The West goaded Russia into the war

[NPCslammer]

Great presentation on Ukraine, Russia, the U.S, NATO and why Putin invaded.

https://youtu.be/JrMiSQAGOS4

[Winston]

That was posted in the Ukraine-Russia thread several times already.

[NPCslammer]

That was posted in the Ukraine-Russia thread several times already.

Maybe it’s good as a thread starter since it’s probably the best summation of the conflict history in that region.

[WilliamSmith]

Yeah, Russia and China are openly resisting the attempt for all these "globalist" elite jews to push their World Economic Forum / Great Reset creepshow worldwide, so surprise surprise when a Ukraine taken over by jews goads the Russian government into this conflict.

NATO Wants a Ground-War in Ukraine

https://www.unz.com/mwhitney/nato-wants ... n-ukraine/

By the way, that article had a quote from NATO openly boasting about how they'd trained thousands of Ukrainian combatants since it got occupied by jews in 2014. Here it is an an excerpt:

...you can see from NATO’s statement that leaders in Washington and across Europe are determined to throw more gas on the fire. That’s the message they’re sending to the world; ‘We are united in our determination to defeat Russia whether we blow up the planet or not.’ Got it? Here’s a clip from their declaration on Thursday:

“Since 2014, we have provided extensive support to Ukraine’s ability to exercise that right. We have trained Ukraine’s armed forces, strengthening their military capabilities and capacities and enhancing their resilience. NATO Allies have stepped up their support and will continue to provide further political and practical support to Ukraine as it continues to defend itself. …..We remain determined to maintain coordinated international pressure on Russia. We will continue to coordinate closely with relevant stakeholders and other international organizations, including the European Union.

Russia’s unprovoked war against Ukraine represents a fundamental challenge to the values and norms that have brought security and prosperity to all on the European continent” (“Statement by NATO Heads of State and Government”, NATO)

Are you surprised that NATO would openly boast about arming and training thousands of Ukrainian combatants since 2014? What if an enemy of the United States did the same thing in Mexico or Canada. How would the US react? Here’s how Noam Chomsky put it:

“… for Ukraine to join NATO would be rather like Mexico joining a China-run military alliance, hosting joint maneuvers with the Chinese army and maintaining weapons aimed at Washington. To insist on Mexico’s sovereign right to do so would surpass idiocy. Washington’s insistence on Ukraine’s sovereign right to join NATO is even worse, since it sets up an insurmountable barrier to a peaceful resolution of a crisis that is already a shocking crime and will soon become much worse unless resolved — by the negotiations that Washington refuses to join.” (Truthout)

It looks to me like Chomsky thinks arming Ukraine was a deliberate provocation. Which it was. NATO stuffed the country full of weapons, trained its combat troops and paramilitaries, conducted military operations with NATO, ordered their army to the east so they could terrorize the ethnic Russian population, and then– to top it off– threatened to develop nuclear weapons. In short, they put a gun to Putin’s head and threatened to blow his brains out.

[Winston]

I don't get something. Why does Ukraine wanna join NATO so badly? What for? Why is it worth sacrificing so many lives for NATO membership or putting their country at risk for invasion for it? Is there a logical reason or is all this cooked up like it was in WW1?

If Ukraine never sought NATO membership then this invasion would have never happened right?

Also since the West would never invade Russia, why does Russia care if Ukraine is NATO or not? If Ukraine joined NATO would NATO have put missiles in Ukraine? Even if they did, NATO would never invade a country right?

Isn't NATO like the Federation in Star Trek, peace loving and just? lol

[Gali]

I don't get something. Why does Ukraine wanna join NATO so badly? What for? Why is it worth sacrificing so many lives for NATO membership or putting their country at risk for invasion for it? Is there a logical reason or is all this cooked up like it was in WW1?

If Ukraine never sought NATO membership then this invasion would have never happened right?

Also since the West would never invade Russia, why does Russia care if Ukraine is NATO or not? If Ukraine joined NATO would NATO have put missiles in Ukraine? Even if they did, NATO would never invade a country right?

Isn't NATO like the Federation in Star Trek, peace loving and just? lol

Yes why would you fight your bully if you can get hurt. Just give in and be his bitch.

