Could Covid-19 be a scam or hoax? Does anyone know anyone who has it?

[Moretorque]

The bailouts and the bailouts that have taken place in the past are no conspiracy theory. That is legalized counterfeiting for the rich and their friends and theft from the rest of the masses of humanity.

The rich want a strong economy ? why would they care if they can loot it with counterfeiting ? and do no work and steal all property and resources ? This is the biggest con in history taking place in front of our eyes and what amazes me is how easily they get away with it. They really did figure long ago most people really are out of it.. You don't blame them as far as I am concerned, their point has been made loud and clear..

[Moretorque]

You know the thing that gets me about what is going on in the world today politically is don't people want to know who we owe all this money to ? I mean I was like when I went on the net and saying to myself who do we owe our national debt to so I typed in federal deficeit and it all and I mean all came right out. I takes you to the all seeing eye on top of the pyramid.

I do not get how people can be sooo dumb..... I didn't even have to look for it, it all just jumped out of the computer with those simple words done on a search. The Covid is just more of their BS is all period end of story....

Countries don't try to ruin their economies. The rich get richer when there is a strong economy.

This might be an exception. You could think of it as a controlled demolition of a structure that was going to collapse anyway. To put it another way, the system was unsustainable, so the elite want to make sure that they are still in charge of what comes next. In the short term, that have managed to destroy lots of small businesses in favour of large corporations.

This is world wide communism going up, they want us all working under their corporate umbrella they have erected.... You will find the same people own controlling stocks in all those corps.... This will be enforced at gun point throughout the world..

[Cornfed]

No. The purposeful inflation is an American thing that spread throughout the West as a consequence.

Other countries' governments overreact out of fear for being charged with not doing enough to protect their populations, not out of some Illuminati conspiracy to impose totalitarianism or to enrich elites.

I can only hope you’re wrong. The thought that governments all over the world wilfully destroyed their own economies for such an absurdly frivolous reason is just appalling. If would be much less discouraging if they did it because they were following orders to carry out some nefarious genocidal plan of the global elite. At least that would be serving some purpose for someone. BTW, the epidemiology (that's the word you meant to use, right?) of cold viruses is fairly well known.

[Cornfed]

The rich want a strong economy ? why would they care if they can loot it with counterfeiting ? and do no work and steal all property and resources ?

Yeah, once property is consolidated then the usual economic rules don’t apply. You don’t need customers if you already own the world, and you only need a certain number of servants. The rest are just useless eaters to be culled, which is what we are seeing now.

[Moretorque]

The Communal Dictatorship..

[Winston]

If your friend lied to you, you would not believe him or her anymore. His or her credibility would be gone. So why is it that when government lies, people still believe everything it says? Isn't that odd? Isn't that proof of mind control?

The reason the people believe what the government says is because they want to believe the government protects them, like their parents did when we were children. So if you don't believe that Covid-19 is deadly, why don't you fly back to Las Vegas and then hangout at the casinos for a week. Covid-19 is SARS. Wasn't SARS deadly?

Do you really believe all your conspiracy theories, or is it that you just enjoy arguing and the attention you get?

Yes, I know people in NYC that have had it. A friend knows someone in NJ who on a respirator. Friends know people in Florida that have had it, a family. They are very sick.

Yes I agree that's why people tend to believe their government. Except in the Philippines where no one trusts their government. lol. Another reason is that people are hardwired to obey hierarchy and authority too.

I cannot go to Vegas casinos. They are closed. If they were open, I'd be glad to go. I have a strong immune system. Haven't been sick in years. If I got Covid19, I'm sure I'd be ok. Just like Tom Hanks was ok.

Yes SARS was deadly. But the authorities claim that COVID19 is more deadly and infectious than SARS was.

I believe that some conspiracies are real and known as conspiracy facts, as Jim Marrs put it. Not just theories. As to this pandemic, I don't know. That's why I asked. Someone told me that no one knows anyone who has it, that it's all on TV. I don't know anyone who has it. And my intuition feels there's something off about this, like something's not right. Like there's something rotten in the state of Denmark. Like when Spiderman senses there's something off with his Spidey Sense. That's why I'm asking.

You know that governments lie and cover up stuff and commit crimes in secret. We all know that. Even you and CE do, even though you deny it, deep down you know it's true. Do you know about MK-ULTRA and the public apology that Bill Clinton gave about it after it was leaked into the public and many people were hurt by it?

