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Spanish woman tells horror stories about Russian women

Discuss culture, living, traveling, relocating, dating or anything related to Russia, Ukraine, or the former Soviet Republics.

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Postby Winston » Thu Jun 05, 2008 9:19 am

Chemist wrote:
And if there are "two exceptions" doesn't that imply that she knows TWO Russian women as exceptions, as the sentence says?

"Exception" is the key word here. She portrayed these two girls as the only exception.


W: As the only exception that SHE'S MET. Get that straight. Your lack of basic understanding of English is appalling.
If she knows two exceptions, then how can her conclusions be based on ONE? You aren't making any sense.

Your right. She can't base her conclusions on only one. But she tried to, and you bought into it.

W: She did not try to base it on only one. She never said that. YOU said that. Her words implied that she's met more than one Russian women that was greedy and manipulative. It was clear and obvious. No one misunderstood except you.

Let talk facts here:

1. You got sloppy with your logic and thought that an anonymous letter from an embittered divorcee actually PROVED anything about your opinions of Russian women.
2. I actually called BS on it and explained why. At some point, Basque had admitted some fallibility about what she wrote since she was angry (an understandable response but not "intellectual" like you claimed.)
3. Now, you are going to split hairs with words and try and tell me that it's really what I've been trying to say to you all along.

Sorry but your jedi mind tricks won't work on me.

But thanks for playing.


W: Dude, it wasn't meant as "proof". It was just an example, one of many, that echo her same opinion and experience. What about all the guys I know who say the same thing?

Basque did not admit fallibility. You were the one who misunderstood her and put words in her mouth. I didn't have a problem understanding what she was saying. You did.

By my standards, she is intellectual, at least she is compared to those cheerleaders in America with valley girl voices.

Again, WHERE does she say "all my conclusions about Russian women are based on one Russian woman"? She NEVER says that. So why do you see that Chemist? Seriously, maybe you need help cause you're clearly hallucinating.

Winston, my poor, ignorant sole:

She actually says that all russian women that she has met are bad with the exception of two.

It's fairly obvious to anybody that she views these two as an exception to the rule and not the rule itself.

She didn't even allow for the possibility that some Russians are good and some are bad.


W: Yes she did. She said humbly that all the ones except two that she's met were like that. But she allowed for the possibility that there were more good Russian women out there.

Face it Winston. You know you shouldn't have posted this letter by now and you're trying to save face.


W: Nothing you claim has been proven.
Just like you hallucinated that Dianne's aunt forbid Dianne from staying with me, and even said you proved it when you didn't. You cited a sentence that never even said that.

Dianne's aunt didn't want Dianne living in your squalor Wu. Unless you got a nicer place. You even agreed to do so.

The fact that Dianne still visited you doesn't mean that the aunt didn't forbid it!


W: And where is your proof that she said that? Why do you claim to know people from afar without ever meeting them? Are you psychic? LOL Of course she didn't want three people living in a small room. I didn't want that either. But she never forbid Dianne. You have no proof for that claim.

By the way, the aunt is still here and I am allowed at the house now. We don't talk much, but she isn't angry at me anymore. She's quieted down after her brother's funeral.

This isn't consistent with what we know about your nature.

Your boastful Winston. You'll take advantage to tell anybody about the girls that you have sex with. Why should it be any different now?


W: Yes I am boastful. But did you think that maybe I have already been talking about getting a lot of sex here, so I didn't need to repeat it and mention it again?!

No, you only see what you WANT to say, not what I say.

Again, you should be ASKING, not TELLING!
I NEVER said I couldn't get sex from normal girls. EVER! Again, you are hallucinating and need help. Admit it. You cannot and did not produce words where I said that. You are only seeing what you want to see.

Stop being so literal! It's what you didn't say that's important.


W: That's YOUR interpretation, not what I said! You are crazy if you think you are the authority on interpretation.

BTW, the reason I am charming is because I CAN get girls into bed with me with my personality, sweet talks, and looks (here I am considered physically attractive cause I have light skin and look clean cut). Plus I have a scorpio rising sign, which means I am very persuasive and have a hypnotic gaze that influences people to do what I want.

I can even go into a store with a no return policy and get a refund, in the US at least.

Let's take another example about you:

The last I heard, you're trying to prove to the US embassy that your Angelo's father. You even assembled a photo-collage and asked me and others to comment on it.

Based on this evidence, I can conclude that you do not have Angelo's birth certificate with your name as the father.

But how can I make such a conclusion? You didn't say one way or the other, right?


