The Weird Way People Treat Pets

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Pixel--Dude
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The Weird Way People Treat Pets

Post by Pixel--Dude »

I saw this article the other day and I thought it seemed weird as f**k! Can you guys tell me what you think to this? Is it just me that thinks this is weird?

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/20281731/ ... ental-rug/

Basically a family turned their pet into an ornamental rug. Isn't a pet supposed to be something you love? Can you imagine losing a family member and having their body skinned and turned into a rug? It's weird! Nobody would do that. Isn't a pet supposed to be a part of the family?

I mean, I can kind of understand taxidermy to a degree... kind of... I still think it's weird, but not necessarily as weird as having your dead pet skinned and used as a rug to walk on. Imagine walking on your dead pet. :| with taxidermy I suppose the owner feels like in a way their deceased pet is still with them in a sense. But having them turned into an ornamental rug says to me that they just saw their pet as something nice to look at every now and again. Maybe it's just me, but I think this is very strange.

Whilst I'm on the topic of pets and their treatment what do you guys think to the ethics of keeping animals as pets? Is it fundamentally wrong in some way? What about people who get pets and keep them in cages? People who keep dogs in cages really piss me off and shouldn't have that dog as a pet in my opinion.

@Outcast9428 I think out of everyone on the forum I haven't seen anyone who seems to be as compassionate towards animals as you. What do you think to the article I mentioned and the ethics of owning pets?

What about you, @Lucas88?
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MarcosZeitola
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Re: The Weird Way People Treat Pets

Post by MarcosZeitola »

Pets are the most perverse things about human culture. People buy a dog, they make a big deal how the dog is "their best friend" then have the dog castrated by a vet so he won't jump around and bark as much or hump a leg. Way to treat your best friend... with friends like that, who needs enemies? Girls will push little tiny dogs around in strollers or carry them around if if they are babies. Some people refer to their dogs, or cats, as their "furbabies". It's sickening.

I like a dog, a guard dog. He ought to stay outside. No excessive petting, no kissing the damn creature. Just let him be an "outside dog". With cats, do not even feed them... don't get them litter boxes and turn them into living stuffer toys; let them catch mice and kill their own food. Pets should only be held if one doesn't live in a city, in a more rural area, and they can roam around freely.

Also what's up with the overpriced pet food? Dogs and cats don't need to eat expensive fancy meats... just let them eat leftover human food. That's what they give pets in the Philippines and some of them live very long lives. People seem to forget an animal is an animal... they treat them as if they're one's offspring, which is a ridiculous notion and one of the biggest issues in modern culture. A pet can never replace an actual human child. To delude yourself into this is a preposterous feminist idea that needs to die already.
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Outcast9428
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Re: The Weird Way People Treat Pets

Post by Outcast9428 »

I agree that turning your pet into an ornamental rug feels seriously wrong to me. Like, you’re going to walk all over your former pet’s body? What the hell?

I don’t think there’s any problem with people keeping pets. Pets are much much happier being domesticated and living under the care of a good human then they are out in the wild. My dogs would never survive if they had to go out into the wild. Pets are good for kids too so they can learn to appreciate animal life, see how every animal is his or her own unique person just the same way as humans are and become more empathetic.
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Re: The Weird Way People Treat Pets

Post by Lucas88 »

Pixel--Dude wrote:
November 4th, 2022, 4:43 am
Whilst I'm on the topic of pets and their treatment what do you guys think to the ethics of keeping animals as pets? Is it fundamentally wrong in some way? What about people who get pets and keep them in cages? People who keep dogs in cages really piss me off and shouldn't have that dog as a pet in my opinion.

@Outcast9428 I think out of everyone on the forum I haven't seen anyone who seems to be as compassionate towards animals as you. What do you think to the article I mentioned and the ethics of owning pets?

What about you, @Lucas88?
Keeping a pet is a good thing is you look after the animal well and do things to raise its standard of life and increase its happiness. My family adopted a cat that had been abused by the neighbor and fled from its previous home. He was tremendously traumatized when we first found him, but we cared for him, fed him up and gave him loads of love and affection. Now he is absolutely thriving and rules the neighborhood as his own.

I'm opposed to keeping a pet when the animal isn't looked after properly or kept in a cage. People show me their pet birds locked up in a little cage and I just think that it's cruel. I'm even honest about what I think. I tell those people outright that I don't think that it's right to keep an animal in a cage like that and they just look at me as though I were crazy.

