Winston asked: Why does this forum attract so many psychos and posers?

[Lucas88]

I’m pretty similar in a lot of ways. I hate tattoos. I don’t want a girl with any tattoos. I hate weird fetishes so I avoid any girl who has them. I also don’t want to date a girl who has a history of hookups and one night stands. If she had sex with long term boyfriends that’s okay with me but one night stands are unacceptable.

I am actually quite extreme when it comes to energetic hygiene. I'm a very sensitive person and I can usually sense what kind of person somebody is as soon as I meet them for the first time (I'm almost always accurate). I just perceive certain energetic patterns and signatures. I am more on the purer side in terms of energetic soul quality and find many people's energy utterly unbearable. I'm highly selective when it comes to friendships and women. Drugs and excessive alcohol intake are a total no. Trashy tattoos greatly diminish a girl's beauty in my eyes. Any weird fetishes and sexual tastes including a liking for anal sex or sadomasochism disgust me and would even be a deal breaker for me. If a girl asked me to perform anal sex on her or some kind of bondage I'd end the relationship immediately. Moreover, I avoid people from certain subcultures that I perceive as low-vibrational. I also avoid certain genres of music that I think have a negative effect on consciousness. I also prefer to associate only with spiritual people. I don't associate with atheists because they almost always give off bad vibes. I take energetic hygiene very seriously and always seek to surround myself with more refined high-vibrational people.

[MrMan]

I’m pretty similar in a lot of ways. I hate tattoos. I don’t want a girl with any tattoos. I hate weird fetishes so I avoid any girl who has them. I also don’t want to date a girl who has a history of hookups and one night stands. If she had sex with long term boyfriends that’s okay with me but one night stands are unacceptable.

I do feel that most men, if given the choice, would still prefer to marry a virgin when it comes to marriage. Dating, its impractical. As for virgins, going on a quest for one, too, is impractical as they're just incredibly rare after a certain point, and at a certain level of attractiveness. Most of the hottest, cream of the crop girls tend to be paired up early, like by their late teens they'd have a serious boyfriend who likely will hold on to dear life as he doesn't want to let her go... any other girl, its hit or miss. But virginity is hard to come by in the year 2022. Its why Tsar is so frustrated; its next to impossible to find a really hot virgin in today's world.

Even @MrMan who takes a lot of pride in marrying a virgin, married her over twenty years ago. Repeating his feat would be more difficult today. Not impossible, mind you, but difficult.

A somewhat moral girl who didn't sleep around a lot and was a "serial monogamist" is the second-best thing. A realistic option for a somewhat conservative leaning fellow, but still not exactly... ideal. Just, ideal enough.

Virgins in Indonesia, especially the villagers and smaller towns did not seem to be that rare... based on what I heard. I did not perform inspections.

[MrMan]

Virgins in Indonesia, especially the villagers and smaller towns did not seem to be that rare... based on what I heard. I did not perform inspections.

Perhaps not twenty years ago, but today? Things are changing rapidly. Even in small Christian towns in the Filipino province, most girls have boyfriends in their teenage years and the vast majority of those who have boyfriends, have sex. Of course they will still claim to be virgins when questioned by others but it is common knowledge that they are not. I assume the same will be true for most Christian Indonesians, with of course Islamic Indonesiand and Filipinas being somewhat of an exception to the rule as their parents tend to be far stricter and wouldn't allow them to have boyfriends at all.

It has been a few years since I have been there. I remember when I was there overhearing my wife and her early 20-something cousin who was staying with us talking about another 20-something cousin sleeping around, and how some of the girls who lived in Jakarta weren't virgins before marriage. The 20-something cousin from the village, but who had gone away to college, seemed really concerned about that. You never know what people are up to. It's expected there that they will be virgins. I do think a lot of them still are. And Indonesian culture is not the same as Filipino. There are some similarities. They are both of at least partly Malay stock, but their cultures may have diverged over 1000 years ago.

[WilliamSmith]

Of course they will still claim to be virgins when questioned by others but it is common knowledge that they are not. I assume the same will be true for most Christian Indonesians, with of course Islamic Indonesiand and Filipinas being somewhat of an exception to the rule as their parents tend to be far stricter and wouldn't allow them to have boyfriends at all.

Yeah, I'm not there so leave it to you and @publicduende and so on to possibly shed more light on the matter, but the Philippines is the #1 place I see tradpill types such as @Outcast9428 as potentially getting a nasty shock if they too readily believe stuff like voluntary response based survey data that make things sound more chaste and traditional than they really are:

Philippines is pretty notorious for cute nice Pinays to nonetheless be very easy, and yet for a lot of them to claim they're being monogamous and/or virgins when in reality they're actually lying and cheating (sometimes with multiple men), then doing the chick thing of exulting in the resulting drama (as well as the sex). I heard Latinas do this a lot too, and have heard Pinays compared with Latinas for this and other reasons.

Thailand is also an awesome country with lots of respectable qualities and interesting traditional culture, for sure, but I know for a fact about lots of guys going there and taking home multiple college age girls easy from bars for tons of sex and a good time even when they can't even communicate at all due to language barrier, and I'm not talking about pros or false promises of traditional marriage or money, just ordinary nice girls who want action, same as everywhere else in the world where the women are allowed to follow their nature in this regard.
Then Thailand is also infamous for being full of homos and ladyboys: A friend of mine was there also and a 40 year old ladyboy who operated renting beachfront shacks to tourists or something (been awhile since I heard his stories) kept trying to sneak into his bungalow thing and hope he'd go homo when drunk, LOL.