In other thread, I also totally destroyed and atomized CE by flooding him with lots of conspiracy proof that he asked for. He ran away in fear and terror like a chicken. He could not handle it. So he went into denial and ignored all my posts. Totally destroyed. Total victory in that debate. (hands in the air) Even if CE denies it, he knows deep down I totally destroyed him and overwhelmed him with proof that he could not deny, so he ran away and pretended the whole thread didn't happen. Seriously. No joke.

So yes conspiracies do exist. We all know that. Let me ask you something WorldTraveler: How do you know when government is lying and when it's telling the truth? What's your barometer? I keep asking this to conspiracy deniers, but they never reply or tell me.

Do you personally know anyone who has COVID19? I mean their names and you've met them? Or is it all second hand info?

[Cornfed]

No. The purposeful inflation is an American thing that spread throughout the West as a consequence.

Other countries' governments overreact out of fear for being charged with not doing enough to protect their populations, not out of some Illuminati conspiracy to impose totalitarianism or to enrich elites.

I can only hope you’re wrong. The thought that governments all over the world wilfully destroyed their own economies for such an absurdly frivolous reason is just appalling. If would be much less discouraging if they did it because they were following orders to carry out some nefarious genocidal plan of the global elite. At least that would be serving some purpose for someone. BTW, the epidemiology (that's the word you meant to use, right?) of cold viruses is fairly well known.

To expand on this, we have two views of the covid insanity - CE’s and mine. These seem to be:

CE’s view:
The Democrats in the US chose to commit the greatest act of economic sabotage in the history in the world in the hopes that it might make Trump look bad and cause their vegetative candidate to win the election. All officials of both parties, from the top to the bottom, including Trump himself, went along with this.

Most world leaders responded by thinking “Well, what the Americans are doing is hysterical/cynical economic destruction over the common cold and designed to defeat Trump in the election, but if I don’t do it too the media might take some footage of some old crone dying of a cold in a nursing home and say it’s my fault, so I’ll have to ruin my country’s economy, put millions of people out of work, run up billions of dollars in debt etc. on that basis. Once again, every level of officials went along with this.

My view:
The world is a top down hierarchy effectively run by a small group of people. Those people decided they needed the covid lockdowns to pull off a particular agenda, just like they have pushed all manner of global agendas in the past. The people lower down in this hierarchy are conditioned to go along with it. This is a “conspiracy” in that the people at the top don’t always reveal who they are and what position they hold and don’t always confide what they are doing to their underlings.

*******
Now ponder this. Which view is more implausible, dystopian and conspiratorial?

[Winston]

Another interesting question. If COVID19 is a hoax, how come in Brazil, where the leaders have chosen to ignore the pandemic and act like nothing is happening, the numbers of infected is skyrocketing? Is that something CNN made up? Or are those stats from Brazil? If Brazil chose to ignore the coronavirus then why would it admit that their cases are skyrocketing? Wouldn't they choose to ignore that too? Or is this something the US media made up?

Remember the US media often lies. It even lied when it said Hitler wanted to take over the world in the 1940s with their "Why We Fight" series when in fact no one in Germany agreed with that and said that that was pure fiction invented by Hollywood. So yes, American media has lied a lot in the past. So how do you know when they are honest and when they are not? Why is every conspiracy denier on this forum dodging this crucial question? That's dishonest. At least admit you don't know, not pretend you didn't see the question.

[WorldTraveler]

If your friend lied to you, you would not believe him or her anymore. His or her credibility would be gone. So why is it that when government lies, people still believe everything it says? Isn't that odd? Isn't that proof of mind control?

The reason the people believe what the government says is because they want to believe the government protects them, like their parents did when we were children. So if you don't believe that Covid-19 is deadly, why don't you fly back to Las Vegas and then hangout at the casinos for a week. Covid-19 is SARS. Wasn't SARS deadly?

Do you really believe all your conspiracy theories, or is it that you just enjoy arguing and the attention you get?

Yes, I know people in NYC that have had it. A friend knows someone in NJ who on a respirator. Friends know people in Florida that have had it, a family. They are very sick.

Yes I agree that's why people tend to believe their government. Except in the Philippines where no one trusts their government. lol. Another reason is that people are hardwired to obey hierarchy and authority too.