[MrMan]

I don't get something. Why does Ukraine wanna join NATO so badly? What for? Why is it worth sacrificing so many lives for NATO membership or putting their country at risk for invasion for it? Is there a logical reason or is all this cooked up like it was in WW1?

If Ukraine never sought NATO membership then this invasion would have never happened right?

How could we know that? The Ukrainian government could not see the future. We don't know if Putin would have invaded if Ukraine had not tried to join NATO. If he had them under his thumb and if they were in a military alliance, he would probably not have invaded. He has not invaded Belarus. But if Ukraine had joined NATO, then Russia would have risked a war with nuclear powers to invade Ukraine. This would likely have protected Ukraine. In the situation they were in, if they joined NATO, they were more likely to be safe. If not, there was the higher risk of invasion. The other option would have been to have been a buffer state and behave in a way that was favorable to Putin's government, suppress anti-Putin media, etc.

But Ukraine not being friendly toward the Putin regime, probably producing an alternative voice of anti-Putin news in the Russian language, while Putin thought it important to control his own media, was something Putin probably considered a destabilizing force.

Also, from a ground war perspective, if Russia can narrow that bit of the plain it has to defend, going all the way into Poland and down through parts of Romania, etc. in that direction, it might be able to hold land well. But considering it may have to fight nuclear powers to go that far, that seems like too big of a risk. Putin probably figured if he attacks Ukraine, what are they going to do, really? He might have been waiting for the price of oil to go up and for a US president that he did not think would be very aggressive to be in power to make his move. If he'd done this on Trump's watch, who knows what Trump would have done? Trump doesn't seem to think like everyone else.

The US, Russia, and UK did actually have a treaty with Ukraine that excluded ground troops. They expected air support. Maybe the US considers supplying weapons to be doing its part.

Also since the West would never invade Russia, why does Russia care if Ukraine is NATO or not? If Ukraine joined NATO would NATO have put missiles in Ukraine? Even if they did, NATO would never invade a country right?

Political climates and philosophies change. Putin might not have been so sure that NATO would never invade. They could. Or they could attack Russia if he invaded elsewhere. Some of this may have to do with Russian speakers in Ukraine creating an alternate source of media he doesn't like. There may also be some weapons there he doesn't like to be in the hands of an opponent like he says.

[Cornfed]

I don't get something. Why does Ukraine wanna join NATO so badly? What for? Why is it worth sacrificing so many lives for NATO membership or putting their country at risk for invasion for it? Is there a logical reason or is all this cooked up like it was in WW1?

If Ukraine never sought NATO membership then this invasion would have never happened right?

How could we know that? The Ukrainian government could not see the future. We don't know if Putin would have invaded if Ukraine had not tried to join NATO. If he had them under his thumb and if they were in a military alliance, he would probably not have invaded. He has not invaded Belarus. But if Ukraine had joined NATO, then Russia would have risked a war with nuclear powers to invade Ukraine. This would likely have protected Ukraine. In the situation they were in, if they joined NATO, they were more likely to be safe.

That's why the Russians had to invade before it came to that.

[Yohan]

I don't get something. Why does Ukraine wanna join NATO so badly? What for? Why is it worth sacrificing so many lives for NATO membership or putting their country at risk for invasion for it? Is there a logical reason or is all this cooked up like it was in WW1?

This is a good question.

1 -
For sure it can be said, that poor Ukraine, with an income of half of Russia for its citizens does not qualify to be a member of EU and not of NATO.

Also Turkey, Moldovia and Georgia want to become a member of NATO and even EU, but so far no way to be accepted out of various reasons.

The reason to join is that these countries believe they are safer within NATO compared to remain neutral as Russia has invaded various territories in the past without any understandable reason, like neutral Finland, also Afghanistan and even took land from China in the Far East, still more than 500.000 Chinese are living there, Russia also attacked China again after WWII (Amur river border conflict)...

Finland was attacked without provoking Russia, 70.000 died while fighting back - the Russian left after approx. 320.000 to 380.000 of their soldiers were shot, but still took some land from Finland.

Russia was also attacking Japan, despite a friendship contract between both countries that they will never consider to attack each other. Nevertheless Russia was attacking Japan by surprise. Japan did not expect that, were late to fight back and lost various islands which were occupied by Russia after WWII and never returned. Japan strongly mistrusts Russia since then, considering Russia as traitors who do not respect any agreement.

