Is Our Earth FLAT and Motionless, Not a Spinning Globe?

[Moretorque]

It's amazing to me how much faith people put in other men; men they will never meet.

I made up my own astrophysics on the fly, but guess what? I am allowed to do that. Astrophysics is completely bogus. It is a philosophy based upon grand fiction.

The same men who believe that all religion is man-made and that God isnt real somehow manage to have enough faith to believe astrophysics is real, and that things really do work on Newtonian principles, whoops, but Einstein had to come along to plug all those holes, such as the hole in the theory of gravity.

Unfortunately for these wise men who call themselves scientists, their new theories always have holes themselves, which can only be plugged by more theory. Even though they call themselves scientists, they never present any real proof for their theories. They just present those theories as fact. They may throw in some calculus to add some credibility to their statements, but that is also meaningless. Why is it meaningless? Cause the top astrophysicists don't agree on much of anything except the major things, and even those things, such as the Big Bang, they can not agree upon the circumstances surrounding them.

So yes, I am a fool for not knowing or believing in astrophysics. But really, you're a fool for believing the lies told to you by Freemasons on record, but more importantly because you don't believe God.

Adama, it's not faith, their works are reproducible, even though those men no longer exist.
For example, right now i can point a gun or slingshot and calculate in a piece of paper the parabolic trajectory, and determine exactly where the projectile will land.
And there are a myriad other examples one can test without investing a lot of money, from the electrical voltage and current laws, thermodynamics, aerodynamics etc etc.

You write off the calculus behind these, but perhaps it's because you haven't studied nor understand it.
Of course not everything in the universe is understood yet, but there is enough understanding to make reasonable calculations for many practical undertakings, yes, including astrophysics.

I don't see a contradiction between the existence of god and understanding the workings of part of the creation, as science currently presents it.
Actually, if you ever study differential calculus, you'll better appreciate the beauty with which god put the creation together.

Of course you are allowed to make your own astrophysics and present an alternative view, as this is an open forum. Threads like these are actually good, challenging current notions. But one has to remain within a logical context, otherwise discussion is moot.

Like ghost suggested, if some things are lies, it doesn't mean its' all a big lie. If that was the case things would be easy, but it's just too intellectually comfortable to assume an all or nothing stand.
The Actual intellectual work is to discern all the different pieces.

Droid I don't know how well your circuitry holds up to fire but if you keep this up you'll probably be finding out shortly, Christer's understand fire real well.

[Winston]

Have you seen this interview with Matthew Boylan? He claimed to have worked for NASA as a graphic design artist, hoaxing and faking tons of images from space, including planets and galaxies. One day, the higher ups at NASA had a meeting with him and told him that the Earth was flat to see how he would react. He thought they were joking, but they were serious. After that, he decided to quit NASA and try to expose their hoaxes after he did some research and find out that the flat Earth model was in fact true and being covered up. Here is the interview with him that has made waves in the flat Earth movement.

[Winston]

Why Astronomy is likely to be a 500 year old hoax!

"It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled." - Mark Twain

Here are some shocking points about the Moon, Sun and Earth that will blow your mind. I learned about them from Eric Dubay's interviews and books at https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=eric+dubay and

1) Astronomy says that the moon's light comes from the sun. However, that cannot be true. The moon's light is white and silver, whereas the sun's light is yellow and golden. The moon's light is also a cold light if you measure it or capture it, whereas the sun's light is warm. So they cannot be the same light and thus the moon's light cannot be coming from the sun, but from another source.

2) If the moon is a sphere, then it's light cannot be from the sun either, because a sphere can only reflect light at one single point, not on its whole surface. If you hold a silver ball near a light bulb for example, you will see that it reflects light at only a small point. For a surface to reflect light properly, it has to be either flat or concave. That's why all light reflectors on Earth are flat or concave, not spheres.

3) Observers of the moon who have filmed it for a long time with HD cameras have discovered that there are "lunar waves" running across it, like the waves you see on old TV screens. This indicates that the moon may not even be a 3D object, but some type of projection or hologram. You can see the lunar waves filmed here:
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_ ... unar+waves

4) The sun cannot be 93 million miles away. If you look at the sun rays, you will see that they come to the earth at different angles. This is easily observable, especially through the clouds. Basic geometry states that only an object that is fairly close can emit light at different angles. If the sun were 93 million miles away, its light rays would come in straight parallel lines, not at different angles.

5) If the earth is 93 million miles away from the sun, then the earth tilting forward during summer and backward during winter cannot possibly make the BIG difference between a blazing hot summer and a cold freezing winter, as astronomy claims. At 93 million miles, a few thousand miles forward or backward isn't going to make any significant difference. Think about that. The explanation just doesn't make sense and doesn't add up.