I cannot go to Vegas casinos. They are closed. If they were open, I'd be glad to go. I have a strong immune system. Haven't been sick in years. If I got Covid19, I'm sure I'd be ok. Just like Tom Hanks was ok.

Yes SARS was deadly. But the authorities claim that COVID19 is more deadly and infectious than SARS was.

I believe that some conspiracies are real and known as conspiracy facts, as Jim Marrs put it. Not just theories. As to this pandemic, I don't know. That's why I asked. Someone told me that no one knows anyone who has it, that it's all on TV. I don't know anyone who has it. And my intuition feels there's something off about this, like something's not right. Like there's something rotten in the state of Denmark. Like when Spiderman senses there's something off with his Spidey Sense. That's why I'm asking.

You know that governments lie and cover up stuff and commit crimes in secret. We all know that. Even you and CE do, even though you deny it, deep down you know it's true. Do you know about MK-ULTRA and the public apology that Bill Clinton gave about it after it was leaked into the public and many people were hurt by it?

In other thread, I also totally destroyed and atomized CE by flooding him with lots of conspiracy proof that he asked for. He ran away in fear and terror like a chicken. He could not handle it. So he went into denial and ignored all my posts. Totally destroyed. Total victory in that debate. (hands in the air) Even if CE denies it, he knows deep down I totally destroyed him and overwhelmed him with proof that he could not deny, so he ran away and pretended the whole thread didn't happen. Seriously. No joke.

So yes conspiracies do exist. We all know that. Let me ask you something WorldTraveler: How do you know when government is lying and when it's telling the truth? What's your barometer? I keep asking this to conspiracy deniers, but they never reply or tell me.

Do you personally know anyone who has COVID19? I mean their names and you've met them? Or is it all second hand info?

Winston, the Las Vegas Casinos are open. Just look online and you can see or just watch Las Vegas news on the internet. You said you are in good health, so come and live fun life anytime you want.

I have told you many times that I believe in conspiracies. I believe our government sugar coats what they are doing on many things. I've believed this for a long time. I read John Pilger's "New Rulers of the World" back in 2001. I've told you to read the "Shock Doctrine" by Naomi Klein. Have you read it? I first got interested in the Kennedy assassination back in the early 1970s, when Dick Gregory showed the Zapruder film on national television. Did you ever watch "Oliver Stone's Untold History of the United States?" I don't like David Icke. I pick and chose which conspiracies are real. I have no interest in debating with you or any other avid conspiracy person about them. I have other interests.

You asked why does Brazil have so many deaths from Covid-19 and maybe it's a conspiracy by the US news media. The reason they have so many deaths is that they are a second world country and they are testing a large number of people and recording a large number of death. There are massive cemeteries being built to bury the dead. Watch BBC. The bigger question is why do other countries have so few deaths. I'd say there are two reasons. 1) Efficient serious response to the Coronavirus. This includes, China, Japan, Korea, New Zealand and many European countries. 2) Under reporting of cases and deaths - many countries like Russia fall into this category. Most countries that are not testing much, so therefore don't record a person as having died of the Covid-19.

They did a study of SARS patients that lived over the next 10 years of their lives. Almost all had health issues long after "beating" SARS. Their lives were substantially diminished. Again, I stress to all you none believes, go be the guinea pigs for Covid-19. We need many people that have had it so we can do thorough studies of the long term effects of Covid-19. I am a believer in Covid-19 and will stay on the cautious side and not participate in this study.

[WorldTraveler]

Watch this. 30 Year Old Dead after attending Covid-19 Party

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nat ... 422175002/

[flowerthief00]

@flowerthief00
Those are valid points. However consider that:

1. Dr. Andrew Kaufman is a microbiologist and explained in his video presentation why Covid19 was never isolated or cultured. But of course his video was censored and banned. Did you see it before it was taken down? It was highly scientific. He was qualified in virology. Not a layman.

When I did a little digging on this person it was unclear whether even has the microbiology credentials claimed. He seems to have psychiatrist credentials. (Here is a Quora thread of members trying to figure out who this guy is)

Now, his ideas are interesting and I don't have the technical knowledge to determine on my own whether he is right or wrong, but given that plenty of other people (whose credentials are not in dispute) disagree with him, I would turn the question back on you. Why choose to believe this one maverick over all the other expert voices telling you he is dead wrong?