2 -
If Ukraine never sought NATO membership then this invasion would have never happened right?

Not sure about that, Russia is a very aggressive country, despite its huge land and being underpopulated, much worse than China in this aspect.

Russia invaded Hungary, arrested the president and executed him. Russia also invaded former Czechoslovakia, both are neighbors of Ukraine and there was no talk about it from both countries to join NATO, they just wanted to be neutral and not being controlled by Russia.

Poland also has its own painful history with Russia. Poland might be now the country (except Ukraine) which is the most mistrusting nation against the Russian government.

Also not to forget the Baltic 3 little nations are also worried about being invaded every day. Recently Russia was even threatening Finland and Sweden with invasion should they ever decide to apply for NATO membership.

[Yohan]

Interesting comment in the Russian TASS

Russia has also its problems in Central Asia, I wonder what will happen in future if all of these Central Asian countries under former Soviet rule will confront Russia with their demands.

https://tass.com/defense/1427837
RUSSIAN NEWS AGENCY

MOSCOW, March 26. /TASS/. Azerbaijan’s Armed Forces have entered the zone of responsibility of the Russian peacekeeping mission in Nagorno-Karabakh and launched four strikes on the Nagorno-Karabakh armed formations, using a Bayraktar TB2 drone, near the village of Furukh, the Russian Defense Ministry said in a statement on its website.

"From March 24 to 25, the Armed Forces of the Republic of Azerbaijan, violating the provisions of the trilateral statement of the leaders of Russia, Azerbaijan and Armenia of November 9, 2020, entered the zone of responsibility of the Russian peacekeeping contingent in Nagorno-Karabakh and set up an observation post. Four strikes were carried out with an unmanned aerial vehicle Bayraktar TB2 against Nagorno-Karabakh’s armed formations outside Furukh," the statement says.

The command of the Russian peacekeeping mission in Karabakh is taking measures to resolve the escalation, Russia’s Defense Ministry said in a statement.

"The command of the Russian peacekeeping contingent is currently taking measures to resolve the situation and get the troops retreat to their initial positions. Azerbaijan has been sent a call to withdraw troops," the statement said.

Nothing is forgotten there, but still Russia-friendly governments are in charge, but only with military help from Russia.

https://abcnews.go.com/International/ru ... d=82243668

Russian troops begin leaving Kazakhstan after government restores control
13 January 2022,

Constitutional order restored after last week's protests, Kazakhstan's president says

At least 160 people were killed and nearly 8,000 arrested, according to authorities.

Russian-led troops sent to help Kazakhstan’s government quell violent protests have begun leaving the country, according to Russia’s defense minister.

Roughly 2,300 troops were dispatched to Kazakhstan last week by a Moscow-dominated alliance of former Soviet countries, after Kazakhstan’s president appealed for assistance amid the protests that saw his government lose control in the country’s biggest city, Almaty.

Kazakhstan’s government has since re-established its grip after its security forces forcibly ended the unrest, using live fire to clear the streets in Almaty, where over a hundred were killed. President Kassym-Jomart Tokayev this week announced the foreign troops from the alliance, the Collective Security Treaty Organisation (CSTO), had completed their mission and could leave now that the situation in the country was stable.

Russia’s defense ministry on Thursday said the first Russian paratrooper units had taken off from Almaty. Four Il-76 transports would fly the troops and their equipment to their base in the Russian city Ivanovo, the ministry said.

Sergey Shoigu, Russia’s defense minister, said the withdrawal was ongoing and would be completed by Jan. 19. In a televised meeting with Russian President Vladimir Putin, Shoigu said the several hundred troops from other CSTO countries — Tajikistan, Belarus and Armenia — would all leave on Russian aircraft on Friday. A contingent sent from neighboring Kyrgyzstan would leave by land, Shoigu said.

Putin in the meeting said the troops had completed their mission and thanked Russia’s military command.

“On the whole we need to return home — we’ve completed our task,” Putin said.

Video published by Kazakh news media on Thursday showed CSTO troops taking part in a farewell ceremony in Kazakhstan, marching on a parade ground at a military institute in Almaty. Photos also showed Russian paratrooper boarding transport planes at the city’s airport.