6) Independent videos taken from high altitude balloons, show that when the sun is over the clouds, it sometimes casts a sunspot or spotlight underneath it on the clouds. This again indicates that the sun is close by, not 93 million miles away, per common sense. See here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qn11MhoaFc

7) The alleged "law of gravity" is unproven, pure conjecture, and inconsistent. There's no proof that gravity exists. It cannot be measured or demonstrated in any laboratory. People take it on faith. There are no scientific experiments or observations which demonstrate that the mass of an object itself will create a magnetic force that will pull smaller objects to it. It's total conjecture, yet taken as fact for some reason. Perhaps because it is the only theory that can explain the heliocentric model of our solar system.

The theory of gravity is also inconsistent in a number of ways: First, if a gravitational force can stick people to all angles of a ball earth, and hold down all the massive oceans onto a ball earth as well, then how can such a super powerful force allow insects, birds and planes fly freely? How can it allow you to easily move your arms UPWARD or allow you to jump, yet be strong enough to pull down the entire Pacific and Atlantic Ocean?

Second, if gravity sticks everything onto the ball earth, then how does it allow a massive object like the moon to move in a permanent orbit around the earth instead of crashing down? And if the moon has some gravity too, why wouldn't both the earth and moon pull each other toward each other until they collide? Also, why would the sun's gravity lock the earth into a permanent fixed orbit, rather than draw the earth toward it? It doesn't make any sense and is inconsistent. Furthermore, why doesn't gravity allow humans to orbit the earth like the moon does?

It also doesn't make sense for oceans to stick onto a rotating sphere when gravity cannot even be demonstrated. No miniature models can demonstrate this to be possible. In fact, a spinning object usually produces centrifugal force which pushes objects on it OUTWARD and AWAY from it, not toward it. So a spinning globe should push the oceans outward into space, not toward it.

"Gravity" seems to be a mere catch-all phrase to explain anything that heliocentrists and globe earthists can't account for. You can't see, touch or feel this alleged "gravity" so people just assume it's there because they are told it is. As Mark Twain said: "It is easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled." This is because no one's ego likes to admit that they were wrong or have been tricked. A simpler explanation for why things fall to the Earth is that if something is heavier then air, it falls down, but if it's lighter than air (e.g. hydrogen, helium) then it floats up. That logic is much more obvious and simple to understand.

8) When it comes to outer space, astronomy is like a blank slate where they can tell you anything, because you can't verify or check any of it, so you have to take it all on faith. Heck, we can't even be sure that the stars and planets exist as huge massive bodies as we are told, as we cannot verify any of it. All we do is assume that NASA's photos of the other planets are real, which we take on faith. There is also no proof that the stars are giant suns either. None at all. The whole field of Astronomy could be just one big massive 500 year hoax, cleverly designed with the fact in mind that people can never disprove or refute it because they can never get up into space to verify or check anything themselves.

We simply assume that astronomers know what they are doing, and the astronomers themselves cannot challenge these established notions either, lest they be seen as crackpots and get kicked out. But in order to become astronomers in the first place, they have to memorize what they are told and accept it in order to qualify to enter such a field in the first place. However, whistleblowers like Matthew Boylan have claimed that they worked for NASA and helped fake images of planets and outer space. See here: https://www.youtube.com/results?search_ ... att+boylan

9) There is no evidence at all that the earth is spinning at 1000 mph or moving through space around the Sun at 67,000 mph, as we've been told. Not even from common sense observation. In fact, we have direct observational evidence to the contrary. All independent videos of Earth from high altitude balloon flights and planes do NOT show a spinning earth, but rather, an earth that is completely MOTIONLESS and still. See for yourself here: https://www.youtube.com/results?search_ ... h+altitude

Let's use basic logic here. If the earth were spinning or moving that fast, you'd definitely feel it. The wind would be so strong that no one would be able to stand outside. Of course they say that the atmosphere moves with the spin of the earth so that you feel no movement, but talk is cheap, let's see some real evidence. Words don't create reality. I could say I'm Britney Spears or Brad Pitt, but it wouldn't make it true. Truth is based on evidence, not words or authority.

If the Earth were spinning at 1000 mph, then a helicopter could just hover in the air and with the Earth spinning at 1000 mph under it, it could get to the other side of the globe in a matter of hours. And a plane moving at 500 mph in the same direction as the Earth's 1000 mph spin would never reach it's destination because its destination would be approaching the plane from BEHIND it faster than in front of it! Furthermore, if the ground were moving at 1000 mph, planes could never land safely on runways and parachuters would never know where they were going to land.

Of course, they will say that the atmosphere is moving with the Earth's spin so that aircraft speed will be constant in any direction. But again, talk is cheap and anyone can make a copout like that. It means nothing, especially with NOTHING to back it up. If direct observation shows the Sun and Moon moving, then that's the simple explanation, according to Occam's Razor. Unless astronomers can prove otherwise, not just with words, but with real evidence.