I have absolutely no respect for people who mistreat animals. I think that you can generally tell what kind a person somebody is by observing their attitudes towards animals.
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Pixel--Dude
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Re: The Weird Way People Treat Pets

Post by Pixel--Dude »

My view on this is more in alignment with @Lucas88 and @Outcast9428 I think pets can provide a lot of contribution to your home and family. Dogs for example make excellent companions. There's no being alive on the planet that is more grateful to see me when I get home other than my dog. It serves as a guard dog, in the sense that it will bark and alert us to anyone entering the property, but is also a loved addition to the family. My daughter spends hours playing with my dog, who is soppy as f**k and enjoys the attention she gives him lol.

I agree @Lucas88 that keeping a pet in a cage is abhorrent. I hate when I go to people's homes and see a small dog locked up in a cage. It pisses me off. My ex used to keep her puppy in a cage because her daughter didn't like the dog picking up her toys and things like that. In the end I made her sell the dog because that is no way for a dog to live.

Excellent point from @Outcast9428 regarding children and pets and this cultivating an appreciation and respect for animal life. I totally agree with this. But it also depends on how the parents treat the pets in front of their kids to set the example.

@MarcosZeitola I don't agree that pets are the most perverse thing about human culture. I would argue that people probably treat animals better than other human beings in some cases. Some people let a stray cat come into their home and adopt it as a pet, feed it and give it a home. How many people would do that for another human being?

But the neglect of homeless people isn't even the tip of the iceberg. It is disgusting how people treat each other in society. And I'm even including the likes of family members and so-called friends. I would say it is that social disconnect and solipsistic toxic individualism that is the most perverse thing in our society. Human beings are social creatures and we are being pushed into becoming more and more antisocial.

I do agree with you though about all the furbaby stuff! That shit is really annoying lol.
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Pixel--Dude
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Re: The Weird Way People Treat Pets

Post by Pixel--Dude »

I thought I'd share these, which I consider to be absolute gems. We know what some of the users here think of keeping pets. Now let's hear what the pets themselves think to their situation:

Sad Dog Diary.


Sad Cat Diary.


Pets In Isolation.


@Outcast9428
@Lucas88
@MarcosZeitola

:lol:
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Winston
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Re: The Weird Way People Treat Pets

Post by Winston »

MarcosZeitola wrote:
November 4th, 2022, 5:56 am
Pets are the most perverse things about human culture. People buy a dog, they make a big deal how the dog is "their best friend" then have the dog castrated by a vet so he won't jump around and bark as much or hump a leg. Way to treat your best friend... with friends like that, who needs enemies? Girls will push little tiny dogs around in strollers or carry them around if if they are babies. Some people refer to their dogs, or cats, as their "furbabies". It's sickening.

I like a dog, a guard dog. He ought to stay outside. No excessive petting, no kissing the damn creature. Just let him be an "outside dog". With cats, do not even feed them... don't get them litter boxes and turn them into living stuffer toys; let them catch mice and kill their own food. Pets should only be held if one doesn't live in a city, in a more rural area, and they can roam around freely.

Also what's up with the overpriced pet food? Dogs and cats don't need to eat expensive fancy meats... just let them eat leftover human food. That's what they give pets in the Philippines and some of them live very long lives. People seem to forget an animal is an animal... they treat them as if they're one's offspring, which is a ridiculous notion and one of the biggest issues in modern culture. A pet can never replace an actual human child. To delude yourself into this is a preposterous feminist idea that needs to die already.
For once I agree with you. Wow your views on pets are very different than most Westerners. I agree with you that pets should not be "fixed". That goes against nature and is cruel. But Americans love to control everything. I also don't get why people treat pets better than people. They should not take the place of human companionship. They don't fill the void for me. I don't understand why they fill some people's void. It's strange.

However, if you guys are traveling and not stable, you shouldn't get a pet anyway. Pets are for stable people, not for people moving or traveling abroad.
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Re: The Weird Way People Treat Pets

Post by MrMan »

MarcosZeitola wrote:
November 4th, 2022, 5:56 am
Pets are the most perverse things about human culture. People buy a dog, they make a big deal how the dog is "their best friend" then have the dog castrated by a vet so he won't jump around and bark as much or hump a leg. Way to treat your best friend... with friends like that, who needs enemies?
Good point? I wonder if they have dog vasectomies. That way your male dog can have some fun with the female dogs in the neighborhood without fear of infecting the neighbor's $7000 French bulldog with a mutt. Does mating knock the females out of commission.
Girls will push little tiny dogs around in strollers or carry them around if if they are babies. Some people refer to their dogs, or cats, as their "furbabies". It's sickening.
This is weird. If I were dating, and a dating profile had 'fur baby' it, that would be a negative. Even mentioning a pet in a dating profile would be. I wouldn't want to live in a house full of dog or cat hair.

