woman.

Of course we must add that, at least in my case, I would never settle for a low-IQ Filipina. There are probably less smart Pinay than Japanese, but I don't think it's impossible to find one, especially after living here (Manila) for a few years.

Oh well, time will tell.

[hypermak]

viewtopic.php?f=11&t=29569&start=75

Everdred made a long report about Japan, surely worth to read it, also some comments in the thread written by me.

I can only recommend you about Japan to start first with YOU and disregard anything related to women.

As you have already experience with a job a chef, the company in Japan, for example in your case a restaurant in an international hotel or so, has to apply for your visa and not you.
Japanese immigration will issue then, if approved, a so-called eligibility certificate, and presented to a Japanese embassy overseas by you, you will get a visa which is OK for work at that company. You will also be able to use the Japanese Health insurance, which is very important too.

I can only say, first of all regulate everything about yourself after arrival in Japan and this will take a while - a few months at least - don't care about women.

To bring a foreign woman with you - if married - is not a problem, but if not legally married don't expect any positive response for long-stay.

Short visits however as a tourist are easy, you can invite relative and friends if you offer full guarantee for airticket, travel insurance, accommodation etc. There are forms for that. If you invite somebody make sure that this foreign woman will never overstay and leave Japan before the visa expires.
ASEAN citizens are often visafree to enter Japan, but only for a short time (Filipino still need visa even for short-stay).

An official list in English can be found here:
https://www.mofa.go.jp/j_info/visit/vis ... ovisa.html
https://www.mofa.go.jp/j_info/visit/visa/index.html
-----

Ordinary Japanese women in general are not materialistic, often very modest, not into wasting money - they expect from a future husband to have a regular job and a minimum income of more than USD 2000,- - USD 2500,-. However these women are not into 'occasional hookups' and expect language problems if you are a foreigner and unable to speak at least some basic Japanese. - Japanese are not good with foreign languages and are not very communicative anyway - many prefer introduction and help from friends, women are often acting only in groups. Believe me, there are many Japanese women who are not 'rich'. Same with Japanese men, some are jobless, only playing pachinko and drinking alcohol, and often full with debits....

What you mention, these are girls who are into nightlife in the major cities, but of course what counts for them 'for dating' is only the money. Daughters from really rich families, who are studying 'something' and spend the evening up to late night in nightclubs or in golf resort hotels etc...

Anyway here in Japan, as a foreign Western man, you need patience - this is true also in other Asian countries like South Korea or Malaysia. Positive response of your actions from local people are slow - much slower as you are accustomed it to be in Western countries.

It is said, that Japanese people are discriminating, but I cannot confirm that - they are more 'to stay away' - not for you but also not against you - considering you more as 'invisible'. Japanese often will tell you they feel the same if they have to move to another part of Japan where they meet new people and know nobody next to them.

Japan should however be seen not only from a negative side - it is still if you ask me by far the best country in Asia for working as a foreigner, it is really a safe place day and night wherever you go - it is a society where this annoying 'give me a tip' does not exist - where prices are regulated - where people are polite and cities are clean, good public transport within the cities, a place with good health care, etc.

However Japan is surely not a place where girls are running after you...

Yohan, this is fantastic insight, thanks so much! I will literally start my "Japan" notes folder with this post. As an Italian, I have a mostly positive image of Japan and, having been there twice as a tourist and to meet friends, I cannot but confirm all the positives and the few negatives.

As I said in another reply somewhere else, I wasn't impressed about the Japanese femdom. I found Japanese women unattractive. I give zero points to a girl who has to conceal all of her physical defects under make up and expensive clothes. Maybe it's just a matter of personal tastes...

I now understand that the Japanese immigration authorities wouldn't be very happy for me to bring an unmarried partner from the Philippines, even if I have secured an employment visa. We will see how this might play out when (if!) we cross that bridge. I wouldn't exclude the idea of my unmarried partner paying several visits, especially if she is from around Manila and Cebu. Air Asia and Cebu Pacific have very cheap flight to several Japanese major cities.

I actually feel discriminated even here in the Philippines. Having lived abroad for a long time I have kind of grown a thick skin about it. I just consider it a honest price to pay to have an experience in a foreign land.