Furthermore, if the Earth is moving through space at 67,000 mph in its orbital path around the Sun, as astronomers allege, which is faster than a bullet, then:
- How come when the Apollo astronauts flew 240,000 miles to the Moon, the Earth behind them didn't speed away from them like a speeding bullet, leaving them to die in outer space with no chance of catching up to the Earth jetting away at 67,000 mph?
- How come high altitude planes and balloons don't show an Earth jetting away from them at 67,000 mph? Instead, they show an Earth that's perfectly still and motioness.
- How come the stars at night are exactly the same? An Earth moving to the other side of the Sun should have different stars above it in the night sky. Also, the North Star known as Polaris is always exactly above the North Pole and doesn't budge even an inch. How can that be if the Earth is moving at 67,000 mph and the Solar System is moving at 500,000 mph around the galaxy, as astronomers claim?

10) Surprisingly, there is no evidence for a curvature on Earth. There are at least 100 proofs of this, many of which you can verify yourself. Too many to list. See the books "Earth is not a Globe" and "100 Proofs That Earth Is Not A Globe". You can download it here: https://archive.org/details/onehundredproofs00carp
Eric Dubay summarized a lot of them too in his book linked above. You can see video summaries of these 100 proofs here: https://www.youtube.com/results?search_ ... ot+a+globe

A ship that disappears beyond the horizon for example, can be seen again with a good telescope or binoculars, which is impossible on a curved surface. When you are on a plane, you do not see curvature on the horizon, only a flat horizon all around you. From space, there is no curvature unless you use a fish lens camera like GoPro, which NASA does to convince you that the Earth is a sphere. But independent videos taken from high altitude balloons do not show a definite curvature from low Earth orbit. Instead, they show either a flat surface below, or they show convex and concave curvatures flipping up and down, if the camera toggles up and down, an optical illusion you can achieve by wiggling a pencil up and down too.

11) The big smoking gun here is that you cannot fly around the southern hemisphere of the globe Earth like you would expect. For example, you can't fly directly from Australia to South America around the lower half of the Earth like you would expect you can. If you try to find such a flight, you may find a small handful that are listed, but they are fake, because once you book them, they always take you up north into the northern hemisphere first to refuel or transfer onto a connecting flight, before they take you back down into the southern hemisphere. Probably their excuse is that there isn't enough demand for flights around the southern hemisphere, so they redirect them up north to catch connecting flights.

Flat Earther Mark Sargent did some investigation and found out all this. He discovered that by looking up PlaneFinder.net, you can see that the GPS tracking system loses flights going around the southern hemisphere for a while until they almost reach their destination, as if they were hiding something. See his interviews where he discusses all this here: https://www.youtube.com/results?search_ ... rk+sargent

If the Earth is indeed a flat disc shaped structure, then the southern hemisphere would be on the outer edge of the disc, which is why it's too far to fly directly around it, so they have to have you fly across it. Moreover, no one has ever circumnavigated the Earth from the North Pole all the way around the South Pole and back up to the North Pole. They've only circumnavigated the Earth from East to West, but that is possible on a disc shaped Earth too by simply going around the disc.

12) There is also no evidence that satellites exist. No real photos of satellites in space exist. Yet supposedly there are at least 20,000 satellites orbiting the earth at super fast speeds, which surprisingly never crash into each other. These satellites are supposedly flying around in the Thermosphere, which has a temperature NASA claims of 3000 degrees farenheit, beyond the melting point of steel! At such extreme temperatures which melt steel, how can 20,000 satellites fly around undamaged? It makes no sense.

Also, the photos taken from these satellites look like CGI and could easily be taken from planes as well. Moreover, there is no evidence that if something gets up into the atmosphere, that it will begin floating or orbiting the Earth. So far, every visible object that has gone up has come down. See here for videos explaining why satellites are a hoax: https://www.youtube.com/results?search_ ... +not+exist

13) Inexplicably, in 50 years of alleged space exploration, NASA only has ONE complete image of the whole Earth! It's the one taken by the Apollo astronauts that you see in science textbooks and posters, but if you analyze it, it looks very fake and contrived with no dimensions or realism at all. They ought to have at least thousands of images of the whole Earth, yet they only have one. The rest, they admit, are composites or CGI taken from satellites. Why can't they just point the Hubble Telescope at the Earth? Or take a photo of the Earth from a space probe heading out into the solar system? NASA won't say. After all, NASA has been known by critics and skeptics to stand for "Never A Straight Answer" or "National Academy of Space Actors".

Why the deception about the globe earth, astronomy and heliocentrism?

Now the next obvious question is, if the Earth is not a globe, and isn't spinning or moving, and doesn't revolve around the Sun, then why all the deception for the last 500 years? Well there are several reasons:

If everyone knew that the Earth was a flat disc shape with an outer ice edge known as Antarctica, and under a possible dome structure, then people would feel trapped and confined. They would start asking questions like "What's beyond the edge of the Earth? What's above the dome above us? Who build this structure we are imprisoned and confined in?" etc. You see, you can confine animals with a border, such as fencing in cows in a grazing field, and they will not ask questions, they will simply turn around. Animals don't ask questions when they find a boundary. Humans do. Humans can think. That's why humans have to be DECEIVED and LIED to.