I don't know much about Indonesia or Laos, but to those for whom traditionalism is really important, I wonder what they would think of Laos... I heard men and women aren't allowed to sleep in the same building together there even if they're engaged.

[Outcast9428]

Of course they will still claim to be virgins when questioned by others but it is common knowledge that they are not. I assume the same will be true for most Christian Indonesians, with of course Islamic Indonesiand and Filipinas being somewhat of an exception to the rule as their parents tend to be far stricter and wouldn't allow them to have boyfriends at all.

Yeah, I'm not there so leave it to you and @publicduende and so on to possibly shed more light on the matter, but the Philippines is the #1 place I see tradpill types such as @Outcast9428 as potentially getting a nasty shock if they too readily believe stuff like voluntary response based survey data that make things sound more chaste and traditional than they really are:

Philippines is pretty notorious for cute nice Pinays to nonetheless be very easy, and yet for a lot of them to claim they're being monogamous and/or virgins when in reality they're actually lying and cheating (sometimes with multiple men), then doing the chick thing of exulting in the resulting drama (as well as the sex). I heard Latinas do this a lot too, and have heard Pinays compared with Latinas for this and other reasons.

Thailand is also an awesome country with lots of respectable qualities and interesting traditional culture, for sure, but I know for a fact about lots of guys going there and taking home multiple college age girls easy from bars for tons of sex and a good time even when they can't even communicate at all due to language barrier, and I'm not talking about pros or false promises of traditional marriage or money, just ordinary nice girls who want action, same as everywhere else in the world where the women are allowed to follow their nature in this regard.
Then Thailand is also infamous for being full of homos and ladyboys: A friend of mine was there also and a 40 year old ladyboy who operated renting beachfront shacks to tourists or something (been awhile since I heard his stories) kept trying to sneak into his bungalow thing and hope he'd go homo when drunk, LOL.

I don't know much about Indonesia or Laos, but to those for whom traditionalism is really important, I wonder what they would think of Laos... I heard men and women aren't allowed to sleep in the same building together there even if they're engaged.

Even the people pushing the “pinays are sluttier then you think narrative” admit that they don’t really do one night stands and hookups at all. Some of them do have sex pretty fast but there’s an expectation even among the sluttier girls that you should at least try to have a relationship if you had sex. There’s no culture of humping and dumping. The “casual sex” people are describing is basically jumping into bed really fast and then realizing a few weeks later that their personalities are incompatible for a relationship. Yes it’s still kind of degenerate but it’s nowhere even close to as bad as the crap I saw in college or even in high school. The same guys saying this said they developed a bad reputation because of sleeping with too many girls. They are also saying that the type of girls who typically go for foreign guys are considered bottom tier in Filipino society. In the video I watched, most of the girls actually had a pretty “meh” attitude towards dating foreigners and said “depends on what kind of guy he is.”

The reason the Philippines seems so easy compared to the West is because girls are supposed to prioritize relationships and they are not encouraged to focus on education or careers instead of getting married. If a guy goes to the Philippines and behaves like a manwhore though then he’ll develop a bad reputation and only attract other female sluts who are considered bottom tier by the locals.

If a guy actually wants a quality pinay girl they still need to behave themselves and earn people’s respect. Respectable pinay girls are not throwing themselves at men who have developed a reputation for being a fuckboy.

Anyway when I say a country has no hookup culture I am not saying “no casual sex ever happens here, ever.” What I’m saying is that there’s no culturally acceptable way of having them. I’ve been talking for example about how Hungary doesn’t have a hookup culture. I am not saying hookups never happen in Hungary. But there’s no promotion of it in the culture and people don’t pursue it as a lifestyle. You won’t see people in the nightclubs or bars regularly trying to hookup with strangers.

Even the people trying to say Philippines is a bit sluttier then my survey data claims, what they mention still indicates the non-existence of hookup culture there. If people were pursuing them as a lifestyle then there wouldn’t be this “we have to at least try to have a relationship” attitude. At my college even trying to have a relationship with girls got you labeled as a clingy freak.

Plus although I think girls’ responses ought to be taken with a grain of salt. I highly doubt that the guys would lie and downplay their numbers. Especially since playboy guys tend to be really proud of how many women they’ve slept with. Even among the guys, only 10% of them claim to have slept with 10 or more girls.

[publicduende]

Yeah, I'm not there so leave it to you and @publicduende and so on to possibly shed more light on the matter, but the Philippines is the #1 place I see tradpill types such as @Outcast9428 as potentially getting a nasty shock if they too readily believe stuff like voluntary response based survey data that make things sound more chaste and traditional than they really are:

Philippines is pretty notorious for cute nice Pinays to nonetheless be very easy, and yet for a lot of them to claim they're being monogamous and/or virgins when in reality they're actually lying and cheating (sometimes with multiple men), then doing the chick thing of exulting in the resulting drama (as well as the sex). I heard Latinas do this a lot too, and have heard Pinays compared with Latinas for this and other reasons.