We have ducks. I feed them and give them water. I take their eggs. My youngest goes out there, holds them, tells them they are cute. The older kids do that on occasion. But they leave eggs behind, not just poop. Their poop is also great fertilizer for the garden, they say.
I like a dog, a guard dog. He ought to stay outside. No excessive petting, no kissing the damn creature. Just let him be an "outside dog". With cats, do not even feed them... don't get them litter boxes and turn them into living stuffer toys; let them catch mice and kill their own food. Pets should only be held if one doesn't live in a city, in a more rural area, and they can roam around freely.
I'm not a child. Kids like pets. But I don't need to have my social needs met by an animal. I agree about dogs. I'd want one for a utilitarian function if I had one-- and outside or maybe in a dog house. I don't want him shedding on my furniture. And definitely no cats inside. If you have a barn full of grain, cats (or black snakes) can keep the rate population down. Some farmers feed the cats in the winter time so the tom cats won't kill each other off.
Also what's up with the overpriced pet food? Dogs and cats don't need to eat expensive fancy meats... just let them eat leftover human food. That's what they give pets in the Philippines and some of them live very long lives. People seem to forget an animal is an animal... they treat them as if they're one's offspring, which is a ridiculous notion and one of the biggest issues in modern culture. A pet can never replace an actual human child. To delude yourself into this is a preposterous feminist idea that needs to die already.
My grandmother used to feed the dog the table scraps and the rest was compost. We have a compost bucket. Since we started doing that, our big trash can by the road is rarely full.

I buy feed for the ducks because I get eggs every day and for the value of the eggs, it works out. But we dump compost outside and they can eat that if they want. I cut some bad-looking junk off some broccoli, had some old baked beans in the fridge and some left over apple wedges someone brought for a get-together. I put that out for the ducks last night. I had to chop the apples for them. But I eat their eggs, so it makes sense.

If I lived in a good place for it, I might not mind having goats, since I could eat their meat. We are supposed to pay a sheep farmer to own some sheep and to feed them. After we have a few of them, we could eat the one-year-olds. The problem is if the kids play with them, it makes it hard to eat them. My kids wouldn't want to eat our ducks.
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Re: The Weird Way People Treat Pets

Post by MarcosZeitola »

Winston wrote:
December 14th, 2022, 5:12 am
For once I agree with you. Wow your views on pets are very different than most Westerners. I agree with you that pets should not be "fixed". That goes against nature and is cruel. But Americans love to control everything. I also don't get why people treat pets better than people. They should not take the place of human companionship. They don't fill the void for me. I don't understand why they fill some people's void. It's strange.

However, if you guys are traveling and not stable, you shouldn't get a pet anyway. Pets are for stable people, not for people moving or traveling abroad.
I'm glad to see we're in agreement. Maybe we'll do another call sometimes man, I am sure we will be in agreement on quite a few things; I've changed my mind on quite a lot of subjects over the last few years. As for animals, I never liked them too much. I respect them and tend to be good to them, but I am just not a pet person and don't see myself ever owning a pet... Western people act like I'm some sort of sociopath when I say that. This whole "are you a dog person or a cat person?" question is kind of a huge deal to a lot of people, and saying you dislike the damn things just makes people raise their eyebrows and think of you as some sort of sociopath which is weird. :lol:

In a lot of ways I think I am MORE compassionate towards pets than those who claim to love them... because I realize animals ought to be free and wild, not (in)bred to be small and deformed and 'cute' for their owners enjoyment. The Filipino "askal" street dogs that more or less function as cats are the superior pet option: they eat leftovers of a family and just mind their own business. I like that. Nobody ever "walks" these things or cleans after them; they are animals, and treated accordingly.
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Re: The Weird Way People Treat Pets

Post by Outcast9428 »

No animal is happy being “wild and free.” There’s nothing liberating about shivering in the cold every night with no shelter, sweltering in the heat, not knowing where your next meal is coming from, having the threat of getting eaten alive by some predator any day. If my dogs wanted to be wild so badly they wouldn’t refuse to go outside when it’s raining. Nobody actually wants to be wild and free, there’s no actual benefit to living that way other then not having to abide by any rules. But all those rules start to seem really nice once people actually have to live without them.