If humans knew they were living in an enclose structure, they would constantly try to break out of it. The controllers or creators of this world, whoever they are, would have a mess on their hands if their prisoners or subjects kept trying to break out. So they ingenuously deceived humans by convincing them that they live on a globe with no edge. And that outer space consisted of billions of stars and galaxies too large to imagine, which NASA is trying to reach.

Thus, rather than feeling trapped, people began to feel insignificant and powerless, like they are just an accident produced by the mechanics of godless evolution on a speck of dust in a vast meaningless universe. This of course, lowers human consciousness and spirituality and convinces people that they are mechanical beings, not spiritual beings. It turns people away from religion and spirituality and makes them focus on science and materialism. Without a higher purpose, people will turn to materialism and atheism. This makes people easier to control, for if people think that they are just machines without a soul, then that's what they will become, which makes people more easily controllable.

You see, civilization is basically a human factory farm. The controllers see humans as cattle in a system of production and consumption. So society is basically human livestock management. As such, humans are designed to be productive slaves, like cattle to be milked, not just physically but energetically as well. Probably there are metaphysical entities that feed off of human suffering, energetically and spiritually, which is what the Christian Gnostics called Archons. So humans were designed to suffer too, not just be slaves. That's why suffering always seems to find a way into your life, no matter what you do, as if it were programmed and intentional by design. It's all part of the package: mind control, giving human cattle delusional beliefs about their world, et al. And the Earth globe heliocentric model is just part of it.

Make sense?

[Adama]

For you round earthers, this man was able to express clearly those things I was struggling to due to a poor science background.



You can skip to about the 14 minute mark, cause he gives a lot of background explanation first. Basically there is nothing in space for the rocket to push against, and like I said, due to the vacuum of space, any type of gas or liquid would be "siphoned off." He uses the term "Free Expansion" rather than siphoning off.

Genius.

[Winston]

Assuming that is true, then what would be the select elite's purpose for deceiving everyone that the Earth is a globe and that outer space exists?

What are the explanations for the auroras, meteor showers, the solar and lunar eclipses, the sun and moon, changing of seasons based on the axis of the Earth, the the moon's gravitational effects on the oceans, and the changing of daylight to night.

Even if there was an ice wall surrounding Antarctica, what would be beyond it?

Assuming it is a hoax, then does Hollow Earth exist, or could this be Hollow Earth and there be a world above that's more expansive that the select elite's are trying to hide from everyone with the entrance/exit somewhere in Antarctica?

For most of history people did believe the Earth was flat, but wouldn't someone fall off?

If outer space isn't surrounding Earth, then what is?

Because if people knew that the earth was flat and under a dome, they would be trying to find the edge and asking why they are confined. The elite can't have human cattle constantly trying to break out of their prison or trying to find the boundary of it. That's why they put cold air above, hot magma below, and freezing cold weather on the Antarctica edge to prevent boundaries from being reached. By convincing people that they live on a sphere, no one would try to find the edge. It's brilliant.

Also, by making you think that you are a random accident by evolution on a meaningless speck of dust in the universe, you will not see yourself as a spiritual being but as an animal or machine, so you will become materialistic, and turn from religion/spirituality toward science, thus lowering your consciousness and becoming more easily controllable.

Eric Dubay and Mark Sargent have answered your other questions. Please listen to some of their interviews.

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=eric+dubay
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_ ... rk+sargent

Regarding seasons, think about this. If the Earth is 93 million miles from the Sun, how can a slight forward cause a blazing hot summer and a slight tilt backward cause a freezing cold winter? At 93 million miles, one million miles forward or backward shouldn't make any difference. It doesn't make sense. Being that far out, tilts shouldn't cause extreme temperature changes. Think about it. It doesn't add up.

No one knows what's beyond Antarctica because you aren't allowed to go beyond it. Commercial flights don't try to cross it. It's too cold and dangerous. There is an Antarctic Treaty signed by many countries.

Yeah there are some who believe in a concave Earth, that we are living INSIDE a sphere. You can see their videos about it here:

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_ ... cave+earth

[Winston]

So what is the firmament or air/space barrier supposed to be made of?

A clear, impenetrable substance made by God. It is supposed to separate the waters above from below, meaning there is water up in the sky above the firmament too.

I was just watching Doomsday Preppers on NGC. I realize now that asteroids too must be another lie to further the round globe/outer space hoax. They want us to believe dinosaurs were wiped out by an asterioid, and that every several million years life on earth gets a reset. But that too is a lie. Asteroids can not destroy the earth, because nothing can enter or leave this plane. Stars can fall from the sky, but asteroids must also be a lie.

They've just discovered that there is a glass wall or force field around the Earth that protects it from harmful things from space. Yet they can't explain how the Apollo astronauts were able to get through it.

How come pilots dont speak out about flat earth? They would know for certain if round or flat. We are talking about a millions of pilots over the past 100 years and they are not dumb people.

