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For Asian Americans to discuss Asian American issues and topics.
I've been thinking of whether or not to make a thread about this but I figured it's interesting enough to talk about. I have dated quite a few asian-american women, some quite hard to break the ice with initially. A lot of non-asian guys experience AA women first as their "minority" experience.
First off there's this misconception that Asian-american women are the same as asian women everywhere else. This is absolutely false and AA women are 100% americanized western women. This is something that a lot of guys can't separate in their heads for some reason. This means Asian-American women have largely the same demands, attitudes, and unrealistic expectations as white American women but also a thickly layered on level of emotional and racial insecurity as well. I'll get into that a bit more later..
Here are some reasons why Asian-American women dislike Asian men:
1) Daddy issues. Very few girls are going to admit this if you don't know them well but 1st generation asian fathers in the U.S. are usually awful to their daughters. The dads are too strict, fobbish, uncool, and very beta in behavior. They daughters aren't taken care of in any meaningful way or given any life lessons. It's not unusual for a lot of 2nd generation AA women to absolutely hate or have no respect for their fathers on some level. I found this to be very common with the hardcore insecure asian-american women. They dated outside the race to piss off daddy as well as to erase their own dysfunctional upbringing.
2) General self loathing. Barbie is blonde. Ken is blonde. The media shows the best looking women and men as white. You have Latino and Black women who are pretty famous and pervasive in American media. Asian women have Lucy Liu and a piece of trash like Tila Tequila. That's about it. When they see asian women on tv they are usually supplicating to some white people or having sex with white people. So their standards of beauty are internalized as white only. Just like good ambitious asians they want to be the white ideal for competitive reasons too. That's why you see some asian-american girls run around with cheesy dyed hair and blue contacts or adopting hilariously stupid valley girl type accents. They are mental cripples.
3) Status. The second best thing you can get aside from trying to look white is to date white. Asian women latch onto predominately white men as a status symbol. You hear a plethora of reasons why they prefer white men etc.. but really it just comes down to asian style hypergamy. Dating a white man is like purchasing a Hermes bag. It's used to show off her social status. It has nothing to do with bigger dingalings, wallets, height etc.. it has everything to do with racial approval seeking. That's why you don't see asian women dating black or latinos anywhere close to the same proportion.
4) Beta asian males. I read mguy's critical comments about asian-american men in another thread and I have to agree on some level. The same things that cripple asian-american women mentally and emotionally in the U.S. also have some effect on a lot of asian-american men. Except with men it tends to create passive betas with no social skills. This is not as true if an asian guy grew up in a major U.S. city like Honolulu, NYC, or the LA area but it's very true if they grew up in 2nd tier cities or in the boonies where there are no asians. So a lot of AA guys come off as weaklings or social retards if they have no positive social group of friends growing up. The U.S. media reinforces that image. Other minorities relentlessly rip into us whenever they can too. So it builds up to an overall negative portrayal of Asian men in the U.S.
5) Religion. This is a pretty minor thing but significant in the bigger picture when it comes to culture. Most asians are secular. There are a lot of practicing catholics, buddhists, etc.. but when you look at daily life most asian-americans actually live very secular lives. This means any kind of mentality to preserve the cultural family unit for traditional reasons are non-existent. Compare Asian-Americans with Indian-Americans. Indians are very adamant about marrying other Indians because their culture and religion demands it in most cases. Arab-Americans marry mostly Arab-Americans if they are muslim. Again, religion.
In the past asians followed this type of culture with marriages of convenience and arranged family marriages but it doesn't really happen much anymore. Asians who come to America almost never practice this.
6) Lack of identity. Asian-Americans are only 4% of the U.S. population. I'd say maybe a third to half of those people are fairly recent immigrants. This means you have some 2nd generation born AA's mixed in with a lot of fobs too. There's no cohesive pan-asian identity. You have dumb asian kids trying to act, talk, and dress black. You have asian kids wearing A&F trying to act like preppy whites. You have dumb ass fobs who try to act like they are back in the motherland. You have asian pride guys who are mostly angry virgins. Not to mention there's all sorts of inter-ethnic asian rivalries. Koreans hating Japs hating Chinese hating Vietnamese etc.. etc.. It's a huge cluster f**k.
It's not like latinos or blacks in the U.S. who have developed a solid American cultural foundation and identity. If you're black at least you know where you stand. Asian-Americans don't know what the f**k is going on half the time. So when you have a lack of your own cultural identity it's easy to latch onto the mainstream as your identity.