W: I did say that I had a birth certificate and I signed it, you dumba**! Maybe not to you, but to others I did. That's not logic. That's Chemist jumping to conclusions.

How much do you want to bet? Want me to scan the birth certificate and show you? What will you wager and pay?
Because, if you had such a document, there would be no need for making that collage or even asking us if it would convince anybody.

Do you get how this "logic thing" works now?


W: I told you before, the Taiwanese embassy said that a DNA test would be required even with a birth certificate. Thus, I wasn't sure if the US Embassy would have the same policy. I'm new to all this. That's why I was trying to be safe. It's common sense.

W: I did boast about it. You just refused to accept it. But it doesn't matter, cause whatever you believe, my sperm did physically go inside a lot of women here, both normal and bar girls. You can't erase that :)

See, it's statements like this that make people wonder if your better off in a padded cell.


W: Why? I'm not insane and not dangerous to anyone. You are the wacko here. I am all about the truth and simply said the truth. You have a problem with truth?

No matter what I say, you twist it against me. You sound like a bitter American woman. lol

Many men will boast about having lots of sex (even when they haven't actually done so). But when do you see men telling others about his sperm? Wacko!

If it really doesn't matter than don't try and convince me.

Even if your telling the truth, I'm not going to be all that impressed with you or anybody else who has sex with poor girls. Fish in a barrel would be the best metaphor in this case.

Whether they are impoverished or not is beside the point.

You'd like to think so wouldn't you?

A global trend that is quite clear, poorer countries have more prostitutes than more affluent countries.

Once a country starts developing to a point where wages go up, people make more money, and more opportunities present themselves (particularly for women), crime and prostitution decrease to a point where very few women engage in it and it is very expensive. We actually see this happening in Russia over the past 10-20 years.

In America a prostitute will run you about $1000/ hour, and there are only a few places where you can do it legally and most American women go onto other professions. In a country like Thailand and the Phillipines, $50 can get you a girl for the whole day or even longer. And more women are competing for that.


W: What hoes in the US cost $1000 an hour? LOL Maybe exec hoes, but normal ones cost $200 an hour, and in Las Vegas, they want $400 an hour. Trust me, I used to be a whoremonger, so I know these things. You can get all this price info on www.worldsexguide.com.

In the Philippines, $24 (1000 or 1200 pesos) can get you a girl for all night.
It was all an economic decision for you Winston. That's all.


W: It doesn't matter. I got my needs fulfilled and that's what counts to me.
W: I merely cited her as evidence and an example. But I have many more letters from those disillusioned with Russian women, including from successful white guys too.

And yet, you're posting silly rant from people that have some sort of grudge.

I assumed that you would present your BEST evidence to prove your point. But I forgot that I'm talking to Winston Wu!


W: I have. In the Russia section, I posted two letters from guys with marriage problems to Russian women. And in the opportunistic Russian women treatise, I cite many people, including expats who have lived in Russia for 9 years.

You simply refuse to look at it.

I know a big WWF type guy named Larry who has gone to Russia 20 or 30 times and said he never met a Russian who didn't cheat when he/she had the chance or opportunity.

W: You have never proven jtest to be wrong. And Hoecus has not had time to come back and answer your points about his claims about his wife at the airport. So the case remains open. You've proven nothing.

There's really not much more they can say, Winston. I know that you're really hoping that they come back vindicating themselves with some type of surprise testimony like the kind that made Perry Mason famous.

But it ain't gonna happen. They lost Winston. Game over.


W: In your dreams butthead. Lots of people have busy lives. Hoecus, I remember, was going to the hospital a lot too. I hope he's ok.
You don't want to read the truth, that's why you avoid the other 400+ letters. They are a variety of letters from different people. You have no appreciation for variety.

The ones I've seen are pretty bad Winston. I'm not holding out hope for the others so don't bother.


W: How many of them did you read, from the reader responses page?
W: Yes I talked to them. They told me so. Some I talked to only online. A few I've met in person and have visited me in Angeles too. And I've talked to some on the phone. They are real.

Yes, I'm sure you took everything at face value without seriously questioning it. Just like Basque. Except I actually started questioning things and found out that she was really angry with mistresses and not Russian women specifically. The mistresses happened to be Russian because their men were Russian.


W: She didn't conceded that to you. You are hallucinating again. Stop putting words in people's mouths.

She said that most of the Russian women she's met were greedy and immoral. She never changed that position. That's all. You changed nothing about it.

This is how stereotypes get started, Winston. With ignorant people flinging letters around cyberspace and calling them "intellectual" for desparaging an entire group of people.

One lawyer even had his firm's name in his email too.