That's already been addressed. Didn't you read? Pilots are trained to fly, not think critically. In this world, "smart" means to memorize things and follow procedures, it doesn't mean to think critically. If a pilot got suspicious about the round earth theory, who would he talk to about it? If he tells the FAA or his employer, he would be declared mentally unstable and lose his pilot's license. If he talked to other pilots about it, they could report him. If he told his wife, she would wonder what kind of nutcase she married. Etc. You can't just freely speak your mind when you have a job to protect. Duh.

[Winston]

So because some things are lies, everything must necessarily be lies?

By that logic, because The, BlackKnight, Mr.Darcy, Banano, and other HA posters are trolls, then Adama must be a troll as well.

Almost, but not quite. There is another factor that you missed. That is that the lies all come from the same source. That only matters if you've already concluded that the government, the media and science (academia) are all controlled by the same entity.

I have no relation to those other individuals other than we each post here, but it is more certain that government, media, academia do all work together. The other incidents I cited above are proof of that conspiracy (between government, so called science and academia and the media). It isnt that space and science are even part of a new conspiracy by itself. It is just another under the umbrella of all the others put together.

NASA is US Military. Do you trust the Military? Do you trust military intelligence? If you do, then you must also believe that they didnt know about Pearl Harbor and knowingly let those US soldiers die, that Iraq had WMD and worked with Al Qaeda to commit 9/11.

Each of the men who supposedly stepped on the Moon are Freemasons. Do you make anything of that? Or is that another mere coincidence?

Yes good point. Ghost, consider this. If someone you know told you some lies, would you trust anything that person said? You would not even trust your own friend if he or she lied, so why would you trust the government or elite after they lie to you? Because you believe that if something is repeated, then it must be true. And you have a need to believe that government is a caring parent and guardian, which they use against you.

Science is indeed like a religion now, not a process, because you aren't allowed to question things that are established, like the moon landings or the round earth theory or heliocentricism. You aren't allowed to think or question, only believe whatever you are told, even without evidence. That's not science, it's religion. This means they can tell you any lie they want, and you aren't allowed to question it. That's a religion. And much of what they tell you is not supported by the evidence or even by common sense.

[Winston]

There's also a couple of points I think nobody has addressed:

1)
According to the flat earth map, when going from LA to MIAMI, the pilot would have to steer the plane left in order to describe the arch corresponding to said curve on the map, at least if one assumes they're flying over the correct landmarks and not just in a straight line.
So the flat-earthers say that in a globe the pilot would have to "pull down" every minute or so Lol, but the need to steer left as i described above is conveniently left out....AFAIK

2)
How come you can call someone that is on the other side of earth during the day and they can attest that for them it's midnight, and they can even send you real time pictures of themselves at night??????
How do the flat-earth theorists account for this? how can some people experience daylight and others night darkness at the same time if the earth is really flat???????

You obviously didn't follow the videos and links and books I referenced. You haven't done any research. Night and day are caused by the sun and moon moving around above the earth, like spinning balls over a flat disc. When the sun is on the other side of the disc, it is night. When it's on your side, it is day. You can see images and videos of these models. I provided many links. Do some research. Sheesh. Listen to a couple of interviews by Eric Dubay or Mark Sargent that I linked above. They go into detail about it all and address those questions. Do that, then come back and comment.

[Winston]

Some great points. See the comments below:

http://www.smarterthanthat.com/astronom ... -not-flat/

coz3001
Ask the liars why they lie. NASA's origins are NAZI so that's enough to question everything about that great American institution. Compartmentalization, big salaries, threat of 20 year prison terms, there are all kinds of reason that people at the top lie or go along with a lie. And yes, if you've been caught lying enough times, then a logical assumption for an honest person to make is that you're lying all the time.

Photograph the curve, and post the photo.

Ever hear of the Salt Flats in Utah? You can see from one end to the other and that 12 miles, each end should be 1152 miles below the other, but it's not, it's flat, no curvature whatsoever.

Forget trusting some agency and look for yourself. It's an incredible thought, but if you can find a curve then it's just not round. The curve should be obvious everywhere you look if it's there, and based on the numbers they've given us it can be calculated. Where is it? The only place there is a curve is in computer generated images provided to us by a gov't agency founded by Nazi's.

But, the flat earth is right out your window and easily seen so. Not to mention thousands of photographs online of things taken from impossible distances if the earth had a curve.

This is one of those moment when a person must choose to either accept the evidence before their eyes, or continue to be comforted by the lie the gov't that raised you has told you.

99.9% are not strong enough to face the truth and take the Blue pill and live a life of delusion. I feel no comfort in being part of the willfully and blissfully ignorant majority.

vanessazephyr
No sorry. Youre hallucinating. My boyfriend has pictures hundreds of feet in the air. He used to climb and fix cellnphone towers. No curve. Even without the pics its obvious. There is no curvature. And this person who wrote this crap is just regurgitating NAZI NASA bull. I lived in miami florida and moved up north... The ships dont come from a curve. You can actually see a ship full on from about 30 miles away with binoculars. They just get smaller. You look at the horizon on a setting sun and take out binoculars and it wont look like its setting. And the stick experiment. Really??? Lmfao just look an ancient sundials that are still accurate, the north pole is fixed, and the constellations never get mixed up.