These are the top 6 that I can think of for now. Feel free to add your own and i'll vet it for authenticity. I dated several asian-american girls and really got into their heads about a lot of these insecurities. I understand this demographic very well.
Great post Repatriate, this is full of original insights.
Which part of California were you originally from? Here where I'm from, in one of the more heavily Asian areas (San Gabriel Valley, Orange County, Bay Area, etc.), the prevailing trend still is for Asian-American women to date within their own race (combinations such as Korean + Chinese, Vietnamese + Korean, Chinese + Japanese are quite common, since they all speak English with each other and identify as "AZN").
What comes to mind is this:
(1) Cool frat-boy, fundamentalist Christian, conformist young AZN guys, epitomized by the "Fung Brothers." http://www.youtube.com/user/FungBrosComedy/videos
(2) Sassy upper-middle class girls with valley girl accents, like Aileen Xu. http://www.youtube.com/user/AILEENwithitt/videos
See also Momopi's thread if you'd like to get a better idea of what I mean: viewtopic.php?t=12891
Pic I took, from viewtopic.php?t=19473 :
Also, are these the types of Asian-American women you'd date:
Last edited by Falcon on July 21st, 2013, 1:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
I'm from the socal area (SG valley) originally. I went to high school around there and you're right for the most part about the LA area. Most asians are pretty well adjusted in those parts. However, when you start going out to the more upwardly mobile bay area or the white part of orange county that's when things get more f***ed up.
The girl on the left in white looks really familiar to me. She looks a lot like someone I know where did you take this?
But yeah, that's actually a better example than most i've seen. A lot of the girls aren't even that good looking.
Well, in the U.S., the three groups that, in my opinion, hate on the other gender the most are Black men towards Black women, Asian women towards Asian men, and increasingly, White men towards White women. Why is that? Is it because of the strange racial dynamics at work in the U.S. of Gay? Do other countries have this kind of weird racial and sexual dynamic at work?
I'll let black men answer about why they hate black women in the U.S. but i'm pretty sure I know the reasons because they are kind of related to the asian-american gender issues but flipped around.
I don't think white American men hate white American women really. I think a lot of American white guys love American white women but the love is manipulated. There's a lot of politics and feminism at play which ends up burning a lot of white American guys. So they get pissed off and start looking elsewhere after that. I rarely meet a white guy who started out looking abroad, it's usually because they got torched in a marriage or a relationship or two. Plus American culture and politics has created ugly monstrosities out of the women..a lot of guys are simply being "domesticated" into accepting whatever white American women give them.
Asian culture inherently value betatudeness in men. White people are taking their women in droves and there is no resentment from the males? Where is the repercussion if an Asian Female dates outside her race? There should be repercussions but there is none.
Asian males should at least have a rule that if Asian girl dates outside then she becomes waste and undateabale. Don't let them resettle back to the Asian male population when they are getting old and used up. Repercussions man.
Asian men are easily crippled because they are going against a majority. Wasn't there a news that military Asian guy killed himself bc the soldiers kept harassing him about him being Asian? I mean this dude is serving the country and he gets that treatment -- wtf? Read the bamboo ceiling.
Asian American Females are the biggest sell outs. But you know what? This is not just them. This is inherent in ALL asian cultures.. it is just that USA magnifies this aspect of the culture. It happens when a population immigrates to a majority controlled lands. This is White man world, keep your facts straight.
You know what would stop this? A strong Asian state. Yup. If there is a strong developed Asian state the relative value of their homeland transfers to men of ethnicity in that country. Have you guys noticed Chinese males getting more respect bc they are becoming world power? True.
"So never refuse an invitation, never resist the unfamiliar, never fail to be polite and never outstay the welcome. Just keep your mind open and suck in the experience. And if it hurts, you know what? It's probably worth it."
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No, it's due to slave legacy, black male disenfranchisement, feminism, black-afrocentrism, and a small dating pool. It's a long discussion for the details, but the result is a gender fight that neither side is winning. The women hate good guys and cannot treat them right and the ones that can, sometimes look terrible, making it tough for a decent looking black male to compete against other good black males for those few women.
I don't think most of these women resettle with asian-american men at all for the most part. If they are really wacky they continue to serial date/marry until they are used up. But they usually find a taker because there are far more horny desperate American guys wanting any kind of asian wife even if she's busted. Plus even a busted asian-american woman in the U.S. still looks better on average than an average white American woman.