Well I'm convinced. I guess I can create a header and signature line that I'm Emperor of the world. I don't think it will happen though.


W: What is so hard to believe about someone being a lawyer?

Oh, and by the way, Winston. A clerk that works in the mailroom can call himself a lawyer. Sheesh!

W: Nothing is perfect, but most of those letters seem honest and probably are. There were no extraordinary claims in them.

I would consider "all russian women except two are bitches" an extaordinary claim, Winston. That's the problem. You can't read!


W: She said all the Russian women SHE MET! That's not extraordinary.
W: Vika was not my date. And she took advantage of me. When I joked about going to an expensive Russian restaurant, she took it seriously and took me there so I could pay for it, even though I was just joking. She also said that it would be a "good thing" if I bought her a $100 camera just for fun as a good friend.

Joking about buying something for somebody and not doing it is cruel Winston. Not charming.


W: It's not cruel if it's a joke. Are you that easy to offend? So why didn't you comment on her "joke" that I ought to buy her a $100 camera just for the hell of it?
Vika may not have been your date, but she had some pretty good insight about why you were screwing up in Russia. Many women wouldn't have the patience to explain such things to an adult man.

And has it ever occured to you that if you were nice to Vika and treated her with respect, than she may not have had any shame in introducing you to others?


W: She tried, but they only liked tall white guys.
More failed opportunities *sigh*

Chemist, why don't you buy me a $100 camera just for fun? It would be a "good thing" right? lol

You miss the point as usual. You don't tease somebody with an gift and not do it. You were better off keeping your mouth shut.

W: I didn't feel in my heart like I wanted to buy her an ice cream. So I didn't. Intellectuals do not follow customs and traditions mindlessly, unless there is a good reason.

The customs and traditions are rooted in something, and it matters to those people. You observe the custom as a way of showing respect.

Your position on the matter is rude and arrogant. Not charming or intellectual.

Read my "new years lessons" post. I bring up this point there as well

W: If I wasn't a charmer and go-getter, I wouldn't have gotten all those hundreds of dates. And I wouldn't have slept with so many women here in the Philippines.

I can't believe that I'm giving dating advice to a grown man.

Winston, you get the date because you asked them out. It has very little to do with you. The woman knows your paying. She just needs to show up. What does she have to lose?

But did you get past two or three dates with them? No.


W: In the Philippines I do.
It's a shame really. You believed that getting one date with a Russian bombshell was a success!

Poor guy!


W: Sure, the blonde Marina in Yoshkar-Ola I met just before I left, said I was charming, good looking, and she liked me a lot.

And you believed her?


W: Why not? You have no proof that she was dishonest.
And not to long ago you were suggesting that Asians wouldn't do well in Russia.


W: They don't, but there are always exceptions.
And it's not like things went anywhere with Marina either. There was an Olga that you met after you visited your fiancee Katya. You hit it off with her as well. And then you skipped town to go back to Katya.


W: If I had stayed longer, it might have progressed, but I was on my way out.
That's the thing Wu. When you had a chance with some of the girls, you boarded a train and left.


W: Cause they weren't right for me or it wasn't meant to be.

W: Yes I do admit that I might have done better in the East, in the Siberian region for example. But that is in theory, and hasn't been put to the test.

Well it's not like anybody could have done worse than you, so it wouldn't hurt for somebody to try.


W: People have done worse. I know an Asian guy who went there and never had sex, he only talked about history and Tolstoy with the Russian women.

And did you read the story of Shane Neff? Others have suffered and lost a lot more than I did, to Russian women.

I have an friend who works as a security convoy in Iraq, who has lost a lot to his Ukrainian wife. He can spend hours telling you about it.
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Postby Winston » Thu Jun 05, 2008 9:52 am

Chemist wrote:W: It does and it's the truth. It's not some excuse I made up. Russian women THEMSELVES told me that!

Anna of Moscow Capital Tours did for instance. Do you remember her? And during the first trip, Terry's wife did too.


When faced with a choice between insulting somebody and telling a white lie so that somebody can save face, most people would do the latter.


W: Dude, you got it backwards again. Anna was blunt, rude, and very frank. What she said was cruel. She wasn't telling a white lie to save face!

She even said some nasty racial stuff at me!

My God I often feel like I'm arguing with an idiot!
It's not like I said Asians would have a tough time in Russia. We all do to a point. And you neede to plan accordingly.

I know your race is a convenient rationalization for a lot of other reasons you won't own up to. After all you didn't have a choice to be born Asian. There's comfort in that. It makes you think that it wasn't really your fault. All things being equal I could agree with this. But not in your case. The cheating, the stinginess, tardiness, etc. had profound effect on you also.