It's actually a bit more disconcerting than that. Many girls over here get devirginised by family members, often young ones (elder brothers, cousins, young uncles), sometimes older ones, even their fathers. It's something few people want to talk about, Catholic stigma and all, but the practice is alive and kicking. And I am talking girls as young as 12. Two of the girls I dated confessed to me, that they were abused by a cousin and an uncle, respectively. The second one (uncle) was from an upper-class Filipino-Chinese family in Davao, and she was still bearing the scars on her personality.

Abuse or not, I stopped believing in the "primal innocence" of Filipinas, and Filipino people in general, pretty soon during my stay here. People here are overly opportunistic and sex is one of the few currencies they have to get something out of someone. Often, it's the only currency they have.

Thailand is also an awesome country with lots of respectable qualities and interesting traditional culture, for sure, but I know for a fact about lots of guys going there and taking home multiple college age girls easy from bars for tons of sex and a good time even when they can't even communicate at all due to language barrier, and I'm not talking about pros or false promises of traditional marriage or money, just ordinary nice girls who want action, same as everywhere else in the world where the women are allowed to follow their nature in this regard.
Then Thailand is also infamous for being full of homos and ladyboys: A friend of mine was there also and a 40 year old ladyboy who operated renting beachfront shacks to tourists or something (been awhile since I heard his stories) kept trying to sneak into his bungalow thing and hope he'd go homo when drunk, LOL.

I don't know much about Indonesia or Laos, but to those for whom traditionalism is really important, I wonder what they would think of Laos... I heard men and women aren't allowed to sleep in the same building together there even if they're engaged.

I get told a lot of how sexually liberated the Thai party girls are. Not having the moral superstructure of Christianity or Islam surely helps making women more nonchalant towards sex, including occasional sex. Still, from what I have heard and read, catching a hottie in a trendy bar or disco requires a specific profile: young, handsome, well-groomed, with money to spend. The polar opposite of the profile of the typical man who comes to the Philippines for romance: in his late 30s or 40s, physically mediocre and in bad shape, with a modest pension or passive income. In Thailand, they would be spit-roasted like baby pig by the many scammers around.

[Outcast9428]

@publicduende

I just don’t get how it can be that I can go to Florida and date a Filipino immigrant girl who really was everything a conservative guy could ask for. Super girly/feminine, sweet, cute voice and mannerisms, long term relationships only, no fetishes or kinks, wanted to be a housewife and be provided for, let me say outrageously anti-liberal stuff that I don’t feel comfortable even saying around my traditionalist father. Had parents who were super traditional in every way you can think of. A girl I was fully prepared to marry. I found this girl in freaking Florida of all places where the degree of sexual liberalism there is almost incomprehensible to anyone who hasn’t been there before. Yet y’all are saying you can’t find a girl like that in the actual Philippines where there is 1950s levels of social pressure to be traditional and where most girls come from very similar families to the one my ex came from?

I just don’t buy it. I feel like there’s something a lot of foreign guys are doing that is drawing the wrong kind of girls to y’all’s doorstep. I don’t know what it is but none of my experiences with Filipinos have indicated that they are liberal or inclined towards the criminal activities you mentioned at all.

[WilliamSmith]

It's actually a bit more disconcerting than that. Many girls over here get devirginised by family members, often young ones (elder brothers, cousins, young uncles), sometimes older ones, even their fathers. It's something few people want to talk about, Catholic stigma and all, but the practice is alive and kicking. And I am talking girls as young as 12. Two of the girls I dated confessed to me, that they were abused by a cousin and an uncle, respectively. The second one (uncle) was from an upper-class Filipino-Chinese family in Davao, and she was still bearing the scars on her personality.

Abuse or not, I stopped believing in the "primal innocence" of Filipinas, and Filipino people in general, pretty soon during my stay here. People here are overly opportunistic and sex is one of the few currencies they have to get something out of someone. Often, it's the only currency they have.

Thanks @publicduende, that is indeed disconcerting, but interesting and hopefully helpful to @Outcast9428 to temper the idealism with realism. (I'm not saying the beautiful Philippines is all rotten and based on false presentation by any means either, I am just skeptical about the degree of purity.)
Vietnam certainly has casual sex but maybe it's another option that's bit more of a step in the right direction for what he wants (at least compared with the other two which are rather infamous).

What you said about the opportunistic use of sex is also an interesting point that'd give me pause if I was going after the ladies there, personally... I don't think there's anything degenerate or "exploitative" when some decent guy (like the one in the other thread in the video who'd got screwed out of most of his $$ in a failed marriage and divorce in the West and almost commit suicide before instead finding a new life with a cute Pinay) goes there and gets a nice village girl for a wife to their mutual satisfaction, even if him having financial security was admittedly a necessary piece of the puzzle. But personally, I lean more toward going after the women in countries where there are not so many women trying to use sex as a currency, or possibly use relationships as a way out of poverty. (I'd gladly help lift some nice young people out of poverty if I had that ability without getting involved with them, but do not want money to be in any way involved as a tradeoff for sex, but that's just me.)