Yeah, it's completely pointless to internalize anger and disenfranchise yourself. The reality is 4% (more like 2%) against 96%. It's not just the majority "white" Americans but American blacks, hispanics, and other minorities in the U.S. generally have similar negative views when it comes to asians too. I look at it this way, asian-american men as an average do well economically compared with most groups except maybe Jews. This is especially true with a lot of guys realizing how valuable the connections in Asia are. The whole concept of happierabroad and leveraging your ability to live anywhere in the world and getting out of the matrix is way more important.
Serving in the military is completely stupid anyways. It's an institution run by old white American men using U.S. citizens as cannon fodder at the behest of Israel and the MIC. Read Project for a New American Century. None of these causes have been worth fighting for since WW2, Korean war, and maybe the first gulf war.
This is true to some extent but I feel non western countries are still about 100 years off from a true cultural balancing of the scales. Culture tends to lags economic influence. I mean if you look at Japan it's only been truly prosperous since 1965 or so. Before that it was an agrarian nation with some limited industrialization. It's not surprising that a lot of asian culture lean towards western positive bias.
The cultural legacy of colonization truly mind f***ed the non white countries in the world.
The three ethnic American groups most likely to marry white are:
Filipino, Korean, and Vietnamese
I see three similarities with these groups..they both come from vastly smaller countries with less influential cultures. If you look at history most of these countries were the ones being influenced by others.
This is starting to change a bit with Korea with the explosion of K-pop and the mainstreaming of Korean economic success but that's a very recent phenomenon. From what I know of Korean women they take hypergamy to another level. It's even way more than Japanese and Chinese.
The Philippines is just colonial through and through in mindset and population. I guess it's comparable with some latin-american countries in that sense.
Vietnam is known for war brides and being an enemy of the U.S. Women react differently when it comes to discrimination and perceptions of social exclusion. They usually want to please more. I bet a lot of that baggage is internalized with Vietnamese-American women.
Plus Vietnam has no mainstream presence or influence in asian or western culture.
Had Japan not turned into super racist, genocidal maniacs during WW2, they could have been the undisputed hegemonic power in Asia! Their influence would have been without equal, and they would have been given a green light to destroy all forms of Communism, had they not bothered the US military. Even then Russia hated and feared the Japanese from their past wars. They had a foot on the throats of all Asian countries, and pissed it all away.... Most of the world did not even known how violent and crazy they were until the war was over. Many still do not know what they did to the Chinese.
To this day, Japanese are not trusted by their Asian neighbors, and it is warranted because they refuse to apologize for anything awful they did and regularly pray at a shrine full of WW2 Human rights criminals. The Japanese perhaps feel it is better to be feared than loved by people they feel are inferior to them.... combined with "saving face" culture, it makes things very interesting...
My theory about this is that the things that make Japanese so ambitious and perfectionist also makes them poor cultural transmitters and assimilators. The concept of cultural assimilation is foreign to them. They are not like Britain or Spain in which they wanted to create smaller versions of themselves. The flying geese and co-prosperity movement was war propaganda. They viewed conquest or being conquered as degradation. That's why when they conquered a people they subjected them to all sorts of inhuman degradation. Britain and Spain were brutal conquerors too but they saw the practicality in setting up a system to transmit their culture. Britain believed in replicating its culture/system overseas as a way to create a cultural empire for itself. The Japanese just saw colonies as non human fodder for exploitation to be ground to dust.
Well I'm spanish, so I'm allowed to date filipinas. So there.
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A lot of white guys are starting to wake up to the fact that white American girls suck. I've found this especially prevalent in the military, of all places.
Take these guys in my unit:
Well, first, there's me, obviously.
Then there's another guy that put in to get stationed in an Asian country for the sole purpose of finding a wife (This guy had no trouble getting attractive white girls. He just doesn't want them.)
Two other older divorced guys (both late 30's) with kids married a black girl from Jamaica and a Turkish girl, respectively.
Another one is a Mormon, rules his family with an iron fist, and cringes at the normal American girls in our office.
Another one is Korean-American. He, too, was stationed overseas and brought a Japanese wife back (though, he confided in me that she's becoming Americanized after only spending 8 months here).
Well, the last one isn't white, but you get the picture.
Well said! Yeah the Japanese never got a chance to read Nicolo Machiavelli's books... Hence never learning the value of cultural warfare. But perhaps maybe their fixation on purity, would have never saw any value in it. You could even play devils advocate and posit that maybe cultural warfare like that is never good, because the British these days seem to not like all these non-anglo British people in the UK, as well as loss of true British identity. Maybe only places like the UK, Italy/Rome, has always had multiple types of people living around them, where as the Japanese were isolated for a very long time and have no idea how to live with different kinds of people.