If we are trut hurling through space around the sun, and the sun around the galaxy at billions of mph then there would be change. And so sorry but you cant deny the laws of gravity and centrifugal force to fit your argument. You cannot explain the gravitron ride on a spinning earth. The atmosphere does not spin with the earth at 1500mph. This is ridiculous.

TomPayton
@vanessazephyr I just want to know WHY the big lie? WHY are we being told the Earth is round, everything is moving, spinning and revolving, gravity, and all the rest. I understand the reasons WHY NASA would lie about the Moon Landings, but cannot understand WHY they and many scientists and scholars through out history would engage in such a super-lie.

vanessazephyr
That's actually easier to explain. There ar endless reasons. They want us to be powerless. We manifest our reality and they want to suppress us of that. These scholars and rocket scientists are nazis. Thats it. There is no more or less "experts". They are all regurgitating the same thing. Its half truths thats poisoning this world. They had to lie about the moon landings. And when they found out about the dome supposedly they sent a crapload of nukes into the sky. They opened a "window" to heaven and apparently the rift is a crack in it. Im on the fence with a lot of this. Im still processing everythig to find out whats really going on. I believe they are planningn some kind of invasion type thing and making it look like "aliens". Its problem reaction solution to the new world order. Now there are a lot more reasons and you have to know the human power to truly understand. Theyve been suppressing us for too long with religion and diseases and we constantly give away our power. Maybe this is a machine and we are the gears. We are biolgical robots in a way but cannot be controlled unless we give them permission. We all fund our own deaths. I believe in other dimensions and think that we are literally in some sort of machine... Think about it, the "invaders" were here first and created this system after destroying whatever other life was here before. Maybe the native teachings are literal? Now if you create a world type system, wouldnt it be plausible that everything would be made to their liking? Fbi protocol, private banksters, mortgages and stock markets etc. It all favors them. So for them to create nasa out of thin air and higher guppies who are trained to be compartmentalized then its safe to assume a lot of them dont know what theyre doing...

coz3001
Forget the drawings. Forget the NASA CGI's. Forget pretending your a scientist or math wiz. Forget long distance pictures of ships on the ocean. AND, just go photograph a CURVE.

2 people, each 6 feet tall, only 3 miles away from each other should not be able to see each other. Because the curvature would place each 72 inches below the other, and their eyes would be only about 68 inches off the ground. Use a telescope, binoculars, or a laser pointer, it doesn't matter, the curvature will completely block the line of sight, right? Prove it.

Except you can't because there is no curve.

Try to photograph the curve, in simple easy to do experiment. It can't be done.

coz3001
You ignore the fact that things are commonly seen well beyond what would be possible on a earth with a curvature that can be simply calculated (miles squared times 8 inches) easily calculates how far below the observation point any object should be. Funny how you never mention that, and that calculation works no matter how HIGH you are.

NASA has NEVER taken a photograph of the earth, only composite images, also known as CGI so out goes point number 10. Flat earth models assume a stationary plain and gravity does not exist, your own gravity model would have a person weighing less the further they get from the center of gravity which doesn't happen there goest point number 9. You assume man landed on the moon, but that ignores the numerous other examples of NASA fraud having to do with bubbles in space which clearly prove their actually in a giant pool.

Its an easily provable fact that objects can be seen and photographed from distances that would be impossible if the earth were round.

It is also a fact that NASA has never taken a non-computer generated image of the earth, just ask 'em. They say it's not possible. Aren't you even curious why they've NEVER turned about the Hubble Telescope and took a simple photograph of earth? If you're not then you're a shill, and no wonder you lie.

coz3001
@TomPayton How do you explain that gravity hold everything to the earth, including the oceans, but magically has no effect on an aircraft that is flying. A helicopter that hovers stays stationary because of gravity, but if the helicopter is flying with the rotation of the earth gravity has no effect 'pushing it along' and a helicopter flying against the rotation isn't hindered by gravity.

'THEY ACTUALLY BELIEVE THIS' is not a logical debunking. We know what we actually believe.

I know it's hard for you to believe that the gov't lies, because they never lie about anything else. And, it is NASA which relies on 'Artist rendtions'. Truth seekers can never get away with the things people like you allow your idols to get away with. There are numerous real world examples people seeing objects well beyond what a curve would allow. Why don't you ask NASA for a photograph of the earth from Hubble? All they have are computer generated images, so don't hold you're breath. They say simple photograph isn't possible. Do you believe that?