I get told a lot of how sexually liberated the Thai party girls are. Not having the moral superstructure of Christianity or Islam surely helps making women more nonchalant towards sex, including occasional sex. Still, from what I have heard and read, catching a hottie in a trendy bar or disco requires a specific profile: young, handsome, well-groomed, with money to spend. The polar opposite of the profile of the typical man who comes to the Philippines for romance: in his late 30s or 40s, physically mediocre and in bad shape, with a modest pension or passive income. In Thailand, they would be spit-roasted like baby pig by the many scammers around.

On the subject of the women:
I don't think it's only the party girls (though I'm not really sure about Thailand specifically on that point), but in some other Asian countries it's definitely not only the party girls who are extremely into white guys (e.g. China before it got closed off, and to a slightly less dramatic but still noteworthy degree, Hong Kong and Japan).
But the main reason I wanted to bring it up is just to point out to @Outcast9428 and possibly other traditionalist types that a lot of the nice Thai girls are anything but virginal there, for the most part. (And they weren't trashy or "degenerate" like some of the tradpill types always want to label them as when they're trying to idealize a given country, they were just nice young girls pursuing some otherwise normal course of study at college, who also liked goin' at it a lot with young guys on the side for fun.)

As for the men: The guys I know of who were living it up there were young (in their 20s at the same time as the girls), but "handsome, well-groomed, with money to spend" definitely wasn't necessarily the case at all, certainly not where the money was concerned, because they were just casually dressed young bucks travelling, and the girls and women they picked up (as opposed to the pros) weren't benefitting in any way from what modest amount of spending $$$ they had, just looking for a good time. So they could pay for their own drinks, sure, but no money or status involved (except by virtue of being a bit exotic as a foreigner).
What you described as the profile brought some kind of young Matthew McConaughey or Christian Bale looking type to mind though (not sure why them, but those are just the two that popped into my mind when I read it), but the ones I noticed including one I know quite well personally weren't anywhere near as handsome as that either (without meaning to sound rude). More on the average side than not (at least by my retro standards, not necessarily vs this newer generation of "non-binaries" and such).
More importantly than their appearance though: It is true that they weren't totally clueless on their basic dating skills (and both were capable of getting white girls back home in the states too, even if they wouldn't have been considered exceptional or heart-throbs in general, and certainly not "Chads").

+ Last but not least: Good point and worthwhile caveat to any other Western gents who fit the profile you described about the danger of getting roasted by Thai scammers. I've heard of that happening to quite a few older guys who were a little too naive and got royally screwed out of the modest amount they had.
Places like Thailand and Jamaica (just to name one other) have lots of nice genuinely friendly people there, but they definitely also have a lot of scammers who can be ruthless with their marks. (I think as a generalization its often naive older Western men falling prey in Thailand, naive older Western women falling prey in Jamaica, though I'm sure there's some of both in each.)

[WilliamSmith]

@publicduende

I just don’t get how it can be that I can go to Florida and date a Filipino immigrant girl who really was everything a conservative guy could ask for. Super girly/feminine, sweet, cute voice and mannerisms, long term relationships only, no fetishes or kinks, wanted to be a housewife and be provided for, let me say outrageously anti-liberal stuff that I don’t feel comfortable even saying around my traditionalist father. Had parents who were super traditional in every way you can think of. A girl I was fully prepared to marry. I found this girl in freaking Florida of all places where the degree of sexual liberalism there is almost incomprehensible to anyone who hasn’t been there before. Yet y’all are saying you can’t find a girl like that in the actual Philippines where there is 1950s levels of social pressure to be traditional and where most girls come from very similar families to the one my ex came from?

I just don’t buy it. I feel like there’s something a lot of foreign guys are doing that is drawing the wrong kind of girls to y’all’s doorstep. I don’t know what it is but none of my experiences with Filipinos have indicated that they are liberal or inclined towards the criminal activities you mentioned at all.

I don't think anyone said " you can’t find a girl like that in the actual Philippines " (I certainly didn't mean that), just that I see some over-idealization of those two countries in particular, so there's a risk of being disappointed by actually expecting it to be like the 1950s. I mean you wouldn't have gotten the Philippine Drug War and a zillion slutty little hotties showing off on the internet in the 1950s even if the technology already existed, right?
And there's specific risks with Pinays and Latinas bullshitting about supposed Catholic virtues of chastity, while in reality going at it like rabbits behind the scenes, which I noticed @Lucas88 mentioned to you in your other thread today.
I certainly never said you couldn't find good traditional girls there though, but hell you can still find nice traditional girls in cesspools of vile depravity like Tel Aviv or Jew York City if you look hard enough, so it's more a matter of choosing a place with your best prospects.

P.S. You might look into Vietnam too. They are on the rise with a bright future I think, so the controversy that personally makes me a bit uncomfortable with so many women using sex as a "currency" like @publidduende mentioned might not be quite as big a thing there (though my being uncomfortable with that is just my own personal factor I am uncomfortable with, others may feel differently), but I think Vietnam is a bit more of a step in the right direction for valuing traditionalism. No question about it you could get a beautiful wife there who values traditionalism though! But I didn't mean you couldn't in the Philippines or Thailand either, I think there's just a risk there's more seedy undercurrents there vs what sounds to me like a bit of an over-idealized take on those two otherwise awesome nations...