Why do so many people seem to be anti civilization these days and harbor these weird fantasies about living a more barbaric life or returning to the law of the jungle? Just because we have trannies now? I will honestly take anything over the Ancient, barbaric past. The only thing I can think of being worse is full blown communism and I’m pretty sure everybody nowadays who glorifies the “wild and free” life would instantly beg to return to civilization if they had to actually live through the world they glorify.

Also conservatism is not compatible with this thought process. The entire point of conservative values was to civilize the world, give it structure and order. This is not conservative or traditional thinking, it’s more like downright primitive thinking.
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Re: The Weird Way People Treat Pets

Post by Pixel--Dude »

Outcast9428 wrote:
December 14th, 2022, 12:01 pm
No animal is happy being “wild and free.” There’s nothing liberating about shivering in the cold every night with no shelter, sweltering in the heat, not knowing where your next meal is coming from, having the threat of getting eaten alive by some predator any day. If my dogs wanted to be wild so badly they wouldn’t refuse to go outside when it’s raining. Nobody actually wants to be wild and free, there’s no actual benefit to living that way other then not having to abide by any rules. But all those rules start to seem really nice once people actually have to live without them.

Why do so many people seem to be anti civilization these days and harbor these weird fantasies about living a more barbaric life or returning to the law of the jungle? Just because we have trannies now? I will honestly take anything over the Ancient, barbaric past. The only thing I can think of being worse is full blown communism and I’m pretty sure everybody nowadays who glorifies the “wild and free” life would instantly beg to return to civilization if they had to actually live through the world they glorify.

Also conservatism is not compatible with this thought process. The entire point of conservative values was to civilize the world, give it structure and order. This is not conservative or traditional thinking, it’s more like downright primitive thinking.
What are you talking about? Why have you segwayed the conversation into another rant about conservatism? This is a discussion about pets and pet ownership. For one, animals don't think the same way human beings do. They are primitive and operate on biological impulses like the imperative to survive. Animals love freedom. Why wouldn't they? When is a dog happier than when it's bounding across a field? Everything loves freedom. It's a good value to have and should be respected.

I disagree with @Winston and @MarcosZeitola. Kind of for the reason you mentioned before you inexorably started ranting hysterically about everyone being degenerate barbarians. Pets provide companionship. They are loyal and loving. I don't buy into the shit that animals don't feel emotion.

If a pet had a choice would it choose to be a stray or locked in a cage all day? Animals get everything they need in a family home. Their basic instinct is to survive. They are proficient at it. But obviously a pet wants shelter when it rains, so they will not willingly go outside.

Personally, I see no problem with showing a pet affection, or even owning a pet so long as the pet is treated with love and respect. When I get home from work there is not a single being alive on this planet that is more happy to see me walk into a room than my dog.
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Re: The Weird Way People Treat Pets

Post by Outcast9428 »

Pixel--Dude wrote:
December 14th, 2022, 12:34 pm
Outcast9428 wrote:
December 14th, 2022, 12:01 pm
No animal is happy being “wild and free.” There’s nothing liberating about shivering in the cold every night with no shelter, sweltering in the heat, not knowing where your next meal is coming from, having the threat of getting eaten alive by some predator any day. If my dogs wanted to be wild so badly they wouldn’t refuse to go outside when it’s raining. Nobody actually wants to be wild and free, there’s no actual benefit to living that way other then not having to abide by any rules. But all those rules start to seem really nice once people actually have to live without them.

Why do so many people seem to be anti civilization these days and harbor these weird fantasies about living a more barbaric life or returning to the law of the jungle? Just because we have trannies now? I will honestly take anything over the Ancient, barbaric past. The only thing I can think of being worse is full blown communism and I’m pretty sure everybody nowadays who glorifies the “wild and free” life would instantly beg to return to civilization if they had to actually live through the world they glorify.