4. Since the 1960s we've all known that the government lies repeatedly about many things and has commit many crimes, both domestically and overseas. So isn't a government that lies and has committed conspiracies many times since the 1960s and prior too, capable of anything? How would u know what to believe anymore? How do you know when government is lying and when its telling the truth? Do you have a barometer to test when its lying and when its not? Or is government God and therefore always right and honest, even when it lies and covers up stuff? Remember the US government has been lying about the JFK assassination to this day even. Everyone knows that. And more people realize that they lied about 9/11 too. So if they have no credibility and have been proven to lie then how do you know what to believe?

If your friend lied to you, you would not believe him or her anymore. His or her credibility would be gone. So why is it that when government lies, people still believe everything it says? Isn't that odd? Isn't that proof of mind control?

I have not said, nor has any skeptic I've ever heard said that the government never lies. Neither do I assume them to always be lying. The government is not comprised of a single person.

Ideally we try to reach conclusions based on the evidence for and against a given claim. But since time is finite and we can't afford to study extensively every wild theory conspiracists throw at us on our own, we do take shortcuts such as trusting experts in specific fields. Sorry but I don't have time to be an expert on everything.

9/11 conspiracists said, "those buildings couldn't have come down without help!" (controlled demolitions or what have you)
Engineers and others who know what they're talking about said, "um, yes they could." That was enough for me. I don't have time to become an expert on structural engineering so I took the shortcut of believing the experts who had already studied the matter and concluded that the conspiracy theory was full of crap.

And this has happened enough times that I take a skeptical stance by default whenever someone presents a new conspiracy theory, while leaving open the door a crack that it might turn out to be true if/when the evidence comes down hard enough for it. (as it did with MKUltra)

*Most* conspiracy theories are probably full of crap, as I find time and again that those concocting them are not the most credible of people, while their adherents (and sometimes the originators themselves) always seem to be trying to explain one conspiracy theory by referencing another. "Theory A is true because of Theory B" is not compelling when we were never convinced of Theory B.

[flowerthief00]

No. The purposeful inflation is an American thing that spread throughout the West as a consequence.

Other countries' governments overreact out of fear for being charged with not doing enough to protect their populations, not out of some Illuminati conspiracy to impose totalitarianism or to enrich elites.

I can only hope you’re wrong. The thought that governments all over the world wilfully destroyed their own economies for such an absurdly frivolous reason is just appalling. If would be much less discouraging if they did it because they were following orders to carry out some nefarious genocidal plan of the global elite. At least that would be serving some purpose for someone. BTW, the epidemiology (that's the word you meant to use, right?) of cold viruses is fairly well known.

You also have to consider that the Left controls major institutions in the West. The news media, education, entertainment, big tech. The news media especially is key. People all over the world who read Western news get a slanted view of things.

If it were the Right that controlled those institutions we might be seeing the Right pulling off such shenanigans instead, but the Right cannot get away with as much as the Left can.

[Moretorque]

No. The purposeful inflation is an American thing that spread throughout the West as a consequence.

Other countries' governments overreact out of fear for being charged with not doing enough to protect their populations, not out of some Illuminati conspiracy to impose totalitarianism or to enrich elites.

I can only hope you’re wrong. The thought that governments all over the world wilfully destroyed their own economies for such an absurdly frivolous reason is just appalling. If would be much less discouraging if they did it because they were following orders to carry out some nefarious genocidal plan of the global elite. At least that would be serving some purpose for someone. BTW, the epidemiology (that's the word you meant to use, right?) of cold viruses is fairly well known.

To expand on this, we have two views of the covid insanity - CE’s and mine. These seem to be:

CE’s view:
The Democrats in the US chose to commit the greatest act of economic sabotage in the history in the world in the hopes that it might make Trump look bad and cause their vegetative candidate to win the election. All officials of both parties, from the top to the bottom, including Trump himself, went along with this.

Most world leaders responded by thinking “Well, what the Americans are doing is hysterical/cynical economic destruction over the common cold and designed to defeat Trump in the election, but if I don’t do it too the media might take some footage of some old crone dying of a cold in a nursing home and say it’s my fault, so I’ll have to ruin my country’s economy, put millions of people out of work, run up billions of dollars in debt etc. on that basis. Once again, every level of officials went along with this.