W: I am not a sociopath. You NEVER told me to stop emailing you.

...Don't make it sound like we're just a couple of drinking budies Winston. You start threads about me, email me about them and copy Dave Fuller.

Now emailing me would be one thing. But why would any rational human being do the last two?


W: To get your attention and debate with you. If you don't like it, you don't have to get involved.
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Postby Winston » Thu Jun 05, 2008 5:41 pm

Chemist wrote:
Being an intellectual, I explain to her that I do not follow customs or traditions just for the sake of tradition. I only follow something that MAKES SENSE.

That isn't the criteria. The criteria is that it has to make sense to them. If you don't understand it, it's your problem as far as they're concerned. They will still expect some common courtesy from you and they won't be interested in hearing about why you won't do it.


W: But people who follow tradition don't do so cause it makes sense. They do it out of sake of tradition, cause they're supposed to. That's all. When asked, most people who follow traditions can't give reason to support doing so.

Chemist, sorry but I'm a rebel, not a conformist like you.

Are you saying that all traditions are to be obeyed?

What about bad ones? Did you know in ancient Babylon, people threw babies into the fire to appease Baal, their God? Do you think that should be followed, just because it's a tradition, even though it's wrong and monstrous?

In ancient Azteca, the men would play a game inside the temple. The winner of the game would get his head chopped off, and used for rituals, so that the tribe could prosper and he would be rewarded in the next life. Is that a tradition you would follow mindlessly, just because it's a tradition?

It's a good thing that you don't have a job or anything. People have been fired or business deals lost because of these things.


W: In a job it would be different. I'm paid to please others and so I will try to do so, to a certain point. I won't take false accusations without correcting them, for instance.

But I don't let anyone or group run my personal life.
Traditions are followed religiously by people who cannot and do not like to THINK.

Extremist theologies "notwithstanding", following certain codes of behavior such as you do in religion and the military are high-order mental skills. They require discipline, intent, concentration and reflection. They actually have to THINK to behave this way.

On the contrary, going to go-go bars to have sex with prostitutes is servicing your urges, nothing more.

You should try observing some traditions Wu. It might make you a better person.


W: It would make me a robot. No way.
Now, back to the point. What is it that Basque said that sounded BS or extraordinary that would merit skepticism? She made no extraordinary claim. She made a common claim which I've experienced too, and so have many others I know.

I would consider the claim that "all russian girls with the exception of two are bad" as extraordinary claims. And she supports that claim by committing the logical fallacy of APPEALING TO EMOTION.


W: She said all the ones SHE MET! That was obvious. You must have a problem if you can't comprehend that.
Not to mention I have a fairly good "BS detector" because of my training. And letters like that make it go berserk.


W: How can it be good when over half the time it errs on factual objective issues?
The fact that you can't see the fallacies and the fact that it was an emotional letter and not intellectual, doesn't bode well for your ability to evaluate anything.

If I told you I had pizza for dinner, would that force you to be skeptical and dig deeper? That's not an unusual claim.

Your actually comparing an innocuous fact about what you had for dinner with a slanderous letter that is being used to cause harm to an entire group of people based on race.

Sorry, I could care less about what you had for dinner. But I will speak out against sterotypes that aren't warranted.


W: There is nothing wrong with reporting honest and real experiences. Would you prefer that Basque lied to you to tell you what you want to hear instead?
So what is your basis for saying that? None it appears.

Actually, the basis goes a lot further then you'd like to think. You're the ignorant fool that doesn't see it.

Chemist, if you don't value my logic, how about challenging me to an online game of chess by notation? Think you can handle it? I'll show you my real efficient calculating logic on the chess board. And without the need for any computers either!

First, I'm only a novice chess player
Second, you challenged a person at Wooweasel a while ago and he kicked your ass in 11 moves.
Third, logic and startegy are two different skills. You can't expect a swimmer to challenge a boxer just because they're both athletes. Logic and chess are just as different.


W: Then I could kick your ass. The person that beat me from the Russian bride groups (not sure if he was a wooweasel member though) but not in 11 moves, much more than that. It was a close game. I didn't make errors. He just outstrategized me. But so what? He was a seasoned tournament player. He was supposed to win. I am still a great player with a 99.99 percent win rate. His ranking was around 1800 or 2000. Mine is around 1400 or 1500.

But what does he have to do with you and me? I'd still kick your ass at the game. It requires some logic skills to be good at chess. And I can demonstrate that I have it.
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