Russia sent the largest contingent from the CSTO alliance, which was established as Moscow’s answer to NATO following the fall of the Soviet Union. The deployment was the first time Russia has acted through the alliance to assist a friendly regime against street protests in one of its former Soviet neighbors.

Peaceful protests began in Kazakhstan over fuel prices but they escalated into a violent uprising against Tokayev’s regime in the middle of last week. Armed mobs stormed government buildings and there was widespread looting in Almaty. Tokayev and Putin have claimed foreign-backed forces inside the country sought to exploit the unrest to stage an “attempted coup” against Tokayev.

Russia deployed soldiers as well as armored vehicles from the 45th Guards Special Purpose brigade, the 98th Guards Airborne Division and the 31st Separate Guards Order.

The Russian-led troops were not used in combat operations or against protesters, according to Kazakhstan’s authorities. Instead the foreign soldiers were used to guard key facilities, freeing up Kazakh security forces to restore order elsewhere, the government said. Russia’s defense ministry released video of Russian troops patrolling a power station.

Western countries, worried about Russian intervention in Kazakhstan, expressed concerns about whether Moscow might seek a more permanent presence in the country and whether its independence could be eroded. Secretary of State Anthony Blinken last week told reporters: "One lesson in recent history is that once Russians are in your house, it's sometimes very difficult to get them to leave.”

[WilliamSmith]

LOL, I'm trying to stop spending my own time on this, but this was too funny not to throw out here:
Of course, it makes perfect sense why the ADL would have no problem with the Ukraine neo nazis, since they implanted the Ukraine occupation regime headed by that degenerate jewish cockroach Zelensky precisely for the purpose of goading Russia into the war, so why would they mind having a bunch of buffoon neo-nazis who call ethnic Russians "subhumans" also serving their cause?

[Winston]

I don't get something. Why does Ukraine wanna join NATO so badly? What for? Why is it worth sacrificing so many lives for NATO membership or putting their country at risk for invasion for it? Is there a logical reason or is all this cooked up like it was in WW1?

If Ukraine never sought NATO membership then this invasion would have never happened right?

Also since the West would never invade Russia, why does Russia care if Ukraine is NATO or not? If Ukraine joined NATO would NATO have put missiles in Ukraine? Even if they did, NATO would never invade a country right?

Isn't NATO like the Federation in Star Trek, peace loving and just? lol

Yes why would you fight your bully if you can get hurt. Just give in and be his bitch.

Bad logic. Why not make peace with your bully or make friends with him? Why start unnecessary conflict? Why make enemies that are unnecessary? You aren't making sense again.

[Gali]

I don't get something. Why does Ukraine wanna join NATO so badly? What for? Why is it worth sacrificing so many lives for NATO membership or putting their country at risk for invasion for it? Is there a logical reason or is all this cooked up like it was in WW1?

If Ukraine never sought NATO membership then this invasion would have never happened right?

Also since the West would never invade Russia, why does Russia care if Ukraine is NATO or not? If Ukraine joined NATO would NATO have put missiles in Ukraine? Even if they did, NATO would never invade a country right?

Isn't NATO like the Federation in Star Trek, peace loving and just? lol

Yes why would you fight your bully if you can get hurt. Just give in and be his bitch.

Bad logic. Why not make peace with your bully or make friends with him? Why start unnecessary conflict? Why make enemies that are unnecessary? You aren't making sense again.

How would you know if it is unnecessary? You do not research history other than weirdo conspiracy stuff combined with it is all a simulation anyway and all are NPCs combined with science denial. So how would you know?

[WilliamSmith]

What's the next jewish false flag going to be anyway? The Davos and World Economic Forum crowd has practically been slavering over the new waves of internet censorship, digital IDs, lockdowns, and expanded mass-surveillance they'll be able to get away with following a "cyber pandemic," which I'm sure they'll blame on Russia and/or China even if they pull the whole thing off themselves. Here's a solid piece talking about recent false flag activity the "West" has been up to now that they've caused the Ukraine situation (which has a lot of links validating each thing he mentions, eg with the hospital and theater incidents):

Ukraine False Flag Coming: Bio, Chem, or Cyber?

https://www.unz.com/kbarrett/ukraine-fa ... -or-cyber/

If at first your false flag doesn’t succeed, what do you? You try another false flag.