[Outcast9428]

It's actually a bit more disconcerting than that. Many girls over here get devirginised by family members, often young ones (elder brothers, cousins, young uncles), sometimes older ones, even their fathers. It's something few people want to talk about, Catholic stigma and all, but the practice is alive and kicking. And I am talking girls as young as 12. Two of the girls I dated confessed to me, that they were abused by a cousin and an uncle, respectively. The second one (uncle) was from an upper-class Filipino-Chinese family in Davao, and she was still bearing the scars on her personality.

Abuse or not, I stopped believing in the "primal innocence" of Filipinas, and Filipino people in general, pretty soon during my stay here. People here are overly opportunistic and sex is one of the few currencies they have to get something out of someone. Often, it's the only currency they have.

Thanks @publicduende, that is indeed disconcerting, but interesting and hopefully helpful to @Outcast9428 to temper the idealism with realism. (I'm not saying the beautiful Philippines is all rotten and based on false presentation by any means either, I am just skeptical about the degree of purity.)
Vietnam certainly has casual sex but maybe it's another option that's bit more of a step in the right direction for what he wants (at least compared with the other two which are rather infamous).

What you said about the opportunistic use of sex is also an interesting point that'd give me pause if I was going after the ladies there, personally... I don't think there's anything degenerate or "exploitative" when some decent guy (like the one in the other thread in the video who'd got screwed out of most of his $$ in a failed marriage and divorce in the West and almost commit suicide before instead finding a new life with a cute Pinay) goes there and gets a nice village girl for a wife to their mutual satisfaction, even if him having financial security was admittedly a necessary piece of the puzzle. But personally, I lean more toward going after the women in countries where there are not so many women trying to use sex as a currency, or possibly use relationships as a way out of poverty. (I'd gladly help lift some nice young people out of poverty if I had that ability without getting involved with them, but do not want money to be in any way involved as a tradeoff for sex, but that's just me.)

I get told a lot of how sexually liberated the Thai party girls are. Not having the moral superstructure of Christianity or Islam surely helps making women more nonchalant towards sex, including occasional sex. Still, from what I have heard and read, catching a hottie in a trendy bar or disco requires a specific profile: young, handsome, well-groomed, with money to spend. The polar opposite of the profile of the typical man who comes to the Philippines for romance: in his late 30s or 40s, physically mediocre and in bad shape, with a modest pension or passive income. In Thailand, they would be spit-roasted like baby pig by the many scammers around.

On the subject of the women:
I don't think it's only the party girls (though I'm not really sure about Thailand specifically on that point), but in some other Asian countries it's definitely not only the party girls who are extremely into white guys (e.g. China before it got closed off, and to a slightly less dramatic but still noteworthy degree, Hong Kong and Japan).
But the main reason I wanted to bring it up is just to point out to @Outcast9428 and possibly other traditionalist types that a lot of the nice Thai girls are anything but virginal there, for the most part. (And they weren't trashy or "degenerate" like some of the tradpill types always want to label them as when they're trying to idealize a given country, they were just nice young girls pursuing some otherwise normal course of study at college, who also liked goin' at it a lot with young guys on the side for fun.)

As for the men: The guys I know of who were living it up there were young (in their 20s at the same time as the girls), but "handsome, well-groomed, with money to spend" definitely wasn't necessarily the case at all, certainly not where the money was concerned, because they were just casually dressed young bucks travelling, and the girls and women they picked up (as opposed to the pros) weren't benefitting in any way from what modest amount of spending $$$ they had, just looking for a good time. So they could pay for their own drinks, sure, but no money or status involved (except by virtue of being a bit exotic as a foreigner).
What you described as the profile brought some kind of young Matthew McConaughey or Christian Bale looking type to mind though (not sure why them, but those are just the two that popped into my mind when I read it), but the ones I noticed including one I know quite well personally weren't anywhere near as handsome as that either (without meaning to sound rude). More on the average side than not (at least by my retro standards, not necessarily vs this newer generation of "non-binaries" and such).
More importantly than their appearance though: It is true that they weren't totally clueless on their basic dating skills (and both were capable of getting white girls back home in the states too, even if they wouldn't have been considered exceptional or heart-throbs in general, and certainly not "Chads").

+ Last but not least: Good point and worthwhile caveat to any other Western gents who fit the profile you described about the danger of getting roasted by Thai scammers. I've heard of that happening to quite a few older guys who were a little too naive and got royally screwed out of the modest amount they had.
Places like Thailand and Jamaica (just to name one other) have lots of nice genuinely friendly people there, but they definitely also have a lot of scammers who can be ruthless with their marks. (I think as a generalization its often naive older Western men falling prey in Thailand, naive older Western women falling prey in Jamaica, though I'm sure there's some of both in each.)

Even if that’s true about the college girls in Thailand you are talking about an institution and lifestyle that is inherently liberal to at least some degree.

Keep in mind that only 13% of women in Thailand even go to college in the first place. The average age of marriage in Thailand is 21. About 25% of girls there are married by the time they are 18 years old. Another 25% marry between 18-21.

Most girls in Thailand are essentially married already or in long term relationships that will soon culminate in marriage by the time they would graduate college. If we are taking about single women going to college in Thailand you are selecting for a group of women that is way more liberal then the average there. It would be like pointing out that girls who go to church every Sunday in America tend to be conservative and using that to say America is a broadly conservative country or that it is a mix between conservative and liberal lifestyles.

