How come guys don't discuss the difficult US dating scene?

[jtest28]

Thanks for that graph. Scary stuff it is. But it doesn't surprise me. I also noticed that areas with a lot of blacks will shift the ratio more to women. This is because blacks have a different birth ratio than others do. More like 50/50 boys/girls than other races. Plus, black guys get killed off fast or go to prison. Anyway, just wanted to point out the gender ratio problem is therefore even greater than what the graph shows.

I wonder what such a graph for Eastern Europe would look like. . .

Some guys actually can get laid very easily. I have such friends and am like that as well. But getting dates, and especially getting girlfriends in the USA is mission impossible. The trend for young women is to not date anyone unless you just get so lonely, you can't help it anymore. Then you date for three weeks and then dump the guy after you start feeling wanted. Then you run around and tell all your friends how bad he was, etc. They in turn will give boatloads of sympathy. The other trend I have seen hit my city is to date only thuggy black men. And let me tell you, if you're a white man, you can just go ahead and forget about getting a white girlfriend.

[James G]

I would venture that actually complaining about the dating scene in the US might be valid but it's pretty much a waste of time. It's not like all the girls in the country are going to read the posts and say "Hmmm, they're right, we ought to start making the first moves."

BINGO - you might as well complain about the sky being blue


~JITW

[momopi]

There's no reliable stats on dating. But demographic data shows that if you want to marry a young American white women, the odds are against you. Consider this demographic data:

White American women

Age 20-24:
Had married: 23.2%
Never married: 76.8%

Age 25-29:
Had married: 58.8%
Never married: 41.2%

Age 30-34:
Had married: 78.9%
Never married: 21.1%


So, if you're looking to marry an American white girl between the ages of 20-24, the girl is only 23.2% likely to marry within that age group. This is an overall % and doesn't reflect individuals, of course. Nor would I recommend marrying young, which is more prone to divorce.

If you're not interested in marriage and just want sex, then the stats are irrelevent. All you need is some $$ and access to the internet, or travel abroad. Countless numbers of women in the US and abroad await you and are willing to sleep with you for a "tip", or free if she likes you enough.


Source: 2008 US Census Data


Jtest: I don't have census data for E. Europe, but here's an article on former East Germany:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6713121.stm

[SNS]

The other trend I have seen hit my city is to date only thuggy black men. And let me tell you, if you're a white man, you can just go ahead and forget about getting a white girlfriend.

This is very true for the USA in general. I have nothing against white women being with non white men. But I refuse to live in a country where being white is a liability, pure and simple. Unfortunately with racist countries in east europe who are partial to white men, at least the women will be attracted to you and date you.

[polya]

Guys don't talk about the terrible US scene because they are in denial. They believe all the lies women have told them e.g. "its not you its me" or "I just want to be friends." Guys don't wake up until they hit at least 30, then they take years to analyse things. By the time they are 50 they head off overseas or give up on the US scene. That's why the dating scene isn't discussed as awake guys have fled like rats off a sinking ship.
I'm not sure if women are a "disease", but they clearly have all the power and KNOW it, so unless you are the top 20% kind of guy, you'll likely get nowhere. Please don't sit and endlessly debate what the top 20% is, as its spelled out on TV, magazines....Fighting amongst ourselves is only giving girls more power. We should be taking the power back from them - getting rid of feminist laws, etc.

[Winston]

Getting married once or getting a girlfriend once is not what we consider "successful". My cousin Dennis just got married to a beautiful girl, for example, but he was single and a virgin for probably over 30 years. Does that make him "successful"? Maybe to you, but not to me. For most of his life, he could not get any dates or any sex, period, and there was nothing he could do about it. Yeah he's married now, so he got what he wanted, but we are talking about a fun, easy, active dating life here that "flows".

Plus your cousin made a major sacrifice to get what he wanted. He turned himself essentially into a manservant. In the United States marriage is for idiots, pure and simple. Wait until your cousin's wife reads some dumb article from a femmie mag-rag, or she's some shit-for-brains woman's talk show on television and she decides she wants to be a lesbian and divorce your cousin, fleece him in court, and eat p***y on his dime.

I do not mean to sound harsh here, but its insanity to be married.

I suspect he did what a lot of desperate guys do, they offer marriage thinking that it will be easy from that point on. It will not. Sex does not get any better with marriage, it gets worse. Luckily i never stepped on that land mine, but i have so many other friends who have and the stories are horrifying. Especially now that the family courts are 1000% are on her side.

So i have to agree with you Vinstonas that your cousin's situation is really not what we are meaning. I agree that romance has to be something that happens more, as you say, fluently and easier. Waiting 30 years and having to sacrifice yourself at the alter is not 'flowing"

Well I'm glad you see my point. But I do not think that my cousin's marriage will have many problems. He is a very square person, and so is his bride probably. This means they always do what's right, live within narrow proper boundaries as though it were second nature to them, and are very NONselfish. He is boring and narrow yeah, but deep down he is a good and kind person, like most Taiwanese are. And he is very picky about who he marries, so he would obviously marry someone of the same nature as himself.