Also conservatism is not compatible with this thought process. The entire point of conservative values was to civilize the world, give it structure and order. This is not conservative or traditional thinking, it’s more like downright primitive thinking.
What are you talking about? Why have you segwayed the conversation into another rant about conservatism? This is a discussion about pets and pet ownership. For one, animals don't think the same way human beings do. They are primitive and operate on biological impulses like the imperative to survive. Animals love freedom. Why wouldn't they? When is a dog happier than when it's bounding across a field? Everything loves freedom. It's a good value to have and should be respected.

I disagree with @Winston and @MarcosZeitola. Kind of for the reason you mentioned before you inexorably started ranting hysterically about everyone being degenerate barbarians. Pets provide companionship. They are loyal and loving. I don't buy into the shit that animals don't feel emotion.

If a pet had a choice would it choose to be a stray or locked in a cage all day? Animals get everything they need in a family home. Their basic instinct is to survive. They are proficient at it. But obviously a pet wants shelter when it rains, so they will not willingly go outside.

Personally, I see no problem with showing a pet affection, or even owning a pet so long as the pet is treated with love and respect. When I get home from work there is not a single being alive on this planet that is more happy to see me walk into a room than my dog.
They like having a backyard to roam around in which my dogs have but that’s not the same as being wild and roaming wherever you want. Dogs need us, they wouldn’t be living the same kind of lives without us.

What a lot of people call freedom just looks like chaos and uncertainty to me.
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Re: The Weird Way People Treat Pets

Post by Tsar »

Outcast9428 wrote:
December 14th, 2022, 1:09 pm
Pixel--Dude wrote:
December 14th, 2022, 12:34 pm
Outcast9428 wrote:
December 14th, 2022, 12:01 pm
No animal is happy being “wild and free.” There’s nothing liberating about shivering in the cold every night with no shelter, sweltering in the heat, not knowing where your next meal is coming from, having the threat of getting eaten alive by some predator any day. If my dogs wanted to be wild so badly they wouldn’t refuse to go outside when it’s raining. Nobody actually wants to be wild and free, there’s no actual benefit to living that way other then not having to abide by any rules. But all those rules start to seem really nice once people actually have to live without them.

Why do so many people seem to be anti civilization these days and harbor these weird fantasies about living a more barbaric life or returning to the law of the jungle? Just because we have trannies now? I will honestly take anything over the Ancient, barbaric past. The only thing I can think of being worse is full blown communism and I’m pretty sure everybody nowadays who glorifies the “wild and free” life would instantly beg to return to civilization if they had to actually live through the world they glorify.

Also conservatism is not compatible with this thought process. The entire point of conservative values was to civilize the world, give it structure and order. This is not conservative or traditional thinking, it’s more like downright primitive thinking.
What are you talking about? Why have you segwayed the conversation into another rant about conservatism? This is a discussion about pets and pet ownership. For one, animals don't think the same way human beings do. They are primitive and operate on biological impulses like the imperative to survive. Animals love freedom. Why wouldn't they? When is a dog happier than when it's bounding across a field? Everything loves freedom. It's a good value to have and should be respected.

I disagree with @Winston and @MarcosZeitola. Kind of for the reason you mentioned before you inexorably started ranting hysterically about everyone being degenerate barbarians. Pets provide companionship. They are loyal and loving. I don't buy into the shit that animals don't feel emotion.

If a pet had a choice would it choose to be a stray or locked in a cage all day? Animals get everything they need in a family home. Their basic instinct is to survive. They are proficient at it. But obviously a pet wants shelter when it rains, so they will not willingly go outside.

Personally, I see no problem with showing a pet affection, or even owning a pet so long as the pet is treated with love and respect. When I get home from work there is not a single being alive on this planet that is more happy to see me walk into a room than my dog.
They like having a backyard to roam around in which my dogs have but that’s not the same as being wild and roaming wherever you want. Dogs need us, they wouldn’t be living the same kind of lives without us.

What a lot of people call freedom just looks like chaos and uncertainty to me.
I have to agree somewhat with @Outcast9428 that domesticated dogs aren't the same as wild or undomesticated dogs. Domesticated dogs can become feral but that's not their ideal environment.

@Pixel--Dude However, most animals will be happier and live more fulfilling lives in the wild because of their freedom.

Many animals will also be healthier because of their exercise and being in nature.