[publicduende]

@publicduende

I just don’t get how it can be that I can go to Florida and date a Filipino immigrant girl who really was everything a conservative guy could ask for. Super girly/feminine, sweet, cute voice and mannerisms, long term relationships only, no fetishes or kinks, wanted to be a housewife and be provided for, let me say outrageously anti-liberal stuff that I don’t feel comfortable even saying around my traditionalist father. Had parents who were super traditional in every way you can think of. A girl I was fully prepared to marry. I found this girl in freaking Florida of all places where the degree of sexual liberalism there is almost incomprehensible to anyone who hasn’t been there before. Yet y’all are saying you can’t find a girl like that in the actual Philippines where there is 1950s levels of social pressure to be traditional and where most girls come from very similar families to the one my ex came from?

I just don’t buy it. I feel like there’s something a lot of foreign guys are doing that is drawing the wrong kind of girls to y’all’s doorstep. I don’t know what it is but none of my experiences with Filipinos have indicated that they are liberal or inclined towards the criminal activities you mentioned at all.

@Outcast9428

It's only apparently a contradiction and it can be easily explained. The Filipino immigrant girl you met in Florida hails from either a family who was already upper class and decided to relocate to the US, or a family of much more modest origins who improved their socio-economic status considerably after moving to the US. In either case, we're talking about a socio-economically, morally "decent" family.

"Decent" families, all over the Philippines, are just as conservative as the one the girl you met came from. My wife C's family was not rich but her mum was the daughter of a well-respected doctor in Davao, someone who did med school in the States in the 1930's. Case in point, C is as conservative as it gets. It took me 6 months of courtship to convince her that I was "the one" for her. And no sex until the end of those 6 months.

Compare and contrast with the army of girls from poor families I met in Davao, who would jump in bed with me hours after having a Starbucks coffee with them, let alone a dinner or a couple of dates. To those young women, being traditional might mean going to church every Sunday and listening to some cheesy sermon, which they will forget about 15 minutes after walking out. What these women won't pass on is the fact that they are poor and in need and their youth, beauty and sex appeal are the only currencies they have to get out of their status. In other words, being conservative is a luxury they can't afford.

Opportunism is key: here's a foreigner, not so old, not so ugly, not so poor, who is sitting in front of them. Maybe he's just looking to womanize. But if he is not, they know they have a fighting chance of starting a relationship with said foreigner, getting shelter, food, support for themselves and maybe their families. It's an opportunity too good to pass, even if it involves giving away their body to a man they will never like as much as the Filipino boy who lives nearby and they have known for ages.

Vice-versa, if you take a girl whose family has enough money to let her live comfortably, graduate from a good college, maybe work abroad or start a career in the big city, she will know she has her pick of local boys from "decent families". Unless she has a particular thing for foreigners (usually first-world Asians, like glamorous Koreans or reliable Japanese), she will steer away from foreigners as much as she can.

[Outcast9428]

@publicduende

I just don’t get how it can be that I can go to Florida and date a Filipino immigrant girl who really was everything a conservative guy could ask for. Super girly/feminine, sweet, cute voice and mannerisms, long term relationships only, no fetishes or kinks, wanted to be a housewife and be provided for, let me say outrageously anti-liberal stuff that I don’t feel comfortable even saying around my traditionalist father. Had parents who were super traditional in every way you can think of. A girl I was fully prepared to marry. I found this girl in freaking Florida of all places where the degree of sexual liberalism there is almost incomprehensible to anyone who hasn’t been there before. Yet y’all are saying you can’t find a girl like that in the actual Philippines where there is 1950s levels of social pressure to be traditional and where most girls come from very similar families to the one my ex came from?

I never said you couldn't find a girl like your ex in the Philippines. In fact you quite likely could. But she was unusual in a few aspects, let us not forget. First of all if I am not mistaken, she was a few years older than you at the time, I believe she was already thirty? So by Filipino standards she'd be a bit on the 'older side' for marriage or relationships and local men may see her as a 'leftover woman'. She was definitely cute in the type of way that foreigners would label a Filipina cute, and she seemed well-dressed, so she would do well with foreigners, would catch their eye. Her "type" is fairly common.

Thing is, and I don't doubt her "purity" or honesty, of course. But NO FILIPINA is going to admit to her more slutty actions from the past. If she DID have a drunken hookup, or did some wild or regrettable stuff in college that she's now ashamed of, she won't tell her conservative American boyfriend who always rants about degenerates about it. Plus since she's a Filipina, she still no matter what has this healthy sense of shame... Western girls may wear their degeneracy like a badge of honor, but Filipinas hide that stuff.

I just don’t buy it. I feel like there’s something a lot of foreign guys are doing that is drawing the wrong kind of girls to y’all’s doorstep. I don’t know what it is but none of my experiences with Filipinos have indicated that they are liberal or inclined towards the criminal activities you mentioned at all.

I never said Filipinas are liberal, I don't think any of us claimed that. Although some of those who went to the fancier universities are kinda liberal by design; they vote "Liberal Party" and are big on LGBT rights and what-not, will mouth off about colonialism being bad. But they will also still make the occasional politically incorrect joke and "slip up" every once in a while because American style liberalism doesn't come natural to any Filipino lol. The majority of them, politically speaking, are fairly conservative, I would say.