You've obviously done SOME reading on the subject. I suggest you try understanding what you are reading before you comment. It also would be prudent to start trusting normal people who are just trying to find the truth of things, and stop worshipping your false idols who have a LONG, LONG, LONG, VERY LONG HISTORY OF LYING ABOUT EVERYTHING.

nick100
The earth we are told has a diameter of @8,000 miles or roughly 40 million feet. Times 3.14 for the earth circumference is @ 125 million feet. A line from either pole to the equator is thus one quarter of the circumference or @ 32 million feet. A line from either pole to the equator descends below the pole 4,000 miles or 20 million feet. Thus, for each foot from a pole to the equator there is a descent of roughly 2/3 of a foot. Thus, a mile and a half from the pole there is a descent of of @ 1 mile according to these calculations.

This is not what we see here on earth. In Los Angeles, for example Catalina Island is 26 miles off shore but is visible to the naked eye most days. According to the calculatons above we should not be able to see Catalina Island. Catalina should be miles below the horizon. How can this be unless the earth is not spherical?

This simple calculation must be explained in order for the spherical earth theory to remain viable.

[Adama]

Winston, you can type to them til you are blue in the face. It will only cause an emotional response in them, which in turn will cause them to further hold onto to their false belief system. (Did you see how upset the character who calls himself Droid appears?) They believe it is science, when it is just conjecture controlled by enforced group think. They don't think financing research, the history of Freemasonry in science and NASA, the blackmailed NAZI scientists who otherwise would have been murdered in Nuremberg, the fact that their theories in astrophysics for the origins of the universe violate the very scientific laws they hold so dear -- means anything. They will refuse to believe their very own eyes in order to believe that lie. That's how powerful this propaganda is. Now that is mind control, Winston!

Growing up watching Superman, Star Wars, Star Trek and hoping desperately that God doesnt exist so they can do anything they want without judgment doesnt help either.

Hey that's what the Big bang is all about. They want us to believe that God didnt create the heavens and the earth. They just happened to appear spontaneously out of nothing, despite the odds that such of thing happening with all the right variables being properly balanced so as to be conducive to life are beyond abysmal. You know, got to be the right distance from the sun, got to have the proper atmosphere, got to have water in liquid form, got to have the proper building blocks for life, got to be the right temperature -- all of these variables (and more that I can not even think of) must be in a very delicate balance. Yet somehow, magically, it all just happened by itself! <slaps knee>

Then they want us to believe that just as the universe created itself from an explosion of nothingness, life itself was also created from nothing by a lightning bolt from the sky into an ocean ripe for life, and that over a gazillion years, somehow positive mutations occurred for billions of years in the right order. And then man emerged from the jungle. Nobody has ever seen one species transform into a new kind of species, but because there are multiple breeds of dogs and colors of moths, they believe that evolution must be true, despite no observations.

All of that space footage is obviously fake. There's no way an objective mind could watch those videos and come away thinking the earth is round and that the space missions were real. None. That's because they don't love the truth. They'd rather believe lies. The truth of this is worse than the truth of 9/11.

[Ghost]

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[Winston]

Ghost,
The difference between me and adama is that he believes Christianity has all the answers. I dont. He wants you to trade one faith for another, scientism for Christianity. I dont.

I never said anything about the sun and moon being under or above the firmament. I only said there are good reasons for believing the sun to be much closer and much smaller than they say. Did you read the 12 points i posted above? Or follow the links i gave? They address your questions about the day and night cycles. Research takes hours and days man. You gotta spend time on it.

The ships disappearing on the horizon thing was addressed many times. If you use a good telescope or binoculars the ship will reappear. So no curvature. This has been tested and verified and you can verify it too.

[Adama]

We've got so many things crossed here I don't know where to start untangling it. Winston, I understand you don't necessarily believe the flat earth and you have your reasons for posting about it because you have your hobby of being about a skeptic about everything. Adama, you and Winston apparently have different notions about the earth being flat. So before I take my sword to this Gordian Knot of flat earth stuff, we should probably start (eh, return) there. Winston says the sun and moon are outside the firmament, while you think they are within the firmament. (Please correct me if I'm wrong about your belief.) So, Adama, if that is indeed what you believe, then I reiterate my disk and flashlight experiment. How does this work? How is it possible to have day and night cycles on a flat earth if the sun is within this firmament and therefore always exposed to the entire surface (which it would have to be if the earth was flat)? You still never even attempted to answer this as I recall. Before worrying about science, you need to pass Simple Logic 101.

And for the "sun and moon are outside and orbit the flat earth" version, there is still the issue of being able to observe ships at sea disappearing below the horizon as opposed to getting smaller. Anyone can go and observe this. And if you can observe one thing impossible on a flat earth, then you must rule out the possibility of a flat earth.

Growing up watching Superman, Star Wars, Star Trek and hoping desperately that God doesnt exist so they can do anything they want without judgment doesnt help either.

This has got to be one of the strangest and funniest non-sequitur sentences I have ever seen.

Believing in a spherical earth has nothing to do with atheism. Now, I'm going to go ahead and preempt what I suspect you'll say - that the Bible references a flat earth so it is tied to a belief in God - but this is bullshit. Before it was discovered that the earth is a sphere, the default belief was that the earth was flat. The Bible is not a science textbook. Ancient people believing in a flat earth had nothing to do with God, and was merely about the (understandable) scientific ignorance of the era they lived in.