When you have two prim and proper square people that have no independent opinions of their own, there isn't much that can go wrong. They are likely to work hard, always do the right thing, etc. These are very stable and unselfish types. They rarely get divorced.

But their lives and personalities are boring as hell, so I wouldn't want to be them either.

[Winston]

I wouldn't say 'guys don't discuss the difficult US dating scene'. You guys are discussing it, and guys also discuss it at work & elsewhere, not necessarily just on the net.

I would venture that actually complaining about the dating scene in the US might be valid but it's pretty much a waste of time. It's not like all the girls in the country are going to read the posts and say "Hmmm, they're right, we ought to start making the first moves."

And, to be fair, the dating scene isn't difficult for everyone.

We are discussing it here, but we're the exception, and that's the point. If you go to the other expat sites like expatexchange.com or transitionsabroad.com or others at http://www.happierabroad.com/ebook/Page90.htm , you will not find guys discussing the difficult US date scene for men on their forums. Why is that? Cause it's taboo and not something you're supposed to do.

This is not a world where anything goes and everything that's true can be uttered without consequence or resistance. No way. Truth is often censored and spun. People do not even respect truth as the highest ideal. Patriotism, pride, loyalty, upholding cherished beliefs, power and money, etc. are often put ahead of truth when there is a conflict with the truth.

What kind of work environment are you speaking of where guys can discuss the difficult US dating scene? In a typical office environment, in the coffee break room, you are only allowed to discuss lighthearted subjects such as weather, sports, what you did over the weekend, headline news, etc. You do not talk about taboo subjects or think outside the box in office conversations. No way.

Two guys who are close friends and know each other well can discuss such things. But these are not topics you bring up with your typical neighbor next door or fellow office worker that you only have working relationships with.

Venting may be a waste of time, but it's a form of release and validation that you're not alone.

[Winston]

I live in one of the red dots, but I have a hunch that most of the red dots are due to black women whose brothers (no pun intended) are living at the penetentiary, and therefore not counted in the statistics. The blue dots are probably due to illegal aliens who are working at those locations while their women are back in the old country.

As for this whole discussion, even at Sosuave, there are discussions about how bad the American dating situation is. But the difference is that men there are still competing in the American dating market, and thus there is only that market, and no comparison can be made to other markets. Of course, there are quite a few men at Sosuave who sing the praises of the foreign dating market, and speak of an ongoing or future interest in going foreign.

It is only going to be sites, such as this, that are about dating foreign women that are going to talk about the bad American dating situation. Of course, by the time a man has made the transition to the foreign market, he is in little mood to dip back into the American market.

I think that I can speak for most men, that the only reason we have not moved to a foreign country (or at least are in a position of traveling very frequently for long periods) is that we are not at the point in our lives of being financially secure enough to do so. I know that once I am at that point, I plan to spend about half the year in Eastern Europe (until I would find a girlfriend or wife, at which time I would spend even more, or perhaps have her move with me to the USA.)

So true and good points. The people at SoSuave agree with us about the horrible dating scene in the US for men, but once you tell them about the abroad option, they get angry and condemn you for dating whores. Just bring it up on the sosuave forum and you will see. People hate what's outside their comfort zone and can't think objectively about it.

This site is unique and so are the topics on this forum.

You are right that most of the guys on this forum who are not already abroad have financial restraints holding them back, otherwise they'd be overseas dating women and not here talking about it. lol There's also a fear of the unknown factor as well. Plus, a lot of people have no budgeting or planning skills and simply squander every income they have without even thinking twice about it, thus never saving up anything.

[Winston]

Winston mentioned that his cousin is a doctor (?) and never dated before he married. If he had wanted to get hitched earlier, I think match makers would've been knocking down his parents door with offers. But I have a feeling that his cousin is someone who prefers yuanfen. For those who don't understand the concept, it has no simple direct English translation, but you can read about it here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuanfen

Well to my knowledge he never dated. But he could have and just kept quiet about it. I am not close enough to him to ask him about his private life either. When we see each other, we just humor each other and be nice. We don't talk about controversial things. And of course, if I have health related questions, he is always glad to answer them. But he is a strict follower and conformist and has no opinions on anything outside the box. Very square too, but kind and helpful at least.

But remember he's only 5ft 3 too, so that alone disqualifies him from the majority of women's criteria. So he is lucky to find someone tall and beautiful who loves him for him and is working in the healthcare field as well. Things like that happen once in a lifetime or once in many years.

I looked up the Yuanfen definition, and it might be true for him. I think the concept refers to people who do not try to make things happen but just lets it happen naturally through natural connections. Is that right? That sounds like it could be him.

I don't get people like that though. How are some guys able to go without sex or women for so long and not complain? How do they turn off their hormones and desires like a light switch? Me and other guys like me cannot do that at all. I asked this question to DiscoProJoe once and he said "CAUSE I'M NOT YOU WINSTON!" LOL

[Winston]

The other trend I have seen hit my city is to date only thuggy black men. And let me tell you, if you're a white man, you can just go ahead and forget about getting a white girlfriend.