As for criminal activities... or scamming... those are the desperate means used by desperately poor girls. You won't encounter them as much abroad because once a girl is abroad, she more or less "has it made" already. Your ex-girlfriend, you say you met her parents. So it sounds as if the whole family was America-based and had been for a while. This indidicates a fairly "high status" by Filipino standards. That family had it made, no need to dishonor themselves by scamming some American guy like yourself. Most of the times when a Filipina does something bad, and I'm not excusing it, but its because that Filipina happens to be dirt poor and she has few options left besides her youth and relative beauty. And foreigners who don't know to spot the red flags can be blinded by love and lust easily when they're in the Philippines.

Well I did more then just say “did you do any hooking up in college?” Over the months that I dated her I would ask questions to construct a complete timeline of her dating history. I didn’t do it all at once or even ask the questions sometimes but if she said “I dated this guy for two years” I made a note of it in my head and then might ask a question to connect the dots like “how old were you then?”

She didn’t pretend to be chaste, I knew she wasn’t but her timeline checks out. She has been in relationships for virtually her entire life starting from the time she was 18. It was quite a few relationships. But there’s no space in her dating history to have even pursued a lifestyle of promiscuity. I suppose it is theoretically possible she may have done it once or twice but the total amount of time she has spent single since turning 18 is only months. So I feel like the chances are quite low out of sheer lack of there being any window of opportunity.

[publicduende]

I don't think anyone said " you can’t find a girl like that in the actual Philippines " (I certainly didn't mean that), just that I see some over-idealization of those two countries in particular, so there's a risk of being disappointed by actually expecting it to be like the 1950s. I mean you wouldn't have gotten the Philippine Drug War and a zillion slutty little hotties showing off on the internet in the 1950s even if the technology already existed, right?
And there's specific risks with Pinays and Latinas bullshitting about supposed Catholic virtues of chastity, while in reality going at it like rabbits behind the scenes, which I noticed @Lucas88 mentioned to you in your other thread today.
I certainly never said you couldn't find good traditional girls there though, but hell you can still find nice traditional girls in cesspools of vile depravity like Tel Aviv or Jew York City if you look hard enough, so it's more a matter of choosing a place with your best prospects.

P.S. You might look into Vietnam too. They are on the rise with a bright future I think, so the controversy that personally makes me a bit uncomfortable with so many women using sex as a "currency" like @publidduende mentioned might not be quite as big a thing there (though my being uncomfortable with that is just my own personal factor I am uncomfortable with, others may feel differently), but I think Vietnam is a bit more of a step in the right direction for valuing traditionalism. No question about it you could get a beautiful wife there who values traditionalism though! But I didn't mean you couldn't in the Philippines or Thailand either, I think there's just a risk there's more seedy undercurrents there vs what sounds to me like a bit of an over-idealized take on those two otherwise awesome nations...

Let's be honest: nu-traditional guys like @Outcast9428 are not the rule, in the Philippines, they are the exceptions. The only traditional men I have found here are some (not even all!) of the older men who come here to retire and have a pet wife who can be their nurse or housewife, in exchange for one or two additional "white kids". Virtually all of the young people here want to have fun and, as I said in my earlier reply, fun can hardly be had with girls from decent families, who are more traditional and won't touch a foreigner with a very long stick

All of the shenanigans young people talk about, the girl-hopping coupled with the island hopping, are 101% with a bunch of poor girls who sleep with a foreigner with the same nonchalance and religious insistence as the 70-yo pensioner who hits the bingo hall every morning, hoping that "today is gonna be the day".

[Outcast9428]

@publicduende

I just don’t get how it can be that I can go to Florida and date a Filipino immigrant girl who really was everything a conservative guy could ask for. Super girly/feminine, sweet, cute voice and mannerisms, long term relationships only, no fetishes or kinks, wanted to be a housewife and be provided for, let me say outrageously anti-liberal stuff that I don’t feel comfortable even saying around my traditionalist father. Had parents who were super traditional in every way you can think of. A girl I was fully prepared to marry. I found this girl in freaking Florida of all places where the degree of sexual liberalism there is almost incomprehensible to anyone who hasn’t been there before. Yet y’all are saying you can’t find a girl like that in the actual Philippines where there is 1950s levels of social pressure to be traditional and where most girls come from very similar families to the one my ex came from?

I just don’t buy it. I feel like there’s something a lot of foreign guys are doing that is drawing the wrong kind of girls to y’all’s doorstep. I don’t know what it is but none of my experiences with Filipinos have indicated that they are liberal or inclined towards the criminal activities you mentioned at all.

@Outcast9428

It's only apparently a contradiction and it can be easily explained. The Filipino immigrant girl you met in Florida hails from either a family who was already upper class and decided to relocate to the US, or a family of much more modest origins who improved their socio-economic status considerably after moving to the US. In either case, we're talking about a socio-economically, morally "decent" family.

"Decent" families, all over the Philippines, are just as conservative as the one the girl you met came from. My wife C's family was not rich but her mum was the daughter of a well-respected doctor in Davao, someone who did med school in the States in the 1930's. Case in point, C is as conservative as it gets. It took me 6 months of courtship to convince her that I was "the one" for her. And no sex until the end of those 6 months.