My view:
The world is a top down hierarchy effectively run by a small group of people. Those people decided they needed the covid lockdowns to pull off a particular agenda, just like they have pushed all manner of global agendas in the past. The people lower down in this hierarchy are conditioned to go along with it. This is a “conspiracy” in that the people at the top don’t always reveal who they are and what position they hold and don’t always confide what they are doing to their underlings.

*******
Now ponder this. Which view is more implausible, dystopian and conspiratorial?

Do we not have all the central banks acting in concert with one another issueing credit ? On top of that there are trillions upon trillions we know of being doled out under the table to the select groups. Do the hospitals not get an extra 39,000 $ for a covid patient ? .

[Contrarian Expatriate]

No. The purposeful inflation is an American thing that spread throughout the West as a consequence.

Other countries' governments overreact out of fear for being charged with not doing enough to protect their populations, not out of some Illuminati conspiracy to impose totalitarianism or to enrich elites.

I can only hope you’re wrong. The thought that governments all over the world wilfully destroyed their own economies for such an absurdly frivolous reason is just appalling. If would be much less discouraging if they did it because they were following orders to carry out some nefarious genocidal plan of the global elite. At least that would be serving some purpose for someone. BTW, the epidemiology (that's the word you meant to use, right?) of cold viruses is fairly well known.

To expand on this, we have two views of the covid insanity - CE’s and mine. These seem to be:

CE’s view:
The Democrats in the US chose to commit the greatest act of economic sabotage in the history in the world in the hopes that it might make Trump look bad and cause their vegetative candidate to win the election. All officials of both parties, from the top to the bottom, including Trump himself, went along with this.

Most world leaders responded by thinking “Well, what the Americans are doing is hysterical/cynical economic destruction over the common cold and designed to defeat Trump in the election, but if I don’t do it too the media might take some footage of some old crone dying of a cold in a nursing home and say it’s my fault, so I’ll have to ruin my country’s economy, put millions of people out of work, run up billions of dollars in debt etc. on that basis. Once again, every level of officials went along with this.

That’s a relatively decent summary of my take, but I don’t see it as a Democratic Party decision; it goes beyond that. I see it as anti-Trump sentiment decision as that includes Leftists, Hollywood, mainstream media, the press, deep state officials still in government, and anti-Trump Republicans too. That is a collection of forces far beyond just Democrats.

Also, the anti-Trump forces did not commit economic sabotage per se, they purposely stirred up fear, terror, and chaos that resulted in mass hysteria which resulted in the economic lockdowns. Since American news outlets are 24 hours and global now, this cascaded into global mass hysteria with pressure on other governments to do the same.

[Moretorque]

No. The purposeful inflation is an American thing that spread throughout the West as a consequence.

Other countries' governments overreact out of fear for being charged with not doing enough to protect their populations, not out of some Illuminati conspiracy to impose totalitarianism or to enrich elites.

I can only hope you’re wrong. The thought that governments all over the world wilfully destroyed their own economies for such an absurdly frivolous reason is just appalling. If would be much less discouraging if they did it because they were following orders to carry out some nefarious genocidal plan of the global elite. At least that would be serving some purpose for someone. BTW, the epidemiology (that's the word you meant to use, right?) of cold viruses is fairly well known.

To expand on this, we have two views of the covid insanity - CE’s and mine. These seem to be:

CE’s view:
The Democrats in the US chose to commit the greatest act of economic sabotage in the history in the world in the hopes that it might make Trump look bad and cause their vegetative candidate to win the election. All officials of both parties, from the top to the bottom, including Trump himself, went along with this.

Most world leaders responded by thinking “Well, what the Americans are doing is hysterical/cynical economic destruction over the common cold and designed to defeat Trump in the election, but if I don’t do it too the media might take some footage of some old crone dying of a cold in a nursing home and say it’s my fault, so I’ll have to ruin my country’s economy, put millions of people out of work, run up billions of dollars in debt etc. on that basis. Once again, every level of officials went along with this.

That’s a relatively decent summary of my take, but I don’t see it as a Democratic Party decision; it goes beyond that. I see it as anti-Trump sentiment decision as that includes Leftists, Hollywood, mainstream media, the press, deep state officials still in government, and anti-Trump Republicans too. That is a collection of forces far beyond just Democrats.

Where do you think the trillions upon trillions missing go ?, I would try and remove him as well if I could get a yacht or a jet out of it....