This is very true for the USA in general. I have nothing against white women being with non white men. But I refuse to live in a country where being white is a liability, pure and simple. Unfortunately with racist countries in east europe who are partial to white men, at least the women will be attracted to you and date you.

How can that be though, when the media and Hollywood portray the sporty looking white male as the ideal image that everyone wants?

[Repatriate]

The other trend I have seen hit my city is to date only thuggy black men. And let me tell you, if you're a white man, you can just go ahead and forget about getting a white girlfriend.

This is very true for the USA in general. I have nothing against white women being with non white men. But I refuse to live in a country where being white is a liability, pure and simple. Unfortunately with racist countries in east europe who are partial to white men, at least the women will be attracted to you and date you.

How can that be though, when the media and Hollywood portray the sporty looking white male as the ideal image that everyone wants?

You said it yourself Winston. Only the "sporty looking white male" is desired. This means being in the 18-35 demographic and attractive or rich to boot. This leaves quite a few average joe white guys out in the cold. I've heard this complaint as well. The average joes can date frumpy or plain jane white women but the problem is there is a severe shortage of attractive white women in the U.S. The attractive ones are constantly fought over hot commodities out there which leads to the bitchy attitude you see most of the time.



[/b]

[jamesbond]

The other trend I have seen hit my city is to date only thuggy black men. And let me tell you, if you're a white man, you can just go ahead and forget about getting a white girlfriend.

This is very true for the USA in general. I have nothing against white women being with non white men. But I refuse to live in a country where being white is a liability, pure and simple. Unfortunately with racist countries in east europe who are partial to white men, at least the women will be attracted to you and date you.

How can that be though, when the media and Hollywood portray the sporty looking white male as the ideal image that everyone wants?

You said it yourself Winston. Only the "sporty looking white male" is desired. This means being in the 18-35 demographic and attractive or rich to boot. This leaves quite a few average joe white guys out in the cold. I've heard this complaint as well. The average joes can date frumpy or plain jane white women but the problem is there is a severe shortage of attractive white women in the U.S. The attractive ones are constantly fought over hot commodities out there which leads to the bitchy attitude you see most of the time.



[/b]

I wish hot women in the US would fight over me! LOL It won't happen unless your a celebrity, then women in the US will be interested in you and talk to you and maybe even fight over you. I am jealous of Hugh Hefner, yeah the women are only interested in his money but hey, he is in his eighties and is dating two twenty year olds right now who were just in Playboy recently. That guy gets more ass than a toliet seat! LOL

[jtest28]

The other trend I have seen hit my city is to date only thuggy black men. And let me tell you, if you're a white man, you can just go ahead and forget about getting a white girlfriend.

This is very true for the USA in general. I have nothing against white women being with non white men. But I refuse to live in a country where being white is a liability, pure and simple. Unfortunately with racist countries in east europe who are partial to white men, at least the women will be attracted to you and date you.

How can that be though, when the media and Hollywood portray the sporty looking white male as the ideal image that everyone wants?

Because they're picky. Yeah, I get women checking me out alot. But they also expect me to be able to mack on them like a black guy does, and that's just not me. So they lose interest. That's why I think I get so many women wanting to get laid with me, because they see me as not good enough, socially anyway, to date. So even though a man may match to a great degree some of the things a woman wants, he had better match all the criteria, or else he's still stays alone.

[jamesbond]

Well maybe most men CAN get a girlfriend or wife either once or a few times in his/her lifetime. But I would not say that most guys in America can get a girlfriend ANYTIME they wanted, like me and my expat friends can in the Philippines, for example. No way jose. Every guy I know here, including younger ones who look fit, say that they would never go back to American women again.

Even I have had girlfriends in the US. But the bottom line is that I have to wait YEARS for the next chance to get a girlfriend or date or sex again. And that's EXCRUCIATING to me and others of my kind. I didn't want to put up with it again, and so I looked for an extreme out, ABROAD.

To me and most of the guys here, if a guy has to wait years to get a girlfriend or get laid, the dating scene sucks. It seems though that you are saying that if a guy scores one time in 10,000, that he is successful. Is that right? If so, I don't agree with that. Being forced to endure years of datelessness and sexlessness like I was in the US is horrible. And walking around for hours trying to meet girls and getting nowhere and ending up with heat exhaustion, hunger, and thirst, as well as frustration, is excruciating, yet that's what I experienced in California in the late 1990's.

It's all about CHOICES. Nothing compares to the feeling that you know you can get almost any girl you want. Nothing compares to it.

What I'm talking about is described here, which you are quoted in:

http://www.happierabroad.com/alternative.php

Good points Winston. In America, a man usually has to go several years in between girlfriends and sex. The only way a man gets sex in America is if he has a girlfriend. So, the typical single guy in the US goes several years not just in between girlfriends but also in between sex.

I am surprised more guys in America are not talking about this. It's only discussed on forums like this.