Compare and contrast with the army of girls from poor families I met in Davao, who would jump in bed with me hours after having a Starbucks coffee with them, let alone a dinner or a couple of dates. To those young women, being traditional might mean going to church every Sunday and listening to some cheesy sermon, which they will forget about 15 minutes after walking out. What these women won't pass on is the fact that they are poor and in need and their youth, beauty and sex appeal are the only currencies they have to get out of their status. In other words, being conservative is a luxury they can't afford.

Opportunism is key: here's a foreigner, not so old, not so ugly, not so poor, who is sitting in front of them. Maybe he's just looking to womanize. But if he is not, they know they have a fighting chance of starting a relationship with said foreigner, getting shelter, food, support for themselves and maybe their families. It's an opportunity too good to pass, even if it involves giving away their body to a man they will never like as much as the Filipino boy who lives nearby and they have known for ages.

Vice-versa, if you take a girl whose family has enough money to let her live comfortably, graduate from a good college, maybe work abroad or start a career in the big city, she will know she has her pick of local boys from "decent families". Unless she has a particular thing for foreigners (usually first-world Asians, like glamorous Koreans or reliable Japanese), she will steer away from foreigners as much as she can.

Ok this makes sense. It would also explain why surveys say Thai girls have a lower number of sexual partners then Filipina girls too since Thailand has a lot less severe poverty.

[WilliamSmith]

My former father-in-law is a Filipino man in his fifties. Good guy. Charming, not particularly handsome but not hideous either. He told me with some pride that he had sex with about twenty girls in his younger years, mostly in college and early on in his career. He was kind of a Lothario. This included maybe one or two hookups, but he said it was rare. Most of the time he'd have to "joke or bullshit his way into her pants", sometimes he'd have two girlfriends at once without each knowing, he'd date around, he was kinda wild."If by the second or third date she wouldn't put out, I knew it was a waste of time and I'd retreat". We're talking late 1980s, early 1990s Philippines here. I trust "the master" when I hear from him.

@MarcosZeitola
That was a great bunch of information overall but I have to bring out the applause for this story of your father-in-law in particular, LOL, this Pinoy Lothario sounds very similar to the older veteran Western gents who are not mean to women nor "misogynistic" but have refined their technique to the point they do indeed become "masters" at getting a lot of women into bed, and those of us always looking to improve our technique can learn from.
I pay serious attention to what these guys say and have already benefitted a lot from it. (I can imagine the pain some of these newer generations of "incels" are going through and sympathize, but damn I'm grateful that I'm at least scoundrelly enough to actually have always wanted to listen to these guys rather than just write them off as a "scam," but of course in your father-in-law's case he wasn't selling PUA products either, so his wisdom is all the more credible.)

Anyway:
What he said about setting up several dates but throwing in the towel if you're not making obvious tangible progress toward getting her in bed by the 2nd (ideally) or 3rd date is exactly what the older veterans have taught: Some of the PUAs who try for rapid escalation actually have worse problems keeping the women around even if they become masters of the "ONS" one-night stand to some degree, but one of the factors I thought was funny is that a lot of the women who decide to go for it on night one with those guys will actually bolt on them afterward because of how the women categorize men as relationship material vs Errol Flynns or whatever (who they assume won't make good longer-term partners).
Sometimes the "PUAs" actually end up that way because they get good at getting the women into bed quickly but then can't keep them around.
But the gents who like the women but try to get them in bed 2+ times to keep them around still like the strategy of escalating to hopefully either win or make substantial progress by date #2, at worst date #3 (even if they specifically avoid date #1, hence the time-limited first date to set the stage, so to speak, but only close the deal and get her in the sack by date #2 or #3 assuming she's happy about it, ready, and willing).

Another thing I've always found inspiring is that so many of these veteran ladies' men aren't necessarily particularly good looking to begin with even when they were young themselves, either, which should be additionally inspiring to other men too:
They have refined great core principles to keep themselves internally attractive to women even into their 60s and beyond in some cases. (The "beyond" 60 crowd admittedly being those who put a priority on physical fitness at least somewhat, as well as laying on the confidence, masculinity, and charm, but I've still seen them, and they don't just get gold-diggers.)

Those of us who come across as at least somewhat handsome (or possibly very, depending on the girl's preferences and our luck of the draw there) know the clock's ticking and any of the theoretic "SMV" stuff is NOT going to last, so I value the help of these older veterans who put in the effort earlier, especially if they even did it in the pre-internet days in the 80s and weren't by any means "handsome" to start with.
That impresses me, being someone who leaned rather heavily on the internet for my acquired knowledge when I was living in a miniscule rathole apartment in my 20s. (Though on the other hand I had at least figured out that women love the bodice ripper romance genre a bit after watching attractive professional women buying stacks of them at brick-and-mortar bookstores when I was a little boy, then seeing what was inside later on even when very few PUA/seduction titles had been published, other than a handful of retro early 90s titles like "How to Be the Jerk Women Love" by FJ Shark if I remember rightly, or much better yet the multi-volume legendary Memoirs of Casanova that I've owned the hardback set of for longer than most, but I didn't even find out about those until later on and think that was yet another thing I had recommended from some of these oldtimers. )