The Armageddonite wing of the War Party wants a NATO no-fly zone over Ukraine. The problem is, the Russians have already imposed their own no-fly zone. So if Russia says “nobody but us can fly over Ukraine,” and NATO then says “nobody but US can fly over Ukraine,” what happens? Both sides start shooting down each others’ planes and bombing each others’ anti-aircraft positions. As Biden said, that’s World War III.

Video Link

Nobody wants World War III, right? Wrong! Zelensky wants World War III. C ongressmorons including Kinzinger, Scott, Mast, Wicker, and other Republicans want World War III. And you can bet the Ukro-Nazis who are leading the fight against Russia are positively drooling for World War III.

So how are they going to get it? Force Biden’s hand! Create an event so shocking, so horrific, that the whole world will stand up on tip-toe and howl for Putin’s blood.

Unfortunately for the false flaggers their false flags have flopped. They bombed a maternity hospital in Mariupol and hired an actress to play a victimized expectant mother. The ruse was quickly exposed. Then they p acked a few hundred hated Russian-speaking untermenschen into the basement of a theater and bombed the theater. It’s unclear whether anyone got hurt. But once again, the false flag flopped. The howls for a no-fly zone were underwhelming.

So if you’re a Ukro-Nazi, what do you do? You up your game! You set off a chemical, biological, or nuclear weapon and blame it on Putin.

The media wing of the Armageddonite Wing of the War Party is already preparing us for such an eventuality. Check out the blizzard of stories like this one from Politico:

NATO official says alliance would be forced to take action if Russia uses chemical, nuclear weapons

Obviously the NATO official in question, Deputy-General Secretary Mircea Geoana, is telling the Ukro-Nazis: “Go for it! Set off a nuke! Splash some chemical weapons around! Blame it on Putin! We’ve got your back!”

The New York Times is throwing gasoline on the fire with articles like this:

U.S. Makes Contingency Plans in Case Russia Uses Its Most Powerful Weapons

Unfortunately the chemical-weapons-as-red-line ruse didn’t work in Syria. Why not? Because the target audience—Americans—doesn’t really care about Syrians. If they did, they wouldn’t have let their government create ISIS and destroy Syria. Likewise, Americans don’t really care about Ukranians, despite the deluge of mawkish propaganda. If they did, they wouldn’t have let their government create the Ukro-Nazis and wreck the country by overthrowing the legitimate government in 2014.

So a big nuclear or chemical splash in Ukraine probably won’t rile up the American people enough to force Biden to push the red button and murder billions and end civilization.

That means the Ukro-Nazis have to find a way to make it look like “Putin” attacked and badly harmed ordinary Americans here in America. How can they do that? Maybe a big cyber false flag?

Armageddon propagandist Alex Rouhandeh is just one of the army of lemmings preparing us for exactly that:

As Ukraine Invasion Stalls, Putin Look to Cyber for Revenge Attack on US

So if the whole internet fails, the economy implodes, and virtue-signaling poseurs can no longer tweet Ukrainian flag icons, will Americans be dumb enough to blame Putin…and angry enough to demand World War III?

[WilliamSmith]

Here we go again, after the lying jewmedia calls it "Russian disinformation" for months, more documents on the "US funded" biolabs that the Russians halted by intervening in Ukraine:

Russia presents new evidence on Ukraine biolabs, comments on links to Biden and US
https://www.rt.com/russia/553067-ukrain ... documents/
Lots more detail in the original article, but just a bit of it:

The US has long claimed that allegations about Pentagon-funded biolaboratories in Ukraine were “Russian disinformation.” Earlier this month, however, US diplomat Victoria Nuland testified before the Senate that “biological research laboratories in Ukraine” did exist, and that Washington was working with Kiev “to ensure that the materials of biological research do not fall into the hands of Russian forces.”
According to Kirillov, all pathogenic biomaterials stored in Ukraine were “transported by military transport aircraft to the United States via Odessa,” in early February 2022. On February 24, as Russian troops entered Ukraine, the ministry of health in Kiev ordered the remaining strains to be destroyed, the general said.
Kirillov said that the Russian intervention halted activities at five Ukrainian biolabs that had been working with anthrax, tularemia, brucellosis, cholera, leptospirosis, and African swine fever.