Some animals will live longer in captivity and look more beautiful and be protected. But there's some animals that are very difficult or nearly impossible to breed in captivity. That's because the wild is more of their home. If a wild animal is raised in captivity from the time it's a baby, it won't know how to survive on its own or not as well. That's why there's involvement with preparing animals born in captivity for potential release into the wild if that's their purpose.
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Pixel--Dude
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Re: The Weird Way People Treat Pets

Post by Pixel--Dude »

Outcast9428 wrote:
December 14th, 2022, 1:09 pm
Pixel--Dude wrote:
December 14th, 2022, 12:34 pm
Outcast9428 wrote:
December 14th, 2022, 12:01 pm
No animal is happy being “wild and free.” There’s nothing liberating about shivering in the cold every night with no shelter, sweltering in the heat, not knowing where your next meal is coming from, having the threat of getting eaten alive by some predator any day. If my dogs wanted to be wild so badly they wouldn’t refuse to go outside when it’s raining. Nobody actually wants to be wild and free, there’s no actual benefit to living that way other then not having to abide by any rules. But all those rules start to seem really nice once people actually have to live without them.

Why do so many people seem to be anti civilization these days and harbor these weird fantasies about living a more barbaric life or returning to the law of the jungle? Just because we have trannies now? I will honestly take anything over the Ancient, barbaric past. The only thing I can think of being worse is full blown communism and I’m pretty sure everybody nowadays who glorifies the “wild and free” life would instantly beg to return to civilization if they had to actually live through the world they glorify.

Also conservatism is not compatible with this thought process. The entire point of conservative values was to civilize the world, give it structure and order. This is not conservative or traditional thinking, it’s more like downright primitive thinking.
What are you talking about? Why have you segwayed the conversation into another rant about conservatism? This is a discussion about pets and pet ownership. For one, animals don't think the same way human beings do. They are primitive and operate on biological impulses like the imperative to survive. Animals love freedom. Why wouldn't they? When is a dog happier than when it's bounding across a field? Everything loves freedom. It's a good value to have and should be respected.

I disagree with @Winston and @MarcosZeitola. Kind of for the reason you mentioned before you inexorably started ranting hysterically about everyone being degenerate barbarians. Pets provide companionship. They are loyal and loving. I don't buy into the shit that animals don't feel emotion.

If a pet had a choice would it choose to be a stray or locked in a cage all day? Animals get everything they need in a family home. Their basic instinct is to survive. They are proficient at it. But obviously a pet wants shelter when it rains, so they will not willingly go outside.

Personally, I see no problem with showing a pet affection, or even owning a pet so long as the pet is treated with love and respect. When I get home from work there is not a single being alive on this planet that is more happy to see me walk into a room than my dog.
They like having a backyard to roam around in which my dogs have but that’s not the same as being wild and roaming wherever you want. Dogs need us, they wouldn’t be living the same kind of lives without us.

What a lot of people call freedom just looks like chaos and uncertainty to me.
There is a difference between true authentic freedom and destitution. I don't consider destitution as being free such as being homeless for example. But living in a commune or a tribe in the jungle, they have authentic freedom even though their lives are harder than ours. We have more comforts, but relatively less freedom.

Same with dogs, or wolves as an example, living in their natural habitat as part of a pack. Their lives are harder but when you see them on documentaries and whatnot they aren't starving bags of bones. They are healthy. They have authentic freedom, but less comforts.

Pet dogs living in a house also have freedom, most of the time. But relatively less because they can't leave the house when they want etc. They live nice lives of comfort and in exchange provide security. Of course, dogs can become strays and they're almost always skinny bags of bones hunting for scraps. That isn't any kind of freedom, that's destitution.

With humans it's more complex. We aren't dogs or pets and our needs and desires are much more complex than that of a pet. Freedom is still a major part of human happiness. Something we don't have too much of in the current system, or we have an illusion of it. With most people the choice is to either play the game, or face destitution. And destitution isn't any kind of authentic freedom. There is a difference between freedom and destitution, but it seems like you are conflating the two.
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Pixel--Dude
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Re: The Weird Way People Treat Pets

Post by Pixel--Dude »

Tsar wrote:
December 14th, 2022, 1:49 pm
Outcast9428 wrote:
December 14th, 2022, 1:09 pm
Pixel--Dude wrote:
December 14th, 2022, 12:34 pm
Outcast9428 wrote:
December 14th, 2022, 12:01 pm
No animal is happy being “wild and free.” There’s nothing liberating about shivering in the cold every night with no shelter, sweltering in the heat, not knowing where your next meal is coming from, having the threat of getting eaten alive by some predator any day. If my dogs wanted to be wild so badly they wouldn’t refuse to go outside when it’s raining. Nobody actually wants to be wild and free, there’s no actual benefit to living that way other then not having to abide by any rules. But all those rules start to seem really nice once people actually have to live without them.