For someone who says he believes in God, you sure do like to insult Him. In your view of the universe (which may not include, you know, an actual universe) God is apparently an idiot who can't make a planet that makes sense, or instead of being a rational Being, just uses magic instead.

I'm okay with you being an atheist. I am just saying that part of the reason people don't want to believe is because it would take them away from atheism, and it is also because science wants to prove that God doesnt exist.

You may think it is a non sequitur, but it isnt. It is accurate, but I suspect you don't know how mind control works. TV, media and film are about controlling what you think about and how you think. 99.9% of the information on TV could be factually accurate and true, but it only takes that 0.1% that is false to throw you completely off the right track. Just as they do not expose certain things in the media which they do not want you to think about, they also show you the things they want you to believe in. Every space movie further reinforces to the subconscious mind that the earth is round. That is the reason why I say it is hard to grow up watching these fantasies, which the subconscious mind can not distinguish as fantasy, and then accept that the earth may actually be flat.

Please don't use God and BS in the same sentence. Don't you think that might be offensive to me? I don't understand why you say that I believe God doesnt know what he's doing, but I also suspect the statement is mostly irrelevant to the topic. And don't you find it a bit puzzling that you as a non-believer are trying to tell me that I am insulting God? Your unbelief is the real insult against God, if we are to talk about insults. But again, this would take us off topic, and that is not necessary, is it? By the way, by what mechanism would a miracle work, if it doesnt work like magic? Magic is definitely real. Ask anyone who is into magic. They even claim there is light and dark magic. But again, off topic. But just trying to illustrate here that God works mysteriously. You can not comprehend the ways. Neither can I.

There is no doubt that the sun is right up there in the sky, right above the clouds, but perhaps still outside of human reach. Winston and I do not have to agree on everything, and I bet if you scoured the entire earth, you would not find two scientists who agree on 100% of everything on a given topic. As they say, everyone has their own individual opinion and belief. As I said before, many prominent scientists disagree with Stephen Hawking about the situation surrounding the Big Bang. Somehow no one cares about those differences.

I don't think there are any Bible verses which clearly state the earth is flat, but with all the verses on the subject taken together, you can say that according to the Bible, the earth would have to be flat. But I don't have those verses to cite for you, and to be honest, I didnt even know about those verses until I started looking into the topic. It is nice, however, that the book does indeed confirm that the earth probably is flat.

I am also under no obligation to conduct any experiment. Why don't you go down to the local shop and buy a salad and report back to me? Are you obligated to do that just to prove to me your observations? Nope.

[Adama]

Ghost,
The difference between me and adama is that he believes Christianity has all the answers. I dont. He wants you to trade one faith for another, scientism for Christianity. I dont.

I never said anything about the sun and moon being under or above the firmament. I only said there are good reasons for believing the sun to be much closer and much smaller than they say. Did you read the 12 points i posted above? Or follow the links i gave? They address your questions about the day and night cycles. Research takes hours and days man. You gotta spend time on it.

The ships disappearing on the horizon thing was addressed many times. If you use a good telescope or binoculars the ship will reappear. So no curvature. This has been tested and verified and you can verify it too.

I'm not asking for him to become a Christian. I am just citing reasons why people do not want to believe the earth could be flat. Those include brainwashing from the media (e.g, science fiction*), many of the reasons you stated above, and the fact that science wants to prove God doesnt exist (origins of the universe and humanity without God).

All these characters have to do is watch a few videos. They wont even do that. Yet these same characters will tell me to go conduct some experiments, as if I want to put on a lab coat and protective glasses.

They also think that just because an opinion is popular, it must therefore be true. Isnt that a non sequitur? I would think so. It is called group think. No one cares about that either. They also refuse to believe that the world is controlled. Every aspect of life is controlled. Politics, organized religion, science, banking, education, courts, major corporations, government, military, media. All of these are controlled by the same entities. They might believe that 9/11 is an inside job, but they refuse to take the next step to see that 9/11 wasnt the first 9/11. Practically all the major events in modern history have been intentionally planned and controlled from the start. They'll refuse to believe that too. But once you realize that IS true, then you know, they are operating under massive deception to fool all of humanity into thinking, feeling and behaving exactly the way they are instructed to.

They may even know that modern feminism is a creation of the CIA, as shown by Gloria Steinem and Betty Friedan's association with intelligence agencies. But we'll just ignore that they intentionally destroyed the family.

It has even been shown that the scientists at universities are lying about their scientific findings of Global Warming. That doesnt mean anything either.

*By the way, have you ever heard of political fiction? Educational fiction? Military fiction? International banking fiction? There is romantic fiction and science fiction. I guess it is okay to have some kinds of fiction but not others. Since somewhere in our minds we already know that political parties are also controlled by the same entities behind the scenes, why is it so hard for these people to see that it doesnt just stop with feminism and 9/11?

[Ghost]

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