Racial Blahs at SUNY in the 80ies.

[ladislav]

I remember when I was still a greenhorn in the US, just got my green card and barely out of my teens, I was studying at State University of New York in New Paltz. There was a black fraternity there. They used to march and chant some slogans. I could not make out exactly what it was they were chanting but it did not sound friendly. Basically, they occupied a dorm in the back of the campus, and once I went there and there were murals about how blacks were brought to America. The dorm folks there seemed to be united in some nationalistic organization with leaders and also, some Rastafarian guys with dreadlocks walking around. These were also kind of like spiritual leaders. I tried to talk to them but they were giving me pissed off looks. There were also some intellectual black guys and they looked like revolutionaries lost deep in thought and they were also hanging around that area with other nationalists.

One day I found a black nationalist newspaper at my dorm. There were angry poems in it about how a honkey could not be trusted the same way a wild tiger could not be trusted. How they ( black people that is) were never meant to be in the US “ thanks to the boy with blue eyes�. They went campaigning from dorm to dorm and they were comparing the white dorms to “cold snow�. It was winter, there was snow outside and I felt so sad reading about the whole thing.

Eventually I met a black guy in my Spanish class and I was assigned to be his tutor to help him with the language. He was one of the leaders in that dorm and he kind of relaxed a bit after he had found out I was an immigrant to the US and was not a real “ honkey�. He was studying chemistry and we got into many discussions on many topics including racism. He had told me that after all his experiences of living in the US, he had decided to “stick with his race�. I told him that in a way he was perpetuating apartheid and segregation by doing that to which he replied sadly that well, that is how things were and that he was doing his best to adjust to the situation.

There was another black guy in my dorm, though, who was obviously gay and he did not belong to that nationalistic community. He hung out with people of all races and was very happy and was basically accepted by the theater people he was always with. There was also a very black teacher there, originally from Jamaica, who was darker in color than coal but he was always hanging out with other teachers of all races and did not seem to be sharing in the same sad spirit with the black dorm guys.

All in all, there was still a lot of anger and “pissed off-edness� on that campus and it left an unpleasant aftertaste in one’s mouth after a month of being there. At that time I was dating a black girl from Panama who was very African in appearance but very Hispanic in culture. She also did not accept the segregation and wanted to make friends with everybody. Many black American girls though, did not like the fact that she was with me and made snide remarks about us being together.

I learned at that time that black people from the Caribbean or Latin America really did not feel the same way as many black people in the US. One Jamaican girl told me: “we do not consider ourselves black- we consider ourselves Jamaican�. I was also hanging out with some Haitian girls who were also pretty black but very French in culture and outlook and who did not know the meaning of the word “honkey�. My friend and I used to visit them and practice our French with them and hang out with them eating and joking and just socializing together. So again, during that time I learned that possibly, in other countries things were different.

I was living in the section of the dorm with some African students. Some guys were from Tanzania and Kenya and also, from West Africa. These were mostly nice and I made friends with them, too, The anger was coming mostly from a certain contingent of Black Americans.

In my native country there were no black people and therefore, I was still very new to the racial dynamics in the US but by observing the centuries- old strife I kept wondering- well, why can’t these people who are writing about the evil honkeys just, leave, you know, and go to places where such evil feelings did not exist? Such as, well, maybe Panama or Jamaica? Or Haiti or Africa? And maybe in those countries I could date black girls and we could all have fun together without having to deal with all this nonsense? I also met US whites who were guild ridden and who were dating black American guys to “make up� for the centuries of oppression. I, as a person just recently on a refugee visa and still stateless, was trying hard to fit in and get Americanized but I could not accept the whole thing. I felt that this was really a gratuitous problem, totally unnecessary. But I guess it filled some people’s lives with the sense of martyrdom and cause.

[onezero4u]

i have a great black friend, a doctor from the caribbean, who is extremely bright, respectful, and good natured. Hes also probly the most racist person i know.

he despises african americans. his major complaints are they expect him to hate white people and act more african american (gansta or hip hop etc) instead of his native black carribean upbringing.

he gets called uncle tom and cracker lover all the time.

strange no?

[ladislav]

Black Americans who are not nationalistic and who do not follow this ghetto culture are great people to be around; they know friendship and can protect you and help you out and are honest and have a great sense of humor; are communal and just great guys period. Same with good black girls- passionate and friendly and very emotional.

[The_Adventurer]

I had been with a couple of black girls from Brazil and from Caribbean and, though they were to tall for me, those were some of the best relationships I had. There was a closeness I never experienced with black American girls.

I never fit in with most black American guys because too many have absolutely no interest in anything not black American. Learning another language? Travel to foreign lands? Not listening to the latest popular rappers? On top of that, I don't talk like them, walk like them blah blah blah. My father is highly educated and had a high position in his work. He spoke proper English and made sure I did as well. I hate seeing black dudes that I know are highly educated and capable of articulate speech, talking and acting like gangsta rappers just to fit in! (or get girls maybe?)

I remember standing with another back friend of mine, an intelligent and very successful dude, and we were watching 3 other guys, including my brother sadly, seemingly playing out a scene from some ghetto movie. These guys went to the same school as us and were just as educated, so why are they acting like this?!

To comment on the original question, though, black people don't know that racial dynamics are different anywhere else in the world. They think the very same white vs. black racism exists on the whole planet and that any non-white countries, say Japan, will take the side of whites in America and perpetuate the very same feelings.

[Contrarian Expatriate]

I don't talk like them, walk like them blah blah blah. My father is highly educated and had a high position in his work. He spoke proper English and made sure I did as well. I hate seeing black dudes that I know are highly educated and capable of articulate speech, talking and acting like gangsta rappers just to fit in! (or get girls maybe?)

Wait a minute! This from the guy who said in another thread how much you appreciate when people use that stereotypical ghetto lingo with you and how you feel a sense of kinship? Which is it going to be Terrence? Make a choice.

[The_Adventurer]

I don't talk like them, walk like them blah blah blah. My father is highly educated and had a high position in his work. He spoke proper English and made sure I did as well. I hate seeing black dudes that I know are highly educated and capable of articulate speech, talking and acting like gangsta rappers just to fit in! (or get girls maybe?)

Wait a minute! This from the guy who said in another thread how much you appreciate when people use that stereotypical ghetto lingo with you and how you feel a sense of kinship? Which is it going to be Terrence? Make a choice.

Hahaha Actually that was Winston that said that. I said that when I am abroad and Nigerians, Jamaicans or Haitians call me brother, while we all exist apart in a sea of people of a very different nationality, like say, in Korea, it is gratifying. That is very different than watching friends, or even family, who you know have equal education to your own, acting like Dr. Dre and Snoop Dogg just to look cool or get girls.

I would say I have a greater kinship with blacks I meet abroad, who are almost never American, who often are very success oriented and, aside from a possible accent, articulately speak proper English. I remember I met this gorgeous Nigerian girl, who was a film student with a dream of turning African mythology into movies. She was always hanging out with a Japanese guy (who went to school with Ryuhei Kitamura no less). She would talk with such passion, expression and in such detail about her goals. Never met any black American girls like that. Wish I could find her again.

[ladislav]

This is all very surprising and illogical. You have the US a nation of some of the best universities and then you have these supposedly "poor" and "backward" nations such as Jamaica and Nigeria and Haiti and you have knuckle dragging ghetto thugs making millions in the former and exporting thug, gangster culture around the world instead of science and technology. And you have intellectual Haitians, Nigerians and Jamaicans.
What gives? Why?

[onezero4u]

Rome is falling Ladislav...and falling fast