Why do so many people seem to be anti civilization these days and harbor these weird fantasies about living a more barbaric life or returning to the law of the jungle? Just because we have trannies now? I will honestly take anything over the Ancient, barbaric past. The only thing I can think of being worse is full blown communism and I’m pretty sure everybody nowadays who glorifies the “wild and free” life would instantly beg to return to civilization if they had to actually live through the world they glorify.

Also conservatism is not compatible with this thought process. The entire point of conservative values was to civilize the world, give it structure and order. This is not conservative or traditional thinking, it’s more like downright primitive thinking.
What are you talking about? Why have you segwayed the conversation into another rant about conservatism? This is a discussion about pets and pet ownership. For one, animals don't think the same way human beings do. They are primitive and operate on biological impulses like the imperative to survive. Animals love freedom. Why wouldn't they? When is a dog happier than when it's bounding across a field? Everything loves freedom. It's a good value to have and should be respected.

I disagree with @Winston and @MarcosZeitola. Kind of for the reason you mentioned before you inexorably started ranting hysterically about everyone being degenerate barbarians. Pets provide companionship. They are loyal and loving. I don't buy into the shit that animals don't feel emotion.

If a pet had a choice would it choose to be a stray or locked in a cage all day? Animals get everything they need in a family home. Their basic instinct is to survive. They are proficient at it. But obviously a pet wants shelter when it rains, so they will not willingly go outside.

Personally, I see no problem with showing a pet affection, or even owning a pet so long as the pet is treated with love and respect. When I get home from work there is not a single being alive on this planet that is more happy to see me walk into a room than my dog.
They like having a backyard to roam around in which my dogs have but that’s not the same as being wild and roaming wherever you want. Dogs need us, they wouldn’t be living the same kind of lives without us.

What a lot of people call freedom just looks like chaos and uncertainty to me.
I have to agree somewhat with @Outcast9428 that domesticated dogs aren't the same as wild or undomesticated dogs. Domesticated dogs can become feral but that's not their ideal environment.

@Pixel--Dude However, most animals will be happier and live more fulfilling lives in the wild because of their freedom.

Many animals will also be healthier because of their exercise and being in nature.

Some animals will live longer in captivity and look more beautiful and be protected. But there's some animals that are very difficult or nearly impossible to breed in captivity. That's because the wild is more of their home. If a wild animal is raised in captivity from the time it's a baby, it won't know how to survive on its own or not as well. That's why there's involvement with preparing animals born in captivity for potential release into the wild if that's their purpose.
Yes I know some animals will not survive in captivity. I think they stopped trying to keep great whites in captivity because they killed themselves. Apparently they ram into the side of their enclosure and eventually kill themselves.

Domestic dogs are either pets or destitute. No domestic dogs enjoy being free and living back in the wild. In fact I'm not sure they'd survive as efficiently as say a pack of wolves. Domestic dogs are happy when they live with decent owners. They see their owners as the leader of the pack.

Cats are pretty much the same. Domestic cats have the freedom to roam their neighbourhoods and then return home when they've had enough. They also love their owners and I think see them as family. People usually misinterpret cats bringing a mouse home as it being some kind of gift, when in actual fact they're trying to teach their owners how to hunt. They think "I've never seen you bring anything home. I'll f***ing teach you how to hunt!" That's how they teach kittens how to hunt. First by bringing home dead creatures, then by bringing home partially alive creatures, and finally by taking the kitten out with them.

@MarcosZeitola argues that we shouldn't be domesticating wild animals anyway. But I don't see why not. These animals (in most cases) are well looked after and serve not only the purpose of companionship in a society which is characterised by alienation and social disconnect, but practical purposes as well such as cats being effective hunters of rodents and dogs being guardians of your property.

I think it's a good thing that we've domesticated these animals and provide them with love and comfort in exchange for the companionship and loyalty they offer in return.

I still think animals and their natural habitats should be respected and preserved as much as possible. I love animals and I do think they are capable of emotions such as love and fear etc. This is mainly why I don't eat meat. I no longer wanted to contribute to the suffering of animals.
You are free to make any decision you desire, but you are not free from the consequences of those decisions.
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